31 minutes ago, no1birdsfan said:

Fing Rick Tocchet is your next coach

Nah I don’t think so

Breaking News! The Flyers are closing in on hiring Flyers Hall of Famer Rick Tocchet as their new head coach, according to

@frank_seravalli

…like I said

1 hour ago, no1birdsfan said:

Breaking News! The Flyers are closing in on hiring Flyers Hall of Famer Rick Tocchet as their new head coach, according to

@frank_seravalli

…like I said

Another terrible coaching hire; I can't imagine why they wouldn't have interviewed better candidates. Tocchet has a terrible track record as a head coach, from his stint in Tampa Bay and Arizona. He had one good season of results in Vancouver, then promptly lost the locker room this past season by publicly calling the players soft and questioning their effort in the press.

I don't even want to start on the gambling and subsequent league suspension, then the lengthened suspension because he didn't follow the original terms of the suspension agreement. I was shocked when he got the head coaching job in Vancouver. Frustration and dismay at this news.

Why not hire Gerard Gallant?? Look at his track record and compare it to Tocchet. I can only assume the Flyers organization is seen as a place not to go; Trotz turned them down last time -- maybe others did this time as well.

The President, GM, and now the head coach are Flyers alum. 🤣

I cannot describe how much I hate the Flyers front office. Tocchet is a bonafide below average coach with no measurable success and tons of baggage. But sure, give him $25M to coach the team over the next 5 years. Same as it ever was.

> "During this process it became clear that Rick was the absolute right coach to lead our team. He has enjoyed the highest level of success both as a player and coach. Rick’s ability to teach and understand his players, combined with his passion for winning, brings out the best in young players at different stages of their development and has earned the respect and confidence of highly talented All-Stars and veteran players alike.”

Just read the press release by the team. How delusional can they be? What success has he had as a coach? Jack Adam's award last year? Yay. When I think of coaching success, I consider playoff success in which he has won exactly 1 playoff series in his 9 years as coach, missing the playoffs entirely in 7 of them.

Then it talks about how he relates to the younger players. Didn't the players rebel against him which is why he didn't stay on with Vancouver? Talk of the Flyers being interested in Tocchet was brought up way back in February by people that cover the team. Either they did a half assed process, or maybe they did offer the job to another candidate or candidates and they didn't want the job. Either way, not a good look for the organization.

1 hour ago, vsptroops said:

> "During this process it became clear that Rick was the absolute right coach to lead our team. He has enjoyed the highest level of success both as a player and coach. Rick’s ability to teach and understand his players, combined with his passion for winning, brings out the best in young players at different stages of their development and has earned the respect and confidence of highly talented All-Stars and veteran players alike.”

Just read the press release by the team. How delusional can they be? What success has he had as a coach? Jack Adam's award last year? Yay. When I think of coaching success, I consider playoff success in which he has won exactly 1 playoff series in his 9 years as coach, missing the playoffs entirely in 7 of them.

Then it talks about how he relates to the younger players. Didn't the players rebel against him which is why he didn't stay on with Vancouver? Talk of the Flyers being interested in Tocchet was brought up way back in February by people that cover the team. Either they did a half assed process, or maybe they did offer the job to another candidate or candidates and they didn't want the job. Either way, not a good look for the organization.

Tocchet has been a candidate to coach this team every time they were looking for a coach. This is what this org does, and it's why they can't win. Gerard Gallant would be an amazing hire, they should've brought him on years ago

7 hours ago, vsptroops said:

The President, GM, and now the head coach are Flyers alum. 🤣

Who never won anything with the team. What can go wrong?

2 hours ago, devpool said:

Tocchet has been a candidate to coach this team every time they were looking for a coach. This is what this org does, and it's why they can't win. Gerard Gallant would be an amazing hire, they should've brought him on years ago

Yeah, just when you have hope they can change their way of operating they go right back to the same crap.

