The Good, the Bad and the Ugly: week 1 at Washington

[mr_hunt]

3 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Do you remember in 2017 when the reports came out that Schwartz was walking around like he owned the place, because he thought it was only a matter of time before he would replace Doug? Now the ownership and GM won’t even allow him to pick his own staff. Truth is he’s never been allowed to. I get the feeling that most people in that building think the Eagles won the Super Bowl in spite of Doug and not because of him.

the playcalling has been inconsistent since reich left. how do you not design a gameplan based around quick throws when you're up against a very good d-line?  it's baffling. 

[EazyEaglez]

2 minutes ago, mr_hunt said:

the playcalling has been inconsistent since reich left. how do you not design a gameplan based around quick throws when you're up against a very good d-line?  it's baffling. 

I don’t understand why Doug won’t give up play calling. He would be smart to let a fresh set of eyes call plays for a while. Even Reid did that at some point in time. That way he can at least get the full pulse of his team. I’ve been a big supporter of Doug, but overall he gambles too much and his gambles cost the Eagles a win yesterday. 

[ManchesterEagle]

17 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

The Wentz apologist have tried to play off the Hurts pick as "insurance for a possible future first round pick later.” These people are just fooling themselves. If the Eagles wanted that kind of banking the better move would have been to simply trade the pick. Hurts isn’t here to be some fake Taysom Hill either. You don’t draft a guy in the 2nd round to be that. No the only logical conclusion is the Eagles are hedging their bet on Wentz. The most interesting thing Roseman said months ago was he looked at the roster at the end of the season and said "who’s healthy?” Carson wasn’t one of those people and he’s ended his last three seasons injured. His play clearly makes him susceptible to injury. It’s only a matter of time before the Eagles ask the question (and by drafting Hurts they clearly have) why are we paying this guy so much money if we can’t count on him when we need him the most? The words you will hear out of the organization will be "Carson’s our guy”, but the truth is Carson is he is their guy FOR NOW. 

Yes agreed completely. Wentz knows it as well.

The only way this pick makes any sense is that they have concerns about Wentz as their long term guy.

[EazyEaglez]

1 minute ago, ManchesterEagle said:

Yes agreed completely. Wentz knows it as well.

The only way this pick makes any sense is that they have concerns about Wentz as their long term guy.

Yup and that’s exactly why Roseman admitted he and Wentz had a "difficult conversation” over the drafting of Hurts. QB factory? Draft insurance? I think not. 

[ManchesterEagle]

20 minutes ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

Thing is, If we're at the point of changing QB at the end of this season A) where does Wentz go? Even cutting him in 2022 carries $25million dead cap hit, and if we're giving up on him good luck getting someone to take him with that contract and B) There are better QB's than Jalen Hurts coming out next year.

I think somebody would trade for him. He is good and has talent. I’d rather have Wentz than a lot of other starting QBs.

As for Hurts - they compared him to Wilson. They may be very wrong, but they obviously feel he has that potential.

[mr_hunt]

are there any stats showing how often the eagles are running RPO vs 2017 when they RPO"d their way to a super bowl championship?  i'd be curious to see those stats. 

[Godfather]

29 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

I don’t understand why Doug won’t give up play calling. He would be smart to let a fresh set of eyes call plays for a while. Even Reid did that at some point in time. That way he can at least get the full pulse of his team. I’ve been a big supporter of Doug, but overall he gambles too much and his gambles cost the Eagles a win yesterday. 

Give it to Press. See what he can do 

[EazyEaglez]

1 minute ago, Godfather said:

Give it to Press. See what he can do 

He ought to give it to someone else, but he won’t unless he’s forced to. Considering they basically don’t allow him to do much of anything else I guess it’s all he has. 

[The Norseman]

5 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

This is going to be a rough year unfortunately. And I hope it forces some major changes. 

Agreed.  I don't think it will be this rough every week, but its not going to be pretty.  This team is heading in the wrong direction. 

[GeorgeM37]

Always look forward to these well written write ups and once again you have delivered....thank you. I have just one question though

You don't think Ertz deserves Kittle or Kelce type money? You wouldn't consider him on their level?

[Wentz 2 Ertz]

The NFL season is a marathon not a sprint but our schedule is tough for sure.    Even if Doug can scrounge out a win against the Rams and Bengals the next two weeks, we still have to play the 9ers, Steelers, and Ravens back to back to back.  2-4 or 3-3 is a very real possibility.

[Utebird]

3 hours ago, birdman#12 said:

Most of this blame falls on Pedersen.  From the play calling to the line problems and the lack of adjustment.

