Derek Barnett and our DL moving forward

[CheesesteakNBeer]

Before i begin, let me say this. I was definitely on the wagon to label this guy a bust and send the guy packing. Boneheaded play after boneheaded play, low productivity game in and game out. But it seems like the last few weeks he's tried harder to clean that up.

Now the fun part. We all know how 1st round picks get treated, multiple chances and excuses. The time is almost there to make a decision on this guy. Keep in mind all of the holes this team has especially on defense, can the eagles afford to let him walk? 

My guess on the 2022-23 DL

DE 1st rd Rookie

DE Brandon Graham on a 1 year deal

DE Josh Sweat

DE Tarron Jackson?

DT Fletcher Cox (Contractually locked)

DT Javon Hargrave

DT Milton Williams

DT 1st-3rd rd Rookie

That's my guess if they let Barnett walk.

Thoughts?

Times Yours

[NOTW]

36 minutes ago, CheesesteakNBeer said:

DE Brandon Graham on a 1 year deal

Brandon Graham is currently signed through 2026, a significant cap hit the next 2 years, unless they wait until after June 1st to cut him. Howie once again kicked the can down the road on an older player who is now being paid to sit on IR and is on the decline.  

 

[NOTW]

Barnett isn't worth re-signing he'll want a big deal and he's too much of a liability.  Sweat is ok, decent but not great.  They should look to draft a DE (no idea what the draft class looks like for DE this year).  

They need to start thinking future at DT as well.  Williams is a decent backup, could grow into a starter, need another young DT to develop.

[Mike030270]

Past few weeks? Didn't he F up just last week?

[time2rock]

With 10 picks in April’s draft, it wouldn’t surprise me if we spent 2 picks on DE, especially considering it is projected as a strong class at the position.  Further, I wouldn’t be shocked to see them both taken by round 3.

But just because Barnett finally started to "try harder to clean up” his boneheaded play, I wouldn’t pay him top dollar to retain him.  He offers very little as a pass rusher.  Now if we could sign him to a team friendly, 1 year minimal deal, I’d think differently.  

[kiwieagle]

1 hour ago, NOTW said:

(no idea what the draft class looks like for DE this year).  

Good - much stronger and deeper than recent years

[brkmsn]

11 hours ago, NOTW said:

Brandon Graham is currently signed through 2026, a significant cap hit the next 2 years, unless they wait until after June 1st to cut him. Howie once again kicked the can down the road on an older player who is now being paid to sit on IR and is on the decline.  

 

You're correct that Graham is an "older player." Where has he showed signs of decline, though? Coming off his best season (last season) he suffered a rare (for him) injury this year. If anything, this season we have seen just how valuable Graham is to our overall defensive success. He gets pressure on QBs in every game and is one of the best DEs vs the run. He's also one of our most vocal team leaders on game day. 

I get that this is a chance for you to take a shot at Howie --- as if Howie should have expected a player that hadn't missed a game due to injury since 2011 to have a season-ending injury. But Graham has been one of those players worthy of a late career extension at the level he was playing and his track record of dependability. 

[Wormlegs]

I would like to see them get major DE help that can get more pressure whether FA or draft. I think Barnett should walk and shouldnt be resigned. He is mediocre to average at best. 

[time2rock]

11 minutes ago, Wormlegs said:

I would like to see them get major DE help that can get more pressure whether FA or draft. I think Barnett should walk and shouldnt be resigned. He is mediocre to average at best. 

Have to wonder how much the complete lack of pressure on the QB is related to the scheme.  I mean we are basically trotting out the same personnel as last season (minus Graham now) where we ranked 3rd in the league (behind only the Rams and Steelers) with 49 sacks.  

[Wormlegs]

Just now, time2rock said:

Have to wonder how much the complete lack of pressure on the QB is related to the scheme.  I mean we are basically trotting out the same personnel as last season (minus Graham now) where we ranked 3rd in the league (behind only the Rams and Steelers) with 49 sacks.  

yeah its pretty weird. Earlier in the year I remember an article where Cox was complaining about the scheme / not attacking the QB enough so maybe it really is a scheme thing. I hope they dont "plug the gap" with DE and actually try to find some beast player(s) where the Eagles defense can be feared again

[birdman#12]

Except for Hargrave, Sweat and Williams, the eagles need a total revamp of their defensive line.

Barnett, Kerrigan, Cox and Graham should all be gone......barnett is terrible and stupid, kerrigan and Cox are done and graham will be 34 coming off an achilles tear.

Most overrated defensive line in the NFL.   The eagles need to use most of those draft picks on defensive players  

[birdman#12]

48 minutes ago, brkmsn said:

You're correct that Graham is an "older player." Where has he showed signs of decline, though? Coming off his best season (last season) he suffered a rare (for him) injury this year. If anything, this season we have seen just how valuable Graham is to our overall defensive success. He gets pressure on QBs in every game and is one of the best DEs vs the run. He's also one of our most vocal team leaders on game day. 

I get that this is a chance for you to take a shot at Howie --- as if Howie should have expected a player that hadn't missed a game due to injury since 2011 to have a season-ending injury. But Graham has been one of those players worthy of a late career extension at the level he was playing and his track record of dependability. 

But age WILL catch up with him and he will be 34 coming off an achilles injury......he is a high risk/cost, low reward player at this point.  The eagles need to get some good young talent in here to develop.  Can't wait for his "decline", which could come at any time and for too high a cost.....

IMO, It's time to cut ties with these high cost veterans and move on....

