January 20, 20241 yr 59 minutes ago, TEW said: Boomers will be gone in 20 years, the religious right will be a much smaller percentage, and white Americans will be barely 50% of the population. Thats going to be a true challenge for Israel. On the other hand, AIPAC and the Saudis have a lot of pull, and the Jewish population will continue to be vastly overrepresented in elite circles. So they will still be influential, just less so. I'd argue the influence is deeper than that. It really is wild how much Jewish culture has impacted American society. For example, the earliest roots of US stand-up comedy via Vaudeville were significantly shaped by Jewish acts. Which of course eventually leaked into other forms of media as time went on. Basically our entire country's sense of humor was significantly impacted by several thousand year old Jewish traditions/mannerisms. So yeah absolutely the 2ish% of the country who are Jewish hold a disproportionate amount of political/economic sway. But at the same time there's also a deep-seated cultural reason why we identify so much more with the Israelis here as a county. Not agreeing or disagreeing with you. Mostly just musing. tl;dr support Israel because of Mel Brooks I guess.
January 20, 20241 yr 4 hours ago, Dave Moss said: I’d make the argument that leftist college kids are much more educated on the Israeli / Palestine issue than your average 40 or 50-year-old who is working a 9-to-5 and then comes home and watches Fox News or CNN for an hour. Is that because you told them about the Ottoman Empire?
January 20, 20241 yr 10 hours ago, we_gotta_believe said: As we've discussed before, young kids are dumb for a reason. Most will eventually get old and become less dumb. Polling this same demo on a number of issues like UBI would yield similar results precisely beause they're dumb. I think it's fearmongering to claim we'd abandon Israel as an ally anytime in the next few decades because of leftist college kids being indoctrinated. A sizable chunk of Gen Z doesn’t believe in the holocaust. Like 20% of them. And a further 30% couldn’t even agree or disagree with the prompt. This isn’t a "hey wouldn’t it be cool if rich people paid me to stay home and do nothing of substance all day” kind of an issue. You have half of the gen Z demo either actively not agreeing or not being able to even agree that the holocaust happened. A historical event that people are alive today that experienced it. The holocaust. You get less dumb from "make love, not war” and "student loan debt relief”. You do not get less dumb from "hey, you know I don’t think those fascists were really all that bad”.
January 20, 20241 yr 14 hours ago, VanHammersly said: The greatest threat to the survival of Ukraine is the American MAGA movement. That's a damn shame.....
January 20, 20241 yr 6 hours ago, Bill said: A sizable chunk of Gen Z doesn’t believe in the holocaust. Like 20% of them. And a further 30% couldn’t even agree or disagree with the prompt. This isn’t a "hey wouldn’t it be cool if rich people paid me to stay home and do nothing of substance all day” kind of an issue. You have half of the gen Z demo either actively not agreeing or not being able to even agree that the holocaust happened. A historical event that people are alive today that experienced it. The holocaust. You get less dumb from "make love, not war” and "student loan debt relief”. You do not get less dumb from "hey, you know I don’t think those fascists were really all that bad”. A sizeable chunk of Gen Z also believe vaccines change your DNA, 5G is a mind control device, the government has recovered alien spacecraft and bodies, 9/11 was an inside job, etc. Let me know if you spot a common thread among those. And before you think this is new, I'll remind you that Bigfoot, Nessie, the moon landing, JFK, etc were the theories de jour from a generation or two ago. Hell, how often do we see ish about Soros mentioned right here in CVON? Weren't one of the flat earthers banned for denying the Holocaust? You can't blame that one on Gen Z. I bet Kanye has some pretty interesting views on the topic, what generation is he from? It was just posted recently in another thread, but good luck getting a massive chunk of the South to admit what the civil war was fought for or even that many of their parents and grand parents were despicable people during the Civil Rights era. Like I said, most kids grow out of it, but some don't and remain stupid their entire lives. Ignorance is as American as apple pie.
