21 minutes ago, The Norseman said:

Oh, c'mon, the gloves have been off since the day Trump took office.  If Dems are expecting this administration to do them a solid after the national tantrum they have thrown over the last 4 years it's just not going to happen. 

We were expecting Republicans to abide by their own rules they created to screw Democrats.

That was our mistake. The era of Democrats in Congress politely disagreeing with Republicans who hate them is over. Be prepared to have Democrats respond with the full power of the WH and Senate in kind to change rules whenever they see fit because that's what we're going to expect from our representatives. They won't even need a reason for me to be OK with it other than, "Republicans will hate that we're doing it". As long as it screws over you and your Republicans and doesn't affect me I'm good.

2 minutes ago, Quiet Boy said:

 

None of those words mattered the second a Republican Senate refused to hold a vote on Merrick Garland. There are no more rules. Get it while you can. You've got 4 months left.

4 minutes ago, mayanh8 said:

We were expecting Republicans to abide by their own rules they created to screw Democrats.

That was our mistake. The era of Democrats in Congress politely disagreeing with Republicans who hate them is over. Be prepared to have Democrats respond with the full power of the WH and Senate in kind to change rules whenever they see fit. They won't even need a reason for me to be OK with it other than, "Republicans will hate that we're doing it". As long as it screws over you and your Republicans and doesn't affect me I'm good.

People only have Harry Reid to thank for this. If he didn't change the filibusterer rules we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.

Just now, Diehardfan said:

People only have Harry Reid to thank for this. If he didn't change the filibusterer rules we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.

I don't care. Do you?

2 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

People only have Harry Reid to thank for this. If he didn't change the filibusterer rules we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.

No, you had the Republicans in the senate throwing temper tantrums about Obama and abusing the filibuster to thank. 

But you're an idiot, so I don't know why I should even bother trying to teach history to someone who prefers their version of facts over matters of historical record. 

1 minute ago, mayanh8 said:

I don't care. Do you?

I don't care at all. I'm loving that a new conservative will be on the bench by the election.

 

Just now, JohnSnowsHair said:

No, you had the Republicans in the senate throwing temper tantrums about Obama and abusing the filibuster to thank. 

But you're an idiot, so I don't know why I should even bother trying to teach history to someone who prefers their version of facts over matters of historical record. 

LOL Harry Reid changed the filibuster policy, which makes this all possible. If he didn't break the old senate policy Chucky would be able to block this and the GOP wouldn't be able to move forward. Thanks Harry!!!!!

7 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

People only have Harry Reid to thank for this. If he didn't change the filibusterer rules we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.

You’re so close to getting it...

15 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

People only have Harry Reid to thank for this. If he didn't change the filibusterer rules we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.

I will say it again: They were given no choice. The only reason the Dems went nuclear was because the Republicans refused to consider any judicial nominations during Obama's second term. They simply refused to adhere to their Constitutional duties as Senators. They would not do their job as it is specifically laid out in Article II. It wasn't like they were willing to consider a moderate nominee and the Dems just wouldn't meet in the middle. They were more than willing to compromise. Obama himself bent over backwards to appease them. Case in point: Republican nominee Merrick Garland.

6 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

I don't care at all. I'm loving that a new conservative will be on the bench by the election.

I'm sure it's going to be great right up to the point when Democrats take the Senate and increase the size of the SCOTUS to get theirs. Then we can all celebrate.

9 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

Harry Reid changed the filibuster policy, which makes this all possible. If he didn't break the old senate policy Chucky would be able to block this and the GOP wouldn't be able to move forward. Thanks Harry!!!!!

No way McConnel wouldn't have done the same. He's the biggest POS in congress.

1 minute ago, EaglesRocker97 said:

I will say it again: They were given no choice. The only reason the Dems went nuclear was because the Republicans refused to consider any judicial nominations during Obama's second term. They simply refused to adhere to their Constitutional duties as Senators. They would not do their job as it was specifically laid out in Article II. It wasn't like they were willing to consider a moderate nominee and the Dems just wouldn't meet in the middle. They were more than willing to compromise. Case in point: Republican nominee Merrick Garland.

