Just now, MF POON said:

I don't want to discuss things you nuts secretly fantasize about on this board. If y''all got a thing for Hurts, use discord.

Look how immature you are. 

And if you don't want to participate in the discussion, there's no need for you to

I'm not a big PFF believer but between this and the actual OL breakdowns maybe the criticisms were over the top?

Just now, pgcd3 said:

I'm not a big PFF believer but between this and the actual OL breakdowns maybe the criticisms were over the top?

PFF had Mahomes as the 8th best QB this week. 

12 minutes ago, pgcd3 said:

I hear you. But am I off base saying that there is a lot animosity shown towards Hurts that seems to go beyond on the field flaws?

I suppose.  When people get worked up over outfits, walking in to the stadium, offseason hype IGs, press conference statements, etc. I tune out.  I don't have social media, because I find most of that stuff to be unnecessarily vile.  

2 minutes ago, pgcd3 said:

I'm not a big PFF believer but between this and the actual OL breakdowns maybe the criticisms were over the top?

I don't know how PFF is calculating accuracy. 

2022 NFL Player Passing Stats | ESPN

Sort by completion percentage.

Hurts was ranked 27th.

1 minute ago, CouchKing said:

I don't know how PFF is calculating accuracy. 

2022 NFL Player Passing Stats | ESPN

Sort by completion percentage.

Hurts was ranked 27th.

If his IAYA (intended air yards/attempt) was only 4.1, any throw should be accurate, IMO. 

11 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

He currently has 21 TDs in his 21 starts (he had 1 passing TD before he was made starter his rookie year). 

He has shown absolutely no indication that he will eclipse 20 passing TDs this year. 

If he gets wins, and doesn't throw touchdown passes,  the Eagles might possibly be able to sign him to a long term contract without having to pay what Lamar is likely to get, and so many of the starters get.  Maybe.

38 points is a lot of points for a team to score.  The Eagles and Hurts did 38+ twice last year.  Wentz didn't get 38+ at all between 2018 and 2020.   Multiple times in the Super Bowl year by both Wentz and Foles.

Did the Eagles lose some sort of hard to see benefit by getting rushing TDs instead of passing TDs?    Because those rushing TDs count just as much as passing TDs and the Eagles just scored the 3rd most points since the Super Bowl win.

Most teams didn't practice too much this preseason.  Most teams were pretty rusty.  The Ravens were rusty too.  But I expect they'll get into mid season form by mid season.

I expect something close to an average of Eagles 28 Opponent 14 over the season.  That might be too wide a gap.  28-17?  

I don't really see a scenario where Hurts isn't the starter next year if he's healthy, and it's kind of ridiculous that people suggest otherwise.   He's going to be paid almost nothing,  he's a top 10 QB by measurements that include rushing yards,  he's top running QB along with Lamar and whoever else belongs with them.   To replace him before the end of 2023 - actual contract cost,  cost of the resources to get the replacement.  

Tom Brady wins half the time.   Is Tom Brady an option?  I'm not going to argue against Tom Brady.   But those other QBs don't win more than the Eagles just did with their backup QB Foles.   Aaron Rodgers?   Won a Super Bowl,  but longer ago than the Eagles and Foles.

I don't see any reason that Hurts wouldn't be the starter this and next year.  However, they might want to draft a QB if they don't want to pay Hurts $40+ M.   Jordan Love has played how much?  A 2nd, 3rd, 4th rounder used to draft a QB in 2023 when Hurts is starting all 2023.   It isn't that hard to find top running QBs who can win if you have a run first offense with all the fixins. 

The Eagles are lacking somewhat in certain areas.  

They don't have the BIGS that the Ravens do. (Well, they do,  Howie gives the coaches versatile freakbeasts who could do that job)  There is no Nick Boyle and no Patrick Ricard,  guys who are out there to block more effectively that the smaller guys most teams have.  They do that, it's effective, it works.

The Eagles don't have one of those great RBs that do exist in the NFL right now, the big and fast kind.  Henry, Barkley, Chubb, Fournette, Dillon.  The ones that you want to hand it to in goal line situations, and also ones who could break a huge run because high top speed.

The Eagles do have that great OL (which wasn't so great against the Lions) which should shake off the rust soon, and that's 5 guys there with quality backups.   The Eagles could use OL backups like Jurgens as their Boyle/Ricard,  they could use players on defense like Davis or Milton Williams or Kyron Johnson.   They get those spots filled, and they have top running QB with adequate passing, and you run a ton, and you're even more dominant than now, you just don't need an expensive QB.  

