15 minutes ago, mattwill said:

As I said, Reggie is my personal #1, with Van Buren as #2.  

Comparing players of different eras and different positions is problematic at best.  Compare the NFL product of 1948/1949 with the product of Reggie’s time.  There is no comparison.  Each player needs to be evaluated in the context of their own era.  Van Buren stood alone above all others in his era, as did Reggie.  For the sake of discussion, as great as Brian Dawkins was, he was arguably not the best player at his position, much less the best player of all the positions.  White and Van Buren were.

I’d have white and bednarik above van buren. I think bednarik was above others in his era. He was a 10x first team all pro. More than white and van buren (5x 1st team 2x 2nd team) with the eagles. 

47 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I’d have white and bednarik above van buren. I think bednarik was above others in his era. He was a 10x first team all pro. More than white and van buren (5x 1st team 2x 2nd team) with the eagles. 

So in his 8 seasons he was on the all pro team 88% of those seasons, with the only one he missed being his last injury plagued year.  Bednarik was no slouch with respect to all pro seasons with 10 out of 14 … 71% of his seasons.  White was all pro 13 out of 15 seasons (87%) missing only his first and last years.

The argument for Bednarik has to include his two-way play on offense and defense, but little is discussed about Van Buren’s three-way play on offense and defense and as a returner on special teams.  Here’s a description of Van Buren’s rookie year … 

Van Buren played in nine games, rushing for 444 yards and snagging five interceptions on defense as a DB.  On Special Teams he recorded a 55-yard punt return TD in the third game of the season. Three games later, he returned a kickoff 97 yards for a touchdown, which was the longest kickoff return by any player that season. His 15.3 yards per punt return led the league. Van Buren was named to the Associated Press's All-Pro first team, the only rookie so named.

His career ended when he tore a knee ligament.  Surgery was pretty primitive in those days, so retirement was the only option.

14 hours ago, VaBeach_Eagle said:

I received something, unexpectedly and something that I didn't order, from Fanatics via UPS today (I'll post a pic of it later). The note in the box says that it's from the "Fanatics Affiliate Team":

  Hide contents

I'm assuming that they sent it because they got purchases from the board's affiliate link and we're a Philadelphia Eagles fan website and I'm assuming it's from them because the shipping label has my full name, address and cell number on it but if it was someone here that had it sent, let me know. 

That sounds pretty damn cool! 😎

Well deserved, enjoy.

12 hours ago, VaBeach_Eagle said:

This is what Fanatics sent me:

  Hide contents

 

 

 

 In 2018, someone on the old EMB sent me some from LII but so much has been going on since 2018 here, that I don't remember exactly who sent it now (though I have an idea between 2 or 3 people). 

 

  Hide contents

Expected more from reading the card. But still cool. 😄

Well but you get the confetti, didn't you even talk about that before? It found you..

Let's keep the collection going this season. 🦅

4 hours ago, Saltpeter said:

Respectfully, are you being intentionally obtuse? If most cars were shades of green and you saw a yellow one, would you call that having its "own character" and scoff at "weird"? Ok fine, this draft has its own character in that the top 2 tiers are smaller than normal - the quality of the guy at 15 is closer to the guy at 32 than it has been in any draft I recall. As in, what I clearly meant by "weird." Sheesh.

5 hours ago, DaBirds said:

Totally random but anyone remember Bryce Brown? No idea why he popped into my head. I remember when I was younger he had some beastly moments as a rookie. Then he went to Buffalo and kind of disappeared. I think maybe I remember him fumbling a lot but, still… big, strong, fast, kid. 

Before there was Travis Fulgham, there was Bryce Brown

The strangest 2 game stretch ever. 32% of his career yards in 2 consecutive games. 

Something wild to think about. Raheem Mostert turns 33 in a few weeks and just signed with the Raiders. Bryce Brown is still "just" 33. 

1	11	11	12	2012-11-26	PHI		CAR	L, 22-30	*	19	178	2	9.4	5	4	11	2.8	0	80.0	2.2	0	0	0		0.0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	2	0	0	0	41	82.0	0	0.0	0	0.0
12	12	12	13	2012-12-02	PHI	@	DAL	L, 33-38	*	24	169	2	7.0	5	4	14	3.5	0	80.0	2.8

 

6 hours ago, mattwill said:

So in his 8 seasons he was on the all pro team 88% of those seasons, with the only one he missed being his last injury plagued year.  Bednarik was no slouch with respect to all pro seasons with 10 out of 14 … 71% of his seasons.  White was all pro 13 out of 15 seasons (87%) missing only his first and last years.

