rrfierce Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, seengreen said: Defensively, the Eagle coaches do not teach their players to create turnovers. They have capable players. But, they just do not impress upon them to go for the ball. CJGJ was a hired gun and not a drafted played here. The last player who the Eagles drafted who could create turnovers was Jordan Hicks. Also again with the LB's, did you see the Jets LB (Williams) flying all over the field, in the backfield, making plays in coverage? The Eagles don't draft or develop that position, and it makes all the difference. Yep - they don't aggressively attack the ball when its in the air. Too busy sitting off them giving a cushion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eglz1 Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 13 hours ago, judunno said: Taylor Swift and Kelce at the Superbowl.... ratings galore. You're probably right Hollywood wet dream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gannan Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 I've been saying it since his first year... Nick Sirianni is not a good coach. Brian Johnson is worse. Most of the time we are playing teams that are so outclassed by the talent on our roster, our inept coaching doesn't matter much. In games like this one, the poor coaching is glaring. The play calling was abysmal. They flat out gave up on the run. There was no effort to try to help the ham and egger who had to come in for Lane Johnson. If they were going to make a conscious decision to abandon the run, they could help out the o line by calling short quick passes to move the ball. There was pretty much none of that. Hurts blew goats, but the coaches did not put him in a good position to succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rey Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 Running game was unsuccessful especially after losing Lane. Aside from one 12 yard run by Gainwell, we were averaging like 2 yards per carry for the rest of the carries by Backs. The pass was there ... Jets were down 2 main Corners. The problem was dropped balls like 3 from D Smith and a big one by Gainwell), a perfect pass by Hurts where AJ stopped running (would have been a TD in stride), a dropped ball by Goedert that turned into an INT. A pressure and arm hit against Hurts caused by Lane's replacement that floated in for another INT. Just one of those games where it could just as easily been an easy win but everything that could have gone wrong with us did. Chalk it up as Crap Happens and move on. Lane needs to not miss time though because that OL is what makes everything go ... and Lane is THE most important of the bunch imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judunno Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 12 minutes ago, Rey said: Running game was unsuccessful especially after losing Lane. Aside from one 12 yard run by Gainwell, we were averaging like 2 yards per carry for the rest of the carries by Backs. The pass was there ... Jets were down 2 main Corners. The problem was dropped balls like 3 from D Smith and a big one by Gainwell), a perfect pass by Hurts where AJ stopped running (would have been a TD in stride), a dropped ball by Goedert that turned into an INT. A pressure and arm hit against Hurts caused by Lane's replacement that floated in for another INT. Just one of those games where it could just as easily been an easy win but everything that could have gone wrong with us did. Chalk it up as Crap Happens and move on. Lane needs to not miss time though because that OL is what makes everything go ... and Lane is THE most important of the bunch imo. Doesn't mean you just stop running the ball. Unsuccessful or not I don't care if you're getting 3 yards a pop you have to give them that look or they make it hell for the QB pass rushing with their ears pinned back. Can't just abandon it and make yourself one dimensional. And no the screens don't replace the run game. Doesn't have the same impact of letting the OL mow down DL, LBs, and DBs. The offense becomes to predictable. I don't care what QB you are if the defense knows exactly what your tendencies are and what you're going to do it's easy pickings (pun intended). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judunno Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 2 hours ago, seengreen said: Defensively, the Eagle coaches do not teach their players to create turnovers. They have capable players. But, they just do not impress upon them to go for the ball. CJGJ was a hired gun and not a drafted played here. The last player who the Eagles drafted who could create turnovers was Jordan Hicks. Also again with the LB's, did you see the Jets LB (Williams) flying all over the field, in the backfield, making plays in coverage? The Eagles don't draft or develop that position, and it makes all the difference. Huhn... we see guys trying to punch the ball out all of the time. Dean did it, Baby Rhino, etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seengreen Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 35 minutes ago, judunno said: Huhn... we see guys trying to punch the ball out all of the time. Dean did it, Baby Rhino, etc Huhn, what is the secondary doing to create turnovers? The Eagles as a defensive team overall do not create turnovers. Of course, there will be a play here or a play there, they get 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MF POON Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 I only had an issue with the passing on the final Eagles drive where Hurts threw the INT. Wtf was Johnson thinking?? I'd have rather played it conservatively with all runs and punt if we don't convert. Chew up clock, and force the jets to burn timeouts. Yet we stupidly throw and put the Jets in the position to win. Smh lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaglesAddict Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 The Eagles have yet to put together a good all-around game. Every week has been a struggle and this was the soft part of the schedule so that's why we have 5 wins. If they continue to play the way they've been playing, the wheels are about to come off as we enter "the Gauntlet" part of our schedule. Not saying the sky is falling, just stating the obvious. I guess the question is whether you believe they can/will fix their issues or what we are seeing is what we will get this year. They don't have 1 glaring problem....their overall issue seems to involve multiple things: play calling, play designs, coaching decisions, Hurts' decision-making, miscues, suspect back-7 on Defense, and now we can add injuries to the list. How do you fix all that before the losses start piling up and the confidence goes down the drain and things spiral