June 12, 20232 yr 25 minutes ago, jsdarkstar said: His cult just doesn't understand that. They believe Justice is not being equally applied. I guess what they don't get is if Trump turned over the documents and cooperated, he would not have been indicted. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out. In a very technical sense, both Biden and Pence broke the law simply by having the documents. But intent matters when bringing a prosecution -- they both cooperated fully. Pence has been cleared, and Biden likely will be as well.
June 12, 20232 yr 18 minutes ago, vikas83 said: In a very technical sense, both Biden and Pence broke the law simply by having the documents. But intent matters when bringing a prosecution -- they both cooperated fully. Pence has been cleared, and Biden likely will be as well. Holy sheet, I can't wait until Biden's cleared. It's gonna be beautiful.
June 12, 20232 yr I'm sure the excuse will be all former presidents just leave documents out for anyone to come and look at. Chinese Nationals at Mar-a-Lago Raise Questions About Classified Documents Zhang was carrying a total of four cellphones, a laptop and other electronic gear, promoting fears she could have been a spy. She was never charged with espionage, but later found guilty of trespassing and lying to Secret Service agents and deported.
June 12, 20232 yr 34 minutes ago, vikas83 said: In a very technical sense, both Biden and Pence broke the law simply by having the documents. But intent matters when bringing a prosecution -- they both cooperated fully. Pence has been cleared, and Biden likely will be as well. Intent is the key. Without it, prosceutors tend not to pursue criminal charges. Getting cult member to see that is next to impossible.
June 12, 20232 yr 36 minutes ago, vikas83 said: In a very technical sense, both Biden and Pence broke the law simply by having the documents. But intent matters when bringing a prosecution -- they both cooperated fully. Pence has been cleared, and Biden likely will be as well. Exactly. The prosecutors also know that a half decent defense lawyer would just say "These guys work a 7-days a week job, so of course they bring files home. It is unreasonable to think that they'd forget that they're still in possession of some files?" A jury of 12 isn't gonna convict that. Which is why Trump keeping the files was dumb. Attempting to steal? Okay fine. But as soon as he got a whiff that this was being investigated, all he had to say was "Whoops, I forgot."
June 12, 20232 yr Chinese Nationals at Mar-a-Lago Raise Questions About Classified Documents Zhang raised suspicions as she didn't have a swimming costume. She later changed her story and said she was there to attend a U.N. friendship event between the United States and China, despite evidence on her phone suggesting she knew the event had been canceled. Zhang was carrying a total of four cellphones, a laptop and other electronic gear, promoting fears she could have been a spy. She was never charged with espionage, but later found guilty of trespassing and lying to Secret Service agents and deported. The indictment, which was unsealed on June 9, said that among the documents Trump retained and moved to his Mar-a-Lago resort were the "defense and weapons capabilities of both the United States and foreign countries; United States nuclear programs; potential vulnerabilities of the United States and its allies to military attack; and plans for possible retaliation in response to a foreign attack." https://www.newsweek.com/maralago-classified-documents-chinese-nationals-trump-1805890
June 12, 20232 yr 30 minutes ago, Lloyd said: Exactly. The prosecutors also know that a half decent defense lawyer would just say "These guys work a 7-days a week job, so of course they bring files home. It is unreasonable to think that they'd forget that they're still in possession of some files?" A jury of 12 isn't gonna convict that. Which is why Trump keeping the files was dumb. Attempting to steal? Okay fine. But as soon as he got a whiff that this was being investigated, all he had to say was "Whoops, I forgot." I'm sure his lawyers counseled him to do just that, but he knows better than they do.
