The short term issue with Hurts is mobility and the injury.  Outside of those two issues, we are complaining because of the "what if" for this offense.  But no one is suggesting benching him...outside of the injury issue.

If this injury gives Hurts a Matt Stafford level of mobility...I don't think he's playable.  

25 minutes ago, 315Eagles said:

As much as Hurts has his flaws as a passer, I thought there was a strong possibility that if Moore came back next year as OC that the offense might open up some more and Hurts might be more comfortable in it, like in year 2 under Steichen.

If Moore leaves then it's gonna be OC  number 4 in 5 years for Hurts.

I liked that theory and really would love to test it out.

I guess most likely it seems there will be another new OC, and this will help perpetuate the Hurtscuses.

23 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Rules folks, if Goedert had caught that screen behind the LOS would that eliminate any potential illegal man downfield? I saw someone blame Goedert for that reason, saying he should have stayed behind the LOS. 

 

20 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Yea, there is no illegal man downfield if the pass doesn't cross the LOS.

Here's the rule...

Section 3 - Ineligible Player Downfield

Article 1. Legal And Illegal Acts

On a scrimmage play during which a legal forward pass is thrown, it is a foul if the entire body of an ineligible offensive player, including a T-Formation Quarterback, is more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage before the pass has been thrown.

 

Item 1. Legally Downfield. An ineligible player is not illegally downfield if, after initiating contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage during his initial charge:

 

he moves more than one yard beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent;

after breaking legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he remains stationary, moves laterally, or moves toward his own goal line until a forward pass is thrown; or

after losing legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he is forced behind the line of scrimmage by an opponent, at which time he is again subject to normal blocking restrictions for an ineligible offensive player.

Note: If an ineligible offensive player moves beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent, an eligible offensive player may catch a pass between them and the line of scrimmage.

 

Item 2. Illegally Downfield. An ineligible offensive player is illegally downfield if:

 

his entire body is more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage without contacting an opponent;

after losing contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage, he advances so his entire body is more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage; or

after losing contact with an opponent with his entire body more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he continues to move toward his opponent’s goal line.

Penalty: For ineligible offensive player downfield: Loss of five yards from the previous spot

21 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Stacking the box still doesn't stop the running game because it is so dominant.  In fact, it's actually facilitating some of Barkley's ultra long runs.  He has essentially become our deep threat.

Hurts is immaterial to all of this.  They are forcing Hurts to beat them...and the running game is so dominant it's not reaching that point because they still aren't stopping it.  If they actually did force Hurts to beat them, we'd be losing.

I'll just have to take your word for it, I guess. 

 

 

Just now, HazletonEagle said:

I liked that theory and really would love to test it out.

I guess most likely it seems there will be another new OC, and this will help perpetuate the Hurtscuses.

I don't think Moore is getting a HC job.  So I think we might get that second year.

But...our offense is obviously atypical.  We see and hear the criticism Moore is getting.  He's going to be getting questions in his interviews about scheming players open, simple route concepts, a cave man running offense, some of these play calls...and his answer is going to be that that was all he could do with the limitations they have at QB.  So if he actually DOES get a HC job, it means his new franchise is 100% buying that he's a good OC who is dragging an anchor up and down the field.

And if he's still here next year, then it's easier to argue that he's got a hand in this.

20 hours ago, DaEagles4Life said:

That will drop to 3.5

Line is up to -5.5 now

7 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I was fine with every call, review, overturn they made. The goal line overturn TD was the closest but I still think it was the correct call.

The DeVonta Smith hit was BS, but still the letter of the law the way the rules are written. Something they should probably change if they are so concerned about player safety. 

There were some bad holds not called. Notably one on Sweat very early in the game. He was directly behind Stafford, and directly in front of the ref. No way it wasnt seen.

The late tackle of Hurts after he was out of bounds was egregious. 

And there was also a very dirty, very late hit of Barkley after he was down for a while. Also very blatant, had to be seen. 

 

Mostly, nothing phantom that erased any big plays from us. And nothing phantom that extended any of the Rams drives. About as well officiated as you can get these days. 

4 minutes ago, hputenis said:

When he’s targeted <5 times a game and his QB has no clue how to throw to an elite receiver like him, I’ll give Devonta the benefit of the doubt on that drop, especially because he got smashed in the head. 

Ridiculous and ignorant statement:

Hurts to Brown: 2022 - 17 games- 88 recptions 1,496 yards; 2023 -17 games-106 receptions, 1,456 yards; 2024- 13 games- 67 receptions,  1,079 yards.

 

 

 

I'm actually not blaming Hurts on this....but the fact that we do run so much and it is THE identity of this team...I do wonder if that has contributed to some of the erosion of pass protection on the OL.  I realize they are professionals and doing something 18 times per game instead of 36 shouldn't change their competency...but with all the RPO, where half the passes are approached as running plays anyway and they are worried about getting downfield...there are probably only 5-10 plays in an entire game where we just have a traditional pocket and they pass protect.  That's not how our offense works...but when it's 3rd and long and we have to do it...it shouldn't come as any surprise that it's not looking so clean anymore.

