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Just now, DEagle7 said:

Ok, and?  That's still significant growth despite your assertion that being forced to ignore pre-existing conditions is somehow handicapping them and forcing them to provide poorer quality care. It's silly. 

And I'm not shocked. But to act as if that is a reasonable model for a nation 's healthcare is incredibly naive. If we want private insurance companies to focus solely on maximizing profit then they need government oversight.  I'm not a "medicare for all" person but acting as if unfettered free market is the solution is equally as absurd. They'd end up like cable companies, creating regional oligopolies and provide the bare minimum.  

And if you disagree then please enlighten me, why are we worsening in every health outcome metric compared to every other western nation?  Because it's sure as crap not too much government. 

Because he have an insane system that is partially a for profit enterprise, and partially a government run program (Medicare, Medicaid, etc.). We need to pick a lane. Either healthcare is a right and basic care will be provided by the government with insurance only for extreme circumstances, or we are fully privately run and will accept that many will not receive care due to price.

We have to pick a lane. Either works for me. But when you try this Frankenstein approach to forcing private companies to act in the public good, you just get a mess.

1 minute ago, Dave Moss said:

The difference between you and everyone else in the thread is we have to pay our kids medical bills.  We've all been overcharged or had claims denied for all kinds of dumb reasons.  You just don't have a clue what you're talking about as usual.

You think I don't have to pay medical bills for myself and my family? Are you insane?

Wait...forgot who I was talking to. Yeah -- you're insane.

2 minutes ago, Dave Moss said:

The difference between you and everyone else in the thread is we have to pay our kids medical bills.  We've all been overcharged or had claims denied for all kinds of dumb reasons.  You just don't have a clue what you're talking about as usual.

And I'm basically paying your kids medical bills by being overcharged as a healthy person for my insurance.

So...you're welcome.

3 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

Because he have an insane system that is partially a for profit enterprise, and partially a government run program (Medicare, Medicaid, etc.). We need to pick a lane. Either healthcare is a right and basic care will be provided by the government with insurance only for extreme circumstances, or we are fully privately run and will accept that many will not receive care due to price.

We have to pick a lane. Either works for me. But when you try this Frankenstein approach to forcing private companies to act in the public good, you just get a mess.

You know full well most Americans can't afford to sue health insurance companies.  In my experience most of the folks savvy enough to navigate the crooked system work in the health-care industry.  Which isn't surprising at all.

CHARGE INSURANCE BY LIFESTYLE MONITOR ERRYBODYS PEE

3 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

You think I don't have to pay medical bills for myself and my family? Are you insane?

Wait...forgot who I was talking to. Yeah -- you're insane.

I'm sure you have exorbitant bills due to being a colossal dope

Just now, Dave Moss said:

You know full well most Americans can't afford to sue a health insurance companies.  In my experience most of the folks savvy enough to navigate the crooked system work in the health-care industry.  Which isn't surprising at all.

So then pass national healthcare already if you think it's a right. Because right now it isn't. And there is no evidence these companies are violating the laws. 

Accept that you can't regulate private industry into acting like a public good because the people passing the laws are significantly dumber than those running the companies.

1 minute ago, vikas83 said:

Because he have an insane system that is partially a for profit enterprise, and partially a government run program (Medicare, Medicaid, etc.). We need to pick a lane. Either healthcare is a right and basic care will be provided by the government with insurance only for extreme circumstances, or we are fully privately run and will accept that many will not receive care due to price.

We have to pick a lane. Either works for me. But when you try this Frankenstein approach to forcing private companies to act in the public good, you just get a mess.

That's not true though. There are plenty of hybrid healthcare systems. England, Sweden, France, Australia etc.

Just now, Dave Moss said:

I'm sure you have exorbitant bills due to being a colossal dope

Honestly, I don't know what we pay for insurance. We are covered through my firm. The CFO knows I am sure. My biggest HC cost is my doctor's annual fee. 

1 minute ago, vikas83 said:

So then pass national healthcare already if you think it's a right. Because right now it isn't. And there is no evidence these companies are violating the laws. 

Accept that you can't regulate private industry into acting like a public good because the people passing the laws are significantly dumber than those running the companies.

Ok, maybe I'll pass it over the weekend.  Thanks for the suggestion.

Just now, Dave Moss said:

Ok, maybe I'll pass it over the weekend...

