Simplest answer is to move the 3 point line back a few inches. This would cause defenders to have to move away from basket and make it hard for defenders to cheat and clog the middle. That would make it a more enticing idea to pass inside and will allow the big men space to operate. Think they can find a happy medium. Right now, it just seems too easy to chuck the ball and play lazy basketball (like the Celtics). I'd experiment in the G-League to see how far back you need to go to make it hard to shoot around 38% or more. It can't be too drastic, but just enough of a deterrent to make it a riskier proposition to shoot it.

8 minutes ago, jojodancer said:

Simplest answer is to move the 3 point line back a few inches. This would cause defenders to have to move away from basket and make it hard to cheat for defenders to clog the middle, which could open up the idea of passing inside near the basket for the big men to operate. Think they can find a happy medium. Right now, it just seems too easy to chuck the ball and play lazy basketball (like the Celtics). I'd experiment in the G-League to see how far back you need to go to make it hard to shoot around 38% or more. It can't be too drastic, but just enough of a deterrent to make it a riskier proposition to shoot it.

Eh, I think that’s punishing the players for being too good. They tried to shoot threes before they just couldn’t do it as well as they can now. Plus half these dudes hit from the logo now so I don’t think it would make much difference anyway.

54 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

I've yet to see any reasonable argument against the proposal. In any case, if you're going to move it back then move it back a foot. IMHO the change should be significant on the game and not just marginal.

I am fine doing a foot but i have a hard time believing the players association agrees. I think you could get 6 inches right now. I do think it would change it more cause 3 point percentages will drop for middle tier shooters and it’ll force teams to play differently

1 minute ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I am fine doing a foot but i have a hard time believing the players association agrees. I think you could get 6 inches right now. I do think it would change it more cause 3 point percentages will drop for middle tier shooters and it’ll force teams to play differently

They certainly should try something.

4 minutes ago, DaBirds said:

Eh, I think that’s punishing the players for being too good. They tried to shoot threes before they just couldn’t do it as well as they can now. Plus half these dudes hit from the logo now so I don’t think it would make much difference anyway.

There's only a few guys in the league who could hit accurately from the logo. Think each inch you move it back will raise the level of difficulty to make this shot and the percentages will get lower. Just logic there. You have Andre Drummond taking and making 3s. Just has become too much of the focal point of offenses and they are not playing team basketball. They are taking turns and playing a game of Horse. It's become too predictable as well. No creativity whatsoever involved in that.

1 hour ago, BigEFly said:

Is that a go pro on Cole Payton? That’s new

They have been doing that for a while now. I remember a few years ago it was some DB down on the depth chart filming his POV

Just now, LeanMeanGM said:

They have been doing that for a while now. I remember a few years ago it was some DB down on the depth chart filming his POV

Makes sense so they can learn from what they would see vs above.

20 minutes ago, jojodancer said:

There's only a few guys in the league who could hit accurately from the logo. Think each inch you move it back will raise the level of difficulty to make this shot and the percentages will get lower. Just logic there. You have Andre Drummond taking and making 3s. Just has become too much of the focal point of offenses and they are not playing team basketball. They are taking turns and playing a game of Horse. It's become too predictable as well. No creativity whatsoever involved in that.

I hear what you’re saying. (Typing)

I feel like you we are past the point of no return though. I mean even if they moved it back in any significant way you are going to see wide open lanes as you said earlier. The guys are just too big/atheltic/long and the bigs can shoot threes. It’s like when you create your own characters in 2k and you’re shooting 3 with Shaq. 😆

I understand your concerns though.

1 hour ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Another 2-3 inches back would change the dynamic more.

Mom thread

35 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

They certainly should try something.

Make the three point line only if effect last two mins of each quarter or something

18 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Make the three point line only if effect last two mins of each quarter or something

Yeah, my suggestion was two quarters with it and two quarters without it.

1 hour ago, HazletonEagle said:

No one would ever admit this either because its like common knowledge now that Curry changed the game, but thats not really true. Steph Curry gets all the credit for revolutionizing the league with his 3 point shooting. He was drafted in 2009. But it started before him. Steven Nash won back to back MVPs in 2005-2006 spearheading that 7 seconds or less offense for the Suns. Steven Nash, Joe Johnson, Quentin Richardson, Sean Marion, Leandro Barbosa and Smush Parker all took a heck of a lot of 3s.

