1 minute ago, brkmsn said:

Neither player is Rodgers, obviously, but they had some weapons on offense and just weren't doing much to help the defense because of the liability at QB. Last year was a wasted opportunity because of their QB play.

I don’t disagree that if they had a better quarterback, they wouldn’t have wasted the year. They probably would’ve been able to be a playoff team. But even with Flacco or Wentz, I do not see them being a Super Bowl contender. Would they have been better? Very much likely cause Wilson suck. But i dont see them being a Super Bowl contender unless Aaron Rodgers was healthy and playing like he did in GB. I also dont know if Flacco at his age or wentz holds up for 17 weeks behind that jets oline. Their oline was also not good 

4 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I don’t disagree that if they had a better quarterback, they wouldn’t have wasted the year. They probably would’ve been able to be a playoff team. But even with Flacco or Wentz, I do not see them being a Super Bowl contender. Would they have been better? Very much likely cause Wilson suck. But i dont see them being a Super Bowl contender unless Aaron Rodgers was healthy and playing like he did in GB. I also dont know if Flacco at his age or wentz holds up for 17 weeks behind that jets oline. Their oline was also not good 

Not every injury is season ending. Sure, either guy could have been hurt at some point and missed a game or even a few, but most NFL injuries are not season ending. I don't know that I ever considered the Giants a Super Bowl contender during Eli Manning's career, but they still managed to win 2. The absolute first thing you need to do to get to the Super Bowl is get to the playoffs. From there, pretty much anything can happen. At this point it's all "what ifs" and conjecture, but the Jets refused to do anything and they missed a postseason opportunity. 

20 minutes ago, brkmsn said:

Not every injury is season ending. Sure, either guy could have been hurt at some point and missed a game or even a few, but most NFL injuries are not season ending. I don't know that I ever considered the Giants a Super Bowl contender during Eli Manning's career, but they still managed to win 2. The absolute first thing you need to do to get to the Super Bowl is get to the playoffs. From there, pretty much anything can happen. At this point it's all "what ifs" and conjecture, but the Jets refused to do anything and they missed a postseason opportunity. 

Yes, but we’re specifically talking about the Jets last year. That was a season ending injury where both would’ve had to play for 17 weeks behind one of the worst olines in the league. They were really bad on oline. 

Also Joe Flacco played behind a solid/good offensive line with the Browns with good weapons and good defense (frankly better offensive coach then anything the jets have). Still got his ass kicked by the Texans in the first round of the playoffs.

The odds are you are not gonna be a Super Bowl contender if your starting quarterback that’s won MVPs gets hurt for 17 weeks and you’re gonna have to go to a 39-year-old Joe Flacco or Carson Wentz who also has had durability concerns and turnover issues behind one of the worst olines in the league. We are under the assumption that the Jets would’ve made the playoffs with either one of those quarterbacks on the roster. That’s not necessarily true either. With how bad their offensive line was both might not have made it through 17 games. You might’ve lost them for a period of time.
 

 

 

8 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Yes, but we’re specifically talking about the Jets last year. That was a season ending injury where both would’ve had to play for 17 weeks behind one of the worst olines in the league. They were really bad on oline. 

Also Joe Flacco played behind a good offensive line with the Browns with good weapons and good defense. Still got his ass kicked by the Texans in the first round of the playoffs.

The odds are you are not gonna be a Super Bowl contender if your starting quarterback that’s won MVPs gets hurt for 17 weeks and you’re gonna have to go to a 39-year-old Joe Flacco or Carson Wentz who also has had durability concerns and turnover issues behind one of the worst olines in the league. We are under the assumption that the Jets would’ve made the playoffs with either one of those quarterbacks on the roster. That’s not necessarily true either. With how bad their offensive line was both might not have made it through 17 games. You might’ve lost them for a period of time.
 

I agree it's all conjecture --- except the part where the jets did nothing and missed the playoffs. They could have brought an upgrade in and still missed the playoffs, but at least they would have attempted something. Last year, injuries played a part on our defense --- especially in the secondary where we lost both Maddox's backup before the season and him just 2 weeks in. Then we brought in some guys that also got hurt and missed significant time. Before the trade deadline we brought in Byard and he played solid for us, but ultimately it didn't make the defense perform better as a whole. At LB we brought in Leonard for depth. We tried some things last season to address problems and they didn't pay off. The year before we added Joseph and Suh and that helped the team at a time when they needed help in a specific area. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. 

