Julio Jones (Falcons WR) -- TRADED TO TENNESSEE

[nipples]

2 hours ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

There are trends you can follow. For instance, top paid receivers in the salary cap era:

 

Cris Carter - No rings, no SB

Randy Moss - no rings, 1 SB (made a second later on as a backup player on a small salary)

Terrell Owens - No Rings, 1 SB (but wasn’t needed to get there)

Deandre Hopkins- No Rings, No SB (yet)

Julio Jones - No Rings, 1 SB

Herman Moore - No Rings, No SB

Javon Walker - No rings, No SB

Calvin Johnson - No rings, No SB

Andre Johnson - No rings, No SB

Wes Welker - No rings, 2 SB

Larry fitzgerald - No Rings, 1 SB

Antonio Brown - No rings, no SB (won a ring last year as a backup on a small contract)

Dez Bryant - No Rings, no SB

Eric Moulds - No rings, no SB

Steve Smith - no rings, 1 SB

Davante Adams - No Rings, No SB

Jimmy Smith - No Rings, No SB

Tim Brown - No Rings, 1 SB

Even Jerry Rice post-salary cap - no rings, 1 SB

 

You can make excuses for each of them, but it is an interesting trend when compared to this list:

Top Safeties of the salary Cap era

Ed Reed - 1 Ring, 1 SB

Earl Thomas - 1 ring, 2 SB

John Lynch - 1 ring, 1 SB

Steve Atwater - 2 ring, 3 SB

Eugene Robinson - 1 ring, 3 SB

Darren Sharper- 1 ring, 1 SB

Malcolm Jenkins - 2 ring, 2 SB

Leroy Butler - 1 ring, 2 SB

Tyrone Braxton - 2 ring, 4 SB

Rod Woodson - 1 ring, 2 SB

Cam Chancellor - 1 ring, 2 SB

Troy Polamalu - 2 ring, 3 SB

Lawyer Milloy - 1 ring, 2 SB

Devin Mccourty - 3 rings, 5 SB

Tyrann Matthieu - 1 ring, 1 SB

Bob Sanders - 1 ring, 2 SB

 

 

there are a couple of exceptions, of course. Brian Dawkins and Marvin Harrison to name one of each... but this is a pretty astounding trend. Obviously every position matters, but historically speaking WR does not play out as a priority position to spend salary space on. 

Ok but we have to remember that the Patriots domination in the current era skews a lot of numbers. They generally haven’t had a top paid receiver through most of their dominance. Look at the Eagles with TO. Harrison with Indy would have likely had another ring at least if not for NE. Julio should have one, but we know what happened. 
 

I just have a hard time really ignoring that one team, which is an anomaly that we likely won’t see again real soon, dominated the league for so long. I think now that Brady is gone to TB, and the Patriots reign is over, you’ll see more top WRs getting rings in the coming seasons. 
 

Also, isn’t Tyreek Hill one of the highest paid receivers in the nfl? And he got a ring two years ago. 

[Infam]

Well, we have Smith and Reagor, so Jones would certainly help them. Besides he would still have at least two good years at the X.

If it is true that he can be had for a second, I for one would be all for it.

[Portyansky]

2 hours ago, Infam said:

Well, we have Smith and Reagor, so Jones would certainly help them. Besides he would still have at least two good years at the X.

If it is true that he can be had for a second, I for one would be all for it.

Problem isn't so much giving up a draft pick. It's his salary. I highly doubt this happens. Howie is building a young team on O, starting at the skill positions.

[Aerolithe_Lion]

4 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

I don’t put much into these rumors anymore. How many times have the Eagles been linked to trading for a star player? How often have we gotten said player? The Eagles aren’t getting Jones or any of these guys. Not to mention Jones is over thirty coming off a lesser season, seems to have red zone issues despite his size, and was hobbled with some injuries. I don’t see Jones as a good match for the Eagles right now anyway although one could argue Jones could bring to the offense as much as Jeffery brought to that SB offense. 

