Fletcher Cox Not liking how Gannon is using him

[Talonblood]

Read an article about how Fletch isn't liking how this coach is using his talent. It sounds to me like Fletch is saying Gannon is all over the place and doesn't have a real, steady scheme. It's not a good look when a star player hints in public that the coaching is not to his liking. 

https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/eagles/eagles-fletcher-cox-regression-defense-jonathan-gannon

[Bwestbrook36]

1 minute ago, Talonblood said:

Read an article about how Fletch isn't liking how this coach is using his talent. It sounds to me like Fletch is saying Gannon is all over the place and doesn't have a real, steady scheme. It's not a good look when a star player hints in public that the coaching is not to his liking. 

https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/eagles/eagles-fletcher-cox-regression-defense-jonathan-gannon

Oh well, he is an elite player who has now played for 5 defensive coordinators... Now that he is older and a bit wore down he complains he doesn't like the scheme? 

[NCTANK]

he has 4 tackles on the season.  wow

[Iggles25]

Hargrave has more sacks than Cox has tackles.

Damn.

[The Blackfish]

He was double teamed a bunch on Sunday, a lot more than Hargrave and I don’t see either guy doing much against the run.  Gannon looks like he has our D line playing more like Billy Davis, and a lot less like Schwartz who just told our line to attack. As much as fans hated him his defense’s for the most part held the run in check

Gannon said he doesn’t have a scheme, but that’s a lie, he believes that as long as QB’s can’t make long completions, they’ll win the game.  To prove his point, he has made zero changes to his defenses after halftime, except for personnel. When this dude says 4-2-5, he literally means it. 

[brkmsn]

The title doesn't really reflect the actual quotes from Cox. There was no criticism of the scheme nor was there any dissention. He merely stated that he knows he can play better and has to get used to less familiar roles. 

[Talonblood]

1 hour ago, brkmsn said:

The title doesn't really reflect the actual quotes from Cox. There was no criticism of the scheme nor was there any dissention. He merely stated that he knows he can play better and has to get used to less familiar roles. 

You ever hear of reading between the lines? His intention was very clear.

[UK_EaglesFan89]

Instead of complaining about the scheme maybe he needs to work on his game to get back to a decent level. He's been bad this year. 

[EazyEaglez]

6 hours ago, Talonblood said:

Read an article about how Fletch isn't liking how this coach is using his talent. It sounds to me like Fletch is saying Gannon is all over the place and doesn't have a real, steady scheme. It's not a good look when a star player hints in public that the coaching is not to his liking. 

https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/eagles/eagles-fletcher-cox-regression-defense-jonathan-gannon

Well basically in an interview the other day Gannon basically said the same thing about himself. These coaches really are looking bad right now. For as much as people praised Gannon and Sirianni I think it was a mistake for him not to pick a veteran coach for his staff. He should have picked a veteran defensive coordinator. I thought this defense would be ahead of this offense because they have more veteran players, but it’s clear this DC is out of his depths. 

[Mr_Philly]

So Gannon, four games into his first DC position is a failure, lol.

Can we at least give him until after his second season to decide. He has no linebackers at all, the secondary has been and still is horrible plus he lost a key piece from the D-line. After BG went down no one stepped up to fill the void and if you noticed as soon as he went down this D as a whole has looked like crap.

IMO we are in three year rebuild maybe more if Hurts isn’t the guy, it sucks but we need to be patient

[Cochis_Calhoun]

I mean he's complaining about sometimes playing 3 technique and sometimes playing 4i technique, he's seriously trying to say that he isn't getting to the QB or runners this year because occasionally he has to line up a foot away from where he lined up on a previous snap.

I have a Fletch jersey, but he's been living on his reputation for a while now, the last year he was genuinely a top DT was probably 2018.

[rickospia]

10 hours ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

Oh well, he is an elite player who has now played for 5 defensive coordinators... Now that he is older and a bit wore down he complains he doesn't like the scheme? 

 

49 minutes ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

I mean he's complaining about sometimes playing 3 technique and sometimes playing 4i technique, he's seriously trying to say that he isn't getting to the QB or runners this year because occasionally he has to line up a foot away from where he lined up on a previous snap.

I have a Fletch jersey, but he's been living on his reputation for a while now, the last year he was genuinely a top DT was probably 2018.

Fletch is right this DC is in over his head .🙁

[brkmsn]

6 hours ago, Talonblood said:

You ever hear of reading between the lines? 

No, I haven't. I don't think this has ever been attempted in the history of Philadelphia sports. 

 

Have you ever heard of click bait?

[nipples]

Cox is cooked, he just isn’t ready to admit it. Love the player he used to be for us but they should have traded him in the offseason before his value plummeted further, which it now has. 

[toolg]

Stats are just a small part of the game. Cox draws extra attention from the opponent, so that frees up Hargrave who has been very effective. That's good. The defense has given up 41 + 42 points the last 2 games. That's bad. Cox knows they can play better than that.

[time2rock]

1 hour ago, nipples said:

Cox is cooked, he just isn’t ready to admit it. Love the player he used to be for us but they should have traded him in the offseason before his value plummeted further, which it now has. 

