1 hour ago, Gannan said:

So what are the Hama sympathizers going with now? That blood thirsty Israel was hell bent on blowing up the AP building for no reason, but at the same time was nice enough to give them advanced warning so they could evacuate the building?

Personally, I think Israel was just looking for good PR.

12 minutes ago, DaEagles4Life said:

No, they are a terrorist organization. 

https://www.state.gov/foreign-terrorist-organizations/

Right, they’re called a terrorist organization because they have no formal military.  And if they did Israel would destroy it in 5 minutes anyway.

27 minutes ago, Dave Moss said:

They’re only referred to as "terrorists” because there’s no organized military on the Palestinian side.  And they’re fighting against a military that receives millions of dollars in military aid from the U.S.

No, they’re referred to as terrorists because they’re terrorists.

As is usually the case in the ME, there are no innocent hands here, and we’d be better off letting them slaughter each other without getting involved.

2 minutes ago, TEW said:

No, they’re referred to as terrorists because they’re terrorists.

As is usually the case in the ME, there are no innocent hands here, and we’d be better off letting them slaughter each other without getting involved.

Other than giving millions of dollars in aid to Israel, we do stay out of it.

1 hour ago, mr_hunt said:

4 more years of jared kushner and all this would've been straightened out...but nooooooo....they had to rig the election for biden. 

Im glad you brought up the unprecedented successes the Trump Administration experienced with respect to the middle east

19 hours ago, TEW said:

It matters when the people who think you shouldn't be there decide to act on that notion. Surely, as a Jew, you can understand the gravity of this concept?

Me being or not being Jewish has nothing to do with our right to live in our country. One of the purposes of the state of Israel is to get rid of the fears and 
anxiety of the traditional diaspora Jew, while giving him his own country, his own army, his own government. If somehow those rockets that are being fired on our civilians, would have been fired on Washington, Paris or London - I am absolutely certain that the source of the rocket firing would have been totally wiped out in 2 hours without any concern for the civilian population. Still, every our defensive action is being tracked under microscope by the entire world.

So when you are questioning  my right to live in my land and to defend it - I absolutely do not have to explain it to you. We are here. We will defend ourselves. If you don't like it - I don't care. I anyone just doesn't like it - I JUST DO NOT CARE. But if someone who doesn't like it, fires rockets on us, throws rocks, knifes, shoots us - he will be punished. Heavily.

So the anti Israel pro Palestinians protestors love to tell us that the people in Gaza are starving to death, yet Hamas has the money to launch 3,000 rockets at Israel. Yet, their starvation is blamed on Israel? 

2 hours ago, Dave Moss said:

Other than giving millions of dollars in aid to Israel, we do stay out of it.

Now we got the whole thing right. Dave Moss and his friends are just jealous because of the money being given to Israel. 

Hamas does not wear uniforms. They wear civilian clothes and launch rockets in civilian areas. They want civilians to die to use as a propaganda tool. Gazans are at the mercy of Hamas who wages war and expects an Israeli Military Response.

Israel destroys Gaza tunnels as Palestinian death toll eclipses 200
The Israeli military unleashed a wave of heavy airstrikes Monday on the Gaza Strip, saying it destroyed 9 miles of militant tunnels and the homes of nine Hamas commanders as international diplomats worked to end the weeklong war that has killed hundreds of people.

8 minutes ago, ilross2003 said:

Now we got the whole thing right. Dave Moss and his friends are just jealous because of the money being given to Israel. 

 

9 minutes ago, jsdarkstar said:

So the anti Israel pro Palestinians protestors love to tell us that the people in Gaza are starving to death, yet Hamas has the money to launch 3,000 rockets at Israel. Yet, their starvation is blamed on Israel? 

And how about their "Metro"?

I am sure, that they could have used this money in much different way if they actually cared for their population.

 

The way progressive liberals are supporting the Palestinians, one would think they believe that Hamas firing rockets is just fine and Israel should do nothing about it, but just let Hamas keep firing rockets. Any response is too much. 

51 minutes ago, Dave Moss said:

 

3,100,000,000   ÷   328,200,000 (US Population) =  9.5 USD

Congrats! Without giving aid to the evil Zionists, you could have afforded  a couple of beers more! Annually!

Just to make sure I'm offending everyone equally in this thread...

30 minutes ago, ilross2003 said:

3,100,000,000   ÷   328,200,000 (US Population) =  9.5 USD

Congrats! Without giving aid to the evil Zionists, you could have afforded  a couple of beers more! Annually!

I'm not 100% against foreign aid to Isreal, but to be fair, you can break down all spending like this.  Dividing anything by 328 Mil gives you a pretty small number.

1 hour ago, ilross2003 said:

Me being or not being Jewish has nothing to do with our right to live in our country. One of the purposes of the state of Israel is to get rid of the fears and 
anxiety of the traditional diaspora Jew, while giving him his own country, his own army, his own government. If somehow those rockets that are being fired on our civilians, would have been fired on Washington, Paris or London - I am absolutely certain that the source of the rocket firing would have been totally wiped out in 2 hours without any concern for the civilian population. Still, every our defensive action is being tracked under microscope by the entire world.