The argument for Bednarik has to include his two-way play on offense and defense, but little is discussed about Van Buren’s three-way play on offense and defense and as a returner on special teams.  Here’s a description of Van Buren’s rookie year … 

Van Buren played in nine games, rushing for 444 yards and snagging five interceptions on defense as a DB.  On Special Teams he recorded a 55-yard punt return TD in the third game of the season. Three games later, he returned a kickoff 97 yards for a touchdown, which was the longest kickoff return by any player that season. His 15.3 yards per punt return led the league. Van Buren was named to the Associated Press's All-Pro first team, the only rookie so named.

His career ended when he tore a knee ligament.  Surgery was pretty primitive in those days, so retirement was the only option.

I’d ague longevity to play 14 years as compared to 8 should matter as they overlapped in time period. Bednarik played in 1949-1951 with van buren. So during the same era of primitive medical/surgery. I get van buren had a knee injury and forced him to retire early. But it wasn’t just 6 more seasons, bednarik played 169 games (out of 172) compared to 83 (out of 96). After missing his first two games as a rookie he missed just 1 more game the rest of his career.  So from 1950-1962 he played 159 games out of 160. So bednarik played more than double the amount of games for the eagles.  Again both were great but that’s part of the lore for bednarik is how he was always out there.

What makes it just absolutely wild to me that he managed to miss just 1 game in a 13 year window and he played positions where he was hitting somebody on almost every single play. Kelce went from 2015-2023 without missing a game (147). 

Not that he was great at it but pro football reference shows bednarik was part time punter in 1953. had a couple of punt returns and kickoff returns in 1954 (had one kickoff return in 1956). 

8 hours ago, brkmsn said:

There was no game missed. It happened in a matter of days.

It took weeks before he agreed to move over.  

5 hours ago, mattwill said:

Frank Gore

LeCharles Bentley

6 hours ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

For me it’s 

1. Early 90’s Reggie

2. 2013 Jason Peters (there have been 9 2000 yard backs, but I’ve never seen a 330lb man do the stuff he could do)

3. 2024 Saquon

4. 2018 Fletcher Cox

5. 2004 TO

Reggie was actually more dominant in the late 80s.

'86 - 18 sacks
'87 - 21 sacks (in 12 games)
'88 - 18 sacks
 

Greatest 3 consecutive seasons by a DE in the history of the NFL, IIRC.   Gave him a big cushion to have more sacks than games played during his Eagles' career.  

11 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Reggie was actually more dominant in the late 80s.

'86 - 18 sacks
'87 - 21 sacks (in 12 games)
'88 - 18 sacks
 

Greatest 3 consecutive seasons by a DE in the history of the NFL, IIRC.   Gave him a big cushion to have more sacks than games played during his Eagles' career.  

It’s really unfortunate the nfl went on strike in 1987 where everyone lost a game and had replacement players for 3 weeks. white was on pace for 28 sacks that year if he played 16 games. There’s a solid chance if there was not a strike that year that white would still own the single season sack record. 

11 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

We can disagree. However time doesn’t stop and players who’s history come along and mean something to the city too. Imo the difference in the Schmidt and van buren comparison is Schmidt retired 36 years ago and he’s still widely (almost unanimously) considered the Phillies best player in franchise history and arguably best at his position in MLB history. I can’t say that about van buren. 

Imo Reggie or bednarik are more comparable to Schmidt. 

If Reggie played his entire career here, you'd be right.    But, Van Buren's handicap is the era in which he played.  The further you go back, the less film exists on them and the fewer people actually saw him play.  He's now sort of lost to history.   Similar to the Robin Roberts thing we discussed.  And then there's always recency bias.  

Schmidt has actually been trying to hand off the 'greatest slugger' epitet for the longest time.  He raised Thome's arm up to crown him while he was here and he did the same thing with Ryan Howard during his time.   Neither one had the longevity of Schmidt to match his 548 in Philly.  Thome eventually got over 600, but only by playing DH in the American League, but barely crossed 100 home runs in the Phillies' pinstripes, and isn't even in the top 25 in HRs in Philly.  Howard did a great job, but never even got to 400.   So, Schmidt remains atop the heap, and by quite a wide margin.

