3 minutes ago, AmericanEagle77 said:

Leaguewide problem. Most of the younger guys not from Shanahan's group are lighter in practices than they used to be. Shanahan is an exception because of his dad, he was brought up on old school coaching. It's not really telling, it's kind of a league flaw that eventually people are going to realize doesn't work.

Wow....I honestly didn't have any idea it was a league wide problem....I believe constant practicing in any sport is the key to long term success....like you said, old school coaching....

5 hours ago, Birdman said:

Same thing he did over a 6 week skid....NOTHING 

There is absolutely no reason to bring Shitanni back other than optics and it seems like the only argument to keep him is for continuity and what we've seen throughout the course of the season, Shitanni is trending downwards and is in over his head. 

There's not really any overt reason to fire him right now when you look at the issues others have had in similar positions. Wanna take a look at what happened to the last teams that lost both coordinators and see what happened to them?

The Philadelphia fanbase is just very reactionary, so obviously they're pissy, and then on top of that he's non-traditional, so they don't get to visibly see with their eyeballs exactly what little nuances of his job he does, so they assume he doesn't do anything at all. 

4 minutes ago, GeorgeM37 said:

Wow....I honestly didn't have any idea it was a league wide problem....I believe constant practicing in any sport is the key to long term success....like you said, old school coaching....

No it's pretty true. If you remember the last CBA reduced the intensity of practices that could be held, and then it kind of just went downhill from there. Younger coaches then came in who only knew this era and weren't connected to old-school coaches and that just made it even lighter than before.

The Eagles do have light practices, specifically in the offseason, but it's really not just them anymore. It's a problem with the shift to younger coaches, the older ones don't make the mistake. But the trend right now is hire young.

Gut feeling I can’t shake is that Siri gets a pink slip tomorrow.  Teams don’t collapse like this without a severe fracture in the locker room which is symptomatic of a coach who’s lost control of that locker room. 

31 minutes ago, VeeMak said:

Gut feeling I can’t shake is that Siri gets a pink slip tomorrow.  Teams don’t collapse like this without a severe fracture in the locker room which is symptomatic of a coach who’s lost control of that locker room. 

I agree.  But I worry Lurie will buy into some excuses.  I keep seeing people argue his record and success, and starting 10-1.  But there's more to it.  Kind of like how stats in garbage time don't show how dominant the other team won, the WAY they collapsed and the way Siri did nothing to fix it except one:  swap Desai for Patricia and that move actually made the defense worse.  He had no idea how to fix things, there were basic simple things that everyone could see should be different and he changed nothing.

I know it's unusual to fire a coach with making the playoffs 3 years in a row and the regular season record but the end of this season was that bad.

The real issue seems like Siri had no clue what to do. The team got worse game after game. By the end of the season even some of the worst teams in the league were rolling the Eagles. Was there a team any worse than the eagles played the last 6 or 7 games? Siri had almost half a season of games to right the ship and rolled out the same slop game after game. 

Was there anything anyone saw the last two months to say Siri was correcting even one thing? Are the young players being coached up and improving? Is any talent being developed at all outside of 3 or 4 players the rest of the team has gotten worse. 

 Siri keeps up his steller coaching and motivating there may be a top 3 draft pick for the eagles in 2025. Howie better not trade that pick away this draft.

9 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I think next year will be a down year but at least if it’s one with new coaches and ideas you can get behind that. With the hope it’ll improve and build from there.

If they don’t change the HC it will not matter. 

6 hours ago, MF POON said:

It could go bad, or we could bounce back. No one expected this team to make the SB last season when it started, so I don't get the super negative outlook.  Firing Siranni now would just set us back even further.  people need to relax and hope for a good draft and FA signings.

SB year was year two, and people did have high expectations for that team. They were coming off a playoff season and just picked up some nice pieces in the off-season. It was also well documented that they had an easy schedule. If you recall there were only two question marks about that team. One was the quarterback and the other was the coach. Now here we stand a year later asking the same questions about both of them and on top of that we are wondering if they can coexist with one another. I tell you I would have felt much better about this coach and these players if they went out there and lost, but fought. That first playoff game in Tampa in Sirianni’s first year that’s exactly what they did. They lost, but they fought. These guys rolled over and played dead. 

1 hour ago, NOTW said:

I agree.  But I worry Lurie will buy into some excuses.  I keep seeing people argue his record and success, and starting 10-1.  But there's more to it.  Kind of like how stats in garbage time don't show how dominant the other team won, the WAY they collapsed and the way Siri did nothing to fix it except one:  swap Desai for Patricia and that move actually made the defense worse.  He had no idea how to fix things, there were basic simple things that everyone could see should be different and he changed nothing.