3 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

 

And if he's still here next year, then it's easier to argue that he's got a hand in this.

not at all. if he is still here next year its easy to argue that the team undersands it looks how it looks because of Hurts, and theyre happy with the couple of added wrinkles Moore has been able to add. And they may be hoping for more with a 2nd year here. 

A 2nd year for Moore doesnt implicate him for anything this year at all. BUT you can judge him going forward if we dont see any improvement with another year working with Hurts. 

3 minutes ago, RLC said:

 

 

I'm fine with that crew - in terms of penalties, I thought they called a fair game.  Certain spots (goaline, etc) were questionable but that has been a league - wide issue this season, imo.  I can deal with a questionable spot here or there if the officials call a "fair game" when it comes to penalties. 

Where is John Facenda when you need him?

 

19 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

When that nfl films music hits  also dickerson’s brief cameo is amazing 

 

Hurts in the background almost immediately after the handoff is great too.

6 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

not at all. if he is still here next year its easy to argue that the team undersands it looks how it looks because of Hurts, and theyre happy with the couple of added wrinkles Moore has been able to add. And they may be hoping for more with a 2nd year here. 

A 2nd year for Moore doesnt implicate him for anything this year at all. BUT you can judge him going forward if we dont see any improvement with another year working with Hurts. 

My point is that if he gets a HC job, the team hiring him is believing that all of the idiosyncrasies of this offense are on Hurts and his limitations.  No team hires an OC from a team running the ball 65% of the time with a generational RB behind a generationally good run blocking OL.  That's not a scheme.  So Moore would be convincing them "I've got a scheme, I just can't run it because of Hurts."

3 minutes ago, Freshmilk said:

Ridiculous and ignorant statement:

Hurts to Brown: 2022 - 17 games- 88 recptions 1,496 yards; 2023 -17 games-106 receptions, 1,456 yards; 2024- 13 games- 67 receptions,  1,079 yards.

 

 

It wasn't even true yesterday, box score shows 7 targets. We should play a new game called "Is it alcohol or IQ?" every time someone makes a dumb comment like that. 

32 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Yea, there is no illegal man downfield if the pass doesn't cross the LOS.

He was behind the LOS.

8 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I don't think Moore is getting a HC job.  So I think we might get that second year.

But...our offense is obviously atypical.  We see and hear the criticism Moore is getting.  He's going to be getting questions in his interviews about scheming players open, simple route concepts, a cave man running offense, some of these play calls...and his answer is going to be that that was all he could do with the limitations they have at QB.  So if he actually DOES get a HC job, it means his new franchise is 100% buying that he's a good OC who is dragging an anchor up and down the field.

And if he's still here next year, then it's easier to argue that he's got a hand in this.

 

3 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

not at all. if he is still here next year its easy to argue that the team undersands it looks how it looks because of Hurts, and theyre happy with the couple of added wrinkles Moore has been able to add. And they may be hoping for more with a 2nd year here. 

A 2nd year for Moore doesnt implicate him for anything this year at all. BUT you can judge him going forward if we dont see any improvement with another year working with Hurts. 

 

Compared to last season, this offense is night and day.  How much of that is Barkely?  Moore?  Etc?  Not sure but either way, the offense is better than it was last season.

 

@HazletonEagle  Out of curiosity, I remember you saying that Moore liked running "Air Raid" concepts at times.  I think we saw a little of that in the beginning of the season but I haven't noticed those type of formations at all since (maybe) the first two games?  Am I missing them?  Do they run those formations? 

2 hours ago, DrPhilly said:

I'm watching the game again now.  I'll post about what I see with Hurts and a bit on Stafford

1st quarter - He was very solid in the 1st quarter.  Had the long run, four or five nice short passes, and put a long ball right on the numbers to Smith who couldn't hold on with the big hit.  The lone sack was 100% on the OL.  Lane slipped and the entire pocket collapsed on him with nowhere to go.  Stafford was well short on his deep ball but the Ram WR made a great play and stole the ball from Rodgers.

There are going to be several bad plays for Hurts as the game proceeds but none in the 1st quarter.

Both Saquon long TDs were plays that were Hurts' audibles.

 

1 hour ago, DrPhilly said:

@HazletonEagle

 

2nd quarter - There was a sailed ball on 2nd and 8 from the 30yrd line with Brown open.  Next play Hurts waited too long and took a sack taking the Eagles out of FG range.  Becton was blown up but Hurts still had time to throw it away and give Elliott a shot.  This was a bad ending to a drive that was solid mixing in some Hurts runs and a short pass to Brown to convert a third down.  Couple of really nice drives pretty deep into Rams territory including the last one in the quarter from inside their own 10yrd line with some nice short passes and a Hurts scramble.  Neither drive resulted in pts.  Hurts failed to get the ball away and was sacked outside of FG range on the 1st one and then Brown's drop cost the Eagles on the 2nd one.  Hurts ended up getting sacked on a blitz over Becton that came completely free.  Not a Hurts sack and the Eagles were not in FG range.  Another sack on the final play but it didn't matter.

