12 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

12 is a way different conversation, thanks.

That is a really weird and complicated formula. Do you have a link that spells it out or is it just something that you heard details about in this case?

The Kempski article spells it out

https://www.phillyvoice.com/should-eagles-exercise-fifth-year-options-jordan-davis-kenny-pickett-and-jahan-dotson/amp/

9 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Williams wouldn’t be replaced by a rookie.  Sweat wouldn’t be replaced by a rookie.  Slay wouldn’t be replaced by a rookie.  Only Graham would be likely to be replaced by a rookie.

Lot of projecting with unproven guys still taking over the starting positions. And a lot of rookies being counted on as key rotational depth.

42 minutes ago, Waiting4Someday said:

It’s going to cost some cash to keep Slay around and $4M in cap (right?), but if we let him loose we still need somebody to replace him (Rodgers) and how much will that cost? Perhaps we keep him, and have Ringo/Ricks/draft pick compete for CB3 and heir apparent. Then there’s Coop as well, but I’m happy with where he is (maybe sliding into S later for $ reasons down the road).

I wouldn’t move DeJean. Guys who can cover quicker guys in the slot, still have the height to match up with bigger receivers, and have the physicality to support the run are exceedingly rare. I almost think it will be easier to find a good boundary corner than it will be to replace Cooper in the slot.

40 minutes ago, mattwill said:

If we were to add a star, what position would that star play?  

Ideally DE or CB.

22 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

This is why I say you bring Williams back, even if you pay more than anticipated. You can structure his contract to be front heavy and even tradeable once Carter is due his payday. Get 3 more years out of these guys playing together and an ascending Ojomo. Draft another DT and move Jordan Davis. 

I see so much talk about Ojomo being on the same level that Williams is right now. Well all 3 of Carter, Williams and Ojomo are still not at the top of their game. Imagine once they do. 

Keep that IDL together. 

As long as Williams is at 3/63 or 4/84.Why would we shorten this window with a dominant interior line? That makes no sense.

Milton Williams is the exact signing Howie would do in free agency in previous years, if he was with another team. 25/26 year old who is on the rise... and has Jalen Carter playing near him to get the max out of him. 

9 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

@mattwill 

Kiper loves Arroyo

Wilfrid Laurier sounds like a finishing school for Butlers. Go Golden Hawks!

Kiper is slow on the uptake.  He had to wait until the Super Bowl to even notice him.  Trevor Sikkema turned me on to him more than a month ago

 

 

7 minutes ago, McMVP said:

Heard that..and I understand the reasoning.  He takes about 1/3 of the snaps.  I’m torn on this. I like the player, and he did come on late this year. Not sure if that was based on the competition, or him just finally beginning to show a little bit more pass rush ability.  5th year option is a big number for his percentage of snaps.  And how important is he for Carter?
 

 

Jordan Davis just doesn't play enough to justify any kind of extension. Week 22 is the SB and he played 14 snaps. Ojomo was getting nearly twice the snaps as Davis. I know Davis plays a different position, but for a position that calls for 15 snaps a game, that's where I'm OK saying next man up. Williams and Ojomo do more with their snaps than Davis does. He did have 2 sacks in the last 2 games of the year, but those are outliers for him. I didn't like the pick when it was made. I have no problem with who Jordan Davis is, but I'm not picking his option up at $12 million. 

 

Defensive Tackle	Wk 1	Wk 2	Wk 3	Wk 4	Wk 5	Wk 6	Wk 7	Wk 8	Wk 9	Wk 10	Wk 11	Wk 12	Wk 13	Wk 14	Wk 15	Wk 16	Wk 17	Wk 18	Wk 19	Wk 20	Wk 21	Wk 22	total
Jalen Carter	51 76%	46 75%	50 89%	52 68%	0	43 75%	46 79%	45 82%	52 96%	43 72%	66 100%	54 84%	71 99%	64 90%	39 91%	65 96%	44 86%	0	62 94%	69 97%	65 82%	0%	1027
Milton Williams	28 42%	25 41%	37 66%	30 39%	0	26 46%	27 47%	28 51%	22 41%	27 45%	22 33%	24 38%	41 57%	46 65%	31 72%	43 63%	29 57%	15 28%	43 65%	44 62%	41 52%	0%	629
Moro Ojomo	14 21%	17 28%	16 29%	37 48%	0	21 37%	22 38%	25 45%	16 30%	27 45%	20 30%	23 36%	20 28%	21 30%	11 26%	21 31%	33 65%	44 83%	23 35%	19 27%	35 44%	0%	465
Jordan Davis	35 52%	29 48%	29 52%	37 48%	0	21 37%	12 21%	22 40%	21 39%	21 35%	26 39%	15 23%	24 33%	25 35%	18 42%	17 25%	15 29%	21 40%	13 20%	17 24%	13 16%	0%	431
Thomas Booker IV	8 12%	9 15%	10 18%	24 31%	0	8 14%	13 22%	5 9%	1 2%	7 12%	6 9%	11 17%	4 6%	4 6%	1 2%	0 0%	16 31%	39 74%	0 0%	0 0%	4 5%	0	170

2 minutes ago, jojodancer said:

Lot of projecting with unproven guys still taking over the starting positions. And a lot of rookies being counted on as key rotational depth.

