39 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Also just the timing of everything in the 24 hours after the game just magnifies it all. You have Devin White retweeting Hurts sack/fumble. Rodgers being stupid and whiny. Slay reciting his profootballreference page. It's like a snowball rolling downhill and one thing after the next building on top of it. It gives off a "what the hell is going on in that locker room" vibe. 

To Slay:

 

13 minutes ago, NOTW said:

But he talks tough and calls out players in the media. He's old school. He's a real Philly guy!

Seems like the grievances of the dolphins players may have been justified 

11 minutes ago, NOTW said:

 

So we have a DC who doesn't speak to the other coaches, and has his own secret analytics that he doesn't share with anyone else, not even his HC or other defensive coaches.

So in turn the team doesn't inform him that a starting player has an illness heading into a game.

Standard. Culture. Accountability. Collaboration. These words are empty and meaningless.

Yea, I can kinda see now where the guys in Miami were coming from. Devin White also gave some curious quotes about Fangio. Paraphrasing but it was basically "Did Vic tell you that you were beat out for Nakobe?" "No, I haven't talked to Vic." "Did Vic tell you what you need to do to improve to earn playing time?" "No." "Nick says you have a role going forward and they are going to need you, did they describe to you what that role was?" "You're going to have to ask them".

It's kinda clear communication is missing on defense. 

Also being in the booth doesn't help that. I have no idea if it makes any strategical difference at all between field and booth, but if he's going to be holed up in there then he's going to miss stuff like knowing what's going on with his players. 

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Seems like the grievances of the dolphins players may have been justified 

If he were a great coach and the team were dominating, that's one thing. Still, you never throw your players under the bus. That hurts your relationship with the players. You give coach speak.

Chew them out in practice and meetings, be tough, hold them accountable. All that, yes. But no point in trashing people in the media. No one should do that.

14 minutes ago, NOTW said:

Culture. Character. Integrity. Leadership. Values. "The Standard." 

These are things they've valued for years. They don't have them under Sirianni. Period.

I would probably stop listening to the stupid core values chart too after years off the same messaging. Nick is going to do some self scouting over the bye and show up with a new poster.

1 minute ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Yea, I can kinda see now where the guys in Miami were coming from. Devin White also gave some curious quotes about Fangio. Paraphrasing but it was basically "Did Vic tell you that you were beat out for Nakobe?" "No, I haven't talked to Vic." "Did Vic tell you what you need to do to improve to earn playing time?" "No." "Nick says you have a role going forward and they are going to need you, did they describe to you what that role was?" "You're going to have to ask them".

It's kinda clear communication is missing on defense. 

Also being in the booth doesn't help that. I have no idea if it makes any strategical difference at all between field and booth, but if he's going to be holed up in there then he's going to miss stuff like knowing what's going on with his players. 

Feels like fangio is living off his past accomplishments. He should ask slay how to tweet about it. 

1 minute ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Yea, I can kinda see now where the guys in Miami were coming from. Devin White also gave some curious quotes about Fangio. Paraphrasing but it was basically "Did Vic tell you that you were beat out for Nakobe?" "No, I haven't talked to Vic." "Did Vic tell you what you need to do to improve to earn playing time?" "No." "Nick says you have a role going forward and they are going to need you, did they describe to you what that role was?" "You're going to have to ask them".

It's kinda clear communication is missing on defense. 

Also being in the booth doesn't help that. I have no idea if it makes any strategical difference at all between field and booth, but if he's going to be holed up in there then he's going to miss stuff like knowing what's going on with his players. 

Dang, I didn't read/hear that. That's terrible communication.

Hurts has given a lot of similar answers like you have to ask them, or I'm not sure, I don't know how to answer that. They don't want to talk about about anyone, but also can't answer questions when the coaches aren't even speaking to them or clarifying their role.

I wonder what the CEO of Culture will do about that?

4 minutes ago, NOTW said:

You're right. It's after a bad loss, and the optics are not good.