GAS    EW

Just now, DEagle7 said:

That's not true though. There are plenty of hybrid healthcare systems. England, Sweden, France, Australia etc.

But those systems have a basic plan provided to everyone, and then you can add more by paying. That would make sense but would never work here because people would cry about those who can afford to go to better hospitals, get superior care, etc. Americans want high end care without paying for it.

7 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

And I'm basically paying your kids medical bills by being overcharged as a healthy person for my insurance.

So...you're welcome.

Wait, you're paying for Moss's family but not mine?

 

I thought we were friends, dick.

1 minute ago, Arthur Jackson said:

GAS    EW

Nah.  Kidney stones.  I'll suffer at home though since I'm a poor

4 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

That's not true though. There are plenty of hybrid healthcare systems. England, Sweden, France, Australia etc.

I believe you are a doctor. How much of your staff's time and energy is taken up with the insane process of trying to get reimbursed by insurance companies? Is it easier with Medicare/Medicaid? Or would it be much cheaper and easier if people paid for basic care out of pocket?

1 minute ago, Dave Moss said:

Nah.  Kidney stones.  I'll suffer at home though since I'm a poor

WHEN ITS TIME SHOOT THEM AT A TIN CAN YULE THANK ME

2 minutes ago, paco said:

Wait, you're paying for Moss's family but not mine?

 

I thought we were friends, dick.

Maybe your check got lost in the mail.

24 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

And I'm basically paying your kids medical bills by being overcharged as a healthy person for my insurance.

So...you're welcome.

HAHAHAHAHA you have to support the poors!!!

18 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

I believe you are a doctor. How much of your staff's time and energy is taken up with the insane process of trying to get reimbursed by insurance companies? Is it easier with Medicare/Medicaid? Or would it be much cheaper and easier if people paid for basic care out of pocket?

Way too much time but it is WAY easier with Medicaid. I'm in pediatrics though. Not nearly as many private insurance only groups in my world. 

7 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

Way too much time but it is WAY easier with Medicaid. I'm in pediatrics though. Not nearly as many private insurance only groups in my world. 

If you don't mind me asking, do you own your own practice or are you part of a larger group? Most of the PCPs that owned their own practices (among family friends) have been selling out to larger groups in the last few years. Seems like being an independent family doctor has been rendered impossible at this point.

12 minutes ago, Alpha_TATEr said:

HAHAHAHAHA you have to support the poors!!!

I'm an American, so there's no avoiding it. We have the most progressive income tax system in the world.

Yeah, I understand that companies exist to make a product. 
 

That said, when a consumer pays for a product, they expect to receive the product. If I’m paying for Disney World, I expect to ride Space Mountain. Don’t piss in my face and tell me that their travel agent took a look at my itinerary and found that Dorney Park is the same. 
 

We wouldn’t be having this much of an issue if companies could correctly target inefficiencies and not just start Fing with the product. 

55 minutes ago, DEagle7 said:

They'd end up like cable companies, creating regional oligopolies and provide the bare minimum.  

Yeah that's the problem. When a claim gets denied, I have no recourse. I'm not gonna spend countless hours on the phone ping ponging between the dr's office and the insurance company trying to get an issue resolved, so after a few phone calls of trying to get it rebilled under a different code and that keeps failing, I just give up and pay the F'ing thing out of pocket. And because there's no competition or no other reasonable avenues to take my business elsewhere, the cycle repeats and the insurance company keeps getting my money. There's no incentive for them to act in a more competent or honest manner to correct their mistakes because they know they have a cornered market with no competitors.

1 minute ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Yeah that's the problem. When a claim gets denied, I have no recourse. I'm not gonna spend countless hours on the phone ping ponging between the dr's office and the insurance company trying to get an issue resolved, so after a few phone calls of trying to get it rebilled under a different code and that keeps failing, I just give up and pay the F'ing thing out of pocket. And because there's no competition or no other reasonable avenues to take my business elsewhere, the cycle repeats and the insurance company keeps getting my money. There's no incentive for them to act in a more competent or honest manner to correct their mistakes because they know they have a cornered market with no competitors.

Because you're not their customer. Your employer, or your employer's outsourced benefits provider, is the customer. It's why I mentioned the need to stop linking insurance with employment. They want to keep TriNet happy, not you.

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