I think I'd rather have freakbeast blockers in the backfield who have the versatility to run and catch and throw if possible, I'll pay a running back.   But I'd try to have a system that doesn't care much if the passer rating is 80 if there are 4 rushing TDs,   and pays the QB at the rate of the 0 passing TDs QB, even though the 4 rushing TDs are there.  QBs are too expensive.   

We just saw the Eagles put up 38 points.  
Roughly 4 ways of getting yards and points.
QB Runs (90 yards 1 TD)
RB Runs (over 100 yards 3 TDs)
Pass catcher 1 (155 yards - WR Brown)
Pass catcher 2 (60 yards - TE Goedert)

That was it, there were less than 30 yards apart from that.

4 positions gained yards.  QB, RB (runs) WR, TE (catches)

2 positions didn't gain yards.   Do the Eagles really need to have 2 positions on the field getting snaps who could get yards and don't?  

When those 4 positions get you 38 points,  3rd most points since the Super Bowl win,  well the least I'd say is that one of those 2 spots should be filled by someone whose job is to make things easier for the 4 who are gaining the yards,  and that would be one of the freakbeasts who are big and versatile.  I mention Cam Jurgens for this because we saw him be good, and there isn't a spot for him on the oline at this point, so he's just sitting. 

You have an even more dominant run attack,  you can draft 242 pound running QB KJ Jefferson from Arkansas, somewhere around where you drafted Hurts, and pay him almost nothing.   You want to keep Hurts, but some team might want him at $40+ M a year, and with your dominant rushing attack (traded for Barkley after the Giants were eliminated) you just don't need a $40+ M QB.  It should be much more easy to see if a QB has what it takes to run well than pass well. 

Anthony Richardson Florida,  it looks like he's a first rounder.  KT Jefferson Arkansas. Malik Cunningham Louisville.  Hendon Hooker Tennessee.  Emory Jones Arizona State.  Those are all guys who could be in the same ballpark, top running, good enough passing with a dominant run game.  The Eagles have Tyree Jackson who looks like a better QB than some of the preseason QBs some teams had this year.  Tyree Jackson did some good stuff in the preseason as the Bills QB.  So, maybe the Eagles bring in more like Hurts, and then after the 2023 season, "let him go",  to find if he can get that $40+ M.  If he can't, he comes back for a better amount of money for the Eagles.  

Baker Mayfield took the Browns to a 11-5 season in 2020, the best record the Browns have had in years.  They were talking about paying him what the top QBs were getting. Next year he has a hurt shoulder, plays through it, doesn't do as well.   He's gone, the Browns pay massive amounts to a QB who apparently did great while going 4-12, and isn't likely to get too many tv commercials any time soon.  Baker is now making $5 Million with the Panthers.    Baker's shoulder isn't quite as bad last year, maybe Baker is making $40+ M.   There seems to be little to separate $40+ M and $5 M.   Slightly worse = costs much less. The Eagles don't need top (expensive) passing if they have that dominant run game and the Eagles have that key piece, the dominant run blocking oline.  A couple of big freakbeasts to block and be versatile,  one of those great rbs who can get it done in short yardage and can also run for long tds,  expensive,  but running backs really aren't that expensive.  Fournette 7 a year,  Henry 12.5 a year.   Barkley  is a FA next year and the Eagles might be able to pick him up cheap,  Giants are out of it, trading deadline, Barkley is leaving.  Eagles should be comfortable they can sign him.   Takes care of that.    Looking at the nextgen stats,  Barkley was the 2nd fastest runner this week - 21.11 mph,  Hurts was 8th fastest 20.5 mph.  Detroit's Swift made the top 20.  No others from that game.

 

3 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

 

5 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

If his IAYA (intended air yards/attempt) was only 4.1, any throw should be accurate, IMO. 

fantasy points.  you get those from passing and running.   Hurts is great at running so he gets a lot of fantasy points from that.  

Obscure passing metrics are less important than the big picture - the good things he did.   Hurts was 4th in fantasy points according to these people.   4th best QB.  Did the 4th most of the good things that they measure.

https://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/reports/leaders/qb.php?year=2022

1 minute ago, Random Reglar said:

fantasy points.  you get those from passing and running.   Hurts is great at running so he gets a lot of fantasy points from that.  

Obscure passing metrics are less important than the big picture - the good things he did.   Hurts was 4th in fantasy points according to these people.   4th best QB.  Did the 4th most of the good things that they measure.

https://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/reports/leaders/qb.php?year=2022

12 minutes ago, CouchKing said:

I don't know how PFF is calculating accuracy. 

