Not saying he doesn't need to be more consistent, but how consistent can he really be when it's musical chairs with everyone around him?

2018 he was good, despite coming off of the ACL and breaking his back. 

2019 the offense was abysmal and banged up the entire season.

2020 the entire offensive side of the ball has been decimated. 17 offensive players hurt.

Consistency is fine, but let's look at the context as well.

8 hours ago, NOTW said:

I think what needs to happen is Doug needs a legit OC who calls the plays, and perhaps a new QB coach.  Carson also needs stability.  The O line, WR, TE, RB, injuries everywhere.  What's odd is when he has most guys healthy he doesn't always perform.  The team needs to be more consistent overall.  I think we can handle the "gunslinger" Carson when things are going well but you ride or die with that.

Unfortunately Doug won't bring in a legit OC, he won't hand over play calling duties. And yeah I mean you do ride or die with Wentz as a gunslinger I'm just not sure that's going to yield great results long term. 

3 hours ago, Swoop said:

Not saying he doesn't need to be more consistent, but how consistent can he really be when it's musical chairs with everyone around him?

2018 he was good, despite coming off of the ACL and breaking his back. 

2019 the offense was abysmal and banged up the entire season.

2020 the entire offensive side of the ball has been decimated. 17 offensive players hurt.

Consistency is fine, but let's look at the context as well.

Inaccurate is inaccurate, the skill level of or the chemistry with the guy that isn't able to catch it is irrelevant. You can blame receivers for drops, you can't blame them for poor mechanics, footwork and pocket awareness.

4 hours ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

Inaccurate is inaccurate, the skill level of or the chemistry with the guy that isn't able to catch it is irrelevant. You can blame receivers for drops, you can't blame them for poor mechanics, footwork and pocket awareness.

70% completion in 2018

64% last season

This year it's been bad, but given what's around him it's not surprising.

His mechanics are poor at times. This is true. Once again though, its probably hard to concentrate on (or to even have) good mechanics when you have no timing with players and have pressure in your face constantly. Can't worry about footwork and the like when you have four DL in your face the second the ball is snapped.

Now yes, he does need to clean some things up. There are absolutely some throws he misses that he has no business missing. I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing that it's being overblown because we have no team around him and no defense to step up. His throws are looked at so critically because the team as a whole right now is garbage and every pass needs to be perfect.

I'd love to see how literally any other QB would look mechanically if they had 17 starters on offense out. You can say it doesn't make a difference. I disagree.

People have routinely argued that Wentz is who he is and that he's never changed. He's always been a spotty passer. You see it on here all the time. That's true. Surprisingly, the last time he had any semblance of an offense around him (2018) those terrible mechanics led to a QB rating north of 100 and a 70% completion percentage.

I wonder what the difference is.

I know fantasy football doesn't matter but I just noticed Wentz is 10th in our ppr league. Pretty crazy consider he has the most injured offense in the league and the schedule stop far. 

Sorry, but I don’t see much change here. Still too inconsistent to count on to win, though much of this isn’t at all his fault. The team for whatever reason can’t stay healthy, and that on top of his style of play will likely lead to him being injured again sooner or later. Almost wins are nothing more than moral victories. It’s frustrating that after 4 seasons it’s hard to tell what Wentz is. 

5 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Sorry, but I don’t see much change here. Still too inconsistent to count on to win, though much of this isn’t at all his fault. The team for whatever reason can’t stay healthy, and that on top of his style of play will likely lead to him being injured again sooner or later. Almost wins are nothing more than moral victories. It’s frustrating that after 4 seasons it’s hard to tell what Wentz is. 

he's just not the same player, either he doesnt want to be here or he wants to be like foles, i just think this team need a new direction with a new qb, it's probably going to be a bridge qb until we found a new healthy qb that's like mahomes, that's why im saying this team needs a clean slate and new identity, it's just not working.

13 minutes ago, toughfighter83 said:

he's just not the same player, either he doesnt want to be here or he wants to be like foles, i just think this team need a new direction with a new qb, it's probably going to be a bridge qb until we found a new healthy qb that's like mahomes, that's why im saying this team needs a clean slate and new identity, it's just not working.

Yeah stupid Doug and Howie, just go find a healthy QB like Mahomes! Because they're just waiting around on Broad Street for the Eagles' brass to invite them inside.

WeNTz SuCKs StARt HuRtS!!!!

I even saw one of you go "yeah let's just get rid of him and have a bridge QB until we get a Mahomes"

 

Wow. You realize teams go decades without a talent like that right? 

 

Let's just go to the QB tree and pick another. Just lol. 

1 hour ago, ShutDownDB said:

Yeah stupid Doug and Howie, just go find a healthy QB like Mahomes! Because they're just waiting around on Broad Street for the Eagles' brass to invite them inside.

Yeah some of these posts just make you laugh. Just go grab a future HOF QB off the street. 