It's one thing to chuckle at it and then say something positive about him like "That's just pre-game getting hyped, everyone gets motivated in different ways. He always brings energy and trash talk, I love his swagger" and then follow up with "we didn't play well and lost, we all as a team have to play better." Just leave it at that. 

He was laughing his ass off too much. And now we've seen CJGJ's response, you know they're going to have words.

This is also where CEO of Culture Nick Sirianni should step in with all these guys. But we know he won't. He didn't last year, and this is a continuation.

I think the days are gone where the coach can make players run laps, do 100 push-ups, etc.  Not sure what meaningful tools coaches have now against players who are paid 10X their salary and more.  Playing time is one of their only chips.

Sirianni is another of the ‘emotional intelligence’ brand of modern head coaches who is a ‘players coach’.  These guys can set a culture and expectations, but when players don’t follow it, what are the remedies?

When the next head coach is brought in, the same issues will still be there.  As much as a head coach can do, it’s just as important or more to look at the leadership group among players to set the tone.

Cox and Kelce are gone.  Graham, Lane, and Mailata can do some of it — but guys like Hurts, AJ, Smith, Dickerson, etc. need to step forward and deal with this stuff also.

1 minute ago, Alphagrand said:

I think the days are gone where the coach can make players run laps, do 100 push-ups, etc.  Not sure what meaningful tools coaches have now against players who are paid 10X their salary and more.  Playing time is one of their only chips.

Sirianni is another of the ‘emotional intelligence’ brand of modern head coaches who is a ‘players coach’.  These guys can set a culture and expectations, but when players don’t follow it, what are the remedies?

When the next head coach is brought in, the same issues will still be there.  As much as a head coach can do, it’s just as important or more to look at the leadership group among players to set the tone.

Cox and Kelce are gone.  Graham, Lane, and Mailata can do some of it — but guys like Hurts, AJ, Smith, Dickerson, etc. need to step forward and deal with this stuff also.

You're right, the veteran leaders are part of it. Those are the guys that should get in their teammates faces and chew them out too. Unfortunately, Slay and CJGJ are the veterans in the backfield. I hope Q is paying attention...about what not to do.

The Head Coach doesn't lead by example. He's a fool who taunts other teams' fans, his young QB had to hold him back from going at the refs, he's immature. He wasn't ready to be a head coach. He wore silly t-shirts mocking teams, and then lost to those teams. 

He's not a leader of men. He speaks empty motivational phrases and then acts like a moron, and makes bad decisions.

You don't have to make them do push ups or run laps. Guys should respect a good coach and want to play hard for him.

8 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I would probably stop listening to the stupid core values chart too after years off the same messaging. Nick is going to do some self scouting over the bye and show up with a new poster.

Feels really fitting for the eagles (edit made it better)

18 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

I think the days are gone where the coach can make players run laps, do 100 push-ups, etc.  Not sure what meaningful tools coaches have now against players who are paid 10X their salary and more.  Playing time is one of their only chips.

Sirianni is another of the ‘emotional intelligence’ brand of modern head coaches who is a ‘players coach’.  These guys can set a culture and expectations, but when players don’t follow it, what are the remedies?

When the next head coach is brought in, the same issues will still be there.  As much as a head coach can do, it’s just as important or more to look at the leadership group among players to set the tone.

Cox and Kelce are gone.  Graham, Lane, and Mailata can do some of it — but guys like Hurts, AJ, Smith, Dickerson, etc. need to step forward and deal with this stuff also.

I don’t think anyone is expecting the coaches to "punish” players with "pushups” - that went out of style decades ago.

 

That said - Andy Reid (is without question) a "player’s coach” but you rarely, if ever, see the type of internal dysfunction that is apparently plaguing this team now - on his teams.

Other than maybe the "dream team” season, I don’t think Reid has ever let his team snowball out of control - which seems to be happening with this team - at least what it seems like from an external optics standpoint.

Now hopefully a lot of this is both media and fanbase over- reaction.   And maybe internally players/coaches are stepping up and dealing with it - the truth is we won’t know until after the bye week or for even for a few weeks after that.   