[NOTW]

1 hour ago, brkmsn said:

You're correct that Graham is an "older player." Where has he showed signs of decline, though? Coming off his best season (last season) he suffered a rare (for him) injury this year. If anything, this season we have seen just how valuable Graham is to our overall defensive success. He gets pressure on QBs in every game and is one of the best DEs vs the run. He's also one of our most vocal team leaders on game day. 

I get that this is a chance for you to take a shot at Howie --- as if Howie should have expected a player that hadn't missed a game due to injury since 2011 to have a season-ending injury. But Graham has been one of those players worthy of a late career extension at the level he was playing and his track record of dependability. 

Signing contracts too long term. Graham, Brooks, Johnson, held onto Peters too long. 

[DawkinsOwnage03]

No he needs to go 

[Cochis_Calhoun]

1 hour ago, Wormlegs said:

yeah its pretty weird. Earlier in the year I remember an article where Cox was complaining about the scheme / not attacking the QB enough so maybe it really is a scheme thing. I hope they dont "plug the gap" with DE and actually try to find some beast player(s) where the Eagles defense can be feared again

Cox's chief complaint about the scheme was he sometimes lined up 3 technique (outside shoulder of the guard) and sometimes 4 (covering the tackle shading to the inside shoulder), I don't believe that a minor shift like that can take production off a cliff.  My own view is that the Vets knew that this wasn't a year they'd be competing and have dropped their effort a notch, it may not even have been deliberate just a subconscious thing, it's also hard to escape that Cox, Kerrigan and Graham's peak years are in the rear view mirror.

[John Blutarski]

He's run his course. Let him walk and draft a DE with one of the 1st or 2nd round picks.

[CheesesteakNBeer]

So the general consensus is to hand Barnett his walking papers this offseason. Once again with Howie, if he walks it's another deliberate kick in the nuts when considering wasted draft capital. 😥 I wish i could continuously f up at work and know my job is safe...

[brkmsn]

9 hours ago, NOTW said:

Signing contracts too long term. Graham, Brooks, Johnson, held onto Peters too long. 

Peters wasn't on a long term deal his last two seasons with us. His last season here was terrible, but we weren't still paying for him after he left. Lane Johnson may be the best RT in the NFL this year. The dude is currently 31 years old. He still has several good seasons of play left in his body. We know Brooks is one of the best when he's on the field, but yeah ... he's made a lot of money for very few starts the last couple seasons. His contract is a concern. But I'm not worried about Graham or Johnson just because they are currently dealing with or just dealt with one significant injury. 

There aren't a lot of "iron men" playing in the NFL. Almost every player is going to experience at least one major injury if they are a starter for several seasons. Every player will experience minor injuries during their career. I'm not worried about the "normal." As I said, Brooks' recent injury history is outside the "normal" parameter. His injuries are almost always major. So even I am concerned at this point about his ability to stay healthy. I'm not concerned at all, though, with Graham or Johnson at this point. 

[EazyEaglez]

If Barnett wishes to be a rotational end and get paid as such then fine, but bringing the Pat guy back as a starter would be an absolute mistake. The guy still basically has one pass rush move and hasn’t really developed at all. He’s a dumb player who makes bad mistakes. He only has two sacks this year. He’s not a starter in the league. The Eagles need to get better defensive linemen. 

[PoconoDon]

Bye Barnett...good luck

[Jeep_man]

Yeah Barnett is done...

 

But I am awfully confused as to why Kerrigan was signed, I believe he still has 1 or 2 good years left, Gannon is just not using him as a DE, I see him lined up at line backer etc during games.. What a waste of a signing....

[time2rock]

52 minutes ago, Jeep_man said:

Yeah Barnett is done...

 

But I am awfully confused as to why Kerrigan was signed, I believe he still has 1 or 2 good years left, Gannon is just not using him as a DE, I see him lined up at line backer etc during games.. What a waste of a signing....

Kerrigan should have been a good signing.  I don’t think Gannon knows what he is doing yet, how to properly scheme to the strengths of his players (which is ironic considered that is what he was preaching after being hired).  We went from ranking 3rd in the league in sack total last year to being one of the worst this season by basically trotting out the same personnel (minus Graham).  

[Jeep_man]

1 hour ago, time2rock said:

Kerrigan should have been a good signing.  I don’t think Gannon knows what he is doing yet, how to properly scheme to the strengths of his players (which is ironic considered that is what he was preaching after being hired).  We went from ranking 3rd in the league in sack total last year to being one of the worst this season by basically trotting out the same personnel (minus Graham).  

AT bare minimum Kerrigan should have replaced Graham's sack productivity, they are both the same age with Kerrigan having the lesser injury history..

 

Kerrigan's production being what it is, is all on Gannon..  I see him running around covering RBs, standing up instead of having his hands down on the ground when lined up as a DE and just flat out looking lost out there...

 

This D has a lot more potential than what it is currently showing..

[time2rock]

4 minutes ago, Jeep_man said:

This D has a lot more potential than what it is currently showing..

That’s what she said!!  

 

[Bwestbrook36]

1 hour ago, time2rock said:

Kerrigan should have been a good signing.  I don’t think Gannon knows what he is doing yet, how to properly scheme to the strengths of his players (which is ironic considered that is what he was preaching after being hired).  We went from ranking 3rd in the league in sack total last year to being one of the worst this season by basically trotting out the same personnel (minus Graham).  

Kerrigan was an outside rush linebacker in a 3-4 his entire career..... Howie signs him to play in a 4-3 zone scheme for a coach who doesn't blitz.