I agree with most of it, but Watson’s circumstance is unprecedented. Never has a QB of his age and ability been available. If there ever was a position Philadelphia valued more than maybe any team in the league (and sometimes ridiculously), it’s quarterback. And if there was ever a year in the Jeffrey Lurie era we needed one, it’s this year.... or 1998 because £¥€% Bobby hoying 

 

The stars align

[EazyEaglez]

1 hour ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

I agree with most of it, but Watson’s circumstance is unprecedented. Never has a QB of his age and ability been available. If there ever was a position Philadelphia valued more than maybe any team in the league (and sometimes ridiculously), it’s quarterback. And if there was ever a year in the Jeffrey Lurie era we needed one, it’s this year.... or 1998 because £¥€% Bobby hoying 

 

The stars align

I think the people in Miami feel the same way. I guess it’s at least good he’d be moving to another division. Heck the Texans could even stick it to the Cowboys a little too. Nevertheless you see how it goes. The next hot name on the trade block and the Eagles are always mentioned, but they rarely actually get the player. 

[Infam]

1 hour ago, Portyansky said:

Problem isn't so much giving up a draft pick. It's his salary. I highly doubt this happens. Howie is building a young team on O, starting at the skill positions.

Salary is not a problem. We should get 8.5M for cutting Ertz, and another 4M for the designated June 1 cuts. So you restructure one guy and we're good even with draft picks.

Or you could just give him a new contract and pay him less this year and more the next year, and add guaranteed money (only 2M next year and nothing the year after atm).

Cap is the one thing that will certainly not stand in the way. If he wants to come here though is another story.

[UK_EaglesFan89]

6 hours ago, Infam said:

Salary is not a problem. We should get 8.5M for cutting Ertz, and another 4M for the designated June 1 cuts. So you restructure one guy and we're good even with draft picks.

And what about addressing the biggest issue which is CB #2?

[Infam]

2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

And what about addressing the biggest issue which is CB #2?

Well, there would be a hole, no doubt. Question is: if you just can't get the guys you want there, do you really throw a lot of money at someone just to get anyone? 

That would be a mistake Giants-style.

[Aerolithe_Lion]

13 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

I think the people in Miami feel the same way. I guess it’s at least good he’d be moving to another division. Heck the Texans could even stick it to the Cowboys a little too. Nevertheless you see how it goes. The next hot name on the trade block and the Eagles are always mentioned, but they rarely actually get the player. 

As In the Dolphins? I don’t understand why teams are so deadset at giving up on a top 10 QB after his rookie year 

[EazyEaglez]

40 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

As In the Dolphins? I don’t understand why teams are so deadset at giving up on a top 10 QB after his rookie year 

I’m not sure why teams are dead set on chasing quarterbacks at all. Most of this top guys kill the cap and in most cases hurts their chances in actually winning the bowl.

[Aerolithe_Lion]

18 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

I’m not sure why teams are dead set on chasing quarterbacks at all. Most of this top guys kill the cap and in most cases hurts their chances in actually winning the bowl.

Hmm; I don’t agree with that. Only 2 teams can go to the super bowl every year, so odds dictate that many big contracts miss out. But the participants over the last 20 years are littered with huge deals. 
 

It’s an argument of getting a great QB and holding on to him, vs a Nick Foles situation coming along. Playing the odds 

[UK_EaglesFan89]

9 hours ago, Infam said:

Well, there would be a hole, no doubt. Question is: if you just can't get the guys you want there, do you really throw a lot of money at someone just to get anyone? 

That would be a mistake Giants-style.

I don't think you need to throw a lot of money at it though. I just think right now it's going to be hard to assess how Gannon does because he's got such a gaping hole at CB #2.

[jsdarkstar]

Julio is old, chokes in big games, and will cost way too much in money and picks. We need help in the secondary more than WR.

[eggs]

On 5/25/2021 at 12:50 PM, Aerolithe_Lion said:

There are trends you can follow. For instance, top paid receivers in the salary cap era:

 

Cris Carter - No rings, no SB

Randy Moss - no rings, 1 SB (made a second later on as a backup player on a small salary)

Terrell Owens - No Rings, 1 SB (but wasn’t needed to get there)

Deandre Hopkins- No Rings, No SB (yet)

Julio Jones - No Rings, 1 SB

Herman Moore - No Rings, No SB

Javon Walker - No rings, No SB

Calvin Johnson - No rings, No SB

Andre Johnson - No rings, No SB

Wes Welker - No rings, 2 SB

Larry fitzgerald - No Rings, 1 SB

Antonio Brown - No rings, no SB (won a ring last year as a backup on a small contract)

Dez Bryant - No Rings, no SB

Eric Moulds - No rings, no SB

Steve Smith - no rings, 1 SB

Davante Adams - No Rings, No SB

Jimmy Smith - No Rings, No SB

Tim Brown - No Rings, 1 SB

Even Jerry Rice post-salary cap - no rings, 1 SB

 