out of control? The Jets game wasn't an anomaly, it was a continuation/progression of what we've been seeing all season. And the opposition is about to be 10 times better than what we've faced thus far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judunno Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 38 minutes ago, seengreen said: Huhn, what is the secondary doing to create turnovers? The Eagles as a defensive team overall do not create turnovers. Of course, there will be a play here or a play there, they get 1. That's all the defense was doing early in the season was creating turnovers. They lived off of it otherwise they'd have way more than 1 loss. They're tied for 2nd in the league in forced fumble takeaways. Could have had more if guys were falling on the ball after teammates punched them out. The secondary has been musical chairs all season so I'm not surprised that they don't have many ints. Out of the gate when they were healthy we saw some picks. Then a tremendous drop off once guys started going down. Playing a lot of off coverage tackle the guy to limit YAC type of schemes with all of the injuries to limit the big X plays. That doesn't lend itself to ints unless there are errant throws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOTW Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 FWIW, the players gave the post-game locker room speeches. They asked Siri not to, so they could hold each other accountable and talk about everyone learning from it and improving. (Siri and Johnson as coaches need a good look in the mirror though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seengreen Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 13 minutes ago, judunno said: That's all the defense was doing early in the season was creating turnovers. They lived off of it otherwise they'd have way more than 1 loss. They're tied for 2nd in the league in forced fumble takeaways. Could have had more if guys were falling on the ball after teammates punched them out. The secondary has been musical chairs all season so I'm not surprised that they don't have many ints. Out of the gate when they were healthy we saw some picks. Then a tremendous drop off once guys started going down. Playing a lot of off coverage tackle the guy to limit YAC type of schemes with all of the injuries to limit the big X plays. That doesn't lend itself to ints unless there are errant throws. You are mentioning the reasons why the scheme they play defensively is deferential to creating turnovers. They play off coverages, so, there aren't going to be playmaking opportunities. The FO doesn't value LB's (see the Jets game for reference on impactful LB play). Therefore, they are easily game planned for and opposing (sub-standard) QB's can easily read the coverages. Because we don't have any creativity defensively. Yesterday, the Jets were missing 3 starters, yet they played aggressively and forced much of the discord offensively. And, still forced 3 INT's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judunno Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 14 minutes ago, seengreen said: You are mentioning the reasons why the scheme they play defensively is deferential to creating turnovers. They play off coverages, so, there aren't going to be playmaking opportunities. The FO doesn't value LB's (see the Jets game for reference on impactful LB play). Therefore, they are easily game planned for and opposing (sub-standard) QB's can easily read the coverages. Because we don't have any creativity defensively. Yesterday, the Jets were missing 3 starters, yet they played aggressively and forced much of the discord offensively. And, still forced 3 INT's. Eagles defense wasn't the problem yesterday. I'm not seeing your point. The Eagles offense had 4 turnovers and they practically held the Jets to FGs with a make shift secondary. The only reason they scored the last TD is because they let them. They bottled up the run game and pretty much shut the Jets offense down. Would it have been nice to force some turnovers? Of course. But the goal was to not give up the big play and let the over powered Eagles offense destroy a depleted Jets defense. Eagles offense failed. They were predictable and made too many self inflicted mistakes from drops, bad qb play, to bad play calling, abandoning the run etc. I'd say the Jets success yesterday was more so because the Eagles shot themselves in the foot and were too predictable than because the Jets did anything special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seengreen Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 17 minutes ago, judunno said: Eagles defense wasn't the problem yesterday. I'm not seeing your point. The Eagles offense had 4 turnovers and they practically held the Jets to FGs with a make shift secondary. The only reason they scored the last TD is because they let them. They bottled up the run game and pretty much shut the Jets offense down. Would it have been nice to force some turnovers? Of course. But the goal was to not give up the big play and let the over powered Eagles offense destroy a depleted Jets defense. Eagles offense failed. They were predictable and made too many self inflicted mistakes from drops, bad qb play, to bad play calling, abandoning the run etc. I'd say the Jets success yesterday was more so because the Eagles shot themselves in the foot and were too predictable than because the Jets did anything special. My point is that they don't force turnovers with or without their starters. Because forced fumbles are typically made at or close to the LOS. Because the defensive scheme is to limit big plays, even with our starting secondary they aren't in the best position to get them. In the game yesterday, you saw how much a difference good LB's can make. Something else the Eagle FO doesn't want to invest in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utebird Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 10 hours ago, Mat said: From what I've read he hasn't they were talking about benching him because he was that bad https://www.musiccitymiracles.com/2023/9/25/23889190/should-titans-bench-andre-dillard Myles Garrett makes alot of tackles not named Lane Johnson look bad. Either way not the eagles problem anymore The weirdest part of the Dillard pick is that hadn't even scouted him, but he dropped and they drafted him sight unseen.