13 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

You should sit this one out

or lay off the white flaw

or both

😆 my wife doesn’t even drink white claw or white flaw…

You don’t think unchecked capitalism could impede freedom?

Simple question. 

1 hour ago, Tnt4philly said:

The illegal problem is a direct result of too restrictive immigration policies. 
 

The murder problem is a direct result of too restrictive murder laws.  

44 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

Fallacy according to who? You? ONLY the worst no possible good?

Sorry, but I don’t want the extreme of either option of socialism or unchecked capitalism.

Look at the country.

Massive social spending, massive military spending, the most progressive tax system in the developed world, massive debt, decaying infrastructure, and degeneracy that is approaching Weimar levels.

The middle ground sounds good in theory. In the reality of our political system, it just means lots of the worst things get put in place, or otherwise the compromises create unintended consequences.

1 minute ago, TEW said:

Fathers side, as far back as colonial times. Mom’s side, late 19th/early 20th century.

Obviously they weren’t sent away. Was there a gate or a fence they had to cross through? How about a 3 year work visa with a 6 year maximum before they became illegal immigrants? Did it take them 5+ years to gain citizenship?

My family didn’t experience any of that. Our family name was actually misinterpreted and the new spelling assigned is what we have now. They weren’t sent back to the home country… 
 

I would say that process back then was much more welcoming than now, which means you’re completely full of crap saying our country wasn’t more welcoming to immigrants historically.

What was the population back then?

to pretend the circumstances are the same as current times is pure intellectual dishonesty 

22 minutes ago, TEW said:

Look at the country.

Massive social spending, massive military spending, the most progressive tax system in the developed world, massive debt, decaying infrastructure, and degeneracy that is approaching Weimar levels.

The middle ground sounds good in theory. In the reality of our political system, it just means lots of the worst things get put in place, or otherwise the compromises create unintended consequences.

Do you think running to one extreme or the other would be a benefit?

5 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

What was the population back then?

to pretend the circumstances are the same as current times is pure intellectual dishonesty 

What is the population of the entire planet now?

to pretend the circumstances moving forward aren’t a geographical concern is pure intellectual dishonesty 

21 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

Obviously they weren’t sent away. Was there a gate or a fence they had to cross through? How about a 3 year work visa with a 6 year maximum before they became illegal immigrants? Did it take them 5+ years to gain citizenship?

My family didn’t experience any of that. Our family name was actually misinterpreted and the new spelling assigned is what we have now. They weren’t sent back to the home country… 
 

I would say that process back then was much more welcoming than now, which means you’re completely full of crap saying our country wasn’t more welcoming to immigrants historically.

It took my dads family killing redcoats to create this country. Later generations joining the rough riders to conquer the frontier.

It took my mom’s side poverty the likes of which doesn’t exist anymore.

More welcoming? We literally pay for everything for immigrants, legal and illegal alike. Food, shelter, clothing, etc. There were no immigrant scholarship programs or front of the line access to college admission because they looked swarthy. There were no sanctuary cities that put you up in a hotel.

What kind of fantasy land do you live in?   

13 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

Do you think running to one extreme or the other would be a benefit?

In some cases, absolutely.

7 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

What is the population of the entire planet now?

to pretend the circumstances moving forward aren’t a geographical concern is pure intellectual dishonesty 

Planet? Irrelevant.

united states? We needed people back then. Now? The opposite

4 minutes ago, TEW said:

It took my dads family killing redcoats to create this country. Later generations joining the rough riders to conquer the frontier.

It took my mom’s side poverty the likes of which doesn’t exist anymore.

More welcoming? We literally pay for everything for immigrants, legal and illegal alike. Food, shelter, clothing, etc. There were no immigrant scholarship programs or front of the line access to college admission because they looked swarthy. There were no sanctuary cities that put you up in a hotel.

What kind of fantasy land do you live in?   

One where people have the opportunity to come here and earn their own way just like my ancestors and yours did.

I don’t want to give them free stuff either… let them earn it.

3 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Planet? Irrelevant.

united states? We needed people back then. Now? The opposite

Still have a labor shortage…

Just now, MidMoFo said:

Still have a labor shortage…

Not in the US. They're collecting welfare.

3 minutes ago, lynched1 said:

Not in the US. They're collecting welfare.

 

36 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

One where people have the opportunity to come here and earn their own way just like my ancestors and yours did.

I don’t want to give them free stuff either… let them earn it.

The idea that the country is less hospitable to immigrants today than it was 100+ years ago is patently absurd.

2 minutes ago, TEW said:

The idea that the country is less hospitable to immigrants today than it was 100+ years ago is patently absurd.

I never claimed it was more hospitable. Especially not the population of people.

I said the government has been open to allowing immigrants into the country.

19 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

I never claimed it was more hospitable. Especially not the population of people.

I said the government has been open to allowing immigrants into the country.

Depends what kinds of immigrants and when. Asians were prohibited from immigrating for periods. Racial quotas existed at times.

1 hour ago, MidMoFo said:

 

 

I just step over the corpses 

10 hours ago, MidMoFo said:

Still have a labor shortage…

Incorrect

6 minutes ago, ToastJenkins said:

Incorrect

true, many trumpers are home crying about not finding work as they don't look and suck off the system while screaming about the browns that get into our country and take away jobs they wont apply for. 

 

like my next door neighbors. 

24 minutes ago, Alpha_TATEr said:

true, many trumpers are home crying about not finding work as they don't look and suck off the system while screaming about the browns that get into our country and take away jobs they wont apply for. 

 

like my next door neighbors. 

So remove the welfare state and let the failures fail

1 minute ago, ToastJenkins said:

So remove the welfare state and let the failures fail

that's a bit of a different convo, i was just agreeing that there is not a real labor shortage in this country. 

 

23 minutes ago, Alpha_TATEr said:

that's a bit of a different convo, i was just agreeing that there is not a real labor shortage in this country. 

 

There is a shortage of skilled workers, particularly engineers. I've posted some version of this before, but here is the real way to fix immigration.

1. End all government assistance and services for illegal immigrants -- not just welfare, food stamps, etc. -- no more drivers' licenses. No more finding ways to make it easier for people who broke the law to live here. Remove the incentives and comfort we have created. And if an illegal alien is arrested, deport them -- no more sanctuary cities.

2. Institute large fines for employers that hire illegals -- make the fine/punishment so massive that it overwhelms any potential cost savings. Implement e-Verify. 

3. Reform legal immigration to a merit based system -- we need MORE immigrants as birth rates drop and the boomers retire. But we need to prioritize applicants with desirable skills and degrees, like engineers. Stop with the stupid equity based lottery junk and go back to the Cold War era merit based system. 

4. End the drug war -- people are fleeing countries that have been taken over by narco terrorists. Legalize drugs and end the drug war, stop creating failed states and hell holes in Central America.

Of course, none of this will happen. But the solutions are all obvious and need to be implemented jointly.

What the RINO has to say. 

Improper Entry into the USA is a Misdemeanor for the first offense. Republicans treat it like it's the most serious felony crime one can commit. 

 

§ 1325, makes it a misdemeanor offense subject to fine or six-month imprisonment for anyone entering the United States illegally.