You can make excuses for each of them, but it is an interesting trend when compared to this list:

Top Safeties of the salary Cap era

Ed Reed - 1 Ring, 1 SB

Earl Thomas - 1 ring, 2 SB

John Lynch - 1 ring, 1 SB

Steve Atwater - 2 ring, 3 SB

Eugene Robinson - 1 ring, 3 SB

Darren Sharper- 1 ring, 1 SB

Malcolm Jenkins - 2 ring, 2 SB

Leroy Butler - 1 ring, 2 SB

Tyrone Braxton - 2 ring, 4 SB

Rod Woodson - 1 ring, 2 SB

Cam Chancellor - 1 ring, 2 SB

Troy Polamalu - 2 ring, 3 SB

Lawyer Milloy - 1 ring, 2 SB

Devin Mccourty - 3 rings, 5 SB

Tyrann Matthieu - 1 ring, 1 SB

Bob Sanders - 1 ring, 2 SB

 

 

there are a couple of exceptions, of course. Brian Dawkins and Marvin Harrison to name one of each... but this is a pretty astounding trend. Obviously every position matters, but historically speaking WR does not play out as a priority position to spend salary space on. 

Good stats — thanks. 

[EazyEaglez]

On 5/26/2021 at 10:16 AM, Aerolithe_Lion said:

Hmm; I don’t agree with that. Only 2 teams can go to the super bowl every year, so odds dictate that many big contracts miss out. But the participants over the last 20 years are littered with huge deals. 
 

It’s an argument of getting a great QB and holding on to him, vs a Nick Foles situation coming along. Playing the odds 

What in the last 20 years only like 2 top five drafted quarterbacks won a Super Bowl, and just consider how the Texans just imploded cause they couldn’t afford their players. On top of that quarterbacks are now acting like NBA players and demanding big salaries and to leave whenever they want to. The Seahawks haven’t won the bowl since they had to pay Wilson the big bucks. 

[ManchesterEagle]

On 5/26/2021 at 6:48 AM, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

And what about addressing the biggest issue which is CB #2?

 

13 hours ago, jsdarkstar said:

Julio is old, chokes in big games, and will cost way too much in money and picks. We need help in the secondary more than WR.

Agreed. This makes very little sense for the Eagles. We have two first rounders who need to play.

I’m hoping Jones goes to either the Pats or the Titans so they can sweep Miami/Indy.

[Aerolithe_Lion]

8 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

What in the last 20 years only like 2 top five drafted quarterbacks won a Super Bowl, and just consider how the Texans just imploded cause they couldn’t afford their players. On top of that quarterbacks are now acting like NBA players and demanding big salaries and to leave whenever they want to. The Seahawks haven’t won the bowl since they had to pay Wilson the big bucks. 

We’re talking about salary cap considerations, not draft position. No one is drafting Julio, and we already know how he performs at the NFL level.

 

The Seahawks just went 12-4, and may be even better this year. RW is as I said previously, 32 teams, all the big contracts can win every year. How many years has Russell been on his contract? 2? 3? "The Seahawks haven’t won the bowl since”. You’re implying they let him walk and go with someone else and they improve their chances?

As for the Texans, the didn’t have salary cap issues that had. They imploded due to terrible management. They got rid of Deandre because the coach didn’t like him, and then they fired that coach immediately after. They traded all their draft picks for Laremy Tunsil, which are a windfall to salary cap relief. 

[Aerolithe_Lion]

Evidently he also wants Philly

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/jasonffl/status/1399395969997832193

 

[Aerolithe_Lion]

Somehow we’re up to third in prop betting

PointsBet has Seattle as a +225 proposition to make the deal, followed by the Titans at +250. Next come the Eagles at +275, followed by the Ravens and 49ers at +300.

[Vee]

On 5/26/2021 at 10:16 AM, Aerolithe_Lion said:

Hmm; I don’t agree with that. Only 2 teams can go to the super bowl every year, so odds dictate that many big contracts miss out. But the participants over the last 20 years are littered with huge deals. 
 

