JJAW IN, Fulgham Out

[Procus]

4 minutes ago, EagleVA said:

I'm sure you can but not TheClownDownUnder can do better than Howie, so quit with the 'that's why you're not an NFL GM'. 

For all his faults, the Eagles would not have a trophy without Howie.

 

[EagleVA]

15 minutes ago, Procus said:

For all his faults, the Eagles would not have a trophy without Howie.

 

Right but maybe they would have had more without him.

[Procus]

1 minute ago, EagleVA said:

Right but maybe they would have had more without him.

Perhaps.  But I doubt that would be the case unless the Eagles did not fire Andy Reid.

[Cochis_Calhoun]

50 minutes ago, Procus said:

For all his faults, the Eagles would not have a trophy without Howie.

 

Don't think that's true, his drafting since 2012 has been at best uneven, even 2017 it's not like he unearthed hidden gems he signed some decent free agents, only Barnett remains on the roster from that draft class, he's thrown two head coaches in a row under the bus in pissing contests now.

A decent GM would have turned 2017 into a roster that challenged regularly with good regular turnover of talent, instead we're still heavily relying on guys drafted almost a decade ago in key positions. I think Howie's helping hand to this organisation is wildly overstated and far and away his biggest skill is his PR the result of which sees him regularly lauded by fans while the head coaches of the last decade are derided as hamfisted clowns.

[UK_EaglesFan89]

8 hours ago, ManchesterEagle said:

I think we have a lot of unknowns but a lot of exciting potential as well. JJAW is the number 5, so it would take at least 2 injuries for him to be playing a lot, particularly as we have Ertz and Goedert. I don’t think there are many teams who would feel good about their current WR5 playing significant snaps.

I don't necessarily agree. I mean I think they have WRs who can do different things and so they are all going to see a decent number of snaps. I don't think they'll go exclusively with Smith, Reagor and Watkins. And even if they did one injury and they are going to have to turn to Ward who can only really play in the slot.

[Traveler Vic]

9 hours ago, Kz! said:

The final decision was probably really close. Looks like we gambled that Fulgham would draw less interest on the open market than JJAW. Obviously we have no way of knowing if JJAW would have drawn interest, but we know Fulgham didn't, so we were at least half right in that assessment. Either way, Fulgham's on the practice squad, so this is a non-issue. Hopefully neither will have to take meaningful regular season snaps on offense. 

 It bogles my mind that there is no better candidate for a roster spot than JJaw. I can think of the few candidates at least.

[brkmsn]

13 hours ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

...as little as JJAW has done their first 2 seasons (when healthy throughout)...

During his rookie year, he was moved around to different WR positions and mentally was lost as a player. We all saw him struggle. After the season, the coaches said he was playing through some injuries. But why should we "buy" that if he wasn't listed on the injury reports? So there's no reason to put a lot of stock in that. Let's just say he struggled because he wasn't good enough. 

Last year, he was mainly just playing X. Obviously Jeffery wasn't ready for the first half of the season, but the starting nod went to Reagor. JJAW was set to start week 4 at X, but got hurt during the pregame warmups and was deactivated for the game. Fulgham was forced to start. For 5 games, Fulgham was a phenom at X. Then a couple unproductive games coincided with Jeffery's return to full health and JJAW was deactivated for a few weeks as the team's 3rd X behind the other 2. 

My point is that while he didn't have any major injuries last season, he did have a significant one that led to what the team did next. I don't think there's one person on the EMB that would have pulled Fulgham in favor of JJAW during that 5 -week stretch. As much as I disagreed with playing Jeffery over Fulgham later, Jeffery has always been a favorite (WR) target of Wentz. I wish Jeffery would have looked good when he finally returned, but he didn't. So yeah ... JJAW wasn't "healthy throughout." His one significant injury forced the team to change directions because the next man up made a lot of plays. 

Fast forward to this (football) season. JJAW already had the benefit of learning X, Z, and slot as a rookie and Sirianni wants that out of all his WRs. Fulgham was just an X for us last year, so it's likely any of his camp "struggles" might have been related to learning the other positions. Both guys were asked to work on special teams as well this year. I can't honestly tell you if one looked better there than the other. That's for the coaches to figure out. Sirianni also places a lot of value on the WRs' ability to block. JJAW was, IMO, the best blocking WR we had last season when he played. 

[Bwestbrook36]

2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I don't necessarily agree. I mean I think they have WRs who can do different things and so they are all going to see a decent number of snaps. I don't think they'll go exclusively with Smith, Reagor and Watkins. And even if they did one injury and they are going to have to turn to Ward who can only really play in the slot.

There is a big difference between having to turn to Ward when we have nothing else and turning to Ward when we have multiple better weapons. Having those outside threats actually open things up for Ward to work underneath 

[Infam]

23 hours ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

It's not really about Fulgham, I find it incredibly hard to believe we couldn't find a WR UDFA or in the roster cuts lists that couldn't outperform JJAW. I mean yes sometimes a player will take a while to find their feet in the big leagues, but players that did as little as JJAW has done their first 2 seasons (when healthy throughout) who breakout as a solid contributor in year 3 are as common as Rocking Horse turds.

