DL, CB not the big problem. Gym Shorts is!

[Portyansky]

You bring in Slay for what??? To play off? NO!!!! You brought him to man up, and you let him do what he wants till he's proven ineffective! JS is calling a game no to be beat deep. Well it hasn't worked. We need the DBs to press and give the dline time to get to the QB. 

If you can stomach to watch the game again, the DL simply did not have time to get to Goff. Rams WRs/TE had too much space for dink and dunk. Some of us make fun of dink and dunk, but Brady made a career out of it "take what the D gives you". Then take your shots. When we had them on 2nd/3rd and long and Goff was forced to make a throw, our line created enough pressure to cause him to make poor passes. 

Secondary and dline depend on each other. If the DBs force the QB to hold on to the ball longer it will give the line time to get to get there, once they get there, it can cause erratic throws and/or poor decisions.

This team is a mess. Can't blame covid guidelines, lack of practice/preseason, but it affects everyone. 

[we_gotta_believe]

In other news, water is wet.

[manz2821]

But but I thought after Undlin left the DBs would be fine. All crap. Its always been Schwartz. Just like getting Groh and Walch go did not fix the offence. Its like rearranging chairs on the deck of the titanic. 

[NCTANK]

get rid of the bum

[DeathByEagle]

1 hour ago, we_gotta_believe said:

In other news, water is wet.

This is going to keep me up all night...........................................MIND BLOWING 

[Road to Victory]

3 hours ago, Portyansky said:

You bring in Slay for what??? To play off? NO!!!! You brought him to man up, and you let him do what he wants till he's proven ineffective! JS is calling a game no to be beat deep. Well it hasn't worked. We need the DBs to press and give the dline time to get to the QB. 

If you can stomach to watch the game again, the DL simply did not have time to get to Goff. Rams WRs/TE had too much space for dink and dunk. Some of us make fun of dink and dunk, but Brady made a career out of it "take what the D gives you". Then take your shots. When we had them on 2nd/3rd and long and Goff was forced to make a throw, our line created enough pressure to cause him to make poor passes. 

Secondary and dline depend on each other. If the DBs force the QB to hold on to the ball longer it will give the line time to get to get there, once they get there, it can cause erratic throws and/or poor decisions.

This team is a mess. Can't blame covid guidelines, lack of practice/preseason, but it affects everyone. 

I always hate soft defenses. Much rather see an aggressive, balls to wall defense that occasionally gets beat deep like what Buddy Ryan ran.
 

Anyone who has ever played football would much rather have someone playing 8 yards off then someone who’s in your face, hitting you at the line every play. 

[wtfcares]

Schwartz or the CBs weren’t the problem yesterday. Sure they gave up a few plays. But every defence does. The big plays that happened were all targeting the linebackers and Mills. According to McLeod Schwartz had them prepared for everything they saw yesterday. 
 

The caliber of talent is just not there at LB and S. People here were so quick to let Jenkins go, but that short middle of the field pass defence was his bread and butter. He shut TEs down. Instead now we’ve got Gerry and Mills lost running behind everyone. 

[GeorgeM37]

2 hours ago, manz2821 said:

But but I thought after Undlin left the DBs would be fine. All crap. Its always been Schwartz. Just like getting Groh and Walch go did not fix the offence. Its like rearranging chairs on the deck of the titanic. 

I have not ever wanted that sack of crap here and I was right because the defense has been horrible the whole time he has been here. I absolutely hate his scheme, it is horrible and doesn't belong in the NFL....please please please get rid of gym shorts!!

[UK_EaglesFan89]

Schwartz is definitely a big problem. He's now got a legit #1 CB and he's still not using him in the appropriate way. So Schwartz time to go is absolutely coming. 

But let's not overlook the issues on defense. The secondary isn't good enough. The team were fooling themselves by thinking Maddox is a good outside corner. And they were complete idiots for going with the weak LB group they have. 

Schwartz is the biggest issue but the personnel simply aren't all that good. The LBs are terrible, literally the worst in the NFL. The corners aren't great and the position lacks depth overall. And then there's the DL. I mean on the edges we lack true play makers. BG is a good player but on the other side it really isn't very good. Barnett is OK but he doesn't look like he's ever going to be a legit #1 and then inside Cox just doesn't look the same. 

[NCTANK]

agreed 

the defense has stunk every year since he’s been here, regardless of talent. 

[EazyEaglez]

2 hours ago, NCTANK said:

agreed 

the defense has stunk every year since he’s been here, regardless of talent. 

Not in 2017. They were a top 5 group. 2017 was a unicorn for this entire squad.

[Portyansky]

25 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Not in 2017. They were a top 5 group. 2017 was a unicorn for this entire squad.

We were exposed in the SB.

[EazyEaglez]

10 minutes ago, Portyansky said:

We were exposed in the SB.

It was the beginning of the end for that defense. 

[NCTANK]

NFL Passing Defense Rankings

2017 - 22nd

2018 - 30th

2019 - 22nd

[IFB DOG]

13 hours ago, we_gotta_believe said:

In other news, water is wet.

My brother, the scientist, once tried to explain to me that water doesn't actually have a property of "wetness".  Whatever it touches becomes wet, but water itself isn't actually wet.

Yeah, go down that Thanksgiving rabbit hole for an hour.... best of luck to you!

