Posted June 23, 20223 yr Congress is close to passing the first significant gun reform in years, in the wake of mass shootings and gun violence across the country (Buffalo, Uvalde, etc.) What is likely to pass in the current Senate bill is: Increase funding for mental health programs & school security Close the "boyfriend loophole" and strengthen red-flag laws Expand background checks of potential 18-21 year-old gun buyers What is not likely to pass in Congress this time is universal background checks, nor a ban on assault weapons or high-capacity magazines. Congress is looking to push the bill through approval today.
June 23, 20223 yr Author Also Sen. John Cornyn has something to say about the current state of NRA. They are wack! Quote While speaking to reporters about the bill, Cornyn emphasized that the NRA was consulted extensively. But he indicated that the group would never be onboard with pretty much anything because of its "business model.” "We worked with the NRA, listened to their concerns, but in the end I think they simply — they have a membership and a business model that will not allow them to support any legislation,” Cornyn said. He added: "And so I understand where they’re coming from, but I think most people will not allow any outside group to veto good public policy.”
June 23, 20223 yr 2 hours ago, toolg said: Congress is close to passing the first significant gun reform in years, in the wake of mass shootings and gun violence across the country (Buffalo, Uvalde, etc.) What is likely to pass in the current Senate bill is: Increase funding for mental health programs & school security Close the "boyfriend loophole" and strengthen red-flag laws Expand background checks of potential 18-21 year-old gun buyers What is not likely to pass in Congress this time is universal background checks, nor a ban on assault weapons or high-capacity magazines. Congress is looking to push the bill through approval today. So basically a bill that does almost next to nothing. But hey, our fearless leaders get to now pat themselves on the back and claim they did "something"...
June 23, 20223 yr Author 7 minutes ago, Phillyterp85 said: So basically a bill that does almost next to nothing. But hey, our fearless leaders get to now pat themselves on the back and claim they did "something"... I feel it is something. Even with all of the division among the parties in Washington, it's what almost everybody agrees with: Let's get guns out of hands of violent folks, let's throw some more money at school security and mental health, and let's vet our young adults carefully before we let them buy a gun. Will it make a difference? Let's find out. Should Congress do more? I think so, but it wasn't going to pass through Congress; or certainly not this quickly.
June 23, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Phillyterp85 said: So basically a bill that does almost next to nothing. But hey, our fearless leaders get to now pat themselves on the back and claim they did "something"... Red flag laws are a pretty big deal with serious constitutional questions. Obviously the devil is in the details, but denying someone constitutional rights without due process is… questionable.
June 23, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, TEW said: Red flag laws are a pretty big deal with serious constitutional questions. Obviously the devil is in the details, but denying someone constitutional rights without due process is… questionable. Given today's ruling, it's pretty obviously unconstitutional.
June 23, 20223 yr If the red flag law compels a speedy hearing to decide the matter, then the hearing probably meets the due process requirement. Those laws have to be very carefully written and function in a way that identifies only those who should not own/possess firearms.
June 23, 20223 yr I've probably told this story before. When I was in my early 20's I worked with a guy who was diagnosed with schizophrenia. We would often see hm having a full on fist fights with people who were not there. He sometimes got violent with others I worked with but didn't with me. He had been arrested and been before judges. His mother tried to have him committed but judge denied committing him against his will. He bought a gun a shot someone before shooting himself in the head. It was amazing to me then and amazing to me now that everyone knew he was a ticking time bomb and he still had no problem buying a gun. I don't think red flag laws are unconstitutional. You don't have an unconditional right to buy a product at any age in any mental state. We have several laws pertaining to this already.
June 23, 20223 yr wait, what does "expanding background checks on 18-21 year old buyers" mean? harsher for them? also, this seems like one of those knee jerk bills that actually does nothing but giving politicians something to show. more laws doesnt mean more safety............
June 23, 20223 yr The school provisions include: Creation of a federal clearinghouse on school safety standards to compile best practices and data to make developmentally appropriate recommendations. $1.05 billion for school improvement programs intended to increase attendance and engagement in schools and community learning centers. The bill would prevent this type of grant from being used to provide any person with dangerous weapons or training to use dangerous weapons, like guns. $1 billion for safe schools and citizenship education, with $500 million set aside for school-based mental health grants and another $500 million for grants to mental health professional development. $28 million for school-based trauma support The mental health provisions include: $80 million for pediatric rapid care for mental health $60 million in mental health training for pediatricians $50 million in grants for school-based mental health through the Children's Health Insurance Program. $150 million for the suicide crisis hotline $250 million for community mental health The agreement falls far short of Biden's calls for comprehensive gun control legislation, including a ban on military-style semiautomatic rifles and universal background checks. But many Democrats and gun safety advocates are celebrating the bipartisan legislation as an important incremental step — with Democrats promising further action on guns in the future.