2 hours ago, toughfighter83 said:

he's just not the same player, either he doesnt want to be here or he wants to be like foles, i just think this team need a new direction with a new qb, it's probably going to be a bridge qb until we found a new healthy qb that's like mahomes, that's why im saying this team needs a clean slate and new identity, it's just not working.

I still think much of this starts with Howie. He just hasn’t done a good enough job to surround Wentz with talent, but I ask have you ever once heard that Carson brought in a passing Guru to help with his mechanics during the offseason? Have you ever heard of him brining in someone to teach him how to slide? For all this talk of how his coaches have failed him where is one time you could say he’s brought in people to help himself improve? I frankly don’t believe he wants to change and isn’t interested in anyone teaching him otherwise. He’s going to do what he thinks is best for him. His fanboys with continue to gush over him like school girls and the losses will just keep piling up for the Eagles. As long as Carson looks good in their eyes nothing else matters. 

2 hours ago, ShutDownDB said:

Yeah stupid Doug and Howie, just go find a healthy QB like Mahomes! Because they're just waiting around on Broad Street for the Eagles' brass to invite them inside.

 

1 hour ago, Uscg-green said:

WeNTz SuCKs StARt HuRtS!!!!

I even saw one of you go "yeah let's just get rid of him and have a bridge QB until we get a Mahomes"

 

Wow. You realize teams go decades without a talent like that right? 

 

Let's just go to the QB tree and pick another. Just lol. 

 

58 minutes ago, Uscg-green said:

Yeah some of these posts just make you laugh. Just go grab a future HOF QB off the street. 

 

I don't think they should get rid of Wentz.  But just for argument's sake:

Before they had Wentz people made these same arguments for not moving on from Vick, Foles and even Bradford.  There were many, many fans who questioned moving up to #2 for Wentz.  They said he came from a small school, that trading that much draft capital wasn't worth it, and draft picks can bust, etc.  Now you're acting like they can't possibly move on from Wentz.  Finding a QB is exactly what they did in 2016.  It's always comfortable to deal with what you have and not want to take a risk but you have to weight the risk/reward.

Again I do think they need to ride out his contract and see what happens if things improve though.

7 minutes ago, NOTW said:

Before they had Wentz people made these same arguments for not moving on from Vick, Foles and even Bradford.

Eagles fans always wanna move on from the current QB in about five minutes. That's one of our problems. Now I was like that with Vick for personal reasons. (I foster abused dogs). But the statement let's go out and get a Mahomes is what makes you laugh. Like those caliber of QBs are plentiful and easy to aqquire. The grass isn't always greener. Plus to really judge a QB you actually need a starting offense around him. I don't think many QBs could do as well with the garbage Wentz has been given. 

45 minutes ago, NOTW said:

 

 

 

I don't think they should get rid of Wentz.  But just for argument's sake:

Before they had Wentz people made these same arguments for not moving on from Vick, Foles and even Bradford.  There were many, many fans who questioned moving up to #2 for Wentz.  They said he came from a small school, that trading that much draft capital wasn't worth it, and draft picks can bust, etc.  Now you're acting like they can't possibly move on from Wentz.  Finding a QB is exactly what they did in 2016.  It's always comfortable to deal with what you have and not want to take a risk but you have to weight the risk/reward.

Again I do think they need to ride out his contract and see what happens if things improve though.

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the only constant From Vick to Wentz is Foles? He’s the guy that no one wanted, but he’s the guy who won the super bowl. 

40 minutes ago, Uscg-green said:

Eagles fans always wanna move on from the current QB in about five minutes. That's one of our problems. Now I was like that with Vick for personal reasons. (I foster abused dogs). But the statement let's go out and get a Mahomes is what makes you laugh. Like those caliber of QBs are plentiful and easy to aqquire. The grass isn't always greener. Plus to really judge a QB you actually need a starting offense around him. I don't think many QBs could do as well with the garbage Wentz has been given. 

 

On 10/5/2020 at 10:57 AM, NOTW said:

This is why debating Wentz is difficult.  He's inconsistent and plays poorly with all his playmakers then sometimes performs well with practice squad guys.

People argue he doesn't perform well because of injuries and he doesn't have anyone to throw to.  But when he had Goedert, Reagor, Jackson, Ertz, Sanders and Scott along with Peters, Lane and Seumalo on the O line he played poorly.

Last night he's got practice squad receivers and rookies on the O line and he played better.

Some of it is play calling as well.  But you can't argue that lack of WRs is the only issue when he played poorly with his playmakers but better with practice squad scrubs.

 

4 hours ago, ShutDownDB said:

Yeah stupid Doug and Howie, just go find a healthy QB like Mahomes! Because they're just waiting around on Broad Street for the Eagles' brass to invite them inside.

if you expecting wentz to be the next mahomes, then you only making yourself more miserable and more losing seasons, if that's what you want. if you care about this team ever winning another sb, you move on to another qb otherwise it's more about you having a man crush on wentz and dont care about this team being in the toilet for another 5 years.