So when you are questioning  my right to live in my land and to defend it - I absolutely do not have to explain it to you. We are here. We will defend ourselves. If you don't like it - I don't care. I anyone just doesn't like it - I JUST DO NOT CARE. But if someone who doesn't like it, fires rockets on us, throws rocks, knifes, shoots us - he will be punished. Heavily.

How can you say, as you did in the post that I originally quoted, that it doesn’t matter who’s land it is because "you are already there?”

This is the entire point of contention. It’s the reason for the conflict. The Palestinians were "already there” as well. If you want to take a might makes right approach, that’s fine — such is the nature of geopolitics — but to continue with the realist philosophy you better start understanding the blowback.

To be clear, I don’t question Israel defending themselves. Certainly Hamas are not exactly a group with which I sympathize. I do, however, question Israel’s loyalty as an ally. And I’d suggest you start caring about perceptions when you’re so reliant on outside support. Israel’s existence is at the whims of America’s political tides; best not to bite the hand that feeds.

Let's be clear. Israel established a Nation with Jerusalem as it's Capitol City a thousand years before Islam was established as religion. So to say Palestinians were there first is false. 

The Fact that the Golden Dome of the Rock and Mosque are built on top of the  ruins of the Jewish Temple proves who was there first.

2 hours ago, jsdarkstar said:

Let's be clear. Israel established a Nation with Jerusalem as it's Capitol City a thousand years before Islam was established as religion. So to say Palestinians were there first is false. 

The Fact that the Golden Dome of the Rock and Mosque are built on top of the  ruins of the Jewish Temple proves who was there first.

Let’s be clear: the Palestinians were there first and religion has nothing to do with it.

 

War is ruthless, brutal, and deadly 

9 hours ago, ilross2003 said:

3,100,000,000   ÷   328,200,000 (US Population) =  9.5 USD

Congrats! Without giving aid to the evil Zionists, you could have afforded  a couple of beers more! Annually!

Yeah why are we giving one of the best economies in the world a dime? I don’t want to pay the taxes that I do, let alone taxes going to people fighting against other people because the Sky Ooga Booga they stole from the Zoroastrians told two different people’s two different things. 

8 hours ago, jsdarkstar said:

Let's be clear. Israel established a Nation with Jerusalem as it's Capitol City a thousand years before Islam was established as religion. So to say Palestinians were there first is false. 

The Fact that the Golden Dome of the Rock and Mosque are built on top of the  ruins of the Jewish Temple proves who was there first.

Cool so you gonna give your house back to the tribe?

14 hours ago, TEW said:

How can you say, as you did in the post that I originally quoted, that it doesn’t matter who’s land it is because "you are already there?”

This is the entire point of contention. It’s the reason for the conflict. The Palestinians were "already there” as well. If you want to take a might makes right approach, that’s fine — such is the nature of geopolitics — but to continue with the realist philosophy you better start understanding the blowback.

To be clear, I don’t question Israel defending themselves. Certainly Hamas are not exactly a group with which I sympathize. I do, however, question Israel’s loyalty as an ally. And I’d suggest you start caring about perceptions when you’re so reliant on outside support. Israel’s existence is at the whims of America’s political tides; best not to bite the hand that feeds.

Quote

How can you say, as you did in the post that I originally quoted, that it doesn’t matter who’s land it is because "you are already there?”

Just in the same way, that you can say that Pennsylvania is your land. The Europeans weren't exactly the first party there, this land (as well as both Americas and Australia) belonged to other people once. So why  Pennsylvania is your land? Only because you're already there. And that's the right thing to say. So why exactly do I have to seek for any kind of justification in our case? The land of Israel belongs to us just like Pennsylvania belongs to you.

Quote

To be clear, I don’t question Israel defending themselves. Certainly Hamas are not exactly a group with which I sympathize. I do, however, question Israel’s loyalty as an ally. And I’d suggest you start caring about perceptions when you’re so reliant on outside support. Israel’s existence is at the whims of America’s political tides; best not to bite the hand that feeds.

I absolutely agree with you that we are totally reliant on the US support. Moreover, without this support we would not exist anymore. I truly appreciate this support.  You're right about the issues, and I'm not proud of it. But caring about perceptions has nothing to do with this. And bringing only issues into perspective is not objective. Many could tell you, that certain US administrations did not treat Israel as an ally as well:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2016/01/20/why-its-correct-to-label-the-obama-administration-anti-israel/

Anyone that questions why Palestinians are evicted from their homes and why they live in camps like refugees is considered anti-Israel.

16 hours ago, VanHammersly said:

I'm not 100% against foreign aid to Isreal, but to be fair, you can break down all spending like this.  Dividing anything by 328 Mil gives you a pretty small number.

That's correct. See, I am pretty sure than nobody gives away 3.1 billion only because he likes to do that. There must be interests, and pretty strong ones. What interests? We can only speculate...