Roseman knew it. 🥇

Really nice interview, Vic Fangio is the man!

Sidenote: 98, living alone in the house Vic grew up in, walking up and down the stairs. I'm impressed.

Who are the players you think Howie would move up for? And how far?

I'll say: Jalon Walker, Walter Nolen, Mykel Williams, Mason Graham(if he miraculously falls), Kelvin Banks Jr.

How far... no idea. Probably mid 20's.

Okay now I’m starting to believe those conspiracy theories about how AJ ended up in Philly

4 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Who are the players you think Howie would move up for? And how far?

I'll say: Jalon Walker, Walter Nolen, Mykel Williams, Mason Graham(if he miraculously falls), Kelvin Banks Jr.

How far... no idea. Probably mid 20's.

I was also thinking about what happens if Jacksonville takes Jeanty or Mcmillan or Johnson, and Graham is still there at 10, at 11, at 12. Suddenly it’s not to unrealistic a tradeup

1 hour ago, mattwill said:

There is no question that those two have changed the competitive landscape of NCAA football, but how have they changed the Draft?

Players moving around so much has made it harder to get familiarity with them. NCAA Coaches can't have a 'long view' for player development, because the player might just leave anytime they wish, for whatever reason they wish (I guess that's really the portal, more than NIL, but they both work together in my mind). And that coach gets nothing for his effort for the future, and so player development is going to suffer, and we will likely start to see the effects of it with this draft, and it will likely get worse as time progresses. So, the draft will become more and more about 'ceiling' and 'potential' and much less about 'competence' and 'technique'.

1 hour ago, Sack that QB said:

Schrager has Nolen at 11. He thinks he goes before Mason Graham. Has the Eagles taking Hairston which isn't going to happen.

Peter Schrager is very connected in the NFL, so the day before the draft, that comment re: Nolen carries a lot of weight to it. I can't comment on the sort of player Hairston is, but the former comments applies there too. Name dropped for a reason

I keep hearing rumblings that by the end of draft weekend the Eagles will have selected some new players. An intriguing situation to keep your eyes on to see how it unfolds.

1 minute ago, NOTW said:

I keep hearing rumblings that by the end of draft weekend the Eagles will have selected some new players. An intriguing situation to keep your eyes on to see how it unfolds.

My intel indicates that it is a fluid situation.

1 hour ago, Waiting4Someday said:

My guess... 1) The NIL keeps some players in college longer, which is an issue because 2) they aren't being trained very well for the pro game as the college schemes have become less complex and tailored for a fluid labor market.

Good point. However, isn’t staying longer in college resulting in players who are more experienced and also more physically mature?

I don’t follow college football closely enough to speculate on whether schemes have become less complex, but that intuitively seems like a bit of a reach.

With that said, those are changes to the college game and to individual player profiles, but how does that change the NFL Draft? It chugs along just the same as it always has chugged along since they shortened it to 7 rounds.

I don’t understand the affinity with Travis Hunter. If he were just a receiver or just a CB, he’d maybe be mid-teen pick? It’s not like he’s going to waltz on in and be combination of Jamar Chase and Patrick Surtain while playing 90% of the snaps on offense and defense.

He’s more than likely going to be a CB that gets maybe 5-10 offensive snaps a game. If he’s a WR, I can’t see him touching the field on defense unless he’s your #3, and no way you’re taking a slot receiver as a top 5 or even top 20 pick.

If he played in the SEC or on a top Big 10 team, he wouldn’t have been a full time player on both sides.

Yeah Travis Hunter will be a bad pick for the Browns. They should be taking Carter and makes no sense to me that they aren't.

26 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Players moving around so much has made it harder to get familiarity with them. NCAA Coaches can't have a 'long view' for player development, because the player might just leave anytime they wish, for whatever reason they wish (I guess that's really the portal, more than NIL, but they both work together in my mind). And that coach gets nothing for his effort for the future, and so player development is going to suffer, and we will likely start to see the effects of it with this draft, and it will likely get worse as time progresses. So, the draft will become more and more about 'ceiling' and 'potential' and much less about 'competence' and 'technique'.

Good points. Your explanation of the evolution is both clear and understandable. The Draft itself won’t change but the approach and expectations of the individual teams will change.

2 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Good point. However, isn’t staying longer in college resulting in players who are more experienced and also more physically mature?

Yes, but more experience doesn't necessarily mean a better player. It could mean a player with more ingrained bad habits. And habits are hard to break.

3 hours ago, Waiting4Someday said:

Works for me, haven’t seen this before…

As has been said time and time again this is a really weird draft. However, the chances of both Nolen being there at 32 AND Scourton at 64 are extremely slim. I also don't like a single day three pick other than Jalen Travis. Not Kempski's best work.

41 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Who are the players you think Howie would move up for? And how far?

I'll say: Jalon Walker, Walter Nolen, Mykel Williams, Mason Graham(if he miraculously falls), Kelvin Banks Jr.

How far... no idea. Probably mid 20's.

I’m thinking he’d trade up for the right edge rusher. Jumping ahead of the Ravens who also need one would be ideal. The Texans at 26 could be a trade partner. They need OL bad but probably won’t have a guy they love at 26. They also have only three day 3 picks.

4 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

I don’t understand the affinity with Travis Hunter. If he were just a receiver or just a CB, he’d maybe be mid-teen pick? It’s not like he’s going to waltz on in and be combination of Jamar Chase and Patrick Surtain while playing 90% of the snaps on offense and defense.