Look, we all hope to be proven wrong and Tocchet has huge success. Lord knows Flyers fans deserve to have a Stanley Cup contender to cheer for. However, if he fails, this should cost Briere and Jones their jobs.

Here's an article from Charlie O' Connor from ALLPHLY. It's a good read.

Rick Tocchet’s NHL head coaching resume is a fascinating example of how one’s perspective impacts their interpretation of a set of facts.

So to quote an early 1990s legal drama, these are the facts of the case, and they are undisputed.

Tocchet has been an NHL head coach for 638 regular season games, and 22 more in the playoffs. He’s won 286 of those games (11 more in the playoffs). He has a career points percentage of 0.517, which would put his teams on pace to finish with about 85 standings points per year in an 82-game schedule. His teams have made the playoffs twice in nine head coaching seasons (seven full seasons), winning a playoff series and then losing a playoff series in each run. He won the Jack Adams Award for the 2023-24 season, given to the NHL’s best coach as voted upon by league broadcasters.

These are the facts of the case, and they are undisputed. Yet how one interprets those facts — specifically in evaluating Tocchet’s quality as a coach — is very much in dispute.

In the estimation of the Philadelphia Flyers, however, they very much are not. Hiring Tocchet as their 25th head coach in team history — as they did on Wednesday — stands as straighforward of an endorsement that can possibly by given — aside from the whopping five-year, $25 million contract that he secured, per OnPattison’s Anthony SanFilippo. Notably, it would be a near-identical deal to the one that then-Flyers general manager Chuck Fletcher gave to Alain Vigneault for the same job back in 2019.

But Vigneault’s head coaching resume back in 2019 did not mirror Tocchet’s track record today. It was far stronger. Vigneault also had a Jack Adams Award to his credit, but he also had two Stanley Cup Final berths, 648 career wins (would tie him for 18th in NHL history today), a career points percentage of 0.611, and 11 playoff appearances in 16 seasons.

Tocchet… doesn’t have that.

So why would the Flyers prioritize Tocchet — and apparently pay top-of-the-market value — for him anyway? Because they share what appears to be the consensus stance of the hockey world at large. That when viewed with the proper lens and focus, Tocchet’s resume does warrant that kind of treatment.

Feb 6, 2024; Raleigh, North Carolina, USA; Vancouver Canucks head coach Rick Tocchet talks to his players against the Carolina Hurricanes during the second period at PNC Arena. Mandatory Credit: James Guillory-USA TODAY Sports

Which brings us back to perspective. Tocchet’s fans within the game — and there are many — swear by him. They rave about his demeanor, his hockey knowledge, and his ability to connect with players. His detractors — and there also also many, largely outside the game — simply don’t understand the fascination with a coach who has never made it past the second round and has only one season to his credit that qualifies as an undeniable success.

The result is that two people — one positively predisposed toward Tocchet, and one on the negative side — can look at the same set of facts and draw wildly different conclusions.

Let’s start with Tocchet’s overall record. On the surface, 286 wins and a 0.517 career point percentage is not terribly impressive. In fact, it’s comparable to two former Flyers coaches who certainly won’t evoke positive memories from fans — Mike Yeo (263 wins, 0.542 points percentage) and Dave Hakstol (241 wins, 0.527 points percentage). Detractors of Tocchet will not unreasonably call it a middle-of-the-road resume at best.

Tocchet’s supporters, which clearly include the Flyers now? They’ll point to the nature of his past opportunities.

For his first job, he took over a Tampa Bay club in 2008-09 that was months removed from picking No. 1 overall, and days removed from the disastrous and abbreviated Barry Melrose tenure. Then, after a very successful run as assistant in Pittsburgh (winning two Stanley Cups in the process), he took over a mess of an Arizona club bereft of talent on the ice and in the midst of an ownership change and arena squabble off of it. As for Vancouver, he joined an organization that had missed the playoffs in seven of the previous eight seasons and was flailing in the mud.

Dinging Tocchet for not putting up a stellar record in those circumstances is supremely unfair, the thinking goes.

