44 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Eventually, they are going to leak VanSumeren into the flat in the red zone for a TD.

That’s just what I was thinking.  Can’t remember who it was but in the Eli years, the giants had a FB that would kill the Eagles with just that play on third down.  We have a super athletic LB/FB.  A 231 lb FB with 4.4 speed. Play with that more Kellen. 

9 minutes ago, Mike31mt said:

I think this might be one of those Dick Vermeil "you think you know, but you don't know...and you never will" moments.

I agree it looked totally obvious.  The tough part is that Saquon was the only route on that side of the field, so if the Giants defended it properly, the play was dead.  No way Hurts could have made it all the way back to the other side of the field in the red zone, it would make for an extremely risky throw.

They may want to look at tweaking that play in the future though, no doubt.

Tsk tsk... wrong Philadelphia coach from the 80s.   That was Jim Mora, Sr!   

 

You are right... but in real time, that's where my head was... so I assumed the QB would see what I was seeing, even if it was a figment of my own imagination.

1 hour ago, vikas83 said:

OK, I woke up and chose violence. 

Hurts is reminding me of...Donovan McNabb. There are plays that drive you nuts, and then plays that simply amaze you. The difference is, I think Hurts is clearly more dedicated to improving than McNabb ever was, but McNabb was clearly more physically gifted. And to be clear, I am a McNabb fan.

6 games in to a new offense, we are seeing improvement. Hopefully it continues. 

I'm not seeing McNabb at all. Donovan played with garbage around him at WR. Donovan was capable of making the players around him better. I've yet to see that with Hurts. What proof do we have that Hurts is dedicated to improving? He loves to lift weights. The issues he has are the same he's had since his rookie year so I'm not sure we can say he's really improved all of that much. He's got a great deep ball, always has. I don't think his progressions or pocket awareness have improved at all and that's the biggest issue with him. 

14 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I'll say one criticism of Hurts and then will wait until next week.

If you were to subtract QB and rank the 32 best 10 man non-QB offenses in the NFL...

The Eagles are #1.  Who is #2 and how big is the gap?  Miami?

We have the #17 scoring offense in the NFL.  What does that say about the QB?  It's going to make everyone wonder what this offense would look like with a different QB and what this QB would look like with a different offense.

Good point! And we don’t have to wonder, it’s pretty obvious. He is clearly holding back this offense from being dynamic. 

OK, how do we defend this one? The people in the comments are saying he was smart for avoiding injury??? There's a perfect pocket to step up in to. If no, there's a huge lane to the right. How is giving yourself up on the play at all defensible?

 

 

15 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I'll say one criticism of Hurts and then will wait until next week.

If you were to subtract QB and rank the 32 best 10 man non-QB offenses in the NFL...

The Eagles are #1.  Who is #2 and how big is the gap?  Miami?

We have the #17 scoring offense in the NFL.  What does that say about the QB?  It's going to make everyone wonder what this offense would look like with a different QB and what this QB would look like with a different offense.

Detroit would be #2.  Great OL.  Several weapons.

6 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Tsk tsk... wrong Philadelphia coach from the 80s.   That was Jim Mora, Sr!   

 

You are right... but in real time, that's where my head was... so I assumed the QB would see what I was seeing, even if it was a figment of my own imagination.

Good call, total brain fart on the Mora reference 

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

OK, how do we defend this one? The people in the comments are saying he was smart for avoiding injury??? There's a perfect pocket to step up in to. If no, there's a huge lane to the right. How is giving yourself up on the play at all defensible?

 

 

You can't even see the WRs in the frame, how can we judge who or may not be open from this? Though I will say that giving yourself up like that will make any coach lose their F'ing ish. Make the defense earn their sacks, FFS.

5 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Detroit would be #2.  Great OL.  Several weapons.

To this point...

After Ragnow, is there an NFC center better than Jurgens right now?  

McCoy and Dalman are injured.  Bradbury and Biadasz are OK.

22 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I'll say one criticism of Hurts and then will wait until next week.

If you were to subtract QB and rank the 32 best 10 man non-QB offenses in the NFL...

The Eagles are #1.  Who is #2 and how big is the gap?  Miami?

We have the #17 scoring offense in the NFL.  What does that say about the QB?  It's going to make everyone wonder what this offense would look like with a different QB and what this QB would look like with a different offense.

Fred Johnson and Grant Calcaterra doing a lot of heavy lifting here in your analysis. 

29 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I'll say one criticism of Hurts and then will wait until next week.

If you were to subtract QB and rank the 32 best 10 man non-QB offenses in the NFL...

The Eagles are #1.  Who is #2 and how big is the gap?  Miami?

We have the #17 scoring offense in the NFL.  What does that say about the QB?  It's going to make everyone wonder what this offense would look like with a different QB and what this QB would look like with a different offense.

Now take into account that Brown, Smith, both tackles, and Goedert have missed games. Some multiple games and some games multiple players at a time.

 

2 hours ago, austinfan said:

Given the poor pass blocking

He had on average 3.6 seconds to throw on his 14 passes. Not sure why you keep saying this.

Some of the sacks were self inflicted.

1 hour ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

Actually if you look what the Giants and Browns did to the Bengals full strength offense, it's not out of the question they could hold them to 220 - 250.

True. 21 points against the Browns yesterday is not impressive at all. 

Lol

 

1 hour ago, vikas83 said:

OK, I woke up and chose violence. 