If you look at the jets last season and you grade each position group at the end of each game, I believe the QB position would have the lowest GPA.

Imagine if wentz gets another ring with the chiefs 

3 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

If you’re calling QB run every play

You must’ve missed the game Thursday night. Pickett can’t run or throw. 

2 minutes ago, brkmsn said:

I agree it's all conjecture --- except the part where the jets did nothing and missed the playoffs. They could have brought an upgrade in and still missed the playoffs, but at least they would have attempted something. Last year, injuries played a part on our defense --- especially in the secondary where we lost both Maddox's backup before the season and him just 2 weeks in. Then we brought in some guys that also got hurt and missed significant time. Before the trade deadline we brought in Byard and he played solid for us, but ultimately it didn't make the defense perform better as a whole. At LB we brought in Leonard for depth. We tried some things last season to address problems and they didn't pay off. The year before we added Joseph and Suh and that helped the team at a time when they needed help in a specific area. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. 

If you look at the jets last season and you grade each position group at the end of each game, I believe the QB position would have the lowest GPA.

I look at the Jets last year this way. Their quarterback position was a massive problem. So was their offensive line. It’s why they did what they did this past offseason. Their offensive line was one of the worst in the league. Nick Foles always had that hot streak in him to play like he did but another reason why Nick foles was able to be foles was because he had good coaching on offense. I don’t think the Jets have that. He had the best offensive line in the league. The Jets have one of the worst. The Eagles had top playmakers and a top running game in the league. The Jets had Garrett Wilson and a good running game with Hall.

The quarterback position was obviously the worst for the Jets. But I don’t think the offensive line was that far behind. Pff had the jets ranked 32nd overall in oline play. 

Wentz is an interesting situation. During the 2017 season he looked like he was on his way to being a HOF QB. Then still looked good in 2018 until he got hurt again and then took us to the playoffs with Greg Ward as WR1 in 2019. 

Then 2020 idk wtf happened. 

Perhaps Reid can get him out of his bad habits because he certainly has the physical capabilities of being a #1 QB 

4 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

Wentz is an interesting situation. During the 2017 season he looked like he was on his way to being a HOF QB. Then still looked good in 2018 until he got hurt again and then took us to the playoffs with Greg Ward as WR1 in 2019. 

Then 2020 idk wtf happened. 

Perhaps Reid can get him out of his bad habits because he certainly has the physical capabilities of being a #1 QB 

Tbh the best place he could go is to KC and work with Reid. If anyone could get him back to where he wants to be it’s likely Reid. Plus if mahomes goes down they have the pieces as their oline is good, great TE, have nice wide receivers this year and a good running game. 

29 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

 

 

 

If the Eagles wanted to invest in a high level backup QB that would have been Carson Wentz.

12 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I look at the Jets last year this way. Their quarterback position was a massive problem. So was their offensive line. It’s why they did what they did this past offseason. Their offensive line was one of the worst in the league. Nick Foles always had that hot streak in him to play like he did but another reason why Nick foles was able to be foles was because he had good coaching on offense. I don’t think the Jets have that. He had the best offensive line in the league. The Jets have one of the worst. The Eagles had top playmakers and a top running game in the league. The Jets had Garrett Wilson and a good running game with Hall.

The quarterback position was obviously the worst for the Jets. But I don’t think the offensive line was that far behind. Pff had the jets ranked 32nd overall in oline play. 

How many years has Burrow played well despite a terrible pass blocking O-line? I mean I guess one can argue that's probably why he's always hurt, but competent QBs have been able to play well despite bad O-line play throughout NFL history. To me, the biggest thing that stands out is that Wilson even doubted and questioned himself. How in the world do you decide to ride with a guy that's scared to drive? You have to get that guy out of there. It didn't take the Eagles long to figure that out with Bobby Hoying after he mentally crumbled under pressure.