Then, there’s his minimal playoff experience. Tocchet has only made the postseason twice as a head coach, and one of those times was in 2019-20, when COVID-19 put a halt to the season and the NHL expanded the playoffs to 12 teams per conference. Arizona, as the 11-seed in the West when the pause took effect, got in. Absent that unique situation, Tocchet would have all of one single season that ended in a playoff berth as a head coach. Yikes.

But now let’s put on those Tocchet-positive glasses again. No one was making the playoffs with those late 00s Lightning clubs, for starters — they were in the very early stages of a full-fledged rebuild, and even then, Tocchet only lost his job because new ownership cleaned house when they bought the team. Yes, it’s true Tocchet only made the playoffs once with Arizona, and it was the COVID year. But he did push a talent-deficient club to two seasons with mid-80s standings point total pace, coming up just four points shy of a berth in 2018-19 and remaining in the traditional eight-team mix with 12 games to go in 2019-20 before the pause.

As for Vancouver? One playoff berth out of three seasons may look bad at first glance. But in Year 1, Tocchet coached the Canucks to a points pace of 100 after taking over for Dave Tippett with 36 games remaining — tough to blame their postseason absence on Tocchet there. And as disappointing as Year 3 was, Vancouver still finished with 90 points, their fourth-best pace of the previous ten seasons. With Tocchet in charge, the Canucks paced for 100 points (in an 82-game season) across a 200-game sample size — a strong track record, and one that the Canucks clearly took into account when making their aggressive pitch last month to Tocchet to try and keep him in the fold.

The disagreements only continue.

Apr 13, 2023; Tempe, Arizona, USA; Vancouver Canuck head coach Rick Tocchet watches game action in the first period against the Arizona Coyotes at Mullett Arena. Mandatory Credit: Matt Kartozian-USA TODAY Sports

The Coyotes playoff season of 2019-20? A fake playoff berth driven by COVID, say one group. A club with Nick Schmaltz, a 21-year old Clayton Keller and Christian Dvorak as its top scorers, says the other, and one that Tocchet nevertheless coached to an upset wild-card round win over 6-seed Nashville in the bubble.

The Jack Adams year in 2023-24? A testament to his coaching acumen, given the dramatic year-over-year improvement and strong underlying metrics (ninth in all-situations xG share, per Evolving-Hockey), say Tocchet’s fans. Nay, fire back the detractors — a product of Thatcher Demko (0.918 save percentage in 51 games) and a sky-high, unsustainable team shooting percentage (10.63 percent — first in the NHL).

The disappointing 2024-25 campaign? It’s proof that Tocchet can’t handle a tough locker room situation (the J.T. Miller/Elias Pettersson drama) without letting it devolve into a season-wrecking disaster — or a long-standing player-on-player feud that predated Tocchet and never could have been resolved by any coach.

And the debate goes on, and on, on.

Some big-name coaches come with unimpeachable resumes, consisting of multiple titles, yearly playoff berths, and stellar career win/loss records. Those coaches wouldn’t inspire such a debate. Tocchet, however, isn’t one of those coaches. It’s a hire that requires trust — trust both in Tocchet’s underlying coaching expertise, and in the Flyers’ ability to accurately recognize it.

And to be clear — the Flyers didn’t just hire Tocchet because they believe in the rosiest interpretation of his head coaching resume. Surely, the personal connection between Tocchet, the Flyers braintrust and the organization as a whole played a role. Tocchet’s reputation as a teacher and developer of young talent — dating back to his work with Steven Stamkos in 2009-10 during his first 50-goal season — surely helped. His strong relationships as a coach with star players like Sidney Crosby, Quinn Hughes and Phil Kessel was almost certainly part of it, given the raw upside of Matvei Michkov in particular.

But the belief in a positive interpretation of Tocchet’s existing head coaching track record clearly was there as well. A organization doesn’t make a coach one of the highest paid in the league simply based on prior friendships and positive recommendations.

