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Andy, Doug, Buddy, Kotite


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Now, of course the Superbowl win by Doug is the greatest postseason accolade any coach could have, and something the other 3 dont have here, but what's weirder? Doug Pederson winning a Superbowl, while Andy didn't, or Kotite winning a playoff game while Buddy didn't?

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Weirder?  I'd say Buddy not winning a playoff game with that legendary defense.  Andy had a lot of success just couldn't get over the hump (and eventually did of course in KC). 

The Super Bowl win was a combo of a lot of factors that lined up well in 2017.  Not taking anything away from Doug at all, but it wasn't like Andy didn't win and they inserted Doug and he won.  There was Chip in between and then Howie and Doug rebuilt the team.

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Pedersen won with an overachieving roster and a backup QB.......

Andy didn't win a SB until he had Mahomes......

Buddy put all his efforts into that defense and only had a "one man show" on offense......

Kotite inherited a talented roster but, along with Harry Gamble's horrible drafts, he drove that into the ground.....

Nothing really weird about it all.......the NFL is so unpredictable from year to year.  Plus the game has changed so much since the 80's-90's......

 

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It takes a lot of things to go right in a season for a team to win a Super Bowl.   The year Pedersen won, Green Bay was a non-factor because Rodgers was out for the year.  I'm not saying things would have been any different, but the Eagles always struggle against Aaron Rodgers.  Doug still did a great job that year, no doubt.

Under Reid, they had 2 legitimate shots at winning it all.  1) The year they lost to TB in the NFC Championship Game, and 2) the year they lost to Arizona.   Going into those NFC Championship Games, I was convinced we would win it all. I don't even remember who to blame, but both were devastating losses.

Kotite inherited a talented roster from Buddy and managed to win a playoff game, but he basically gave away his game plans by announcing to the world that "Randall can't run in the playoffs like he does during the regular season."  Stupid idiot.

Here is how I would rank them:

  1. Doug - He won it all; he's a legend
  2. Andy - Really close to being good as Doug, but no SB
  3. Chip - Believe it or not, I'd rank him third
  4. Buddy
  5. Ray Rhodes
  6. Kotite - Not even good enough to coach a high school team
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11 minutes ago, JamesK said:

3. Chip - Believe it or not, I'd rank him third

🤣 Some reason, that made me laugh

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3 hours ago, birdman#12 said:

Pedersen won with an overachieving roster and a backup QB.......

Andy didn't win a SB until he had Mahomes......

Buddy put all his efforts into that defense and only had a "one man show" on offense......

Kotite inherited a talented roster but, along with Harry Gamble's horrible drafts, he drove that into the ground.....

Nothing really weird about it all.......the NFL is so unpredictable from year to year.  Plus the game has changed so much since the 80's-90's......

 

Joe Wooly was handling the drafts during this time, not Gamble.

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Buddy often ignored the offense. He built a great defense, but his offense was primarily, "Randall- go make a play"   He didn't deserve to win a playoff game.

Then again neither did Kotite, who inherited that Defense 

Andy's shortcomings showed up at the worst time. 

Doug got really lucky- with his staff, the free agents Howie brought in and Big Dick Nick went on a two game tear!

 

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5 hours ago, birdman#12 said:

Pedersen won with an overachieving roster and a backup QB.......

Andy didn't win a SB until he had Mahomes......

Buddy put all his efforts into that defense and only had a "one man show" on offense......

Kotite inherited a talented roster but, along with Harry Gamble's horrible drafts, he drove that into the ground.....

Nothing really weird about it all.......the NFL is so unpredictable from year to year.  Plus the game has changed so much since the 80's-90's......

 

Kotite is the worst HC in my book.

Pederson had an overachieving roster.  Don't underestimate the coaching staff was a damn good one too.  

AR could not win a SB until he got to KC and had Mahommes, hIs thick folder notwithstanding.

Buddy cared only the defense.  Can't win without scoring some points.

 

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I don’t think it’s fair to knock AR for not winning until he had Mahomes.  Belichick gets bashed for not winning post Brady.

You can’t snip team HC on both ends of the stick.

AR built an offensive juggernaut in Philly and then went and did it again in KC.  His qb in Philly was a choke artist.  It happens.

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4 hours ago, Ipiggles said:

Buddy often ignored the offense. He built a great defense, but his offense was primarily, "Randall- go make a play"   He didn't deserve to win a playoff game.

 

8 hours ago, birdman#12 said:

Buddy put all his efforts into that defense and only had a "one man show" on offense.....

 

3 hours ago, Penn7980 said:

Buddy cared only the defense.  Can't win without scoring some points.

This is a misconception people have. Buddy inherited one of the worst offensive lines in NFL history. They couldn't run block or pass block. There was no free agency when Buddy became a HC. You built through the draft or through trades. Every year, our offensive line improved a little bit under Ryan. People forget, though that Ryan's first pick was Keith Byars and his second was Anthony Toney. He also used a first round pick on Keith Jackson and traded a 1st round pick for All Pro OG Ron Solt who would soon get busted for steroids. He also drafted Cris Carter in the supplemental draft. 

Buddy never ignored the offense. The only free agency that began in Buddy's time here was Plan B which was really just a team's garbage heap. 

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Buddy was a terrible coach. There is nothing weird about him being dominated when it mattered the most.

Doug doing what Andy couldn’t is more of an outlier, IMO.

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I loved buddy.    I think he was 6-0 against Jimmy Johnson and the Cowboys.    The super bowl win under Doug was #1.   But, Buddy dominating the Cowboys and pissing them off so bad ranks high on my list.

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How I would rank the coaches:

 

Doug: Had a bit of luck go his way, fortune favors the brave, he was also a great coach and not as dumb as I thought he would be after listening to his first press conference as the Eagles coach.