5 minutes ago, brkmsn said:

How many years has Burrow played well despite a terrible pass blocking O-line? I mean I guess one can argue that's probably why he's always hurt, but competent QBs have been able to play well despite bad O-line play throughout NFL history. To me, the biggest thing that stands out is that Wilson even doubted and questioned himself. How in the world do you decide to ride with a guy that's scared to drive? You have to get that guy out of there. It didn't take the Eagles long to figure that out with Bobby Hoying after he mentally crumbled under pressure.

I think the difference is burrow is a top tier Qb. Not sure you are getting a backup at the level of joe burrow to play behind arguably the worst oline in the league and have success. And even so he’s been banged up cause of that. I’d also argue i don’t think the bengals oline was ever as bad as the jets oline was last year. Jets had injuries and it was just not very good to begin with.

again, I don’t disagree with you. I wouldn’t have gone with Zach Wilson as the backup. Once you got Aaron Rodgers, you had to move on from him because he was never turning it around there if he ever did. Which I don’t think he’s going to do. However, Wilson’s ineptitude helped cover up for the fact that the jets oline was an absolute disaster last year. Wilson was the biggest problem but his ineptitude helped steer criticism away from just how bad the jets oline was in 2023. 

Based on some of the beats, it might not be long before DeJean is the nickel and Mitchell is CB2. I'm going to be a bear about it, but they have two starting outside CB that will be on the bench in Ringo and Rodgers. It's great to have depth but at the same time, there's a huge hole at WR3. As good as Smith and Brown are, the Eagles have absolutely no young depth at WR. Could we see one of Rodgers/Ringo moved?

Next year Mitchell is CB1 and one of Rodgers/Ringo is CB2. For Rodgers to be considered next year, he needs to be brought back on a new deal. I think it's a bit strange that Rodgers has been pulled from both games so fast considering he hasn't played in a year. I would think getting him more gameplay would be good to get him back up to speed.

Part of me thinks, they are either A. taking Rodgers out so he doesn't get hurt so they can try to trade him, or B. showcasing Ringo so teams can get more tape on him for a possible trade or C. I'm overthinking the entire thing, Rodgers has CB2 locked down and Ringo is just getting the normal reps he would as a back up in the preseason. I do think they have one too many starting CBs even though that sounds ridiculous. There's also DeJean and his potential at outside CB. Do they have a potential 5 outside starting caliber CB on the team?

Tyler Hall is now on IR. Nickel CB and backup Nickel are now open. They could always move Maddox back to the slot, but I think he's settling in at safety and it makes it easier to get rid of Bradberry. 

I also have a gut feeling they aren't ready to get rid of McPhearson yet.

I originally had them with 11 DB (including Brown on PUP). 

S- CJGJ, Blankenship, Maddox, McCollum

CB- Slay, Mitchell, Rodgers, Ringo, DeJean, McPhearson       If Rodgers/Ringo are moved CB- Slay, Mitchell, Ringo, DeJean, McPhearson, Ricks

Just spit balling as we hit the dog days here. 

I'm also wondering with Patrick Johnson and Jalyx Hunt looking better than expected, could Josh Sweat be moved for a WR3? I don't know what to make of Sweat. Is the the frustrating player who doesn't gets sacks and plays DE poorly or is he a force? He's not coming back after this year. 

Let me also say, I don't want to trade everyone. I'm just looking at a huge need in WR3 and positions where there are expiring contracts and or logjams with depth. I didn't think WR3 was that important until I watched the Eagles play the last 2 games without Smith and Brown and it was NOT good. They need someone who can offer a dynamic skillset as WR3 with Brown and Smith but also be able to step in if either had to miss time. 

 

14 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Based on some of the beats, it might not be long before DeJean is the nickel and Mitchell is CB2. I'm going to be a bear about it, but they have two starting outside CB that will be on the bench in Ringo and Rodgers. It's great to have depth but at the same time, there's a huge hole at WR3. As good as Smith and Brown are, the Eagles have absolutely no young depth at WR. Could we see one of Rodgers/Ringo moved?

Next year Mitchell is CB1 and one of Rodgers/Ringo is CB2. For Rodgers to be considered next year, he needs to be brought back on a new deal. I think it's a bit strange that Rodgers has been pulled from both games so fast considering he hasn't played in a year. I would think getting him more gameplay would be good to get him back up to speed.