 

IMO, Reggie is still the all-time sack leader in the league.  Bruce Smith hung on with bad Washington teams just chasing that record, and still barely beat Reggie.   Reggie at 37 years old, still led the league in sacks with 16, and was Defensive Player of the year.  Smith's last 3 years he had a combined 19 sacks.   Had he played his entire career with the Birds, he'd be above Van Buren, no doubt.

7 hours ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

For me it’s 

1. Early 90’s Reggie

2. 2013 Jason Peters (there have been 9 2000 yard backs, but I’ve never seen a 330lb man do the stuff he could do)

3. 2024 Saquon

4. 2018 Fletcher Cox

5. 2004 TO

What about Harold Carmichel?

Have the Eagles had any top-30 visits scheduled yet? I assume there’s a list being kept somewhere around here.

8 hours ago, paco said:

You may be right but…..

 

… don’t contacts that void have a trigger date associated with them?  I’ve seen it where it automatically voids 9/1.
 

Difference is there was a minimum base salary associated with those. BG doesn’t have that so I’m leaning to you being correct. Maybe Howie really is biting the bullet and taking on dead cap now vs pushing it. 

I'm sure Howie is smarter than any of us when it comes to how to deal with the cap.  We can disagree with how he handles it at times, but he definitely knows the nuances way more than we do.   So, if he's not spreading out the cap hit for Graham, its intentional.  He had plenty of time to discuss it and rework Graham's deal to make it happen.  And we know Graham would have done whatever the team asked, especially if his goal is to stick around with the club.   He could even have given some money back... and gotten it back as a team ambassador or whatever.  🤷‍♂️

 

The long and the short is... Howie could have pushed some of Graham's money to next year, if he wanted to.   We'll find out if that was his plan or not eventually.

6 hours ago, mattwill said:

Frank Gore

LeCharles Bentley.

Being 43, my first real seasons of being an Eagles fan were 1990/91. My grandfather and dad were Eagles fans so I was destined to be an Eagles fan, but watching Randall Cunningham in 1990 is what got me hooked. Unfortunately, as exciting and as good as he was, I watched the downside of Randall's Eagles career no thanks to Bryce Paup and The Meadowlands. Similarly, I only got to watch 2-3 seasons of Reggie White and my biggest memory of Reggie was God telling him to go to Green Bay. 

Randall made me a fan. My first taste of winning is in large part due to Donovan McNabb. Brian Dawkins was the heart and soul of the team. The bridge between modern generations of Eagles teams and the glue to the OL was Jason Kelce. 

My personal Eagles Mt. Rushmore-

Randall Cunningham, Donovan McNabb, Brian Dawkins, Jason Kelce

11 minutes ago, Waiting4Someday said:

Have the Eagles had any top-30 visits scheduled yet? I assume there’s a list being kept somewhere around here.

 

Seems we only have one known top 30 visit at this time...OT Anthony Belton, NC State.  Likely 3rd/4th round kinda prospect.

We should hopefully start hearing about more soon.  Last year, I'm pretty sure the 1st reported top 30 visit was Cooper DeJean, FWIW.

22 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

If Reggie played his entire career here, you'd be right.    But, Van Buren's handicap is the era in which he played.  The further you go back, the less film exists on them and the fewer people actually saw him play.  He's now sort of lost to history.   Similar to the Robin Roberts thing we discussed.  And then there's always recency bias.  

Schmidt has actually been trying to hand off the 'greatest slugger' epitet for the longest time.  He raised Thome's arm up to crown him while he was here and he did the same thing with Ryan Howard during his time.   Neither one had the longevity of Schmidt to match his 548 in Philly.  Thome eventually got over 600, but only by playing DH in the American League, but barely crossed 100 home runs in the Phillies' pinstripes, and isn't even in the top 25 in HRs in Philly.  Howard did a great job, but never even got to 400.   So, Schmidt remains atop the heap, and by quite a wide margin.

 

IMO, Reggie is still the all-time sack leader in the league.  Bruce Smith hung on with bad Washington teams just chasing that record, and still barely beat Reggie.   Reggie at 37 years old, still led the league in sacks with 16, and was Defensive Player of the year.  Smith's last 3 years he had a combined 19 sacks.   Had he played his entire career with the Birds, he'd be above Van Buren, no doubt.