January 20, 20241 yr 17 minutes ago, DEagle7 said: I blame Tide pods. I blame doctors. For saving the kids who ate Tide pods
January 20, 20241 yr Author Fwiw - Studies over the last 10 years show a change in the old adage that youth outgrows their stupidity. This most recent batch isn’t following the normal trends. Maybe just a temporary glitch.
January 20, 20241 yr 6 hours ago, we_gotta_believe said: A sizeable chunk of Gen Z also believe vaccines change your DNA, 5G is a mind control device, the government has recovered alien spacecraft and bodies, 9/11 was an inside job, etc. Let me know if you spot a common thread among those. And before you think this is new, I'll remind you that Bigfoot, Nessie, the moon landing, JFK, etc were the theories de jour from a generation or two ago. Hell, how often do we see ish about Soros mentioned right here in CVON? Weren't one of the flat earthers banned for denying the Holocaust? You can't blame that one on Gen Z. I bet Kanye has some pretty interesting views on the topic, what generation is he from? It was just posted recently in another thread, but good luck getting a massive chunk of the South to admit what the civil war was fought for or even that many of their parents and grand parents were despicable people during the Civil Rights era. Like I said, most kids grow out of it, but some don't and remain stupid their entire lives. Ignorance is as American as apple pie. Some people think AIPAC controlling U.S. foreign policy is a conspiracy theory…
January 20, 20241 yr 8 minutes ago, Dave Moss said: Some people think AIPAC controlling U.S. foreign policy is a conspiracy theory… Don't you have a Bund meeting to attend Dave?
January 20, 20241 yr 33 minutes ago, Procus said: Don't you have a Bund meeting to attend Dave? Aren’t you pumped full of horse meds?
January 20, 20241 yr 17 hours ago, DEagle7 said: I'd argue the influence is deeper than that. It really is wild how much Jewish culture has impacted American society. For example, the earliest roots of US stand-up comedy via Vaudeville were significantly shaped by Jewish acts. Which of course eventually leaked into other forms of media as time went on. Basically our entire country's sense of humor was significantly impacted by several thousand year old Jewish traditions/mannerisms. So yeah absolutely the 2ish% of the country who are Jewish hold a disproportionate amount of political/economic sway. But at the same time there's also a deep-seated cultural reason why we identify so much more with the Israelis here as a county. Not agreeing or disagreeing with you. Mostly just musing. tl;dr support Israel because of Mel Brooks I guess. The challenge I see for Israel is demographic. The US white gentile population as a whole genuinely adores the Jewish population. As you said, culturally, the Jews have had an enormous impact, but more so we’ve based our entire morality system around World War 2 and the holocaust. The issue is, no other racial group has done this. So as the whites decline in numbers, and the older generations die out, the fundamental world view of the population shifts. The greatest generation who fought WW2 is all but gone. Their boomer children are entering old age. And the millennials are the last people with a living memory of talking to a grandparent who lived during WW2. They’re already hitting their 40’s. So the fundamental moral anchor for our national psyche is going to be lost. That anchor placed Jews as the sacred cow, if you will. And at the same time that moral anchor is being replaced by these oppressor/oppressed dynamics of the political left and Democratic Party. So Jews are going to have the moral script flipped on its head. In one generation they will go from the most oppressed people on earth, victims of a flat out genocide, and the beneficiaries of the resulting cultural protective moat around them in the aftermath of WW2, to becoming the most oppressive group, lording over Palestinians in Israel and the pinnacle of privilege as the most financially successful racial/ethnic group in the west.