[ManchesterEagle]

11 hours ago, wtfcares said:

Schwartz or the CBs weren’t the problem yesterday. Sure they gave up a few plays. But every defence does. The big plays that happened were all targeting the linebackers and Mills. According to McLeod Schwartz had them prepared for everything they saw yesterday. 
 

The caliber of talent is just not there at LB and S. People here were so quick to let Jenkins go, but that short middle of the field pass defence was his bread and butter. He shut TEs down. Instead now we’ve got Gerry and Mills lost running behind everyone. 

Agreed.

I'm not giving Schwartz a full pass though for Sunday. The D was really bad and he was definitely out coached. Same as in the Super Bowl.

But the reality is that Schwartz has overachieved with what he has had to work with. We had a top 5 D in 2017 and top 10-15 in the last two years. Given the injuries and lack of talent that's an achievement. We have invested next to nothing in terms of high draft picks over the past 5 years on the D. 

It also looks like letting Jenkins go was a big mistake without a ready replacement in place.

If the D keeps going like this, then Schwartz has to go, but he has done a lot more with very little than people give him credit for. With the lack of young talent, the D could be bad for years, regardless of who they bring in.

[Bwestbrook36]

The Dline needs to get there in order for the secondary to have a chance. This under performing over paid Dline is the biggest problem in my book. Once again most claim that this defensive line is going to cause chaos in the beginning of the season to it falling flat on it's face once again

[20dawk4life]

Yup. He sucks. 

[wtfcares]

1 hour ago, ManchesterEagle said:

Agreed.

I'm not giving Schwartz a full pass though for Sunday. The D was really bad and he was definitely out coached. Same as in the Super Bowl.

But the reality is that Schwartz has overachieved with what he has had to work with. We had a top 5 D in 2017 and top 10-15 in the last two years. Given the injuries and lack of talent that's an achievement. We have invested next to nothing in terms of high draft picks over the past 5 years on the D. 

It also looks like letting Jenkins go was a big mistake without a ready replacement in place.

If the D keeps going like this, then Schwartz has to go, but he has done a lot more with very little than people give him credit for. With the lack of young talent, the D could be bad for years, regardless of who they bring in.

This. It’s way too easy to blame it all on Schwartz. 
 

Everybody always wants the sexy high draft picks on offense. We’ve done that over and over past few years and haven’t done anything to inject good quality youth on defence. Half the starters on D this year are 4th round picks or later. They let the leader of the defence walk because they didn’t want to pay him a couple million more that he deserves. No DC is going to succeed with that. 
 

Like you said Schwartz has over achieved with the personnel we have given him. He’s fielded a top 15 defence every year he’s been here. In 2018 and 2019 it was the offence starting slow and failing to regularly score 20 points that caused us to lose. 
 

But everybody wants to take the easy way out and blame the DC instead of realizing we’ve neglected that side of the team for years. There are no better defences our there that have invested as little as we have in their D. A new DC is not going to fix that. 

[ManchesterEagle]

1 hour ago, wtfcares said:

This. It’s way too easy to blame it all on Schwartz. 
 

Everybody always wants the sexy high draft picks on offense. We’ve done that over and over past few years and haven’t done anything to inject good quality youth on defence. Half the starters on D this year are 4th round picks or later. They let the leader of the defence walk because they didn’t want to pay him a couple million more that he deserves. No DC is going to succeed with that. 
 

Like you said Schwartz has over achieved with the personnel we have given him. He’s fielded a top 15 defence every year he’s been here. In 2018 and 2019 it was the offence starting slow and failing to regularly score 20 points that caused us to lose. 
 

But everybody wants to take the easy way out and blame the DC instead of realizing we’ve neglected that side of the team for years. There are no better defences our there that have invested as little as we have in their D. A new DC is not going to fix that. 

Agreed completely. In the past 5 years we have invested 1 first round pick and 1 second round pick on the D. In terms of 3rd rounders, we have invested two compensation picks, both pretty much 4th rounders.

You can’t ignore one side of the ball in that way and expect it to dominate. That’s why we end up having Avonte Maddox as starting corner, Mills at safety and scrub linebackers.

They were atrocious on Sunday (including the overpaid D-Line) and if they continue like that, Schwartz will have to go. But those expecting a sudden turn around with this talent will likely be sorely disappointed.

[ManchesterEagle]

3 hours ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

The Dline needs to get there in order for the secondary to have a chance. This under performing over paid Dline is the biggest problem in my book. Once again most claim that this defensive line is going to cause chaos in the beginning of the season to it falling flat on it's face once again

Yeah that’s where all the investment has gone. This D-Line should be dominant, particularly inside, but they have showed next to nothing.

We would get torn apart if we blitz. Only Slay can hold up on an island.

[GeorgeM37]

 

[EazyEaglez]

20 hours ago, GeorgeM37 said:

 

It’s time to amicably par ways. Sadly Doug can’t fire him even if he wanted to because he didn’t hire him to begin with. 

[GeorgeM37]

51 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

It’s time to amicably par ways. Sadly Doug can’t fire him even if he wanted to because he didn’t hire him to begin with. 

I NEVER wanted this guy here.....never. I was right the whole time because the defense has been crap his entire tenure.....the defense is the laughing stock of the league....

[EazyEaglez]

2 minutes ago, GeorgeM37 said:

I NEVER wanted this guy here.....never. I was right the whole time because the defense has been crap his entire tenure.....the defense is the laughing stock of the league....

Certainly is an easy defense to defeat and now that they have been exposed over and over again by the Rams over pursuing and getting abused on the edges they can expect other teams to do it as well.