48 passes to 17 running plays?  Talk about playing into the opponents strength.  And where the hell are the misdirection plays?  The wheel routes?  The rollouts?.....The 2-3 step drop passes?  Hell, even a f------ draw play?.....I could go on and on.

The offense gave the foreskins short field on their first 4 scores.  139 yards for 2 TDs and 2 FGs?  2 INTs, a missed FG and a 4th and 2 failure.  That's and average of 35 yards per scoring drive.....

The offensive line struggled....but it should never have gotten that bad because washington knew the eagles were passing and pinned back their ears.......and the eagles never gave the running game a chance or the lineman a chance to pound on some defenders.......

Yeah,  Wentz allowed the skins to get in his head, the defense didn't get a critical stop and the o-line was manhandled.  But the vast majority of this loss is squarely on Pedersen's shoulders.

Holy sh--,  everybody assumed the eagles O-Line could struggle, but Pedersen still had wentz drop back 56 times ....WTF??

Sounds like Marty Morhinwig is having quite the impact on offensive game planning.😤

[hoosierdaddy]

Great post as usual.

The two things you cite that make my blood boil the most are Howie's draft results (with a major WTF on the Hurts pick...AJ Epenesa was still available at that point, how nice would it be to have him now?...) and the injuries AGAIN. Seriously, in 2017 we lost our captain on each side of the ball (Wentz & Hicks) + our all-world LT, in 2018 we were so depleted in the defensive backfield that we had guys off the street trying to cover Michael Thomas in the playoff game. Last year our WR corps was so thin that Greg Ward was our #1 and it impacted Howie so much that he really didn't focus on any other position this past offseason. And this year....both lines are getting absolutely decimated. 

[Talonblood]

[NOTW]

1 hour ago, Utebird said:

Sounds like Marty Morhinwig is having quite the impact on offensive game planning.😤

Yeah, remember when Marty was OC they would abandon the run even when the QB struggled and the O line hurt and would keep trying for the big play?

Good times.

[e-a-g-l-e-s eagles!]

1 hour ago, GeorgeM37 said:

Always look forward to these well written write ups and once again you have delivered....thank you. I have just one question though

You don't think Ertz deserves Kittle or Kelce type money? You wouldn't consider him on their level?

I think kelce and kittle are better overall players than ertz. They are both better blockers. I think ertz is a better route runner than both. heading into the season, ertz imo was the 3rd best tight end in the league. kittle is only 26 years old. So i think he has at least 6 prime years left if he stays healthy. As for kelce, he’s the same age as ertz but i think he is the best tight end in football. If we compare the stats of kelce, kittle and ertz the last 2 seasons it becomes more noticeable that ertz isn’t in the same tier as those two. Kelce is going for his 5th consecutive 1000 yard receiving season. Now kittle has a lack of TDs but then again in 2018 his QB wasn’t very good. Last year you could make the argument he should’ve had more but he also missed two games with a knee injury. 
 

would’ve went 3 years but it’s really unfair to judge kittle as a rookie To ertz and kelce in their primes. But ertz outside of 2018 has been a around 800-900 yard tight end  

kelce:

2019: 97 receptions, 1229 yards and 5 tds 

2018: 103 receptions, 1336 yards and 10 tds

4 year average: 92 per season (368 receptions) 1182 yards per season (4,728 yards) and 6.8 tds

kittle:

2019: 85 receptions, 1053 yards and 5 tds 

2018: 88 receptions, 1377 yards and 5 tds

only been league going on 4th  hard to average his rookie season in. Kind of skews it cause he’s vastly better now then as a rookie 4 years ago  

ertz:

2019: 88 receptions, 916 yards and 6tds 

2018: 116 receptions, 1163 yards and 8 tds

4 year average: 89 receptions per season (356 receptions),930 yards per season (3719 total yards) and 6.5 tds

so the touchdowns are close but with the roughly the same amount of receptions as kelce he’s far less dynamic with them. And he’s definitely not nearly as good of a blocker. I think he’s top 5 tight end and deserves top 5 tight end money But he’s not kelce or kittle greatness. And kittle has the added bonus of being 4 years younger. Add on most tight ends over 30 tend to decline especially after 32 when this new contract would kick in. I don’t think it is in the eagles best interest to sign him to an extension that kicks in at 32 years old.

[UK_EaglesFan89]

1 hour ago, The Norseman said:

Agreed.  I don't think it will be this rough every week, but its not going to be pretty.  This team is heading in the wrong direction. 