June 12, 20232 yr 21 minutes ago, DaEagles4Life said: Chinese Nationals at Mar-a-Lago Raise Questions About Classified Documents Zhang raised suspicions as she didn't have a swimming costume. She later changed her story and said she was there to attend a U.N. friendship event between the United States and China, despite evidence on her phone suggesting she knew the event had been canceled. Zhang was carrying a total of four cellphones, a laptop and other electronic gear, promoting fears she could have been a spy. She was never charged with espionage, but later found guilty of trespassing and lying to Secret Service agents and deported. The indictment, which was unsealed on June 9, said that among the documents Trump retained and moved to his Mar-a-Lago resort were the "defense and weapons capabilities of both the United States and foreign countries; United States nuclear programs; potential vulnerabilities of the United States and its allies to military attack; and plans for possible retaliation in response to a foreign attack." https://www.newsweek.com/maralago-classified-documents-chinese-nationals-trump-1805890 It is a shame that nothing will change the minds of his cultists. These people think Jesus would pick Trump to help him fight evil.
June 12, 20232 yr 12 minutes ago, vikas83 said: He seems to be doing well Good to see the GOP getting back to "kitchen table" issues.
June 12, 20232 yr This is a good start. Magistrate to preside over Trump’s arraignment, not controversial Judge Aileen Cannon A magistrate judge will be presiding over the momentous Miami federal court hearing on Tuesday afternoon when former President Donald Trump makes his first appearance on charges of keeping classified documents at his Palm Beach estate and obstructing government efforts to reclaim them. Magistrate Judge Jonathan Goodman — not U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon, who was randomly assigned Trump’s case — will be handling the former president’s arraignment and bond matters. Cannon, who had been widely reported to be handling those duties, will still remain on the historic case as the lead judge. Goodman is a well-regarded veteran magistrate who once worked as a newspaper reporter in South Florida and later obtained his law degree and practiced civil litigation, including as a partner with the Greenberg Traurig law firm in Miami. Goodman is known not only for his legal wisdom but also for his wry humor in the courtroom. Cannon is the newest member of the federal bench in South Florida, joining the court system as a judge just days after Trump lost the November 2020 election. Cannon, who was nominated by Trump and previously served in the U.S. Attorney’s Office as a prosecutor, drew widespread criticism for her handling of the former president’s civil case challenging the FBI’s seizure of classified documents from his Mar-a-Lago estate last summer. Miami attorney Joseph DeMaria, who once worked in the Justice Department’s organized crime task force in South Florida, told the Herald last week that there may be no legal reason to disqualify Cannon from staying on the Trump case. But he said that the American public is so divided politically that if she chooses to stick with it, many people might not have faith in the outcome. "Should she recuse herself?” asked DeMaria, a Republican. "As a citizen, I think she should. Donald Trump is entitled to a fair trial, but the people of this country also deserve a fair trial.” If Cannon were to step aside for any reason, the Trump case would be randomly assigned again to one of the other three federal judges in the West Palm Beach division: Robin Rosenberg, Donald Middlebrooks or Kenneth Marra. Trump’s legal team has been interviewing South Florida lawyers to join the team, most notably Ben Kuehne, a Democrat and prominent member of the legal community. He’s a former president of the Miami-Dade Bar Association and most recently represented Miami Commissioner Joe Carollo in his federal civil case in which Carollo was sued by businessman Bill Fuller.
June 12, 20232 yr 24 minutes ago, vikas83 said: He seems to be doing well Hilarious how he adds in the subtle racism as well
June 12, 20232 yr Just remember it' wasn't Garland or Smith or the DOJ or Biden who indicted Trump. It was a group of citizens of Palm Beach County Florida who heard the evidence and issued the indictment. That's how the justice system works. Go read the indictment.
June 12, 20232 yr 18 minutes ago, jsdarkstar said: Cannon, who had been widely reported to be handling those duties, will still remain on the historic case as the lead judge. Was pleased until I got to this part.
June 12, 20232 yr 7 minutes ago, vikas83 said: How are my people involved in this??? i believe multi people have won all of the districts before, but fact checking is a foreign concept when it comes to magat cucks and their daddy.
