8 minutes ago, Boogyman said:

Has Manchin been deemed a "DINO" yet and been excommunicated from the party?

Just now, Procus said:

Manchin is not what he seems to be to many.  He is not a R disguised as a D.  It's just that in today's times, if a D is not a de facto socialist, they're deemed not real D's

Manchin is running for President. He is staking out the middle ground, and it just might work.

Just now, The_Omega said:

Manchin is running for President. He is staking out the middle ground, and it just might work.

He'll never secure the nomination.  But if he did secure the nomination, he could very well be just what this country needs if he can move the Democratic party closer to the center.  Too much wood for one man to chop.

54 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

The problem is simple -- Biden is stuck. The right move would have been to start with Manchin, get him on board, and then try to strong arm the far left by saying it was Manchin's deal or nothing. But...Bernie Sanders is the Chairman of the Budget Committee in the Senate. Putting aside how completely insane that is (it's like making Donald Trump chair of the Ethics Committee), it meant that he got to craft the first version of the bill at $6 trillion. Now...Biden should have stopped him and told him to be more realistic, so that's on the White House. But they all bet that they could start at $6 trillion, go to ~$2 trillion, and Manchin would feel like he won and cave. They were wrong.

Now, if Biden takes Manchin's deal...watch Sanders and other progressives blow it up. Never forget -- Democrats are children who are incapable of accepting that politics is the art of the possible.

Careful.  If you point out that the far left has taken over the democrat party, you'll have about a dozen people spam this thread by reflexively dismissing that notion.     

13 minutes ago, Boogyman said:

Has Manchin been deemed a "DINO" yet and been excommunicated from the party?

 

I've been calling him that all along.

5 minutes ago, The_Omega said:

Manchin is running for President. He is staking out the middle ground, and it just might work.

I might just vote for him too.

 

Just now, EaglesRocker97 said:

 

I've been calling him that all along.

nevermind, I'm in.

4 minutes ago, paco said:

Careful.  If you point out that the far left has taken over the democrat party, you'll have about a dozen people spam this thread by reflexively dismissing that notion.     

Nowhere in there was an implication that the "far left has taken over the democrat party"

In the Senate, who beyond Bernie would be considered "far left"? 

The Democrats' margin in both chambers is so slim that a couple votes matter. But it's also why Manchin matters so much. 

If the far left had truly taken over the party infrastructure would not have passed.

Manchin for President? Lol, the dude has the personality of a houseplant.

10 minutes ago, Procus said:

Manchin is not what he seems to be to many.  He is not a R disguised as a D.  It's just that in today's times, if a D is not a de facto socialist, they're deemed not real D's

 

As opposed to any Republican that broke from the Trumplican party, right? 

 

So like I asked, have any other members of his party tried to take any action as revenge? Vote him off any committees yet? 

7 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

Nowhere in there was an implication that the "far left has taken over the democrat party"

In the Senate, who beyond Bernie would be considered "far left"? 

The Democrats' margin in both chambers is so slim that a couple votes matter. But it's also why Manchin matters so much. 

If the far left had truly taken over the party infrastructure would not have passed.

Did Elizabeth Warren resign from the Senate? Mazie Hirono? 

Hell, the progressives call Sanders the 17th most progressive Senator. I'm not going that far, but he's not some solo act.

https://progressivepunch.org/scores.htm?house=senate

5 minutes ago, Boogyman said:

As opposed to any Republican that broke from the Trumplican party, right?

So like I asked, have any other members of his party tried to take any action as revenge? Vote him off any committees yet? 

Removal from committees could happen if he becomes an Independent - who knows.

It wasn't so long ago where both parties had prominent centrists.  The D's had people like Sen. Scoop Jackson, R's had people like Arlen Specter.  You had both Dixiecrats AND Rockefeller Republicans.  And it was a better political system that provided for more compromise.  Today, for the most part, both parties are too polarized without a middle ground for compromise.  Centrists are needed in BOTH

7 minutes ago, Boogyman said:

So like I asked, have any other members of his party tried to take any action as revenge? Vote him off any committees yet? 

give it time. 

Just now, vikas83 said:

Did Elizabeth Warren resign from the Senate? Mazie Hirono?

I respect Bernie more than either of those two.  Warren is as fake as a $3 bill.  Hirono is just a stone cold idiot.

I don't like what Bernie stands for, but he believes in his bs, and has been true to himself through the years.

Just now, Procus said:

Removal from committees could happen if he becomes an Independent - who knows.