Yes, and we can argue the reasons, but the bottom line is both sides use rules and procedures for their political agenda. 

I can tell it's gonna be a good week in here this week

 

7 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

No way McConnel wouldn't have done the same. He's the biggest POS in congress.

Not sure about the biggest...but I won't argue technicalities. He sure found his balls the last few years though. 

12 minutes ago, mayanh8 said:

I'm sure it's going to be great right up to the point when Democrats take the Senate and increase the size of the SCOTUS to get theirs. Then we can all celebrate.

Quote

Pollak: Democrats Threatened to Pack the Court Long Before Ginsburg's Death

Joel B. Pollak

4-5 minutes

---

Democrats are threatening to abolish the filibuster and pack the Supreme Court if President Donald Trump and the Senate Republicans confirm a replacement for the late Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, who passed away on Friday. Some are also threatening to add the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico as states — which means adding four Democrat seats to the Senate — in response.

     

But Democrats have been threatening to do these things for months — long before Ginsburg’s passing.

The idea of packing the Supreme Court by expanding the number of justices and filling the new positions with liberals has been floating around within the Democratic Party since Brett Kavanaugh was confirmed to the Court, creating a new 5-4 conservative majority. In May 2019, the Boston Globe reported that then-South Bend, Indiana, Mayor Pete Buttigieg, who was running for president, was backing a version of that plan in which the current justices would choose the new ones.

Not everyone supported the idea. Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT), perhaps remembering that even Democrats opposed packing the court when President Franklin Delano Roosevelt tried it, proposed "rotating” justices off the Court instead.

 

But a year later, influential liberal activist groups had taken up the cause. As Breitbart News reported, a broad coalition of left-wing organizations backed a plan to expand the Supreme Court by at least two seats, and fill the new vacancies with liberal justices.

By the end of June 2020, with Black Lives Matter riots raging throughout America, a more radical agenda had begun to come into focus. Democrats in the Senate used the filibuster to block Sen. Tim Scott (R-SC) from offering moderate police reform legislation, and House Democrats passed a bill granting statehood to most of the District of Columbia. These new developments indicated that Democrats hoped to use the energy of the movement to enact sweeping changes after 2020.

As I noted:

With a permanent majority in the Senate, and the filibuster gone, Democrats will be able to redesign the country, even without passing a constitutional amendment. They will be able to expand the Supreme Court and pack it with liberals with just a simple majority. They will be able to make all eleven-million-plus illegal aliens in the country voting citizens, permanently altering the electorate in Democrats’ favor. They will pass a version of the Green New Deal. And so on.

I reported again:

They’re going to create a new Democrat-held Senate. They’re going to knock away the filibuster to get rid of minority protections in the Senate, and they’re just going to pass whatever they want. It’s going to be Green New Deal, amnesty for illegal immigrants, you name it. This is going to be a socialist revolution. They’ll rewrite the histories afterward so that those of us who remember things a little differently will be called racists. We won’t be published; we won’t be heard.

In July, Democrats circulated a platform that included D.C. statehood and hinted at statehood for Puerto Rico. Then, at the funeral for the late Rep. John Lewis (D-GA), former President Barack Obama let the cat out of the bag. He called for the filibuster to be eliminated and suggested that D.C. and Puerto Rico might be granted statehood. Then former Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) was revealed as the mastermind behind a "war room” to kill the filibuster called "Fix the Senate.” And Biden himself came out last week in favor of statehood for Puerto Rico — all before Ginsburg passed away on Friday.

There is nothing new about Democrats’ radical plans. Ginsburg’s passing is simply a pretext for them to pretend Republicans have forced them to adopt extreme measures. The only thing that has changed is that they might go beyond 11 judges at the Supreme Court, and extend their court-packing to the judiciary as a whole. They are cynically exploiting Ginsburg’s death.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/09/21/pollak-democrats-threatened-to-pack-the-court-long-before-ginsburgs-death/

That was on the table already 

It’s deeper than just changing rules.  Voters keep electing GOP Senators who want to blow up the system or refuse to compromise.  There’s really not an equivalent movement on the Left. If anything, it’s like Mayanh8 said.  Dems treat Republicans with kid-gloves.