Yeah I agree. We will match up better against some opponents... But it's going to be a pretty ugly season. 

[e-a-g-l-e-s eagles!]

2 hours ago, ManchesterEagle said:

I think somebody would trade for him. He is good and has talent. I’d rather have Wentz than a lot of other starting QBs.

As for Hurts - they compared him to Wilson. They may be very wrong, but they obviously feel he has that potential.

no offense but the eagles 5 years ago were infatuated with wentz and thought he was a generational talent. So much so they maneuvered up the board to get him. If the belief is hurts was drafted as hedging their bets on wentz it doesn’t exactly give me great confidence in their scouting of QBs cause it means they weren't exactly accurate on their assessment with wentz originally.

Add on it is easy for the eagles to say we wanted Russell Wilson after the fact and run with it. If you wanted him that bad And thought he’d be that great you had multiple second rounders that year, didn’t take him and he was a QB who inherently has better value then any other position. I legitimately hate the eagles stupid PR spin. If you loved him so much why gamble it and why not take him when you had multiple opportunities to do so at pick 46 and 59. You took a linebacker over a Potential Qb you thought could be a franchise QB. It’s the biggest spin job the eagles continue to use 

They can say they think Hurts is Russell Wilson but i call BS. There’s only one Russell Wilson in the league. Kyler murray who went 1 might be a closest thing to him. Hurts isn’t murray. And i like hurts. Also they have used the spin machine with JJAW, pryor and a bunch of other players who have failed. You know how many years i heard Tobin was going to be really good from the eagles? A lot. The eagles spin things the way they want too. However doesn’t mean it actually is true. I like hurts but i think it’s absurd to say he’s Russell Wilson. It’s unfair to him to have to live up to that lofty expectation and i don’t think he’s as talented as Wilson. 

[GeorgeM37]

20 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I think kelce and kittle are better overall players than ertz. They are both better blockers. I think ertz is a better route runner than both. heading into the season, ertz imo was the 3rd best tight end in the league. kittle is only 26 years old. So i think he has at least 6 prime years left if he stays healthy. As for kelce, he’s the same age as ertz but i think he is the best tight end in football. If we compare the stats of kelce, kittle and ertz the last 2 seasons it becomes more noticeable that ertz isn’t in the same tier as those two. Kelce is going for his 5th consecutive 1000 yard receiving season. Now kittle has a lack of TDs but then again in 2018 his QB wasn’t very good. Last year you could make the argument he should’ve had more but he also missed two games with a knee injury. 
 

would’ve went 3 years but it’s really unfair to judge kittle as a rookie To ertz and kelce in their primes. But ertz outside of 2018 has been a around 800-900 yard tight end  

kelce:

2019: 97 receptions, 1229 yards and 5 tds 

2018: 103 receptions, 1336 yards and 10 tds

4 year average: 92 per season (368 receptions) 1182 yards per season (4,728 yards) and 6.8 tds

kittle:

2019: 85 receptions, 1053 yards and 5 tds 

2018: 88 receptions, 1377 yards and 5 tds

only been league going on 4th  hard to average his rookie season in. Kind of skews it cause he’s vastly better now then as a rookie 4 years ago  

ertz:

2019: 88 receptions, 916 yards and 6tds 

2018: 116 receptions, 1163 yards and 8 tds

4 year average: 89 receptions per season (356 receptions),930 yards per season (3719 total yards) and 6.5 tds

so the touchdowns are close but with the roughly the same amount of receptions as kelce he’s far less dynamic with them. And he’s definitely not nearly as good of a blocker. I think he’s top 5 tight end and deserves top 5 tight end money But he’s not kelce or kittle greatness. And kittle has the added bonus of being 4 years younger. Add on most tight ends over 30 tend to decline especially after 32 when this new contract would kick in. I don’t think it is in the eagles best interest to sign him to an extension that kicks in at 32 years old.

welp, you most certainly answered my question and once you added the stats here...very hard to disagree with you. That being said...I am inclined to agree with you on this one...I just wanted to know your reasoning...

[ManchesterEagle]

10 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

no offense but the eagles 5 years ago were infatuated with wentz and thought he was a generational talent. So much so they maneuvered up the board to get him. If the belief is hurts was drafted as hedging their bets on wentz it doesn’t exactly give me great confidence in their scouting of QBs cause it means they weren't exactly accurate on their assessment with wentz originally.