The next year they added Tim Thomas, Eddie House, James Jones... all could shoot it. Even Boris Diaw would hit 3s. Not all of those guys were the greatest shooters either, but they fired at will.

Shane Battier was also known to be an analytics guy during his playing career, and it was a story at the time how he converted Chris Bosh from a traditional post player with Toronto, to a stretch 4/5 with Miami by explaining the math to him. Those were the early days of the transition. Battier went from consistently around two 3pt attempts per game in 05-06 and prior, and doubled it to 4+ attempts when he went to Houston (Darryl Morey GM, analytics guy). Then helped spread the knowledge in Miami.

That analytics knowledge began before Curry was even drafted. D'Antoni and Nash ran that offense in Phoenix, Morey was converting his teams in Houston, and THEN Curry was drafted.

You guys are all way late. The fundamental change in the college game was done by Jerry Tarkanian and his UNLV Running Rebels beginning in the 1970s but the old ABA had the 3 point shot in 1967 and for all of its history. The NBA adopted it 12 years later. Curry was simply the best shooter, although I think Pete Maravich had greater range, though he only shot the 3 at the end of his career when he was all busted up.

6 hours ago, paco said:

Me:

A month ago: The sixers should just loose out. Then they have a shot at getting a lottery pick and possibly not losing it to OKC

Today: We got the Knicks?  Let’s get revenge for 2024!

Somebody better tie Brunson’s shoelaces together.

Popovich also deserves some credit for making 3s a big part of the game. Some of the records for 3s in a game both individual and team wise were held by the Spurs for a while.

3 minutes ago, just relax said:

You guys are all way late. The fundamental change in the college game was done by Jerry Tarkanian and his UNLV Running Rebels beginning in the 1970s but the old ABA had the 3 point shot in 1967 and for all of its history. The NBA adopted it 12 years later. Curry was simply the best shooter, although I think Pete Maravich had greater range, though he only shot the 3 at the end of his career when he was all busted up.

Never heard of Tarkanian. Looks like he was known for inventing the 1-2-2 defense in the 70s, and then in the late 80s and 90s made the runnin rebel fastbreak style famous, where his teams shot a lot of 3s.

Even then, teams werent shooting it as much.

https://www.capecodtimes.com/story/sports/2011/02/13/the-3-point-arc-hits/50197473007/

Even when it was first instituted, coaches were hesitant to take advantage: NCAA Division I teams attempted an average of 9.2 3-point attempts – making 3.5 – per game in 1986-87, compared to 18.2 in 2009-10, the first season the line was moved back a foot to 20 feet, 9 inches.

And then the google AI compares Tarkanian teams 3pt attempt rates to today's

During the 1986-87 season, the first year the three-point line was adopted at the college level, Jerry Tarkanian's UNLV Runnin' Rebels averaged approximately 20 three-point attempts per game. [1]

While this pace was high for the era, it was part of a free-wheeling, uptempo style that was generally lower than modern, high-volume shooting. By comparison, that 1987 team's rate of 20 3-point attempts per game would have ranked just 37th among the 68 participants in a modern NCAA tournament. [1]

Interesting though, he was ahead of the curve on it.

I guess they didnt have the analytics guys back then to really make it more widespread quicker.

Tark is a legend. Supposedly several franchises tried to pry him away but he had some buddies that were involved with the mob and they weren’t having it.

8 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

Never heard of Tarkanian. Looks like he was known for inventing the 1-2-2 defense in the 70s, and then in the late 80s and 90s made the runnin rebel fastbreak style famous, where his teams shot a lot of 3s.

Even then, teams werent shooting it as much.

https://www.capecodtimes.com/story/sports/2011/02/13/the-3-point-arc-hits/50197473007/

And then the google AI compares Tarkanian teams 3pt attempt rates to today's

Interesting though, he was ahead of the curve on it.

I guess they didnt have the analytics guys back then to really make it more widespread quicker.

They didn’t have the data to lean on in the beginning and also players weren’t practicing the shot until the 3 was introduced.