Hurts had one really bad play in the 1st half and that was when he waited too long and took a sack that took the Eagles out of FG range.  Otherwise, he was solid.

Another bad throw by Stafford which Rodgers nearly intercepted.  Otherwise, Stafford hit some nice short throws in rhythm.

 

All in all the Eagles really owned the first half and should have been up by 10pts.

 

Both Saquon long TDs were plays that were Hurts' audibles.

 

14 minutes ago, DrPhilly said:

 

@HazletonEagle

3rd quarter - Stafford gets a big catch by Kupp and the Rams move the ball inside the Eagles 10 1st and goal only to have Stafford fumble the ball as he wasn't able to reach the Ram RB for the handoff.  The Rams recover but it is a big loss and they are now outside the 15.  A mistake by Stafford that likely cost the Rams 4pts. The Eagles had two drives.  Nothing of interest happened in the 1st one.  Nothing good or bad by Hurts.  The 2nd one was a nice drive with some decent passing from Hurts.  He did have one really bad pass on a deep shot down the left sideline to Brown that should have been an INT.  Otherwise, it was a solid drive by the Eagles for a FG and Hurts was fine.  Really only the one bad pass.

The knee injury occurred with just over 3 mins to go in the quarter on a nice play by Hurts to nearly get back to the LOS and keep Elliott in FG range.  Up until that point, Hurts had two bad plays with one that should have been an INT and also had two deep shots that his WRs did not pull in.  His passing was minimal but effective at times and he had had a big game running.  Stafford made more throws and threw better in rhythm but also was lucky not to get picked two or three times and had the benefit of his WRs making two huge plays downfield.  Just after the Hurts' injury, Puka did drop one that would have given the Rams a first down.  However, the punt pinned the Eagles inside their five and resulted in the safety.

The safety was a really bad play by Hurts.  However, it must be pointed out that it occurred after the knee injury and he clearly couldn't move thereafter.  No excuse for Hurts but Moore needs to take some of the blame.  Did Moore not read Hurts and understand that Jalen wasn't going to be able to move?

A super close 16-15 game after three and the QBs were pretty much equally effective overall at that point with Hurts making the one turnover (not official turnover but close enough).

 

 

 

@HazletonEagle

4th quarter - Hurts obviously limited in movement due to his knee injury.  The 1st two drives are after the Rams' turnovers.  Hurts has no bad plays and one good one where he hits Brown for a 4th down conversion.  Stafford loses a fumble when Smith strips him.  Looking back on it these TOs plus the FG conversions were huge.  Game manager Hurts put up six pts (would have been 10 without the Lane penalty) while Stafford fumbled the ball away.  On the drive with just over two mins left Hurts had a bad sack on the boot leg but honestly Moore shouldn't have had Hurts moving like that on a bum leg.

Stafford had 147yds on the final two drives and the 1st of those two was against a prevent D.  Take those away and he had 177 vs. Hurts 128 and Hurts had 70 rushing to Stafford 5.  Hurts gave up the safety but Stafford had two fumbles with one being recovered by the Eagles and the other essentially forcing the Rams to kick a FG instead of having a great shot to get a TD.

Eagles D was awesome in the first three Rams' drives in the 4th quarter with two TOs and a three and out.  It was only when they started to give the Rams space on those final drives that things went south.

 

In summary, a rewatch makes me reach a conclusion that Hurts wasn't nearly as bad as I thought he was live.  Not saying he was good but the bad plays were really far fewer than I had remembered and two of those were after the injury and where Moore did not put Jalen in a good spot.  My take is that he did his job again as game manager and bringing us into the NFC Championship game.

 

Both Saquon long TDs were plays that were Hurts' audibles.

 

1 hour ago, Arsenal79 said:

I give Hurts a C for yesterday.  Averaging out a B for the first half and a D for the second half.

I also think the terrible conditions were a big problem for him.  He doesn't have the laser rocket arm of Stafford (or others).  He relies on good footing and mechanics to pass, which became a problem in the second half elements.

Don't forget his knee injury, that definitely negatively impacted him. 

20 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

I was fine with every call, review, overturn they made. The goal line overturn TD was the closest but I still think it was the correct call.

The DeVonta Smith hit was BS, but still the letter of the law the way the rules are written. Something they should probably change if they are so concerned about player safety. 

The big miss was the Higbee fumble.  Other than that they called a good game.

4 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

He was behind the LOS.

Oh wow, I never caught that. Nice catch. 

 

 

5 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

He was behind the LOS.

My only defense for the refs here....it was hard for them to see what the LOS actually was for all the snow.

Replay assist SHOULD have helped them out there.