Part of me thinks, they are either A. taking Rodgers out so he doesn't get hurt so they can try to trade him, or B. showcasing Ringo so teams can get more tape on him for a possible trade or C. I'm overthinking the entire thing, Rodgers has CB2 locked down and Ringo is just getting the normal reps he would as a back up in the preseason. I do think they have one too many starting CBs even though that sounds ridiculous. There's also DeJean and his potential at outside CB. Do they have a potential 5 outside starting caliber CB on the team?

Tyler Hall is now on IR. Nickel CB and backup Nickel are now open. They could always move Maddox back to the slot, but I think he's settling in at safety and it makes it easier to get rid of Bradberry. 

I also have a gut feeling they aren't ready to get rid of McPhearson yet.

I originally had them with 11 DB (including Brown on PUP). 

S- CJGJ, Blankenship, Maddox, McCollum

CB- Slay, Mitchell, Rodgers, Ringo, DeJean, McPhearson       If Rodgers/Ringo are moved CB- Slay, Mitchell, Ringo, DeJean, McPhearson, Ricks

Just spit balling as we hit the dog days here. 

I'm also wondering with Patrick Johnson and Jalyx Hunt looking better than expected, could Josh Sweat be moved for a WR3? I don't know what to make of Sweat. Is the the frustrating player who doesn't gets sacks and plays DE poorly or is he a force? He's not coming back after this year. 

Let me also say, I don't want to trade everyone. I'm just looking at a huge need in WR3 and positions where there are expiring contracts and or logjams with depth. I didn't think WR3 was that important until I watched the Eagles play the last 2 games without Smith and Brown and it was NOT good. They need someone who can offer a dynamic skillset as WR3 with Brown and Smith but also be able to step in if either had to miss time. 

 

How many targets you do you see this WR3 getting?  Look at the WR3 around the league.  It's the most overblown panic on this board.  If AJ or DeVonta go down then go use one of those CBs in a trade to get a WR.  There's no reason to now though when WR3 would be 5th option in this offense and Slay could just as easily go down at some point with his age or any of the other CBs. 

1 hour ago, bpac55 said:

 

 

Yeah…very wild.  He’s in the perfect spot. If Mahomes has to miss three or four games in a row… I think the Chiefs likely don’t miss a beat with him and Andy together.  

10 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

How many targets you do you see this WR3 getting?  Look at the WR3 around the league.  It's the most overblown panic on this board.  If AJ or DeVonta go down then go use one of those CBs in a trade to get a WR.  There's no reason to now though when WR3 would be 5th option in this offense and Slay could just as easily go down at some point with his age or any of the other CBs. 

WR3 is likely fine between Campbell, Covey, and Wilson. But we do need outside WR depth on this team.

I guess most people want the slot to be a guy who can kick outside if needed due to injury. I dont care about that depth coming from our slot WR spot.

Just get me a guy who can backup AJ or Smith if needed. We dont have that. 

26 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Based on some of the beats, it might not be long before DeJean is the nickel and Mitchell is CB2. I'm going to be a bear about it, but they have two starting outside CB that will be on the bench in Ringo and Rodgers. It's great to have depth but at the same time, there's a huge hole at WR3. As good as Smith and Brown are, the Eagles have absolutely no young depth at WR. Could we see one of Rodgers/Ringo moved?

Next year Mitchell is CB1 and one of Rodgers/Ringo is CB2. For Rodgers to be considered next year, he needs to be brought back on a new deal. I think it's a bit strange that Rodgers has been pulled from both games so fast considering he hasn't played in a year. I would think getting him more gameplay would be good to get him back up to speed.

Part of me thinks, they are either A. taking Rodgers out so he doesn't get hurt so they can try to trade him, or B. showcasing Ringo so teams can get more tape on him for a possible trade or C. I'm overthinking the entire thing, Rodgers has CB2 locked down and Ringo is just getting the normal reps he would as a back up in the preseason. I do think they have one too many starting CBs even though that sounds ridiculous. There's also DeJean and his potential at outside CB. Do they have a potential 5 outside starting caliber CB on the team?

Tyler Hall is now on IR. Nickel CB and backup Nickel are now open. They could always move Maddox back to the slot, but I think he's settling in at safety and it makes it easier to get rid of Bradberry. 

I also have a gut feeling they aren't ready to get rid of McPhearson yet.