🤷♂️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judunno Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 35 minutes ago, seengreen said: My point is that they don't force turnovers with or without their starters. Because forced fumbles are typically made at or close to the LOS. Because the defensive scheme is to limit big plays, even with our starting secondary they aren't in the best position to get them. In the game yesterday, you saw how much a difference good LB's can make. Something else the Eagle FO doesn't want to invest in. I just showed you that they did force turnovers. Practically leading the league in forced fumble takeaways. The secondary has punched some balls out as well (pause). The Jets can afford to be more aggressive because they literally have nothing to lose. They're not even expected to make the playoffs let alone contend for a championship. The LBs have been playing pretty well especially against the run (2nd best in the league to Detroit) and have caused some forced fumbles themselves. The secondary has been in position to make some ints but they've dropped them.Your point of them not forcing turnovers isn't exactly true. Considering Desai has been working with a patch worked secondary I feel like the defense has seen some improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seengreen Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 1 hour ago, judunno said: I just showed you that they did force turnovers. Practically leading the league in forced fumble takeaways. The secondary has punched some balls out as well (pause). The Jets can afford to be more aggressive because they literally have nothing to lose. They're not even expected to make the playoffs let alone contend for a championship. The LBs have been playing pretty well especially against the run (2nd best in the league to Detroit) and have caused some forced fumbles themselves. The secondary has been in position to make some ints but they've dropped them.Your point of them not forcing turnovers isn't exactly true. Considering Desai has been working with a patch worked secondary I feel like the defense has seen some improvement. I am looking beyond the numbers here, and to me and a lot of people, they don't force t/o's. Also the Jets have better LB's, a better CB/Secondary and still were much more aggressive in that game. The Eagles and the coaches played down to the competition. Just think if their starters played with that Gameplan Nick et. al. deployed. Jalen could have possibly thrown 5 INTs. I am not saying the Defense played bad or hasn't shown itself to be competent. They have. But they had 5 sacks yesterday, and nothing to show for their efforts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleVA Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 5 hours ago, seengreen said: The FO doesn't value LB's That's because Mr. Peanut Head is a dumb sheet. Next thing you know he'll be trading away draft picks for a band-aid fix with over the hill LBs.......ditto for CBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleVA Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 20 hours ago, opa-opa said: If Devonta caught even one of those drops we could be talking about a totally different outcome.... I think you're going to see his play continually spiral down, the league sees what I saw year one, dude is overrated......the Jets practice squad DBs all but proved it. It's so funny when I hear announcers talk about Smith taking the top off of a defense, dude can't take the top off of a jar of peanut butter let alone a NFL secondary. Granted he has good hands and a good vertical but that's about it, it does nothing for separation. I just hope Hurts doesn't try to force the ball to him because if he does his INTs will continue to rise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seengreen Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 2 hours ago, EagleVA said: That's because Mr. Peanut Head is a dumb sheet. Next thing you know he'll be trading away draft picks for a band-aid fix with over the hill LBs.......ditto for CBs. Interesting take on Howie "The Golden Fleece" Roseman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opa-opa Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 1 hour ago, EagleVA said: I think you're going to see his play continually spiral down, the league sees what I saw year one, dude is overrated......the Jets practice squad DBs all but proved it. It's so funny when I hear announcers talk about Smith taking the top off of a defense, dude can't take the top off of a jar of peanut butter let alone a NFL secondary. Granted he has good hands and a good vertical but that's about it, it does nothing for separation. He didnt have anyone within 10 yards when he dropped that second pass though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brkmsn Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 3 hours ago, EagleVA said: I think you're going to see his play continually spiral down, the league sees what I saw year one, dude is overrated......the Jets practice squad DBs all but proved it. It's so funny when I hear announcers talk about Smith taking the top off of a defense, dude can't take the top off of a jar of peanut butter let alone a NFL secondary. Granted he has good hands and a good vertical but that's about it, it does nothing for separation. I just hope Hurts doesn't try to force the ball to him because if he does his INTs will continue to rise LOL. Smith had a bad day. Hardly a big concern. There is tons of NFL tape showing Smith getting separation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestlevessel Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 12 hours ago, Gannan said: I've been saying it since his first year... Nick Sirianni is not a good coach. Brian Johnson is worse. Most of the time we are playing teams that are so outclassed by the talent on our roster, our inept coaching doesn't matter much. In games like this one, the poor coaching is glaring. The play calling was abysmal. They flat out gave up on the run. There was no effort to try to help the ham and egger who had to come in for Lane Johnson. If they were going to make a conscious decision to abandon the run, they could help out the o line by calling short quick passes to move the ball. There was pretty much none of that. Hurts blew goats, but the coaches did not put him in a good position to succeed. Robert Saleh isn't a great coach either just so you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judunno Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 43 minutes ago, brkmsn said: LOL. Smith had a bad day. Hardly a big concern. There is tons of NFL tape showing Smith getting separation. Smith is a beast. Only a clown would think otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleVA Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 11 hours ago, judunno said: Smith is a beast. This is exactly why I say he's overrated, Smith being a beast of a receiver is absurd. Beastly receivers doesn't go down as easily as Devonta Ertz, excuse me, Devonta Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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