I know it's unusual to fire a coach with making the playoffs 3 years in a row and the regular season record but the end of this season was that bad.

I agree 100 percent... That was my biggest issue with Sirianni is that I feel like he did absolutely nothing to improve the team specifically the offense... It's like he was trying to push a square peg through a round hole all season eventually hoping it would fit... Did he refuse to change because they were winning? Everyone and anyone could tell something was off and it mainly felt like playing calling... Was it BJ was it Sirianni? Either way it falls on the head coach... If they made changes to the offense and it didn't work at the very least you can say an effort was made but literally nothing changed... Every single game felt the same... Even when they were winning games you knew something was going to give eventually... I don't think anyone expected it to be as big a collapse as it was... Very telling about the head coach in my own opinion... 

1 hour ago, GeorgeM37 said:

Wow....I honestly didn't have any idea it was a league wide problem....I believe constant practicing in any sport is the key to long term success....like you said, old school coaching....

I specifically remember Kelce saying one of the reasons he returned this year is because the coaches aren't too demanding which makes it easier for the older vets. I'm not saying that is a good thing. However, if it helps to bring back someone like Kelce then at least in that regard it's not such a bad thing. I never believed in working people for the sake of working them. If there's something to be gained then that's one thing. But in today's NFL, with the money these players are making they should be working on improving all year, practice or not, That's how average players become well paid good players and good players become very wealthy superstars. It's not the military where they need whip young boys into men. If someone doesn;t have the discipline and will to do that on their own...goodbye!

That said, I do believe there is no substitution for putting the pads on and hitting guys. You can't replicate that. But there's also a lot that can be learned by simple studying film and the playbook. I personally believe part of the problem is we have too many older vets that don't benefit from harder practices but this comes at the detriment of the younger guys who need that. You can't single any group out on a team because that can lead to animosities. It's a balancing act.

One last point I want to make about the "epic collapse". Yes indeed it was. However, if this team was always as bad as it was at the end season then does the fact that we won 10 out of 11 of the first games account for something? I'm not buying the coach lost locker room. If that were the case we would have heard louder rumblings of this long before now and even with the season over, players who have no reason to "tow the corporate line" any longer, are protecting this coach.  There may be validity to many of the criticisms made by fans. The fact is we are all just backseat drivers not in the drivers seat and certainly not seeing what the driver sees.

Frankly, when I come on here I mostly think...STFU you know nothing POS. I'm sure people thought that of many of my opinions. If my or anyone else's opinion mattered we'd be in the locker and meeting rooms. But I get it....it's part of the entertainment. It's fun to spout our opinions....so carry on.......It's why we're all here!

But at some point you need to look at the rest of the league and think about where this team has been in comparison. Is it really so dire we need to fire the GM, all of the coaches and let more then half the team walk? Again, lets have fun discussing it.....it's what we're here for.

Yes it is. The lack of desire, the nonchalance, the unspirited movement by the players, the grade school tackling, the plain lack of motivation,  which showed in their faces, surely was not something we brought on. It was by whom surrounded the players- the coaches led by Siri. 

Winning and losing is a team function, there's appropriate blame (or credit) to be given to everyone. Players and coaches alike. 

4 minutes ago, nicks said:

Yes it is. The lack of desire, the nonchalance, the unspirited movement by the players, the grade school tackling, the plain lack of motivation,  which showed in their faces, surely was not something we brought on. It was by whom surrounded the players- the coaches led by Siri. 

Taking this line of thinking just a tad further....I fathom you would blame every bad move you've made you in your life on your parents. I believe at this level there is such a thing as self-accountability and that's exactly what I've been hearing from many of the players.I'm not absolving coaching but that only goes so far. A coach can't force a player like slay to not think about his family and future when making a tackle.

Where are the sign people with the metal trash cans when we need them? They need to line the road before the meeting tomorrow and label them Nick's offense. 

4 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

If they don’t change the HC it will not matter. 

Yeah that’s what I was saying bud. If it’s new coaches (HC, OC and DC) then you can get behind that. Any struggles are to be somewhat expected as they bring in a new scheme etc.

4 hours ago, Thing3 said:

Taking this line of thinking just a tad further....I fathom you would blame every bad move you've made you in your life on your parents. I believe at this level there is such a thing as self-accountability and that's exactly what I've been hearing from many of the players.I'm not absolving coaching but that only goes so far. A coach can't force a player like slay to not think about his family and future when making a tackle.

A coach can't force a player to do his job but he can bench him, call for him to be inactivated, traded, cut. There is no player who gets a free pass for not doing his job. His job includes accepting millions of dollars to do many things, including to tackle. The often used term "made a business decision" is synonymous with "chose cowardice" or "surrendered". There's no room for cowards or surrender in the heat of competition. As long as someone gives it their all, there is no shame in losing. The problem is when they don't give their all.