January 21, 20241 yr 1 hour ago, TEW said: The challenge I see for Israel is demographic. The US white gentile population as a whole genuinely adores the Jewish population. As you said, culturally, the Jews have had an enormous impact, but more so we’ve based our entire morality system around World War 2 and the holocaust. The issue is, no other racial group has done this. So as the whites decline in numbers, and the older generations die out, the fundamental world view of the population shifts. The greatest generation who fought WW2 is all but gone. Their boomer children are entering old age. And the millennials are the last people with a living memory of talking to a grandparent who lived during WW2. They’re already hitting their 40’s. So the fundamental moral anchor for our national psyche is going to be lost. That anchor placed Jews as the sacred cow, if you will. And at the same time that moral anchor is being replaced by these oppressor/oppressed dynamics of the political left and Democratic Party. So Jews are going to have the moral script flipped on its head. In one generation they will go from the most oppressed people on earth, victims of a flat out genocide, and the beneficiaries of the resulting cultural protective moat around them in the aftermath of WW2, to becoming the most oppressive group, lording over Palestinians in Israel and the pinnacle of privilege as the most financially successful racial/ethnic group in the west. You don’t seem to understand what the Holocaust was about. The NSDAPs were the perpetrators, and that’s who you need to focus on. Jews were scapegoated along with gypsies, gays, and other undesirable groups.
January 21, 20241 yr 4 hours ago, Dave Moss said: You don’t seem to understand what the Holocaust was about. The NSDAPs were the perpetrators, and that’s who you need to focus on. Jews were scapegoated along with gypsies, gays, and other undesirable groups. I understand just fine. The point is that the entire western world’s moral center in the post war era was built around world war 2 and the holocaust. It’s why retards constantly screech accusing each other of being NSDAPs, it’s why the Zionist movement had the political capital to create Israel, and it’s why the US and the western world in general is so supportive of Israel in the first place. Well, that moral center is reaching its expiration date. WW2 and the holocaust will gradually drift into abstract history rather than a touchstone of morality. And with that, Israel and Jews will find popular opinion of them flipped.
January 21, 20241 yr TEW is right, next thing you know, we'll be electing political candidates who post antisemitic memes on Twitter and then try to claim the Star of David in the meme was a sheriff's badge.
January 21, 20241 yr 15 hours ago, Dave Moss said: You don’t seem to understand what the Holocaust was about. The NSDAPs were the perpetrators, and that’s who you need to focus on. Jews were scapegoated along with gypsies, gays, and other undesirable groups. one problem with your thesis... they spared the Italians
January 21, 20241 yr 1 hour ago, Arthur Jackson said: one problem with your thesis... they spared the Italians Not necessarily When the Allies finally invaded Europe in 1943, they invaded Italy first. Italy was the sacrificial lamb.
January 21, 20241 yr 12 hours ago, TEW said: I understand just fine. The point is that the entire western world’s moral center in the post war era was built around world war 2 and the holocaust. It’s why retards constantly screech accusing each other of being NSDAPs, it’s why the Zionist movement had the political capital to create Israel, and it’s why the US and the western world in general is so supportive of Israel in the first place. Well, that moral center is reaching its expiration date. WW2 and the holocaust will gradually drift into abstract history rather than a touchstone of morality. And with that, Israel and Jews will find popular opinion of them flipped. Jews still face discrimination in the 21st century which is abhorrent. But that doesn’t give a nation-state like Israel a pass to do whatever it wants. The analogy I keep using is that the U.S. is like a crack dealer and Israel is the crack fiend. Then everybody acts surprised when the crack fiend does bad things. The U.S. response (so far) has been to give the crack fiend more crack.
January 21, 20241 yr 15 minutes ago, Dave Moss said: Not necessarily When the Allies finally invaded Europe in 1943, they invaded Italy first. Italy was the sacrificial lamb. I'm sure you're right I was just making fun of Italians they're the Irish of Europe
January 21, 20241 yr 5 minutes ago, Arthur Jackson said: I'm sure you're right I was just making fun of Italians they're the Irish of Europe I spent 10 days in Italy last summer. Venice, Florence, Rome, etc. I couldn’t think of a bad thing to say about it.
January 21, 20241 yr 1 hour ago, Dave Moss said: Jews still face discrimination in the 21st century which is abhorrent. Yes @Dave Moss, we know. You've shown us.
January 21, 20241 yr 5 hours ago, Dave Moss said: I spent 10 days in Italy last summer. Venice, Florence, Rome, etc. I couldn’t think of a bad thing to say about it. How much time did you spend in Florence? Did she make you use Wesson Oil?
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