2022 NFL Player Passing Stats | ESPN

Sort by completion percentage.

Hurts was ranked 27th.

PFF probably doesn't count "throwing the ball away"

42 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Who cares? 

because an incomplete pass thrown out of bounds to avoid a sack is a smart play and has nothing to do with accuracy.

Got a gif ready for that one?

Just now, Random Reglar said:

because an incomplete pass thrown out of bounds to avoid a sack is a smart play and has nothing to do with accuracy.

Got a gif ready for that one?

6 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

because an incomplete pass thrown out of bounds to avoid a sack is a smart play and has nothing to do with accuracy.

Got a gif ready for that one?

 

10 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

yes you do, you have nonsense bs,  and plenty of gifs.

14 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

because an incomplete pass thrown out of bounds to avoid a sack is a smart play and has nothing to do with accuracy.

Got a gif ready for that one?

You know other QB's also throw the ball away to avoid sacks

2 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

yes you do, you have nonsense bs,  and plenty of gifs.

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

You know other QB's also throw the ball away to avoid sacks

Did you know they also have receivers drop the ball and the other team tries to sack them?

4 minutes ago, downundermike said:

You know other QB's also throw the ball away to avoid sacks

This guy seriously proposed using Tyree Jackson as our QB. 

More egregiously...he claims "Tom Brady wins half the time"

Here's the thing...

Hurts played like this in college. He played like this in 2020. He played like this last season. He played the same way on Sunday. 

He no longer has the rookie excuse. He no longer has the "different system/different coach" excuse. He supposedly worked very hard all off-season and yet, we have the same results. 

To those of you saying "let's see what he does this season" what about all of the above truly makes you believe he's going to suddenly flip a switch when the past several years he hasn't changed a lick?

5 minutes ago, Shalodeep said:

 

I know you'd love to be able to use logic and rationality to actually win an argument,  but this is the best you can do.

There is no reason why fantasy points can't be as good a proxy for quality as any other stat out there.

Fantasy points is the peoples stat.  It's the stat that many people look at when they're playing their fantasy football, and determining whether they won.

Fantasy points could be based on bad things that QBs could do,  and the accumulation of bad points would cause you to lose,  but players that didn't play wouldn't accumulate bad points,  so, instead,  they give points for good things, and the more good things you do, the more points you get.   If people thought that this method of ranking quality was total BS,  they wouldn't be playing fantasy football, and a lot of people play fantasy football.  I don't,  but, I see that Hurts is 4.   He ranked 4 among QBs in racking up points for doing things that football fans agree are good things.   If fans didn't think this ranking system was valid,  they'd quit, or demand a different ranking system.  But they don't.   Fantasy points measure everything,  not just the one part that you want to point to to criticize the #4 QB in fantasy points.

 

32 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

But I expect they'll get into mid season form by mid season

If a rat goes inside is it a mouse? Furthermore, if a mouse goes outside is it a rat?

9 minutes ago, downundermike said:

You know other QB's also throw the ball away to avoid sacks

and PFF counts all those things, and includes that data into their analysis.  If Hurts can run for 16 on 3rd and 15, if that's his level of running ability, he might throw the ball away more often, because he knows what he needs to move the chains.  Another QB might make a risky pass that gets intercepted instead of throwing it away, because running for 16 on 3rd and 15 is not an option for them.

8 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

I know you'd love to be able to use logic and rationality to actually win an argument,  but this is the best you can do.

There is no reason why fantasy points can't be as good a proxy for quality as any other stat out there.

Fantasy points is the peoples stat.  It's the stat that many people look at when they're playing their fantasy football, and determining whether they won.

Fantasy points could be based on bad things that QBs could do,  and the accumulation of bad points would cause you to lose,  but players that didn't play wouldn't accumulate bad points,  so, instead,  they give points for good things, and the more good things you do, the more points you get.   If people thought that this method of ranking quality was total BS,  they wouldn't be playing fantasy football, and a lot of people play fantasy football.  I don't,  but, I see that Hurts is 4.   He ranked 4 among QBs in racking up points for doing things that football fans agree are good things.   If fans didn't think this ranking system was valid,  they'd quit, or demand a different ranking system.  But they don't.   Fantasy points measure everything,  not just the one part that you want to point to to criticize the #4 QB in fantasy points.

 

He's ranked dead last in passing touchdowns and 27th in completion percentage. You using something with the literal word FANTASY to defend this guy is adorable and fitting for someone who hangs off of Hurts every word and action 

Also this may be the dumbest thing I've read in here

"nonsense bs"

 

"Cam Jurgens should play RB/WR"