Tark was as good as it got in his era and really went up tempo which was his big thing. Won an NCAA title and then was undefeated into the final four the following year only to lose to Duke in the semis.

Doesnt know Tark = doesnt know ball

3 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Obviously it wasn’t invented with the warriors run. It became the new era of nba in terms of how teams Played with Steph a that warriors run.

2 hours ago, HazletonEagle said:

No one would ever admit this either because its like common knowledge now that Curry changed the game, but thats not really true. Steph Curry gets all the credit for revolutionizing the league with his 3 point shooting. He was drafted in 2009. But it started before him. Steven Nash won back to back MVPs in 2005-2006 spearheading that 7 seconds or less offense for the Suns. Steven Nash, Joe Johnson, Quentin Richardson, Sean Marion, Leandro Barbosa and Smush Parker all took a heck of a lot of 3s.

The next year they added Tim Thomas, Eddie House, James Jones... all could shoot it. Even Boris Diaw would hit 3s. Not all of those guys were the greatest shooters either, but they fired at will.

Shane Battier was also known to be an analytics guy during his playing career, and it was a story at the time how he converted Chris Bosh from a traditional post player with Toronto, to a stretch 4/5 with Miami by explaining the math to him. Those were the early days of the transition. Battier went from consistently around two 3pt attempts per game in 05-06 and prior, and doubled it to 4+ attempts when he went to Houston (Darryl Morey GM, analytics guy). Then helped spread the knowledge in Miami.

That analytics knowledge began before Curry was even drafted. D'Antoni and Nash ran that offense in Phoenix, Morey was converting his teams in Houston, and THEN Curry was drafted.

Suns started it but teams didn’t all jump in cause the suns never got themselves to a title doing it. Teams were beginning to start taking more 3 but not all in like the suns. Really had 3 stages. The suns with the 7 seconds or less. then had Morey (i want to say Don Nelson’s warriors kind started trending towards more 3s and a couple other teams prior) building the rockets as they began to emulate that suns offense to a max around the time of the warriors being built and established. Then the warriors were all in and then had the success they did so everyone then everyone tried to copy cat it by jumping on board and that’s when it blew up big.

23 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Doesnt know Tark = doesnt know ball

Can tell you this, heard and read some good Arizona/unlv stories from late 80s and early 90s. Players hated each other.

56 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Doesnt know Tark = doesnt know ball

Also, just not that old.

35 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Suns started it but teams didn’t all jump in cause the suns never got themselves to a title doing it. Teams were beginning to start taking more 3 but not all in like the suns. Really had 3 stages. The suns with the 7 seconds or less. then had Morey (i want to say Don Nelson’s warriors kind started trending towards more 3s and a couple other teams prior) building the rockets as they began to emulate that suns offense to a max around the time of the warriors being built and established. Then the warriors were all in and then had the success they did so everyone then everyone tried to copy cat it by jumping on board and that’s when it blew up big.

It comes down to the ANAL-ytics goofs surmising that shooting better than 33% from 3-point range was preferable to shooting 50% from anywhere else on the floor. Where there were only so many skilled big men to go around, any 6-foot tall chucker can just heave it up from outside. Who cares if it isn’t entertaining?

Move the 3-point line back one foot and raise the rim 6 inches. You’ll have a better, more watchable game.

3 hours ago, jojodancer said:

Simplest answer is to move the 3 point line back a few inches. This would cause defenders to have to move away from basket and make it hard for defenders to cheat and clog the middle. That would make it a more enticing idea to pass inside and will allow the big men space to operate. Think they can find a happy medium. Right now, it just seems too easy to chuck the ball and play lazy basketball (like the Celtics). I'd experiment in the G-League to see how far back you need to go to make it hard to shoot around 38% or more. It can't be too drastic, but just enough of a deterrent to make it a riskier proposition to shoot it.

Could shrink the width and length of the court like in euro leagues that way defenders dont have as much ground to cover, everything is more compact, lanes shrink etc ..defenders can play defense

I’m leaning toward a situation where Howie hasn’t traded AJ yet by June 5th, and Rams call up saying, "New England is lowballing you? Hell, we’ll give up a 1 and change if that’s all it is.”