Hurts is reminding me of...Donovan McNabb. There are plays that drive you nuts, and then plays that simply amaze you. The difference is, I think Hurts is clearly more dedicated to improving than McNabb ever was, but McNabb was clearly more physically gifted. And to be clear, I am a McNabb fan.

6 games in to a new offense, we are seeing improvement. Hopefully it continues. 

We are not seeing improvement. Where do you think you are seeing improvement?

1 hour ago, vikas83 said:

He's also just played his 6th game in a new offense. It's not like he's been running the same system for 5 years.

But people keep arguing the offense looks no different and Sirianni keeps meddling.

Which is it?

15 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

OK, how do we defend this one? The people in the comments are saying he was smart for avoiding injury??? There's a perfect pocket to step up in to. If no, there's a huge lane to the right. How is giving yourself up on the play at all defensible?

 

 

I think that one demonstrates Hurts' propensity to escape to the right, rather than step up into the pocket.  It looks to me like he sees Burns about to get past Fred Johnson, takes a quick glance right and sees the other DE has outside leverage on Lane, and the play is over.

Not what you want to see from a 5th year QB, for sure.    

Just now, jsb235 said:

Fred Johnson and Grant Calcaterra doing a lot of heavy lifting here in your analysis. 

How much lifting is Calcaterra capable of?

 

Seriously, he's been getting a lot criticism for his blocking.  But at least he is willing to throw his body into the challenge.

A nice, unbiased breakdown.

 

55 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I conceded that in the post.  But, if he's completely useless against the pass... then he's not worthy of a first round pick, and definitely not worth trading up for.  Pretty one dimensional.  

That’s a tad inaccurate.  His role is different than you are projecting.  With his size and strength, when he is in he draws a double team a significant amount of the time. When he is out it is Carter that usually draws the double team.  He has some flaws in his game.  He needs to not get straight up when blocked and he needs to raise his arms more.  That’s training and developing habits.  But if he draws double teams and raises his arms when passes are on his side, I will take that 100% of the time if it means Milton, Ojomo or (and especially) Carter get single blocking.   Because that is his role.   He’s our Hollis Thomas.  Mountain of a man that is strong as an ox.   With Davis’ athleticism (compared to Thomas), it is a huge risk for any team to single him even if the G is Dickerson or even Becton sized. (Speaking of not playing to upright, Becton at 363 has shown decent crouch for such a big man.). 

1 hour ago, we_gotta_believe said:

@Wentz_Era & @Iggles_Phan

I've watched the goal line miss to Barkley again from the ESP tweet and it's not as egregious of a mistake as I thought watching live, or at least, it's far less egregious than Hurts missing Smitty on the drag on that 3rd and 2. On the 3rd and 2 play where Kenny runs a wheel, Smitty is almost certainly the 2nd, or at the very least 3rd read, in the progression. Like I'd bet a large sum of money on it based on the play design. The defense is in man and Smitty comes free late, but it should have been anticipated based on the coverage. You can clearly see there's plenty of open space that was vacated by Kenny dragging the defender deep. With a clean pocket and decent protection, Hurts really has gotta come off his primary read quicker to find Smitty there. There's just no excuse for Hurts not pulling the trigger. None. F- play from Hurts.

On the Saquon wheel at the goal line, based on the field position and route concepts, I'd be shocked if Saquon was even the 3rd read (seems like he's 4th in the progression but I'm not as sure). What's very clear is that he's definitely not the first read and there's not much in the defensive alignment pre-snap that would tell Hurts to deviate to read him first. The play design also makes it clear that Barkley should NOT have delayed his release as I intially assumed, becase it's the same route combo as the 3rd and 2 play from earlier. The progression seems to be different but TEs are still running dig/curl, with the RB running a wheel to peel back the flat/hook defender. However, the concept doesnt work as well here because the defense is in a flatter coverage in zone and the wheel wasn't even the primary read (this tracks logically based on the compressed spacing near the goal line.) And when your LT is beat like a drum instantly after the snap, it makes sense why he never got a chance to progress beyond his 1st or 2nd read in this case. I'm willing to walk back my criticism of both Hurts and Barkley here. Hurts wanted to hit the TEs and then Smitty but they're all covered and he just doesn't have time. This is actually just a well called coverage by the Giants and the majority of the blame is on Johnson who became the single point of failure on this play. C+ play from Hurts. 

Did you notice though, that the defender with the RB responsibility IMMEDIATELY gets sucked inside which should have been an instant giveaway to Hurts that A. His primary read on that play just got more defenders in their space, and B, that wheel was now left uncovered. It should have been an immediate reaction to throw it over there as soon as that LB or S moved inside at the snap. 

5 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

A nice, unbiased breakdown.

 

The first one Jalen really needs to be making that pass to Smith. The second one I think they said on commentary that a defensive player possibly blocks Hurts sight to Barkley.

8 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

We are not seeing improvement. Where do you think you are seeing improvement?

Hurts work ethic hasn't been questioned, the results have. 

McNabb wasn't exactly known for his work ethic.

28 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

OK, how do we defend this one? The people in the comments are saying he was smart for avoiding injury??? There's a perfect pocket to step up in to. If no, there's a huge lane to the right. How is giving yourself up on the play at all defensible?

 

 

According to Afan, Hurts was intentionally getting sacked rather than trying to make plays in fear of turning the ball over, but is also criticizing the pass blocking despite Hurts having 3.6 seconds on average to throw.

So, there you have it. Try to make sense of that