That a player thinks they can get a way with giving half effort without consequences suggests poor leadership. That they actually do get away with it without consequences confirms poor leadership. Poor leaders must be always be replaced. I imagine Sirianni is well liked because he's soft and easy on players. Why wouldn't they like him? Andy Reid's first training camp he cut a really good veteran run stuffing DT (Johnson IIRC) because he spoke out against the coach's philosophy. Andy had him push a blocking sled for 100 yards and then cut him. Everyone needs to know their role and embrace it. When a whole team does that, things tend to trend in the direction of winning. When the climate allows 53 CEO's, well, you get what we saw in the last half of the season.

On 1/16/2024 at 3:29 PM, AmericanEagle77 said:

If Sirianni is fired, which I think is a bad idea, then yeah. Younger coaches and Philadelphia are disastrous because younger coaches tend to have more to learn and Philadelphia doesn't have the patience anymore. It's pretty much rings or bust here now.

Might as well let Sirianni stay for his contract. Finishing second in the division with a one and out in the playoffs means that their attempt at establishing a dynasty has failed. They're not even contenders. 

2 hours ago, ThinkGreen said:

Might as well let Sirianni stay for his contract. Finishing second in the division with a one and out in the playoffs means that their attempt at establishing a dynasty has failed. They're not even contenders. 

Frankly, the fact that literally no one cares about the details is pretty nuts to me. Jim Schwartz probably had more experience than the entire defense or offensive staff excluding Sirianni combined when Doug got him and it was widely reported that Doug wasn't the one who reached out to him originally, but the FO instead. So the question is, why isn't Sirianni allowed the same kind of opportunity?

Eagles fans honestly have never been so insufferable as this year. Especially with people out here saying to go after Bill Belichick and crap. Like, are people insane? It'd never work. You'd have to fire Howie too. Lane would absolutely retire. There's several people who have said they don't like Belichick. It's such a terrible idea.

Fans this year are super delusional.

16 minutes ago, AmericanEagle77 said:

Frankly, the fact that literally no one cares about the details is pretty nuts to me. Jim Schwartz probably had more experience than the entire defense or offensive staff excluding Sirianni combined when Doug got him and it was widely reported that Doug wasn't the one who reached out to him originally, but the FO instead. So the question is, why isn't Sirianni allowed the same kind of opportunity?

Eagles fans honestly have never been so insufferable as this year. Especially with people out here saying to go after Bill Belichick and crap. Like, are people insane? It'd never work. You'd have to fire Howie too. Lane would absolutely retire. There's several people who have said they don't like Belichick. It's such a terrible idea.

Fans this year are super delusional.

because we are the ones that want to win a super bowl and all you care about is nick sirianni, this team could be 4-12 with nick, you will still give him a free ride.

7 minutes ago, toughfighter83 said:

because we are the ones that want to win a super bowl and all you care about is nick sirianni, this team could be 4-12 with nick, you will still give him a free ride.

So actually approaching things rationally and logically means I don't want the Eagles to win a Super Bowl? I don't know why I'm even replying to such a baseless assertion, but I'll just kindly say that you have no idea what you're talking about.

What I care about is stability, and keeping Philadelphia a good destination for both player talent and coaching talent, the latter of which will not want to come here if we keep tossing coaches out of the building frequently, especially after much of the league seemed to feel Doug being thrown out in his first year struggling was wild, and Nick having the best winning percentage in franchise history.

I've explained this like a billion times since the playoff loss, but no one with a family who actually has options is going to want to come here if they have to accept expectations twice as high as any other fanbase, a GM who's a non football guy *and* has a vice-grip on power, and an organization with crumbling stability, when they can choose...literally anywhere else. On top of that, said expectations would then become the norm, meaning young guys can't take time to grow into the shoes.

So if the older football guys (Belichick, Vrabel, Harbaugh) would get in a power struggle with Howie within 3 years.
And if the younger guys in the cycle have no room to struggle or grow.

Who DO you actually hire? And that's of the people who would WANT to come here. It sounds like a total disaster. Add to that, that Nick Sirianni is the first Head Coach since 1994 to lose both coordinators to NFL Head Coaching jobs after a Super Bowl, and my thought process is 'this is an extremely bad idea'. 

Not like you'll read the whole post after your little two-liner and accusation without any evidence, but maybe someone will read it.

14 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

SB year was year two, and people did have high expectations for that team. They were coming off a playoff season and just picked up some nice pieces in the off-season. It was also well documented that they had an easy schedule. If you recall there were only two question marks about that team. One was the quarterback and the other was the coach. Now here we stand a year later asking the same questions about both of them and on top of that we are wondering if they can coexist with one another. I tell you I would have felt much better about this coach and these players if they went out there and lost, but fought. That first playoff game in Tampa in Sirianni’s first year that’s exactly what they did. They lost, but they fought. These guys rolled over and played dead. 