Projections:

Wherever he goes, Williams will not produce like he has next to Carter.
Ojomo will equal William's production
Hunt will equal Sweat's production
A value-priced vet FA DL/Edge will come in to take up necessary rotational snaps
The pick at 32, if taken, will be DT/EDGE/LB and contribute this year

Injuries not withstanding, the D will be better next year than it was this year.
Fangio has a group of players who are (1) smart enough and (2) talented enough to pull off his system.

6 minutes ago, jojodancer said:

Lot of projecting with unproven guys still taking over the starting positions. And a lot of rookies being counted on as key rotational depth.

Ojomo today is every bit as good as Williams was 12 months ago … that is indisputable.  Hunt is similarly every bit as good as Sweat was 12 months ago.  Rodgers filled in very nicely for Slay this year.

what is unproven about those guys?

3 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Kiper is slow on the uptake.  He had to wait until the Super Bowl to even notice him.  Trevor Sikkema turned me on to him more than a month ago

 

 

The big question with him is injuries. But no one questions his talent. I don’t think he lasts to our 3rd round pick. He might even be gone by our second. Is he worth 64?

I’m not sure, but I love the player on the field.

5 minutes ago, TEW said:

Ideally DE or CB.

So you bump either Smith or Hunt? I wouldn’t.

If you add a star CB, are you giving up on Rodgers?  Giving up on Ringo?  My personal preference is to re-sign Rodgers and get one more mentoring year out of Slay .., getting actual value rather than nothing for Slay’s dead cap dollars.  I wouldn’t have all three rotating snaps to get a clear idea of what 2026 holds for the D.

8 minutes ago, Next_Up said:

Projections:

Wherever he goes, Williams will not produce like he has next to Carter.
Ojomo will equal William's production
Hunt will equal Sweat's production
A value-priced vet FA DL/Edge will come in to take up necessary rotational snaps
The pick at 32, if taken, will be DT/EDGE/LB and contribute this year

Injuries not withstanding, the D will be better next year than it was this year.
Fangio has a group of players who are (1) smart enough and (2) talented enough to pull off his system.

I like how you think!

11 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

 

Jordan Davis just doesn't play enough to justify any kind of extension. Week 22 is the SB and he played 14 snaps. Ojomo was getting nearly twice the snaps as Davis. I know Davis plays a different position, but for a position that calls for 15 snaps a game, that's where I'm OK saying next man up. Williams and Ojomo do more with their snaps than Davis does. He did have 2 sacks in the last 2 games of the year, but those are outliers for him. I didn't like the pick when it was made. I have no problem with who Jordan Davis is, but I'm not picking his option up at $12 million. 

 

Defensive Tackle	Wk 1	Wk 2	Wk 3	Wk 4	Wk 5	Wk 6	Wk 7	Wk 8	Wk 9	Wk 10	Wk 11	Wk 12	Wk 13	Wk 14	Wk 15	Wk 16	Wk 17	Wk 18	Wk 19	Wk 20	Wk 21	Wk 22	total
Jalen Carter	51 76%	46 75%	50 89%	52 68%	0	43 75%	46 79%	45 82%	52 96%	43 72%	66 100%	54 84%	71 99%	64 90%	39 91%	65 96%	44 86%	0	62 94%	69 97%	65 82%	0%	1027
Milton Williams	28 42%	25 41%	37 66%	30 39%	0	26 46%	27 47%	28 51%	22 41%	27 45%	22 33%	24 38%	41 57%	46 65%	31 72%	43 63%	29 57%	15 28%	43 65%	44 62%	41 52%	0%	629
Moro Ojomo	14 21%	17 28%	16 29%	37 48%	0	21 37%	22 38%	25 45%	16 30%	27 45%	20 30%	23 36%	20 28%	21 30%	11 26%	21 31%	33 65%	44 83%	23 35%	19 27%	35 44%	0%	465
Jordan Davis	35 52%	29 48%	29 52%	37 48%	0	21 37%	12 21%	22 40%	21 39%	21 35%	26 39%	15 23%	24 33%	25 35%	18 42%	17 25%	15 29%	21 40%	13 20%	17 24%	13 16%	0%	431
Thomas Booker IV	8 12%	9 15%	10 18%	24 31%	0	8 14%	13 22%	5 9%	1 2%	7 12%	6 9%	11 17%	4 6%	4 6%	1 2%	0 0%	16 31%	39 74%	0 0%	0 0%	4 5%	0	170

Here’s the problem I see with your analysis.  What Davis allows Fangio to do is neuter the Opposing team’s running game.  Once the Eagles score to go ahead thy make the opposition more and more one dimensional … and predictable.  Once that happens Davis has added immense value to the victory trajectory.  And that is what the bottom_line is, isn’t it?