June 12, 20232 yr 7 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: Was pleased until I got to this part. Yeah, hopefully, that won't be for long. There is plenty reasons to get rid of her. Bias, she's the youngest judge on the circuit, reprimanded twice by the Circuit Court and she was appointed by the Defendant, conflict of interest. She should recuse and the head/senior most Judge should handle this case. If she doesn't the DA can file a motion and then the Circuit Court will appt a new Judge.
June 12, 20232 yr 17 minutes ago, jsdarkstar said: Yeah, hopefully, that won't be for long. There is plenty reasons to get rid of her. Bias, she's the youngest judge on the circuit, reprimanded twice by the Circuit Court and she was appointed by the Defendant, conflict of interest. She should recuse and the head/senior most Judge should handle this case. If she doesn't the DA can file a motion and then the Circuit Court will appt a new Judge. Temper your expectations. Getting the Circuit Court of Appeals to remove a judge for bias is an INCREDIBLY high bar. It's very rarely successful.
June 12, 20232 yr 3 hours ago, vikas83 said: In a very technical sense, both Biden and Pence broke the law simply by having the documents. But intent matters when bringing a prosecution -- they both cooperated fully. Pence has been cleared, and Biden likely will be as well. as I understand it being prosecuted for removal and retention requires the state to prove a person to knowingly took the documents. I'm specifically referring to US Code 18 1924 in the case of Biden and Pence there is zero evidence suggesting this. there is a requirement that if you find classified materials you have to contact the government and arrange for their return, which as you said they both did. IANAL, but when I looked up history of people prosecuted for this (such as Sandy Berger), in all cases the state successfully proved that the defendants knowingly took the documents. In the case of Berger specifically I believe he ultimately plead to it, but the gov't had the evidence. is there another statute here?
June 12, 20232 yr 12 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said: as I understand it being prosecuted for removal and retention requires the state to prove a person to knowingly took the documents. I'm specifically referring to US Code 18 1924 in the case of Biden and Pence there is zero evidence suggesting this. there is a requirement that if you find classified materials you have to contact the government and arrange for their return, which as you said they both did. IANAL, but when I looked up history of people prosecuted for this (such as Sandy Berger), in all cases the state successfully proved that the defendants knowingly took the documents. In the case of Berger specifically I believe he ultimately plead to it, but the gov't had the evidence. is there another statute here? I had thought the possession alone was a crime, since there was a duty to exercise care and not take documents. Either way, it doesn't matter since no chance in hell they'd prosecute for a mistake.
June 12, 20232 yr I guess the argument would be -- how does one unknowingly take something? Unless you can prove someone else put it in the box to frame you. Just because a staffer packs the box, you are still responsible (also, why is a staffer seeing classified info). All semantics. But it does lead to an interesting question -- how could Trump's lawyers search for classified docs when they don't have security clearance? Technically, did Trump even have the clearance at that point?
June 12, 20232 yr 22 minutes ago, vikas83 said: I had thought the possession alone was a crime, since there was a duty to exercise care and not take documents. Either way, it doesn't matter since no chance in hell they'd prosecute for a mistake. 18 minutes ago, vikas83 said: I guess the argument would be -- how does one unknowingly take something? Unless you can prove someone else put it in the box to frame you. Just because a staffer packs the box, you are still responsible (also, why is a staffer seeing classified info). All semantics. But it does lead to an interesting question -- how could Trump's lawyers search for classified docs when they don't have security clearance? Technically, did Trump even have the clearance at that point? I would think that there has to be a level of negligence that would be considered enough for prosecution, but I'm not a lawyer. but as that particular statute is written, which is the one that Berger and a handful of others have been prosecuted under, knowingly removing the documents is part of what the state has to prove. it doesn't appear that uncommon for classified material to get inadvertently mixed in with personal files. I think we'd all like to think that could be tightened up, but when you're trafficking in classified material every day and handing off the documents to a rotating bunch of staff assistants, I think that may be the price of doing government business? as you say, intent is what these things turn on. it's clear at this stage that Donny boy intended to remove these classified documents, knew they were classified, did not declassify them, and even was stupid enough to brag about having them on tape. the guy deserves what's coming to him.
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