39 minutes ago, Tnt4philly said:

Shape, clear, hold, and build worked a whole lot better when we stopped killing civilians. Who do you think will help us more, a father with two living kids, or a father whose kids were killed by our bombs?

False dichotomy and an appeal to emotion

fallacy double play

35 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

fallacy double play

every time you make a post

 

 

36 minutes ago, Imp81318 said:

I’m amazed that you actually think that is a reasonable expectation for response to a terrorist group purposely hiding among civilian infrastructure that just invaded and murdered random people indiscriminately and raped women. 

Yeah, you’d think my experience living under that very same expectation would have changed my mind but no. I still have higher expectations for my actions than I do of terrorists. 

45 minutes ago, Phillyterp85 said:

When did we stop killing civilians during the Iraq war?

https://www.iraqbodycount.org/database/

Wrong choice of words. The point is, the US took steps, that put our own troops at risk, to reduce civilian casualties. 

1 hour ago, Tnt4philly said:

Shape, clear, hold, and build worked a whole lot better when we stopped killing civilians. Who do you think will help us more, a father with two living kids, or a father whose kids were killed by our bombs?

Yeah I remember how Ghenkis Khan was able to conquer and hold because he brought everyone beer and flowers. 

5 minutes ago, Tnt4philly said:

Wrong choice of words. The point is, the US took steps, that put our own troops at risk, to reduce civilian casualties. 

Yet somehow Saddam deliberately killed civilians by the bushel and didn’t have the insurgency problems we did. 
 

So maybe it had to do with holding ground. Novel concept. 

3 minutes ago, Bill said:

So maybe it had to do with holding ground. Novel concept. 

Or maybe they both went hand in hand. Much easier to hold the ground when the civilian population is on your side, or at least not actively fighting you. Regardless of your opinion on whether the change in ROE had a positive impact or not, the fact is it happened. 

2 minutes ago, Tnt4philly said:

Or maybe they both went hand in hand. Much easier to hold the ground when the civilian population is on your side, or at least not actively fighting you. Regardless of your opinion on whether the change in ROE had a positive impact or not, the fact is it happened. 

Their issue wasn’t them getting killed in the crossfire. Their issue was with us leaving and the insurgents coming in for retribution. 
 

That’s why they didn’t help us.

1 hour ago, Tnt4philly said:

Wrong choice of words. The point is, the US took steps, that put our own troops at risk, to reduce civilian casualties. 

And still resulted in civilians making up 2/3 of the total casualty count.   
israel is taking steps to reduce civilian casualties as well. 

Anybody think this is an execution of the Hegelian Dialectic (problem, reaction, solution) spearheaded by a False Flag (create an issue and blame it on others)? 

I mean, Hamas would have to know if they did what they're accused of they would getting exactly what they're enduring now.

I heard one Israeli state that this was their 9/11, as it turns out 9/11 was an execution of the Hegelian Dialectic, the Problem was spearheaded by the False Flag of an inside job with the planes and blaming it on terrorists, the Reaction from the American public was to get them, the Solution was war which is what the US wanted all along.

The Solution is always what the executioner of the Hegelian Dialectic wanted all along, they just need the Reaction to support them. 

2 hours ago, EagleVA said:

Anybody think this is an execution of the Hegelian Dialectic (problem, reaction, solution) spearheaded by a False Flag (create an issue and blame it on others)? 

I mean, Hamas would have to know if they did what they're accused of they would getting exactly what they're enduring now.

I heard one Israeli state that this was their 9/11, as it turns out 9/11 was an execution of the Hegelian Dialectic, the Problem was spearheaded by the False Flag of an inside job with the planes and blaming it on terrorists, the Reaction from the American public was to get them, the Solution was war which is what the US wanted all along.

The Solution is always what the executioner of the Hegelian Dialectic wanted all along, they just need the Reaction to support them. 

I blame McNabb

 

My old college friend Jon Leibowitz (Stewart) gets it right for the most part.

12 hours ago, Dave Moss said:

every time you make a post

 

 

Its ok dave i dont expect you to understand logic

12 hours ago, Tnt4philly said:

Yeah, you’d think my experience living under that very same expectation would have changed my mind but no. I still have higher expectations for my actions than I do of terrorists. 