"During this process it became clear that Rick was the absolute right coach to lead our team,” general manager Daniel Briere said in the press release announcing the hire. "He has enjoyed the highest level of success both as a player and coach.”

As a head coach? Jack Adams notwithstanding, it’s pretty difficult to argue that Tocchet has indeed reached that level. He hasn’t won a Stanley Cup; he hasn’t even been to hockey’s final four. He’s rarely even coached in the playoffs.

At least not yet. With this hire, the Flyers are betting that it’s just a matter of time before Tocchet’s actual head coaching track record matches their (and the hockey world at large’s) clearly very-high estimation of him.

And that fact is undisputed.

I give full credit to Couts for not laughing when Briere told him "he's done a wonderful job with a few teams".

13 hours ago, vsptroops said:

For his first job, he took over a Tampa Bay club in 2008-09 that was months removed from picking No. 1 overall, and days removed from the disastrous and abbreviated Barry Melrose tenure. Then, after a very successful run as assistant in Pittsburgh (winning two Stanley Cups in the process), he took over a mess of an Arizona club bereft of talent on the ice and in the midst of an ownership change and arena squabble off of it. As for Vancouver, he joined an organization that had missed the playoffs in seven of the previous eight seasons and was flailing in the mud.

Dinging Tocchet for not putting up a stellar record in those circumstances is supremely unfair, the thinking goes.

Not buying it at all.

You can't give Tocchet credit for Steve Stamkos; he was a #1 overall pick who scored 50 goals as a 19 year-old, and credits Gary Roberts for getting him into better physical condition and honing the elements of his game that needed improvement. After Tocchet was fired Stamkos produced just fine under Guy Boucher. Did Tocchet do a better job with the Lightning than his replacement, Guy Boucher? Probably not. Did he do a better job than Jon Cooper? Not even close.

In Arizona would they tell you Tocchet is a better head coach than Dave Tippett? I seriously doubt it. Is he a better coach than their current guy, Andre Tourigny? I'm betting most Coyotes fans (5 out of the 9 of them) would tell you there isn't much difference.

48 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

Not buying it at all.

You can't give Tocchet credit for Steve Stamkos; he was a #1 overall pick who scored 50 goals as a 19 year-old, and credits Gary Roberts for getting him into better physical condition and honing the elements of his game that needed improvement. After Tocchet was fired Stamkos produced just fine under Guy Boucher. Did Tocchet do a better job with the Lightning than his replacement, Guy Boucher? Probably not. Did he do a better job than Jon Cooper? Not even close.

In Arizona would they tell you Tocchet is a better head coach than Dave Tippett? I seriously doubt it. Is he a better coach than their current guy, Andre Tourigny? I'm betting most Coyotes fans (5 out of the 9 of them) would tell you there isn't much difference.

Yeah I get it. To be honest, my biggest fear is that he turns them into a dump and chase team, which would be horrible for Michkov. It's almost comical how the Flyers can't seem to help themselves from being talked about as being the same old Flyers.

1 hour ago, vsptroops said:

Yeah I get it. To be honest, my biggest fear is that he turns them into a dump and chase team, which would be horrible for Michkov. It's almost comical how the Flyers can't seem to help themselves from being talked about as being the same old Flyers.

I've listened to a few podcasts since I don't follow the team nearly as closely as I used to. The consensus seems to be he coaches a system nothing like he used to play and that he values an offensive system where the centre has increased importance, as well as wanting the defencemen joining the offensive rush more frequently to contribute points.

That sounds fine for Drysdale and Andrae -- we'll see if they can develop in Tocchet's system. The Flyers have nothing at centre, though, which will pose a big problem. Are they using 32 year-old Couturier as their #1 centre full time? Do they have any cap room to attract a top 6 free agent centre? One can assume they'll be drafting C at #6 overall (barring a trade-up), but there is a lot of work to be done with the roster before they can play the system Tocchet apparently wants.

Meh. Whatever.

Provide me with Talent, then after you get that, Coaching matters.