Add on it is easy for the eagles to say we wanted Russell Wilson after the fact and run with it. If you wanted him that bad And thought he’d be that great you had multiple second rounders that year, didn’t take him and he was a QB who inherently has better value then any other position. I legitimately hate the eagles stupid PR spin. If you loved him so much why gamble it and why not take him when you had multiple opportunities to do so at pick 46 and 59. You took a linebacker over a Potential Qb you thought could be a franchise QB. It’s the biggest spin job the eagles continue to use 

They can say they think Hurts is Russell Wilson but i call BS. There’s only one Russell Wilson in the league. Kyler murray who went 1 might be a closest thing to him. Hurts isn’t murray. And i like hurts. Also they have used the spin machine with JJAW, pryor and a bunch of other players who have failed. You know how many years i heard Tobin was going to be really good from the eagles? A lot. The eagles spin things the way they want too. However doesn’t mean it actually is true. I like hurts but i think it’s absurd to say he’s Russell Wilson. It’s unfair to him to have to live up to that lofty expectation and i don’t think he’s as talented as Wilson. 

Yeah look the Wilson chat was a bit foolish. I have no idea what the Eagles think or don't think in terms of talent, but the only way the Hurts pick makes any sense is if they are not sure about Wentz and want a possible alternative.

Wentz is an incredible talent. We've seen how good he can be to be fair. Whether injuries/the mental side will be too much is another thing.

 

[jsdarkstar]

Great read, but 8-8 now seems to be a stretch. 4-12 more like it. Washington was one of the 8 wins. 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

The Good:

3.Run defense—Without Hargraves and forced to use Jackson, McGill and Ridgeway more with Gerry and Edwards mainly at linebacker I thought the Eagles might struggle more against the run. The Eagles like they have done for most of Schwartz’s tenure were able to keep Washington below 100 rushing yards. Washington had 36 rushing attempts for 80 yards (2.2 yards per carry). However the Eagles run defense couldn’t stop the Washington inside the red zone as they were able to get Barber to punch it in for two touchdowns. I think next week is definitely going to be a tougher test. The Cowboys had issues with Malcolm Brown all night long and it felt like you knew the Rams wanted to run the ball and didn’t trust Goff throwing to win the game. 

So Washington could not run the ball very effectively, but stuck with it.  Eagles had 17 rushing attempts for 57 yards ( 3.4 yards per carry ).  Sticking with the run, even when minimally effective protects you from sacks, bad yardage situations and turnovers.  GOTTA STICK WITH THE RUN DOUG.

[e-a-g-l-e-s eagles!]

2 minutes ago, downundermike said:

So Washington could not run the ball very effectively, but stuck with it.  Eagles had 17 rushing attempts for 57 yards ( 3.4 yards per carry ).  Sticking with the run, even when minimally effective protects you from sacks, bad yardage situations and turnovers.  GOTTA STICK WITH THE RUN DOUG.

Manu and I have the argument last year about that. I went back and showed With stats the Eagles in 2017 had games were they could not run the ball early in the game. But they stuck with it and eventually the running game got on track and it wound up correcting the offense that was struggling early on. It also helped wentz get on track and comfortable. 

It’s not even just that. Like if they’re running backs aren’t doing a very good job. There’s other ways to run the football. You just got three big-time speed receivers in the draft. You wanted to be like the San Francisco 49ers. You boasted about that in the off-season. Well the San Francisco 49ers found ways to get Samuel the ball in his hands. End arounds and hand offs in motions to get him the ball in his hands with speed going up field. Those are running plays. The Eagles don’t do that. That is a lack of creativity and a lack of getting the ball into speed guys hands

[Guest]

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

That is a lack of creativity and a lack of getting the ball into speed guys hands

I have said it multiple times today, what happened to all the new offensive minds and the creativity we were supposed to see.  Roll outs, moving the pocket ??

Once the Team scored to make it 17-7, it was the same tired plays we all complained about last year.

[e-a-g-l-e-s eagles!]

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

I have said it multiple times today, what happened to all the new offensive minds and the creativity we were supposed to see.  Roll outs, moving the pocket ??

Once the Team scored to make it 17-7, it was the same tired plays we all complained about last year.

It feels like this team consistently needs until December to figure out their personnel and how to properly use them. This is now the third year in a row where I feel like this is the constant theme. At some point it comes back to the guy who’s consistently been there running the offense. Doug Peterson won a Super Bowl but that only gives you so much clout for so long. The Offense since the Super Bowl has been more like the 2016 offense for the majority of the games. It might be that the 2017 eagles under doug might be the outlier rather than the norm.