If this thing starts to really go south I can’t wait until we get all the leaks that come out of the organization that get put out there to the local beats and some national guys. Always happens. I’m guessing if they lose to the Browns, we’re gonna get some of that by week 7.

6 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

but guys like Hurts, AJ, Smith, Dickerson, etc. need to step forward and deal with this stuff also.

I think this is the key moving forward for PHI and a couple of other teams right now, there is just too much talking and not enough doing. The tough part about it is PHI has drafted some really, really good talent defensively (at least on paper, considering combine evals, pedigree, etc.) over the last few years. Those younger players are the most impressionable now...early in their career vs later. Yeh, they're pros and shouldn't have to be motivated, nurtured, etc., but iron sharpens iron, and when you lose leadership from those who set "the Standard" there will be fall off. Someone, at least one, if not two, from each side of the ball needs to be that leader for the young talent.

2 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

I don’t think anyone is expecting the coaches to "punish” players with "pushups” - that went out of style decades ago.

 

That said - Andy Reid (is without question) a "player’s coach” but you rarely, if ever, see the type of internal dysfunction that is apparently plaguing this team now - on his teams.

Other than the "dream team” season, I don’t think Reid has ever let his team snowball out of control - which seems to be happening with this team - at least what it seems like from an external optics standpoint.

Now hopefully a lot of this is both media and fanbase over- reaction.   And maybe internally players/coaches are stepping up and dealing with it - the truth is we won’t know until after the bye week or for even for a few weeks after that.   

The next four games on the schedule should be 4-0, or 3-1 at worst.  If the Eagles are a 4-4 team after the next 4 games it’ll be time to start baling water and throwing dead weight overboard 

Thing is with fangio, his defence was ripped to shreds and he’s a bit of a laughing stock. Will he done something different or keep doing the same thing. 
 

surely someone’s pride can only take so much before they say, I’m going to change things so I don’t look like an idiot 

As much as I can't believe I am saying this, but this team....needs Bill Belichick. Say what you will about him, his teams are always prepared. No chance they dump Nick during the season, but absent a massive turnaround, I'd give Bill whatever he wants this offseason so long as Howie keeps personnel control. I'd try and convince him to keep Moore instead of hiring McDaniels, but the defense is all his. 

I'd rather have Ben Johnson, because an elite offensive mind and play caller paired with your QB is the most important combo to have in the NFL. But Belichick might be #2 for me. If he was 62 instead of 72 he might be #1, but he's not. And if for whatever reason Johnson is a no go, then I'd only hire Belichick if his cronies aren't coming here with him. No McDaniels, no Joe Judge, no Patricia, etc.

2 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

As much as I can't believe I am saying this, but this team....needs Bill Belichick. Say what you will about him, his teams are always prepared. No chance they dump Nick during the season, but absent a massive turnaround, I'd give Bill whatever he wants this offseason so long as Howie keeps personnel control. I'd try and convince him to keep Moore instead of hiring McDaniels, but the defense is all his. 

Couple things, I actually think Belichick is going to wind up with the giants. I think that’s where he ultimately wants to be because he kind of started his whole career there. he has a lot of respect for the Giants. I think defensively they actually have a lot of pieces that you could make a good defense. Burns, Lawrence, Thibs and Banks. Add on have Nabers and Thomas. They are going to be bad. If they get a QB on a rookie deal and it’s who belichick wants they have money to make the team much better around him.

Also, I am not sold that the Eagles would go after Belichick over somebody like Ben Johnson. Lurie hasn’t hired a defense coach since Ray Rhodes. I get belichick has a pedigree and he’s from the patriots. But I tend to think Lurie believes offense is the name of the game and wants his next HC to be an offensive mastermind like Reid. I tend to think he would lean to Ben Johnson candidate or an offense of mind like that. That said i don’t know if Ben Johnson wants to come here because I think he goes to the place where he believes in the Wb or can pick his own Qb 

49 minutes ago, DaEagles4Life said:

Just awesome 

Again, just another scenario of Slay not being able to read the room and having zero sense of how the optics come across. 