I originally had them with 11 DB (including Brown on PUP). 

S- CJGJ, Blankenship, Maddox, McCollum

CB- Slay, Mitchell, Rodgers, Ringo, DeJean, McPhearson       If Rodgers/Ringo are moved CB- Slay, Mitchell, Ringo, DeJean, McPhearson, Ricks

Just spit balling as we hit the dog days here. 

I'm also wondering with Patrick Johnson and Jalyx Hunt looking better than expected, could Josh Sweat be moved for a WR3? I don't know what to make of Sweat. Is the the frustrating player who doesn't gets sacks and plays DE poorly or is he a force? He's not coming back after this year. 

Let me also say, I don't want to trade everyone. I'm just looking at a huge need in WR3 and positions where there are expiring contracts and or logjams with depth. I didn't think WR3 was that important until I watched the Eagles play the last 2 games without Smith and Brown and it was NOT good. They need someone who can offer a dynamic skillset as WR3 with Brown and Smith but also be able to step in if either had to miss time. 

 

Patrick Johnson balling in very late pre-season action is fools gold. Im not ready to trade one of our few proven pass rushers because Patrick Johnson is around. 

 

1 hour ago, bpac55 said:

 

 

Wentz might have a career renaissance with Andy.

Looking at Washington WR depth

McLaurin

Crowder

Dyami Brown

Zaccheus

Luke McCaffrey

Jahan Dotson

 

Probably one of those guys will hit the streets in a week.

31 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Based on some of the beats, it might not be long before DeJean is the nickel and Mitchell is CB2. I'm going to be a bear about it, but they have two starting outside CB that will be on the bench in Ringo and Rodgers. It's great to have depth but at the same time, there's a huge hole at WR3. As good as Smith and Brown are, the Eagles have absolutely no young depth at WR. Could we see one of Rodgers/Ringo moved?

Neither of these guys has actually proven that yet on the field in real games, so getting the value that you expect seems highly unlikely.   Slay is gone after this year, so you would be eliminating future young depth to get pennies on the dollar.  Not exactly a great way to build a roster for the long term.   If they could get good value back, then maybe that's a good move.   But, IMO, finding good CBs is harder than finding WRs.

Jordan Whittington is once again playing well for the rams. As well as one can likely possibly hope with Stetson Bennett at QB. That man is gonna have a long career in the league.

5/52 at halftime and excellent blocking skills.

1 hour ago, HazletonEagle said:

WR3 is likely fine between Campbell, Covey, and Wilson. But we do need outside WR depth on this team.

I guess most people want the slot to be a guy who can kick outside if needed due to injury. I dont care about that depth coming from our slot WR spot.

Just get me a guy who can backup AJ or Smith if needed. We dont have that. 

I don't care if they don't get a lot of touches. I'm looking for depth and development. AJ Brown and DeVonta Smith are top level talents. Goedert is a good tight end, but the next full season he plays will be his first. Saquon is a great RB, but we all have questions about his health and IF he plays a full season. After their top 4 weapons, the Eagles have next to nothing in the cupboard. Calcaterra, Gainwell, Shipley, Covey, Wilson. Those are next man up. 

The Eagles potentially have 5 CB who could be outside starting CB. At the very least 4. They have capable spot starters in Jobe and Ricks. If they can use some of that depth to acquire a young weapon for the offense, I'm all for it. 

 

 

They had the perfect backup QB at one point in time. 

 

4 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I don't care if they don't get a lot of touches. I'm looking for depth and development. AJ Brown and DeVonta Smith are top level talents. Goedert is a good tight end, but the next full season he plays will be his first. Saquon is a great RB, but we all have questions about his health and IF he plays a full season. After their top 4 weapons, the Eagles have next to nothing in the cupboard. Calcaterra, Gainwell, Shipley, Covey, Wilson. Those are next man up. 

The Eagles potentially have 5 CB who could be outside starting CB. At the very least 4. They have capable spot starters in Jobe and Ricks. If they can use some of that depth to acquire a young weapon for the offense, I'm all for it. 

Yeah, Id trade Jobe, and/or potentially Ringo or Rodgers.

We may be able to trade an OL also. And seem to have a QB to spare.

Howie should be able to make some moves.