Note -- I am an idiot who knows nothing about anything.

16 hours ago, LacesOut said:

Meh. Whatever.

Provide me with Talent, then after you get that, Coaching matters.

Note -- I am an idiot who knows nothing about anything.

Yep, they need what they haven't had in over a decade. Elite level talent. Michkov looks like the real deal and hopefully Luchanko can be a high end scoring guy as well. It'll be interesting to see who they get at 6 this year.

4 hours ago, vsptroops said:

Yep, they need what they haven't had in over a decade. Elite level talent. Michkov looks like the real deal and hopefully Luchanko can be a high end scoring guy as well. It'll be interesting to see who they get at 6 this year.

The board actually sets up for them pretty well in that the top 10 prospects are riddled with centres. It'll be a matter of picking and developing the right one. I'm coming around on James Hagens -- really good passer as well as having a heavy shot; I think he has 1st line centre potential. Frondell scares me a bit due to a lower level of competition.

Of what was on the coaching market, we probably did about as good as we could do. We went outside the org once for a GM and twice for coaches. Didn't really work out too well.

I think we all got a little burnt out from the Homer years, but IMO Homer's disastrous moves late in his tenure were more for Snyder pushing him to try and get one more cup before he passed. Before Snyder started pulling the strings more, Homer did put together a few pretty good teams and we had good coaches.

Briere isn't Homer nor is he Hextall, so we're not going to see a whole bunch of crazy moves and offer sheets. He spent a bunch of time getting rid of players to get picks and cap space.

This team is going to be rebuilding for at least another season or two. FA in 2026 is stacked, so we're not going to know what kind of a team we have until we go into the 26-27 season. One thing going for us is that Briere set us up to have a really big chunk of cap space available for the summer of 26.

In other words, the dish is in the oven and we're not going to know what we're eating for awhile.

On 5/17/2025 at 11:09 AM, Bill said:

Of what was on the coaching market, we probably did about as good as we could do. We went outside the org once for a GM and twice for coaches. Didn't really work out too well.

I think we all got a little burnt out from the Homer years, but IMO Homer's disastrous moves late in his tenure were more for Snyder pushing him to try and get one more cup before he passed. Before Snyder started pulling the strings more, Homer did put together a few pretty good teams and we had good coaches.

Briere isn't Homer nor is he Hextall, so we're not going to see a whole bunch of crazy moves and offer sheets. He spent a bunch of time getting rid of players to get picks and cap space.

This team is going to be rebuilding for at least another season or two. FA in 2026 is stacked, so we're not going to know what kind of a team we have until we go into the 26-27 season. One thing going for us is that Briere set us up to have a really big chunk of cap space available for the summer of 26.

In other words, the dish is in the oven and we're not going to know what we're eating for awhile.

I’d have been much happier with Gerard Gallant, but we’ll see how this goes. The Flyers have committed 5 highly paid years to Tocchet, so he’ll be the guy for at least 3 years — one would think.

I’ll take an interest in the draft for the first time in many years. If they stay at #6 my preference is Hagens, or Desnoyers if Hagens is gone. I assume Schafer, Misa and Martone will be taken already. Not too excited about McQueen or Frondell as picks.

They have enough draft capital to make a splash and move up. Would have been a lot easier from the #4 spot but the lottery kind of screwed them on that.

I'm thinking trade-up at the draft is the way to go; make two picks in the top 10. Stay at #6 overall and take Desnoyers or Frondell for C (Hagens would be even better), then package up picks 22, 40, and 45 to move back up to #9 or 10 overall. Take the best available d-man on the board. I'm hoping Jackson Smith is there; excellent skater with size who would fit Tocchet's system of activating the defenseman into the rush to create offense.

Come out of the draft with one of the top 3 centres and one of the top 3 defensemen. Still have picks 30 in the first round, and 36 and 48 in the 2nd round to work with. Need a trade partner, of course, but I'd be surprised if this isn't the draft strategy.