It wasn't so long ago where both parties had prominent centrists.  The D's had people like Sen. Scoop Jackson, R's had people like Arlen Specter.  You had both Dixiecrats AND Rockefeller Republicans.  And it was a better political system that provided for more compromise.  Today, for the most part, both parties are too polarized without a middle ground for compromise.  Centrists are needed in BOTH

So why such a partisan reply from earlier?  Especially from a guy such as yourself, who is so bipartisan nobody can even guess who you voted for?

2 minutes ago, Alpha_TATEr said:

give it time. 

It may come to pass. Maybe they will "Liz Cheney" him? Honestly the overall reaction from the party is going to be pretty interesting.

15 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

Nowhere in there was an implication that the "far left has taken over the democrat party"

In the Senate, who beyond Bernie would be considered "far left"? 

The Democrats' margin in both chambers is so slim that a couple votes matter. But it's also why Manchin matters so much. 

If the far left had truly taken over the party infrastructure would not have passed.

1 minute ago, vikas83 said:

Did Elizabeth Warren resign from the Senate? Mazie Hirono? 

Hell, the progressives call Sanders the 17th most progressive Senator. I'm not going that far, but he's not some solo act.

https://progressivepunch.org/scores.htm?house=senate

For the most part the progressives are setting the attempted high level policy agenda.  They aren't getting the exact results they are asking for but they are the ones driving the more visible agenda.  Biden and the moderates are essentially holding the fort.

8 minutes ago, Boogyman said:

So why such a partisan reply from earlier?  Especially from a guy such as yourself, who is so bipartisan nobody can even guess who you voted for?

Well we know YOU'RE not a bipartisan person.  Here's an example of what is being floated by the political left that YOU support wholeheartedly.

https://www.texastribune.org/2021/12/21/texas-abortion-law-transgender-pregnancy/?utm_campaign=trib-social&utm_content=1640096955&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

"Left out of the conversation”: Transgender Texans feel the impact of state’s restrictive abortion law

12 minutes ago, Procus said:

Well we know YOU'RE not a bipartisan person.  Here's an example of what is being floated by the political left that YOU support wholeheartedly.

https://www.texastribune.org/2021/12/21/texas-abortion-law-transgender-pregnancy/?utm_campaign=trib-social&utm_content=1640096955&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

"Left out of the conversation”: Transgender Texans feel the impact of state’s restrictive abortion law

That didn't answer the question at all. 

 

Also you said a few days ago you are part of the party you are registered to. Do you still feel that way, or was that just yesterday?

13 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

Did Elizabeth Warren resign from the Senate? Mazie Hirono? 

Hell, the progressives call Sanders the 17th most progressive Senator. I'm not going that far, but he's not some solo act.

https://progressivepunch.org/scores.htm?house=senate

that's fair on Warren and Hirono, but there's only one senator (Bernie) who's on the Progressive caucus. most dems are voting with their party, so it's not shocking to see a huge majority voting together as a bloc. that site seems a bit out of whack. 

given what is and is not getting passed, and how much leverage moderates appear to have on the Biden agenda, it's pretty difficult for me to buy that as a whole the Senate dems are being led by progressives. 

I'm not shocked those are the loudest voices. but again - infrastructure was passed in the house (which is generally even crazier than the senate) by spurning progressives and joining with a small group of moderate republicans. 

23 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

that's fair on Warren and Hirono, but there's only one senator (Bernie) who's on the Progressive caucus. most dems are voting with their party, so it's not shocking to see a huge majority voting together as a bloc. that site seems a bit out of whack. 

given what is and is not getting passed, and how much leverage moderates appear to have on the Biden agenda, it's pretty difficult for me to buy that as a whole the Senate dems are being led by progressives. 

I'm not shocked those are the loudest voices. but again - infrastructure was passed in the house (which is generally even crazier than the senate) by spurning progressives and joining with a small group of moderate republicans. 

Let's see if we can come to a conclusion here.

Would you agree that the Republicans are a lost cause while the Dems are under serious threat from their flank, who control the public narrative, yet holding under increasing pressure?

50 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

For the most part the progressives are setting the attempted high level policy agenda.  They aren't getting the exact results they are asking for but they are the ones driving the more visible agenda.  Biden and the moderates are essentially holding the fort.

No they’re not, Doc

6 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

Let's see if we can come to a conclusion here.

Would you agree that the Republicans are a lost cause while the Dems are under serious threat from their flank, who control the public narrative, yet holding under increasing pressure?

I can probably get on board with that to some degree. I still think the thread of progressives is a bit overstated, but maybe I'm just numb to how crazy the left has become because the right represents a threat to our democracy. 

1 minute ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

I can probably get on board with that to some degree. I still think the thread of progressives is a bit overstated, but maybe I'm just numb to how crazy the left has become because the right represents a threat to our democracy. 

6 people out of 535 members of Congress.   Talk about a faux bogeyman