Trading him this year (using a pre June 1 designation) would have resulted in a dead cap hit of $51.8M.  

Trading him next season (again , pre June 1 designation) would result in a dead cap hit of $40.9M.  In 2023 $28.1M, in 2024 $16.9M.  I don't think he's going anywhere anytime soon.  

[time2rock]

8 hours ago, Talonblood said:

You ever hear of reading between the lines? His intention was very clear.

They're trying to bait him into blaming Gannon for his lack of production ... his answers don't reveal much other than that he is uncomfortable answering them.  

Look, the scheme is different from what he had been playing in for most of his career (he started under Washburn who worked under Schwartz so they shared some similar philosophies).  We all knew Gannon was going to change things up when he was hired (he learned under Zimmer).  And he is getting long in the tooth, so it is understandable that he'd be experiencing a lack of production.  I do think we'll see him become more productive as the season progresses as everyone gets more comfortable within the new scheme.  

[Cochis_Calhoun]

2 hours ago, toolg said:

Stats are just a small part of the game. Cox draws extra attention from the opponent, so that frees up Hargrave who has been very effective. That's good. The defense has given up 41 + 42 points the last 2 games. That's bad. Cox knows they can play better than that.

But Hargrave is doing things that Cox hasn't done for 2 years, he's manhandling guys out of the way, he has more sacks in 4 games under Gannon than he had in 11 starts with Schwartz, he needs 2 more sacks to go past Fletch's sack production from last year.

I've been where you are, like I said in my earlier post Fletch is one of my favorite Eagles, but it's been a couple of years now we've (me included) been trotting out the 'its not all about stats' line while Aaron Donald has been walking through O Lines to hammer the QB double digit times a season.  It kind of is about stats and Fletch's haven't matched his reputation for some time.

[ilikepargo]

Aside from opposing offenses, does anyone really like the way that Gannon is leading this defense?

[toolg]

13 minutes ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

But Hargrave is doing things that Cox hasn't done for 2 years, he's manhandling guys out of the way, he has more sacks in 4 games under Gannon than he had in 11 starts with Schwartz, he needs 2 more sacks to go past Fletch's sack production from last year.

I've been where you are, like I said in my earlier post Fletch is one of my favorite Eagles, but it's been a couple of years now we've (me included) been trotting out the 'its not all about stats' line while Aaron Donald has been walking through O Lines to hammer the QB double digit times a season.  It kind of is about stats and Fletch's haven't matched his reputation for some time.

Ok, Cox seems to be in some decline. But I don't think the Eagles are going to get Aaron Donald from the Rams either.

[Cochis_Calhoun]

4 minutes ago, ilikepargo said:

Aside from opposing offenses, does anyone really like the way that Gannon is leading this defense?

The defense isn't great at the moment, but that doesn't excuse Cox having goose egg on the rusher stat sheet, not a solitary tackle for loss or even QB hit, even Barnett has managed 2 TFL and a trio of QB hits.

[Cochis_Calhoun]

5 minutes ago, toolg said:

Ok, Cox seems to be in some decline. But I don't think the Eagles are going to get Aaron Donald from the Rams either.

I wasn't suggesting they should, it's just Cox's contract is a lot closer to Donald's than his on field production justifies and it has been for a couple of years.

[toolg]

2 minutes ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

I wasn't suggesting they should, it's just Cox's contract is a lot closer to Donald's than his on field production justifies and it has been for a couple of years.

Cox isn't going to give back the money he was paid either... Were the Eagles supposed to let Cox go to another team, and find somebody else to play his position? What is your point?

[Cochis_Calhoun]

4 minutes ago, toolg said:

Cox isn't going to give back the money he was paid either... Were the Eagles supposed to let Cox go to another team, and find somebody else to play his position? What is your point?

You said it wasn't all about the stat line and I said it kinda is, and pointed at Aaron Donald as a DT who is paid at a level not massively above Cox's and is producing a stat line to match, you then said you didn't think the Eagles would acquire Donald, a response to an argument I hadn't made.

My point is Cox isn't playing well, he's overpaid and too old for where the rest of the roster is, what did you think it was? I've made my feelings on Howie's contract judgement pretty clear over the last 18 months too, I don't think teams will trade for Cox's contract for his level of production, but if you could find a trade partner then it is beyond time for the franchise to accept the roster needs cleaning out and that means eating dead cap on some horrible contracts for big players and realising that good drafting is the only sustainable way out of the hole we're in.

 

[toolg]

6 minutes ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

My point is Cox isn't playing well, he's overpaid and too old for where the rest of the roster is, what did you think it was? I've made my feelings on Howie's contract judgement pretty clear over the last 18 months too, I don't think teams will trade for Cox's contract for his level of production, but if you could find a trade partner then it is beyond time for the franchise to accept the roster needs cleaning out and that means eating dead cap on some horrible contracts for big players and realising that good drafting is the only sustainable way out of the hole we're in.

 

Then I disagree. I don't believe Cox has been ineffective just because he's not putting up jaw-dropping stats. I still think he's a fine player, working to get better at the new schemes. I believe Cox now is better than drafting some new players and coaching them up. That'll take years to rehab the defense. I blame the new coaches more than the players for the doldrums we see on defense now.