Saquon was supposed to be on the Dan Patrick Show the Tuesday after he had the drop against Atlanta. He canceled that spot and decided to come on the week after when they beat New Orleans. That's a guy who understands how to read the room and knows that it's not best to be in the public light after a loss. It's really just common sense stuff that he has and Slay does not. 

Yeah throw a bag at Ben Johnson. That's a guy who can legit turn things around. Bill's shtick won't work as well on a new team who doesn't care about anything he did in NE.

2 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

I'd rather have Ben Johnson, because an elite offensive mind and play caller paired with your QB is the most important combo to have in the NFL. But Belichick might be #2 for me. If he was 62 instead of 72 he might be #1, but he's not. And if for whatever reason Johnson is a no go, then I'd only hire Belichick if his cronies aren't coming here with him. No McDaniels, no Joe Judge, no Patricia, etc.

 

Just now, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Couple things, I actually think Belichick is going to wind up with the giants. I think that’s where he ultimately wants to be because he kind of started his whole career there. he has a lot of respect for the Giants. I think defensively they actually have a lot of pieces that you could make a good defense. Burns, Lawrence, Thibs and Banks. Add on have Nabers and Thomas. They are going to be bad. If they get a QB on a rookie deal and it’s who belichick wants they have money to make the team much better around him.

Also, I am not sold that the Eagles would go after Belichick over somebody like Ben Johnson. Lurie hasn’t hired a defense coach since Ray Rhodes. I get belichick has a pedigree and he’s from the patriots. But I tend to think Lurie believes offense is the name of the game and wants his next HC to be an offensive mastermind like Reid. I tend to think he would lean to Ben Johnson candidate or an offense of mind like that. That said i don’t know if Ben Johnson wants to come here because I think he goes to the place where he believes in the Wb or can pick his own Qb 

My reasoning for getting Bill is the team is an undisciplined mess. I'm not sure another young HC with no experience will be able to get it under control. Belichick has the cache to make the hard decisions and hold guys accountable. 

For instance -- Slay should be benched for Rodgers or Ringo. He's a headache and not playing well. A young coach may not have the balls to do it, but Bill would.

 

1 minute ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

Again, just another scenario of Slay not being able to read the room and having zero sense of how the optics come across. 

Saquon was supposed to be on the Dan Patrick Show the Tuesday after he had the drop against Atlanta. He canceled that spot and decided to come on the week after when they beat New Orleans. That's a guy who understands how to read the room and knows that it's not best to be in the public light after a loss. It's really just common sense stuff that he has and Slay does not. 

I think slay has common sense. I just don’t think he cares. I think he got paid last year and at this point it he’s over it and just doing whatever he wants. He’s a crap leader. Frankly should’ve given his C to smith 

I'd also think about Vrabel. We have the talent. We need someone to hold these guys accountable.

1 minute ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Yeah throw a bag at Ben Johnson. That's a guy who can legit turn things around. Bill's shtick won't work as well on a new team who doesn't care about anything he did in NE.

I just want someone to be mean to the players for me.  I am sure Ben Johnson will be number 1 on everyone's list.  I would wonder if he would want to come to Philly.  

8 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

I don’t think anyone is expecting the coaches to "punish” players with "pushups” - that went out of style decades ago.

The only way to really get the attention of a player in todays game is to fine them heavier, suspend them, or straight cut them. Unfortunately cutting a player now days is extremely difficult to do because of cap implications for most every team.

The NFLPA and the players have way too much control and have for some time now. I agree they should be compensated fairly based on their contributions and the amount of money the owners make, but along with the $ comes accountability. Too many players are worried about too many off the field endeavors these days, podcasts, social media, endorsements, etc. Some guys can handle that and get their job done, others need to have as few distractions as possible.

Pretty much everything stated in the above paragraph leads to a much poorer product on the field in a variety of ways. The discipline is slowly fading out of the game imo and the result is becoming acceptable...by the players, use to be the players were the ones holding the team accountable.