No one expected them to go nearly undefeated and get to the SB at the beginning of that season. I remember the board back then, and many of us were shocked at how good the team was. Sure, we had higher expectations and knew they'd be a playoff team, but not a "this is our year" kind of season.  Like you said, there were still questions regarding both sides of the ball and whether Jalen would take the next step, as I remember a LOT of doubters in the offseason leading up to that season. 

To me at least, it's clear that the new OC and DC were the main issues, along with some FO meddling.  I know Nick is gonna say that's his offense, and take the heat for stupid moves, but every "good" HC takes the blame when things go south.

 

8 hours ago, PoconoDon said:

A coach can't force a player to do his job but he can bench him, call for him to be inactivated, traded, cut. There is no player who gets a free pass for not doing his job. His job includes accepting millions of dollars to do many things, including to tackle. The often used term "made a business decision" is synonymous with "chose cowardice" or "surrendered". There's no room for cowards or surrender in the heat of competition. As long as someone gives it their all, there is no shame in losing. The problem is when they don't give their all.

That a player thinks they can get a way with giving half effort without consequences suggests poor leadership. That they actually do get away with it without consequences confirms poor leadership. Poor leaders must be always be replaced. I imagine Sirianni is well liked because he's soft and easy on players. Why wouldn't they like him? Andy Reid's first training camp he cut a really good veteran run stuffing DT (Johnson IIRC) because he spoke out against the coach's philosophy. Andy had him push a blocking sled for 100 yards and then cut him. Everyone needs to know their role and embrace it. When a whole team does that, things tend to trend in the direction of winning. When the climate allows 53 CEO's, well, you get what we saw in the last half of the season.

Fair points and I wasn't completely absolving coaching. There may have been more Nick could have done, or not done, that could have been helpful. The fact is we don't really know the root cause(s) for how this team played this year. If Nick wasn't the root cause then replacing him changes nothing. Some could, and are, pointing at Howie as having a major role. why should Nick have to fall on that sword? What about the many mistakes made by players....you can't bench most of the team. You seem to be suggesting that beatings should continue until moral improves.

The problem with the "fire Nick" mentality is that it's seems to be a shortsighted oversimplification of the issues that plagued this team. There is no guarantee a new coach is going to come in here and turn this ship around any faster then Nick can. It could actually make situations worse. Nick is a young coach and if the FO believes (based on the internal knowledge they have) that things can get corrected, then I tend feel he deserves that chance. A new coach is not going to change the analytics and they're certainly not going to change Lurie or Howie. Much of the personnel is locked in for years and aren't going anywhere either. In short, I don't believe there is a single point of failure and trying to pin it all on one person is missing the forest for the trees. The FO is in the best position to make that call. I'm not saying they are the best people to be making the call, only that they are in the best position to make it.

On 12/31/2023 at 1:41 PM, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

That’s where I’m at too. I’m not sure he’s got what it takes to turn this around. He seems to have lost the players. They aren’t happy and they aren’t buying his BS.

When we say "lost the players” which I agree and use the phrase too, it actually means the players don’t have faith in the coaches abilities and that’s as big a problem as you can have as a football team. Just as big as a TO like Cancer on the roster 

2 hours ago, MF POON said:

No one expected them to go nearly undefeated and get to the SB at the beginning of that season. I remember the board back then, and many of us were shocked at how good the team was. Sure, we had higher expectations and knew they'd be a playoff team, but not a "this is our year" kind of season.  Like you said, there were still questions regarding both sides of the ball and whether Jalen would take the next step, as I remember a LOT of doubters in the offseason leading up to that season. 

To me at least, it's clear that the new OC and DC were the main issues, along with some FO meddling.  I know Nick is gonna say that's his offense, and take the heat for stupid moves, but every "good" HC takes the blame when things go south.

 

They were a playoff team that improved the talent on that team. That was evident even before the season started. Ultimately none of that matters IMO. What matters from my perspective is that Nick had no answers to fix a disastrous defense and an ailing offense. For over a. Onto he was basically out coached by sub par football teams. Most of their half time adjustments made them worse. They lost games to sub par teams they were leading against. How many blowout games did we watch them lose in the second half of the year? I mean even during their 10-1 stretch they were barely winning most of those games. I come back to the question. Considering the fact Sirianni can’t call plays what is the purpose for keeping him? 

22 hours ago, NOTW said:

 

 

Love Kelce, but look back over the years, and you will find that Kelce has supported every coach that’s been fired since he’s been here. 😂