So yeah it's not that Fulgham isn't good enough it's that neither are, hell even Hightower had a better case for a potential year 2 progress than JJAW as a 2 year flat out bum.

Agreed.

Maybe Siriani wants to prove a point? Some pet project like: "If I can get JJaw to produce, maybe they build me a statue, too." ?

[EagleVA]

I thought I read a post that Whitside was a Lurie pick, if so, that explains it all. 

[Traveler Vic]

15 hours ago, brkmsn said:

During his rookie year, he was moved around to different WR positions and mentally was lost as a player. We all saw him struggle. After the season, the coaches said he was playing through some injuries. But why should we "buy" that if he wasn't listed on the injury reports? So there's no reason to put a lot of stock in that. Let's just say he struggled because he wasn't good enough. 

Last year, he was mainly just playing X. Obviously Jeffery wasn't ready for the first half of the season, but the starting nod went to Reagor. JJAW was set to start week 4 at X, but got hurt during the pregame warmups and was deactivated for the game. Fulgham was forced to start. For 5 games, Fulgham was a phenom at X. Then a couple unproductive games coincided with Jeffery's return to full health and JJAW was deactivated for a few weeks as the team's 3rd X behind the other 2. 

My point is that while he didn't have any major injuries last season, he did have a significant one that led to what the team did next. I don't think there's one person on the EMB that would have pulled Fulgham in favor of JJAW during that 5 -week stretch. As much as I disagreed with playing Jeffery over Fulgham later, Jeffery has always been a favorite (WR) target of Wentz. I wish Jeffery would have looked good when he finally returned, but he didn't. So yeah ... JJAW wasn't "healthy throughout." His one significant injury forced the team to change directions because the next man up made a lot of plays. 

Fast forward to this (football) season. JJAW already had the benefit of learning X, Z, and slot as a rookie and Sirianni wants that out of all his WRs. Fulgham was just an X for us last year, so it's likely any of his camp "struggles" might have been related to learning the other positions. Both guys were asked to work on special teams as well this year. I can't honestly tell you if one looked better there than the other. That's for the coaches to figure out. Sirianni also places a lot of value on the WRs' ability to block. JJAW was, IMO, the best blocking WR we had last season when he played. 

I was looking forward to what Siri could do with Fulgham during the camp..because for 5 weeks last year Fulgham was not just an X, but the best X in the NFL. Siri being a WR coach and everything. So I am mildly disappointed with what happened to Fulgham. But even more , it boggles my mind that JJAW is still on the roster. We have so many TEs that are better blockers and receivers than him. Why not release/trade JJaw and give a chance to a better prospect. This goes against what Siri was saying that he will not pay attention to a pedigree, and smells like another Howie/ Owner meddling. 

[hoosierdaddy]

On 9/2/2021 at 9:51 AM, Kz! said:

They'd be happy until JJAW got his first reception with the new team. Then, TATeRgeddon!

And imagine if that first catch was a TD?!?

[Bwestbrook36]

2 hours ago, Traveler Vic said:

I was looking forward to what Siri could do with Fulgham during the camp..because for 5 weeks last year Fulgham was not just an X, but the best X in the NFL. Siri being a WR coach and everything. So I am mildly disappointed with what happened to Fulgham. But even more , it boggles my mind that JJAW is still on the roster. We have so many TEs that are better blockers and receivers than him. Why not release/trade JJaw and give a chance to a better prospect. This goes against what Siri was saying that he will not pay attention to a pedigree, and smells like another Howie/ Owner meddling. 

Nah Fulgham sucks. 

[UK_EaglesFan89]

54 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

Nah Fulgham sucks. 

Both suck that's the reality. That's why they were both on the bubble.

[ggs5008]

We have the worst WR core in the nfl. I doubt anyone is looking at our group. 

[NOTW]

9 hours ago, EagleVA said:

I thought I read a post that Whitside was a Lurie pick, if so, that explains it all. 

That was one of the rumors last year about Lurie meddling, that he heard the scouts say he compared to Alshon Jeffrey's skill set and Lurie wanted him.

Also the scouts wanted Jefferson last year but Howie wanted Reagor because speed.

[Penn7980]

On 9/2/2021 at 4:57 AM, Cochis_Calhoun said:

It's not really about Fulgham, I find it incredibly hard to believe we couldn't find a WR UDFA or in the roster cuts lists that couldn't outperform JJAW. I mean yes sometimes a player will take a while to find their feet in the big leagues, but players that did as little as JJAW has done their first 2 seasons (when healthy throughout) who breakout as a solid contributor in year 3 are as common as Rocking Horse turds.

So yeah it's not that Fulgham isn't good enough it's that neither are, hell even Hightower had a better case for a potential year 2 progress than JJAW as a 2 year flat out bum.