Andy: Just didn't get it, he wasted so many great to peak years of TRA, Runyan, Donovan, Dawkins etc by going with band aid WRs like Pinkston, James Trash etc. He had to be fired and get to KC to finally correct his mistakes.

Buddy: It was all about his Defense and nothing else, didn't care one bit about his Offense, with his analogy: '5 big plays, would you usually win the game for ya, everything was built around him (Randall)'  What a load of rubbish.

Ray Rhodes: Unfortunately for Ray, the Mark Brunnell trade to the Eagles didn't happen and that pretty much sealed his fate in Philly. Ray had to contend with avg to below avg signal callers through out his years here.

Ritchie: As bad of a coach he may have been, apparently there were murmurs in 1994 when the Eagles were 7-2 that Jeff Lurie was not keen on him being the head coach and hence the season went downhill from there. Even if Ritchie did coach well, it was the years of Dallas Dynasty and Eagles had no shot at winning the Superbowl or get close to it.

Chip: I don't even know what to say... But thanks for drafting Lane Johnson and not Dion Jordan..

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1 hour ago, Pliny said:

I loved buddy.    I think he was 6-0 against Jimmy Johnson and the Cowboys.    The super bowl win under Doug was #1.   But, Buddy dominating the Cowboys and pissing them off so bad ranks high on my list.

Giants too. Not undefeated, but he had a pretty good record against Bill Parcells. 

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This went from which is weirder to rank the coaches. Weirdest thing here is most people would rank Kotite last in this group, but he did more with Buddy’s players than Buddy did, and has more wins than Chip plus won a playoff game when Chip didn’t. 

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21 hours ago, Procus said:

Joe Wooly was handling the drafts during this time, not Gamble.

Either way......the drafts were atrocious......

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4 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

This went from which is weirder to rank the coaches. Weirdest thing here is most people would rank Kotite last in this group, but he did more with Buddy’s players than Buddy did, and has more wins than Chip plus won a playoff game when Chip didn’t. 

Kotite, warts and all, had one great move - he hired Bud Carson as his DC.  Carson was a more brilliant defensive genius than Buddy.  Kotite rode Bud Carson's tails - it was not Richie's coaching prowess

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On 9/30/2022 at 12:02 PM, birdman#12 said:

Pedersen won with an overachieving roster and a backup QB.......

Andy didn't win a SB until he had Mahomes......

Buddy put all his efforts into that defense and only had a "one man show" on offense......

Kotite inherited a talented roster but, along with Harry Gamble's horrible drafts, he drove that into the ground.....

Nothing really weird about it all.......the NFL is so unpredictable from year to year.  Plus the game has changed so much since the 80's-90's......

 

How do you figure it was an "overachieving" roster other than the obvious Nick Foles playing out of his mind? 

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On 9/30/2022 at 12:02 PM, birdman#12 said:

Pedersen won with an overachieving roster and a backup QB.......

Andy didn't win a SB until he had Mahomes......

Buddy put all his efforts into that defense and only had a "one man show" on offense......

Kotite inherited a talented roster but, along with Harry Gamble's horrible drafts, he drove that into the ground.....

Nothing really weird about it all.......the NFL is so unpredictable from year to year.  Plus the game has changed so much since the 80's-90's......

 

Honestly, it was far less to do with Kotite and much much MUCH more to do with the defensive players' hatred of Norman Braman for firing Buddy.  That defense died due to free agency.  None of that defense resigned with the Eagles when their contracts were up... the exception, I believe, was William Thomas, but he didn't come until '91 IIRC... after Buddy was gone.

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On 9/30/2022 at 5:39 PM, Penn7980 said:

Kotite is the worst HC in my book.

Pederson had an overachieving roster.  Don't underestimate the coaching staff was a damn good one too.  

AR could not win a SB until he got to KC and had Mahommes, hIs thick folder notwithstanding.

Buddy cared only the defense.  Can't win without scoring some points.

 

If we are discounting Doug due to his coaching staff... Andy should be discounted as well.  His first staff when he was brought in was awesome.  No fewer than 8 future NFL head coaches on that staff.  Childress, Rivera, Frazier, McDermott, Spagnuolo, Culley, Shurmur and Harbaugh.

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1 hour ago, Iggles_Phan said:

If we are discounting Doug due to his coaching staff... Andy should be discounted as well.  His first staff when he was brought in was awesome.  No fewer than 8 future NFL head coaches on that staff.  Childress, Rivera, Frazier, McDermott, Spagnuolo, Culley, Shurmur and Harbaugh.

That further enhances the point that AR needed quality players to win, despite his first staff filled with stellar coaches.

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3 hours ago, [TSM]_PimpDaddyPain said:

How do you figure it was an "overachieving" roster other than the obvious Nick Foles playing out of his mind? 

I'm with you. Doug called it a Super Bowl roster before the season (which the media snickered at) so I don't see how you could label the roster "overachieving".

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8 hours ago, [TSM]_PimpDaddyPain said:

How do you figure it was an "overachieving" roster other than the obvious Nick Foles playing out of his mind? 

Peters, Sproles, Hicks and Sturgis were on IR.......

They signed Jake Elliot off the bengals practice squad.

The RBs consisted of a mixed bag of older vets, UDFAs, and wendall smallwood.

The WRs were jeffrey, smith and agholor......

They had one all-pro on defense and 3 on offense.......and Wentz missed the last 3 games and the playoffs.

The were a good team but nobody thought they would dominate the season and then, when wentz went down, nobody thought they would win anything.....3 home playoff underdogs?

They overachieved.  Which made it all so much sweeter.

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