I don’t hold it against Reggie for not playing his entire career here. Ownership stunk and allowed it. Unfortunately lurie wasn’t owner yet cause i think there’s a better chance white finishes his career here if he was. But we’ll never really know. But white played 8 years in Philly just like van buren. (NFL had more games so he played 121 games compared to 83 for van buren). i still have him (also bednarik) over van buren. in my opinion he was just the greatest player to put on an eagles uniform. 

as for Schmidt, Howard would’ve been the closest to him in terms of power if he didn’t have the Achilles. Got to 382 and his power really dropped after 2011 with the Achilles. Shame cause it really destroyed his chances to get to 500 and thus 400. Had 286 before the Achilles and just 96 after. I’d say Bryce as he’s gonna play here for 13 years (who knows maybe more) but he’s only on pace to hit 329 homers as a Phillie. He’d reach 500 if he did but 184 of those were as a National. Wish we had Bryce his entire career cause i love watching him. But also i think his numbers with HRs when he was younger might have been better at CBP 

6 hours ago, mattwill said:

That choice illustrates the dilemma between being the greatest over a career … clearly Clarke … and greatest/apex performance over a season … just as clearly IMO Parent.

I also grade on a curve for injury shortened success, versus just playing elsewhere.  Hence, the difference between Parent and Reggie.  Parent is a guy that I have no memory of seeing in a different uniform, though I know he was a Maple Leaf... Reggie had some iconic moments as a Packer... and those hurt his Eagles' legacy IMO.  🤷‍♂️

 

That's the thing about these types of discussions.  Consensus can never be fully found.  There are so many different criteria used by different individuals.  And then there's the subjective pieces of just how you connected with a specific player.  For example, I connected with Nick Foles on a great many levels, but don't have the same connections with Hurts.  So, which is my preferred QB?  Foles, even though I concede that Hurts has had, by far, a more successful tenure as Eagles' QB.   BUT... even more than that, my favorite Eagles QB is Cunningham, because he played during my formative years of fandom, and played with a style unlike anyone else in the league!  It was always so exciting (and also very frustrating)!   How do you list them 'objectively'?   And Wentz had the single greatest stretch of 12 (or was it 13) games by an Eagles' QB I can remember... even better, IMO than the 27-2 season Foles had.  But then it all came crashing down with that knee injury in LA, and the slide down was painful to watch.    So many variables.

4 hours ago, mattwill said:

So in his 8 seasons he was on the all pro team 88% of those seasons, with the only one he missed being his last injury plagued year.  Bednarik was no slouch with respect to all pro seasons with 10 out of 14 … 71% of his seasons.  White was all pro 13 out of 15 seasons (87%) missing only his first and last years.

The argument for Bednarik has to include his two-way play on offense and defense, but little is discussed about Van Buren’s three-way play on offense and defense and as a returner on special teams.  Here’s a description of Van Buren’s rookie year … 

Van Buren played in nine games, rushing for 444 yards and snagging five interceptions on defense as a DB.  On Special Teams he recorded a 55-yard punt return TD in the third game of the season. Three games later, he returned a kickoff 97 yards for a touchdown, which was the longest kickoff return by any player that season. His 15.3 yards per punt return led the league. Van Buren was named to the Associated Press's All-Pro first team, the only rookie so named.

His career ended when he tore a knee ligament.  Surgery was pretty primitive in those days, so retirement was the only option.

Talk about exciting whites!!!  Cooper and Reed would be proud!

2 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Talk about exciting whites!!!  Cooper and Reed would be proud!

You can say that again!

To change the discussion a little bit...   

 

how did this take age?

 

 

Is Pickett better or worse off now than he was a year ago?   Got to live his dream playing for his childhood favorite team... got to take snaps in the NFC CG for that team... got to take snaps in the Super Bowl... got a ring with his childhood favorite team... and is now lined up to be the starter in Cleveland.  Is that worse, better or basically in the same situation, but with a championship ring to his resume... and a life time of memories of a great ride?

 

What's your take?

4 minutes ago, Waiting4Someday said:

You can say that again!

. Stupid double posts!

Anyone else worried that Goedert might be gone?  I trust in Howie's process given his track record, but man, I don't see a good tight end situation without Dallas here this season. I hope they can come to an agreement for at least 1 more year so the Eagles can draft a tight end and have some sort of succession plan to Goedert.