It’s an argument of getting a great QB and holding on to him, vs a Nick Foles situation coming along. Playing the odds 

Of the last 15 Super Bowl winners the average winning quarterback salary was 8 percent of their team’s overall cap. Conversely the average of the top five quarterback salaries averaged 15 percent of the team’s cap of the same year.  Three times in those fifteen years did the winning QBs salary rank amongst the top 5 and one-third of the winning QBs were on their rookie contract.  Average Super Bowl winning QB’s salary applied to the cap for this period was $10.9 million. The top five QBs salary applied to cap was $18.8 million compared to  the average top 5 running back’s salary applied was $8.2 million, and the top 5 wide receiver salary applied was $12.1 million. 

 

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/max-qb-sb-ring-facts-data-ryan-mccumber/

[Aerolithe_Lion]

1 hour ago, Vee said:

Of the last 15 Super Bowl winners the average winning quarterback salary was 8 percent of their team’s overall cap. Conversely the average of the top five quarterback salaries averaged 15 percent of the team’s cap of the same year.  Three times in those fifteen years did the winning QBs salary rank amongst the top 5 and one-third of the winning QBs were on their rookie contract.  Average Super Bowl winning QB’s salary applied to the cap for this period was $10.9 million. The top five QBs salary applied to cap was $18.8 million compared to  the average top 5 running back’s salary applied was $8.2 million, and the top 5 wide receiver salary applied was $12.1 million. 

 

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/max-qb-sb-ring-facts-data-ryan-mccumber/

Thats without proper context. Only during the first couple years of a QB’s new deal is it in the top echelon, yet people act like signing a guy for 6 years means he’s at the top of the list for all 6 years.

Take Derek Carr for instance. He once had the richest contract IN NFL HISTORY. Now, still on that contract, if he won the Super Bowl people would say they did it with a guy who had a modest deal.

 

In 2008 when Roethlisberger won he was on a long term mega deal that wasn’t so mega by that year. Same with Peyton In 2015, he was on the tail end of his contract. A-rod today. If he had won the Super Bowl last year (which he got a lot closer to beating the chiefs than Mahomes did), he would have done so on a contract most deem dramatically underpaid... despite it also once being the biggest ever

[EazyEaglez]

5 hours ago, Vee said:

Of the last 15 Super Bowl winners the average winning quarterback salary was 8 percent of their team’s overall cap. Conversely the average of the top five quarterback salaries averaged 15 percent of the team’s cap of the same year.  Three times in those fifteen years did the winning QBs salary rank amongst the top 5 and one-third of the winning QBs were on their rookie contract.  Average Super Bowl winning QB’s salary applied to the cap for this period was $10.9 million. The top five QBs salary applied to cap was $18.8 million compared to  the average top 5 running back’s salary applied was $8.2 million, and the top 5 wide receiver salary applied was $12.1 million. 

 

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/max-qb-sb-ring-facts-data-ryan-mccumber/

Yeah I think it’s just as easy for people to say top five receivers do not win as they could say highly paid quarterbacks don’t win. Even Brady understands this and that’s why he prefers to take less in order to be able to field a team. The Chiefs had to pay Mahomes and basically had to let Sammy Watkins go. By the way Sammy Watkins and Tyreek Hill and Watkins are both great receivers and kind of debunk the idea they can’t help you win don’t they? 

[ManchesterEagle]

10 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

Yeah I think it’s just as easy for people to say top five receivers do not win as they could say highly paid quarterbacks don’t win. Even Brady understands this and that’s why he prefers to take less in order to be able to field a team. The Chiefs had to pay Mahomes and basically had to let Sammy Watkins go. By the way Sammy Watkins and Tyreek Hill and Watkins are both great receivers and kind of debunk the idea they can’t help you win don’t they? 

To be fair, Mahomes took a very team friendly deal. 

The nightmare contracts are the ones like Watson/Prescott etc where you are starting to incur cap hits of close to 40 million a year and that really limits what you can do. It still makes me laugh that people think we can trade for and effectively restructure Watson's contract so we are under the cap this year.

I wouldn't call Watkins great, but Hill is very good. 

The point I've always made is that most of the Super Bowl winning teams don't have a true stud number 1 receiver, yet that's probably the position that fans obsess about the most other than QB. And stud WRs can be taken out of the game relatively easily by a good D/DC. 

You definitely need enough weapons to move the ball though. Hopefully we have that now with Smith, Reagor, Goedert, Sanders etc. 

[metal]

Traded to the Titans.

[EazyEaglez]

I hope this is the wake up call people needed. They’re always putting the Eagles in these trade rumors and the truth is the Eagles do not make these types of moves very often.