39 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

It had been getting punchy since 2004.

Republicans took the gloves off with Obama. The fact that Democrats are somewhat fondly remembering that Boehner didn't outwardly show disdain for Obama and had a decent relationship with the guy behind closed doors speaks to how far it's come.

Their base demanded that they go scorched Earth, and they sat on an absurd number of court nominations, daring Reid to do away with the filibuster. NEVER has there been that sort of obstructionist approach to judicial vacancies as there was during this era. So when Reid pulled the nuclear option to unclog the logjam of nominees to fill long-vacant seats, Republicans went further.

It has gotten measurably worse during Republican controlled eras. A simple read through the history of the Senate procedural changes shows that. 

You're talking about court appointments, I'm talking about politics in general. 

I think it actually started under Clinton.  When Republican's investigated him for Whitewater and then came across the Lewinsky stuff they should have dropped it (as despicable as it was).  The environment since then has been downright toxic.  So, yes, in some ways Republicans started it.

However, democrats were absolutely awful to Bush, they raised the stakes substantially during those 8 years.  Republicans were obstructionist to Obama, agreed.  But, the environment under Trump has been nothing short of an adult tantrum by the Democrats.  Love him or hate him, he isn't going to give them an inch after the last four years.   

6 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

That was on the table already 

That's awesome. The fact that they've been planning for it means they'll have to spend less time trying to figure out the logistics.

3 minutes ago, Dave Moss said:

It’s deeper than just changing rules.  Voters keep electing voters who want to blow up the system or refuse to compromise.  There’s really not an equivalent movement on the Left. If anything, it’s like Mayanh8 said.  Dems treat Republicans with kid-gloves.

And further, the best chance for someone to put a stop to this political escalationism is Biden.

And as someone who is sick of all this backstabbing bull sheet, I hope he gets in there, avoids using brinkmanship as his MO, and allows cooler heads to prevail once again.

39 minutes ago, mayanh8 said:

We were expecting Republicans to abide by their own rules they created to screw Democrats.

That was our mistake. The era of Democrats in Congress politely disagreeing with Republicans who hate them is over. Be prepared to have Democrats respond with the full power of the WH and Senate in kind to change rules whenever they see fit because that's what we're going to expect from our representatives. They won't even need a reason for me to be OK with it other than, "Republicans will hate that we're doing it". As long as it screws over you and your Republicans and doesn't affect me I'm good.

I get it, I'd feel the same way if I were on the other side.  Of course you have to win the election and take the Senate first. 

All that being said, the view in here that Democrats have been a bunch of lambs playing fair over the last four years is laughable. 

3 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

And further, the best chance for someone to put a stop to this political escalationism is Biden.

And as someone who is sick of all this backstabbing bull sheet, I hope he gets in there, avoids using brinkmanship as his MO, and allows cooler heads to prevail once again.

He will need to deal with the left fringe in his own party to make that a reality.  I don't see it happening.

3 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

And further, the best chance for someone to put a stop to this political escalationism is Biden.

And as someone who is sick of all this backstabbing bull sheet, I hope he gets in there, avoids using brinkmanship as his MO, and allows cooler heads to prevail once again.

I agree.  Mostly because he can barely form a complete sentence and will spend half his time in office napping  

6 minutes ago, The Norseman said:

 But, the environment under Trump has been nothing short of an adult tantrum by the Democrats.  

Anyone not throwing a tantrum about all the slimy, blatantly unconstitutional and eminently corrupt conduct by this administration either doesn't get it or is complicit in undoing federalism. Flipping out over and resisting this abortion of democracy is the patriotic thing to do.

6 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

And further, the best chance for someone to put a stop to this political escalationism is Biden.

And as someone who is sick of all this backstabbing bull sheet, I hope he gets in there, avoids using brinkmanship as his MO, and allows cooler heads to prevail once again.

Yeah, I would even use the phrase from Warren Harding’s 1920 campaign, a "return to normalcy.”  Except his administration was very corrupt, so maybe not the best comparison...

 

Just now, DrPhilly said:

He will need to deal with the left fringe in his own party to make that a reality.  I don't see it happening.

Biden will make the left fringe his b**ch just like he did in the primaries.