▶️ Watch this reel https://www.facebook.com/reel/711228317542347?fs=e&s=TIeQ9V&mibextid=0NULKw
 

4,000 kids in a few weeks seems excessive to me. Just my opinion, you don't need to share it, or approve it, or care.

1 hour ago, Imp81318 said:

▶️ Watch this reel https://www.facebook.com/reel/711228317542347?fs=e&s=TIeQ9V&mibextid=0NULKw
 

Blah blah blah, Hamas is evil. Blah blah blah.  I already know that Hamas is an evil organization and they need to be eliminated, but I don’t believe "we” have to be like them to do it. Revenge leads to revenge leads to revenge………

2 minutes ago, Tnt4philly said:

Blah blah blah, Hamas is evil. Blah blah blah.  I already know that Hamas is an evil organization and they need to be eliminated, but I don’t believe "we” have to be like them to do it. Revenge leads to revenge leads to revenge………

And I don’t think that "we” or Israel has in acted in any way that even remotely resembles the ruthless and barbaric actions of Hamas. 

16 minutes ago, Imp81318 said:

And I don’t think that "we” or Israel has in acted in any way that even remotely resembles the ruthless and barbaric actions of Hamas. 

I don't either, but the ridiculously low bar you have set, holds babies as shields.

12 hours ago, Phillyterp85 said:

And still resulted in civilians making up 2/3 of the total casualty count.   
israel is taking steps to reduce civilian casualties as well. 

Yeah, there are all kinds of stats on civilian casualties but my points are directed more at  nonchalant attitude on civilian war deaths that so many have here. 

 The fact is, at some point in the war we stopped bombing areas where there were civilians and those steps not only prevented civilian deaths, it put our troops at more risk. That doesn’t mean there were no more civilian casualties, just that we weren’t going to bomb a school full of children because insurgents launched a few mortars from a playground, or Mosque, or neighborhood……. 

The Gaza hospital is an example of heavy handed Israeli action. It is generally considered a war crime.

Flame on.

4 hours ago, TEW said:

this

Ackman taking this stuff… personally.

9 hours ago, EagleVA said:

Anybody think this is an execution of the Hegelian Dialectic (problem, reaction, solution) spearheaded by a False Flag (create an issue and blame it on others)? 

I mean, Hamas would have to know if they did what they're accused of they would getting exactly what they're enduring now.

I heard one Israeli state that this was their 9/11, as it turns out 9/11 was an execution of the Hegelian Dialectic, the Problem was spearheaded by the False Flag of an inside job with the planes and blaming it on terrorists, the Reaction from the American public was to get them, the Solution was war which is what the US wanted all along.

The Solution is always what the executioner of the Hegelian Dialectic wanted all along, they just need the Reaction to support them. 

dude, do the world a favor and go back to sucking on tailpipes. 

1 hour ago, Tnt4philly said:

Yeah, there are all kinds of stats on civilian casualties but my points are directed more at  nonchalant attitude on civilian war deaths that so many have here. 

 The fact is, at some point in the war we stopped bombing areas where there were civilians and those steps not only prevented civilian deaths, it put our troops at more risk. That doesn’t mean there were no more civilian casualties, just that we weren’t going to bomb a school full of children because insurgents launched a few mortars from a playground, or Mosque, or neighborhood……. 

If your argument is that Israel is relying to heavily on air power and rockets/missiles, as opposed to going in with troops and clearing targets building to building like we did in Fallujah, then I can understand that criticism. My hope would be that at some point Israel's tactics will shift to more of a ground campaign that focuses on clearing out pockets of resistance. But as you said, that puts IDF forces at greater risk. I don't know enough about Israel's military capabilities to know if they can commit the required forces to Gaza while still defending its borders in the North and the East.

I'd view this as honest debate/criticism of tactics. But that doesn't make what Israel is currently doing immoral or a war crime. Those are bold accusations that require proof well beyond non-sensical comparisons of civilian casualties in wildly different conflicts. 

27 minutes ago, Alpha_TATEr said:

dude, do the world a favor and go back to sucking on tailpipes. 

I mean, clearly he has been for quite some time now.