 

This is the right way to view the situation.  Fulgham did not have a good camp and preseason games.  He is where he should be based on that performance.  JJAW had a reasonable Jets game which might have saved him.  Hightower did not do enough to bump JJAW off the roster.  He too is where he should be. 

Back to your point that there should be a better waived WR to replace JJAW.  Assuming the FO did look, but did not turn up with any prospects.  That process may still be ongoing.  As the season goes on, it would be harder to find a new player to come in and can still contribute.   

[Bwestbrook36]

3 hours ago, ggs5008 said:

We have the worst WR core in the nfl. I doubt anyone is looking at our group. 

Not even close. We have 3 guys with great upside at least. They may not turnout to be sheet but, for now they have upside there is quite a few teams that really have nothing like the lions

[Traveler Vic]

5 hours ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

Nah Fulgham sucks. 

Obviously judging by the training camp, you are correct. But I think that he doesn't suck..he is just slow. Physically gifted , but slow. Needs more time to figure out where line up, etc.. We will see.

[Bwestbrook36]

1 minute ago, Traveler Vic said:

Obviously judging by the training camp, you are correct. But I think that he doesn't suck..he is just slow. Physically gifted , but slow. Needs more time to figure out where line up, etc.. We will see.

Well he apparently has a sheety attitude as well. He is in no position to think he just should get a job

[brkmsn]

9 hours ago, Traveler Vic said:

I was looking forward to what Siri could do with Fulgham during the camp..because for 5 weeks last year Fulgham was not just an X, but the best X in the NFL. Siri being a WR coach and everything. So I am mildly disappointed with what happened to Fulgham. But even more , it boggles my mind that JJAW is still on the roster. We have so many TEs that are better blockers and receivers than him. Why not release/trade JJaw and give a chance to a better prospect. This goes against what Siri was saying that he will not pay attention to a pedigree, and smells like another Howie/ Owner meddling. 

I'm sure most TEs would be better blockers than most WRs --- especially in pass blocking situations vs LBs and DEs. But Siriani highly values WR blocking down the field for the ball carriers. 

Anyway, I'm not sure who you feel the better prospect is/was. One guy that rose from the depths this year is Watkins. He put in the work, made the most of his opportunities and moved past Fulgham, Hightower, JJAW and probably Ward. So your conclusion isn't exactly fair. If we had had a guy that outplayed JJAW  in practice and/or the preseason games, then you'd have a case. If you're looking at names of available WRs around the league after roster cuts, most of them were disappointments for their respective teams. 

During the season, injuries are a realistic factor that can change the trajectory of a position. Last year, Fulgham rose from nowhere to be our playmaking spark when most of our starting skill players were injured. If we experience significant injuries at WR, maybe something similar happens this year. Until they force your hand, there is no reason to change your mind about what you learned from camp. These are the guys that won a job on the 53 and the guys that were brought back to the PS. There aren't currently any WRs available that are guaranteed to be better than the ones we kept and there is no familiarity (between players or with Sirianni's offense) to base positive projections on. You have camp and preseason for a reason. You make decisions based on those opportunities. You have to be prepared to move forward with those decisions. 

[Breeze 44]

Look I'm not a JJ backer and can't believe I'm supporting him here but he at this point does and adds things that those others don't ( omg, I just threw up in my mouth)

These aren't things we want from a 2nd rd pick but something this new Offense wants and that is size< a willingness to block and play ST. He will make the occasional

catch.  Fulgham apparentley is a head case and thus we are like his 4th team. Too many fans made him out to be the next T.O and made him out to something he never was and never will be. 

[Bwestbrook36]

3 hours ago, Breeze 44 said:

Look I'm not a JJ backer and can't believe I'm supporting him here but he at this point does and adds things that those others don't ( omg, I just threw up in my mouth)

These aren't things we want from a 2nd rd pick but something this new Offense wants and that is size< a willingness to block and play ST. He will make the occasional

catch.  Fulgham apparentley is a head case and thus we are like his 4th team. Too many fans made him out to be the next T.O and made him out to something he never was and never will be. 

Every year we have someone go on a tear for a few games and everyone crowns them as the next star that we unearthed. Then they get cut or traded for scraps and everyone argues over them until they disappear never to be seen again. It's like clockwork. 

[NOTW]

22 hours ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

Not even close. We have 3 guys with great upside at least. They may not turnout to be sheet but, for now they have upside there is quite a few teams that really have nothing like the lions

We don't know what Smith will be yet, but great potential from draft. Reagor nothing special so far, hopefully decent. 

The rest are scrubs. If Smith (a twig) or Reagor (already injured last year) get injured this WR group is screwed.

[Bwestbrook36]

9 minutes ago, NOTW said:

We don't know what Smith will be yet, but great potential from draft. Reagor nothing special so far, hopefully decent. 

The rest are scrubs. If Smith (a twig) or Reagor (already injured last year) get injured this WR group is screwed.

Well yeah I got that but, their are teams like the lions who don't even have hope of a young skilled player.