June 23, 20223 yr 16 minutes ago, Gannan said: I've probably told this story before. When I was in my early 20's I worked with a guy who was diagnosed with schizophrenia. We would often see hm having a full on fist fights with people who were not there. He sometimes got violent with others I worked with but didn't with me. He had been arrested and been before judges. His mother tried to have him committed but judge denied committing him against his will. He bought a gun a shot someone before shooting himself in the head. It was amazing to me then and amazing to me now that everyone knew he was a ticking time bomb and he still had no problem buying a gun. I don't think red flag laws are unconstitutional. You don't have an unconditional right to buy a product at any age in any mental state. We have several laws pertaining to this already. If he’s put through a psychological evaluation and found to have a severe psychological disorder, I don’t see the problem (in principle at least). The problem is when you have red flag laws based on third party reports. You can’t just take away someone’s constitutional right because someone else claims they shouldn’t have it.
June 23, 20223 yr 16 minutes ago, TEW said: If he’s put through a psychological evaluation and found to have a severe psychological disorder, I don’t see the problem (in principle at least). The problem is when you have red flag laws based on third party reports. You can’t just take away someone’s constitutional right because someone else claims they shouldn’t have it. I agree with that, but if someone is arrested for violent behavior that shouldn't be considered a 3rd party claim. Maybe a judge can trigger the red flag. That seems like enough due process.
June 23, 20223 yr 20 minutes ago, Gannan said: I agree with that, but if someone is arrested for violent behavior that shouldn't be considered a 3rd party claim. Maybe a judge can trigger the red flag. That seems like enough due process. Most states limit red flag reporting to some combination of household members, law enforcement, psychologists and school administrators. Obviously you want to take reports seriously, but threading the needle of taking good faith reports seriously while protecting people from abuse of a reporting system and preserving their rights is a real challenge. I haven’t read the bill but I’m skeptical it can do those things simultaneously.
June 24, 20223 yr 2 hours ago, TEW said: Most states limit red flag reporting to some combination of household members, law enforcement, psychologists and school administrators. Obviously you want to take reports seriously, but threading the needle of taking good faith reports seriously while protecting people from abuse of a reporting system and preserving their rights is a real challenge. I haven’t read the bill but I’m skeptical it can do those things simultaneously. The government in PA can't figure out how to get the lines on the road to show up on a rainy night. I have 0 faith they can navigate a system like that efficiently
June 24, 20223 yr 57 minutes ago, BFit said: The government in PA can't figure out how to get the lines on the road to show up on a rainy night. I have 0 faith they can navigate a system like that efficiently Right. This my reluctance to accept any of this crap, because we all know it’s a slippery slope that the left is going to dump lubricant on.
June 24, 20223 yr Author 10 hours ago, TEW said: Right. This my reluctance to accept any of this crap, because we all know it’s a slippery slope that the left is going to dump lubricant on.
June 24, 20223 yr Author 15 hours ago, BFit said: wait, what does "expanding background checks on 18-21 year old buyers" mean? harsher for them? It will incentivize states to give to access juvenile records that are currently sealed, if that young adult wishes to purchase a firearm. Instead of giving the youth benefit of doubt because the records are sealed, let's find out if this person may act out violently if they want a firearm. Many mass shooters are under 21 years old, and we know brains don't fully mature until they're older in their 20s.
June 24, 20223 yr 15 hours ago, Gannan said: I've probably told this story before. When I was in my early 20's I worked with a guy who was diagnosed with schizophrenia. We would often see hm having a full on fist fights with people who were not there. He sometimes got violent with others I worked with but didn't with me. He had been arrested and been before judges. His mother tried to have him committed but judge denied committing him against his will. He bought a gun a shot someone before shooting himself in the head. It was amazing to me then and amazing to me now that everyone knew he was a ticking time bomb and he still had no problem buying a gun. I don't think red flag laws are unconstitutional. You don't have an unconditional right to buy a product at any age in any mental state. We have several laws pertaining to this already. Interestingly as an aside, after the ruling on Obamacare you don’t even have a right NOT to buy a product The left just wants to be able to control people. And then they call US fascists
June 24, 20223 yr 15 hours ago, Mike030270 said: The school provisions include: Creation of a federal clearinghouse on school safety standards to compile best practices and data to make developmentally appropriate recommendations. $1.05 billion for school improvement programs intended to increase attendance and engagement in schools and community learning centers. The bill would prevent this type of grant from being used to provide any person with dangerous weapons or training to use dangerous weapons, like guns. $1 billion for safe schools and citizenship education, with $500 million set aside for school-based mental health grants and another $500 million for grants to mental health professional development. $28 million for school-based trauma support add up all those dollar amounts and divide them by the 130,000+ schools in the united states. that's like $20,000-$25,000 per school.
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