1 hour ago, toughfighter83 said:

if you expecting wentz to be the next mahomes, then you only making yourself more miserable and more losing seasons, if that's what you want. if you care about this team ever winning another sb, you move on to another qb otherwise it's more about you having a man crush on wentz and dont care about this team being in the toilet for another 5 years.

Triple strawman. Nicely done. 

1 hour ago, toughfighter83 said:

if you expecting wentz to be the next mahomes, then you only making yourself more miserable and more losing seasons, if that's what you want. if you care about this team ever winning another sb, you move on to another qb otherwise it's more about you having a man crush on wentz and dont care about this team being in the toilet for another 5 years.

Please list all the future Pat Mahomme’s out there.  We’ll wait.

1 hour ago, toughfighter83 said:

if you expecting wentz to be the next mahomes

The point is there are no Mahomes other than Mahomes. And ditching a good QB like Wentz to chase a Unicorn is stupid. Franchises have gone decades without the talent at QB we have. Look at Washington. 

I find it difficult to nail down exactly what kind of QB Wentz is. He is in year 5 but due to injury and rehab, hasn't has 3 seasons in a row to develop without interruption. His receivers have changed dramatically over the last few years due to personnel changes and injuries, he's missing his future TE, and he has 1 starter left on the O-line with 4th stringers everywhere else, and he's had a change in QB coaches twice. 

He finally was healthy this year, but still didn't get a true off season last Spring/Summer due to COVID-19. I've never seen a QB's development interrupted as much as Carson's. If someone told me he'd be struggling a bit because of all of this, I'd say that sounds about right, he should struggle given all that's happened. 

2 hours ago, toughfighter83 said:

if you expecting wentz to be the next mahomes, then you only making yourself more miserable and more losing seasons, if that's what you want. if you care about this team ever winning another sb, you move on to another qb otherwise it's more about you having a man crush on wentz and dont care about this team being in the toilet for another 5 years.

What in the actual F? My man, you brought up Mahomes not me. 

I'll put it to you very simply, if this team ditches Carson Wentz they'll be the laughing stock of the NFL, like worse than the Browns.  

Fact of the matter is if you put all the injuries aside for a minute Carson is/was going through some ish this year. But even with everyone hurt his stock is trending upward these last few games and as this team gets healthier hopefully he'll continue the trend.

3 hours ago, ShutDownDB said:

I'll put it to you very simply, if this team ditches Carson Wentz they'll be the laughing stock of the NFL, like worse than the Browns.  

I'm not sure I'd go that far. Howie would face major questions for the contract he gave them but I'm not sure they'd be the laughing stock of the NFL. I mean I think the jury is out on Wentz across the rest of the NFL. Some think that he can be really good, others think he's going to be limited due to his style and others think he's going to be average with highs and lows.

9 hours ago, Uscg-green said:

WeNTz SuCKs StARt HuRtS!!!!

I even saw one of you go "yeah let's just get rid of him and have a bridge QB until we get a Mahomes"

 

Wow. You realize teams go decades without a talent like that right? 

 

Let's just go to the QB tree and pick another. Just lol. 

That poster does not realize any of that. He is the worst "fan" on here.

4 hours ago, ShutDownDB said:

What in the actual F? My man, you brought up Mahomes not me. 

I'll put it to you very simply, if this team ditches Carson Wentz they'll be the laughing stock of the NFL, like worse than the Browns.  

Fact of the matter is if you put all the injuries aside for a minute Carson is/was going through some ish this year. But even with everyone hurt his stock is trending upward these last few games and as this team gets healthier hopefully he'll continue the trend.

This.  The Eagles would be rightfully criticized for pulling a stunt like that.  Quality organizations do not trade young franchise QBs just for the F of it. Hell, they don't trade serviceable QBs for no reason.  The jury is not out on Wentz, his talent, or his value to this organization.  If the jury is still out on something, its if these posters are really Eagles fans.

Toughfairy83 once rage quit on the Eagles in a GameDay thread Week 1....of the Super Bowl year.  His predictions are never good.

Wentz had a good first couple years and was MVP level in 2017.  He had a strong team as well, that went on to win without him.  Then Reich and Flip left.

The next 2 years he struggled with being up and down.  At times he's had all or most starters and struggled, and at times performed well with 2nd string players and practice squad receivers.  You can't blame injuries when he has also struggled with his starters available, and performed without them.  He's been inconsistent.

He goes through streaks where he plays really well, or struggles for stretches of a game and then lights it up.  

Stability is an issue with personnel and coaching and injuries.  But he's also a 5th year QB and making bad decisions causing turnovers, not throwing it away instead of taking a sack, throwing worn burners or overthrowing guys on what appear to be simple throws.  You can't blame those things on others, that stuff is on him.

His early career people hyped him as practically the next Peyton Manning, who was so smart that he would make pre-snap reads, call his own plays and read a defense so well and slice and dice.  What we've seen is inconsistency and struggling with some basics and mechanics, while other times making heroic plays and winning comeback games.  So it's confusing and makes it hard to evaluate.