3 minutes ago, mattwill said:

So you bump either Smith or Hunt? I wouldn’t.

If you add a star CB, are you giving up on Rodgers?  Giving up on Ringo?  My personal preference is to re-sign Rodgers and get one more mentoring year out of Slay .., getting actual value rather than nothing for Slay’s dead cap dollars.  I wouldn’t have all three rotating snaps to get a clear idea of what 2026 holds for the D.

I think Rodgers is gone and if we were guaranteed a star CB I’d let Slay walk. I’m higher on Ringo than most, but the fact is he hasn’t proven anything. A bird in hand…

At DE we have no depth. If we suddenly add a star DE our EDGE rotation is set. Hunt and Smith would still get plenty of playing time.

1 minute ago, mattwill said:

Here’s the problem I see with your analysis.  What Davis allows Fangio to do is neuter the Opposing team’s running game.  Once the Eagles score to go ahead thy make the opposition more and more one dimensional … and predictable.  Once that happens Davis has added immense value to the victory trajectory.  And that is what the bottom_line is, isn’t it?

I’m also encouraged by Davis’ increased pass rushing production in the playoffs. He seems to be making improvements in that area.

2 hours ago, Sack that QB said:

Berman doesn't think the Eagles will pick up Jordan Davis' option.

I'm not sure what you do there. But they could always work out an extension so I'm not all that worried about not picking it up. I think there's definitely more potential there but he's gotta play more than 12-15 snaps. He can't be called a core player when he's only playing that minimal amount of plays. 

38 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

12 is a way different conversation, thanks.

That is a really weird and complicated formula. Do you have a link that spells it out or is it just something that you heard details about in this case?

https://overthecap.com/fifth-year-option-projections
 

It explains each tier in there. Davis hasn’t hit any of the benchmarks so it’s the average of the 3rd to 25th highest salaries over the last 5 years. 

1 hour ago, mattwill said:

If we were to add a star, what position would that star play?  

A true star at any position? As much as I love Goedert, I would love even more to have that position locked down for the next decade. 
 

 

52 minutes ago, jojodancer said:

Lot of projecting with unproven guys still taking over the starting positions. And a lot of rookies being counted on as key rotational depth.

 

41 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Ojomo today is every bit as good as Williams was 12 months ago … that is indisputable.  Hunt is similarly every bit as good as Sweat was 12 months ago.  Rodgers filled in very nicely for Slay this year.

what is unproven about those guys?

Counterargument-

Hunt-had 200 snaps in regular season. Maybe a larger sample size?

Ojomo- Played well. But will have increased snaps and had ZERO sacks in regular season

Rodgers- was decent depth but there was a drop off from Slay. Looked small out there on bombs. May not be coming back? Maybe Ringo?

These could all be incremental hits that reduces this defense. Only so many it can take to maintain a top rank. Alot of projecting here going forward.

And the depth after that is super questionable right now. For continuity purposes, Milton Williams is the linchpin to whether this defense takes a step down this offseason or not, and for the forseeable future potentially. I am presuming Baun is here when saying this. That's my call. 

19 minutes ago, mattwill said:

I like how you think!

Snrub!

52 minutes ago, jamiller said:

Coop has had such a great impact where he is. And it was a weakness for the team and now it is a strength.  We went from weak to really strong, even game changing.  Sure would like to leave him there and watch him get even better.

 

Agreed - it would just require paying a NCB like an outside CB (which means we might need a low cost option elsewhere). 

34 minutes ago, TEW said:

I wouldn’t move DeJean. Guys who can cover quicker guys in the slot, still have the height to match up with bigger receivers, and have the physicality to support the run are exceedingly rare. I almost think it will be easier to find a good boundary corner than it will be to replace Cooper in the slot.

I like where Coop is as well, but to pay him outside CB $ likely means we have to make a sacrifice elsewhere or hit on another draft pick to even out the cost across the secondary.

1 hour ago, SkippyX said:

The 5th year option on Jordan Davis will be somewhere between 22 and 24 million.

That number is a solid rock on your cap and can't be stretched over void years.

I would not pick up his 5th year option.

Nah. Based off his performance/playing time etc it should be about half that amount. 

1 hour ago, FranklinFldEBUpper said:

2 hours ago, Iggles25 said:

With a stacked DE/EDGE class in 2025, I'm hoping he falls to Eagles pick at 64.

Bradyn Swinson, EDGE, LSU

6'4" 250 lbs

Eagles fans will never spell that first name correctly. Looks like a perfect match for us.

Brandon Swansong?