He’s more than likely going to be a CB that gets maybe 5-10 offensive snaps a game. If he’s a WR, I can’t see him touching the field on defense unless he’s your #3, and no way you’re taking a slot receiver as a top 5 or even top 20 pick.

If he played in the SEC or on a top Big 10 team, he wouldn’t have been a full time player on both sides.

A small part of me thinks that he and Sanders will fall in this draft, because they seem to be media darlings vs prospects that teams will pick high. The fact Hunter seems determined to play both ways will put off some teams.

Just now, Iggles_Phan said:

Yes, but more experience doesn't necessarily mean a better player. It could mean a player with more ingrained bad habits. And habits are hard to break.

Another good point. As noted above, that will change the outlook and expectations of the individual teams, but it won’t change the Draft itself.

So what pick, position, direction, etc would straight up piss you off for the Eagles. Considering they pick at 32 and this is a weird draft where people are expecting a lot of big surprises in round 1 there isn't much that would piss me off in round 1. I think standing pat at 32 and taking Hairston or Amos would piss me off. There are are FAR bigger needs than CB and I don't think their value at 32 is so good you can't pass them up. It would be one thing if Barron somehow fell to 32 and I would be all for that, but not Hairston or Amos. I also think having Quinyon and Cooper up for big contracts one year and then possibly another young corner the following year is asking for trouble as you can only commit so much cap space to one position in a short span like that and paying three corners big time money is something no team can afford to do.

On the flip side, what would be pleasantly surprising for you that would have you jumping up and down and screaming LFG? I would say drafting Malaki Starks or Mason Taylor at 32. I don't see them drafting a S or TE that early but I think they are two of the biggest needs on the team and these are two players that I really like in this draft.

5 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Another good point. As noted above, that will change the outlook and expectations of the individual teams, but it won’t change the Draft itself.

"The Draft" is about much more than just the event that the NFL holds in April with 7 rounds of selections. For the diehard fans, "the Draft" is a year long process... it can start as early as the spring practices and reports from them about how the new incoming players look, how the senior class looks, etc. Then it goes into the season and watching games on Thursdays and Saturdays... all season long watching as players demonstrate learned skills and show their wares. Then we move in to the ramp up for the Draft itself and we have all-star games, the Combine and Pro Days. We get to hear about player visits and rumors of interest. And then finally, we get to Draft Weekend and the 7 rounds of selections and the post-draft scramble to sign UDFAs. But what you are referring to as "the Draft" is just a drop in the bucket of the entire process of what goes into it. Its not even the most visible part anymore. Senior Bowl practices are televised and watched with fine tooth combs by fans now. The Combine workouts are covered and people dig deep into those, and some Pro Days are even televised on NFL Network for the truly die-hard fan. So, yeah, all those things impact the enjoyment of 'the Draft'. And if you are someone who used to do all the things I've outlined, but now find the college game far less entertaining to watch so relentlessly, it will have a massive impact on someone's enjoyment of 'the Draft'.

57 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Who are the players you think Howie would move up for? And how far?

I'll say: Jalon Walker, Walter Nolen, Mykel Williams, Mason Graham(if he miraculously falls), Kelvin Banks Jr.

How far... no idea. Probably mid 20's.

I would be extremely surprised if they moved up any higher than the mid 20's and Minnesota at 24 makes a lot of sense. I think you have the right guys on your list with Nolen and Williams being the two most likely as I would be surprised if Walker and Graham don't go top 10 and shocked if they made it out of the top 15. Maybe Mike Green if they are ok with his off the field concerns but he is also a guy I don't think makes it to their trade up range.

I would also throw in that perhaps they move up just a few spots for someone that they like more than we realize and want to jump certain teams. Maybe there is an edge rusher or OL sitting there at 30 and they are afraid the Chiefs will take them so they jump them and move up with the Bills. That could be just about anybody too, Ezeiruaku, Pearce Jr., Jackson, Conerly Jr., etc. Maybe they absolutely covet Malaki Starks and want to get to 26 with the Rams to jump Baltimore at 27. That sort of thing.

24 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

I don’t understand the affinity with Travis Hunter. If he were just a receiver or just a CB, he’d maybe be mid-teen pick? It’s not like he’s going to waltz on in and be combination of Jamar Chase and Patrick Surtain while playing 90% of the snaps on offense and defense.

He’s more than likely going to be a CB that gets maybe 5-10 offensive snaps a game. If he’s a WR, I can’t see him touching the field on defense unless he’s your #3, and no way you’re taking a slot receiver as a top 5 or even top 20 pick.

If he played in the SEC or on a top Big 10 team, he wouldn’t have been a full time player on both sides.

He’s perhaps a top 10 talent at CB; he’s not even a first round talent at WR, IMO.

10 minutes ago, T-1000 said:

So what pick, position, direction, etc would straight up piss you off for the Eagles. Considering they pick at 32 and this is a weird draft where people are expecting a lot of big surprises in round 1 there isn't much that would piss me off in round 1. I think standing pat at 32 and taking Hairston or Amos would piss me off. There are are FAR bigger needs than CB and I don't think their value at 32 is so good you can't pass them up. It would be one thing if Barron somehow fell to 32 and I would be all for that, but not Hairston or Amos. I also think having Quinyon and Cooper up for big contracts one year and then possibly another young corner the following year is asking for trouble as you can only commit so much cap space to one position in a short span like that and paying three corners big time money is something no team can afford to do.

On the flip side, what would be pleasantly surprising for you that would have you jumping up and down and screaming LFG? I would say drafting Malaki Starks or Mason Taylor at 32. I don't see them drafting a S or TE that early but I think they are two of the biggest needs on the team and these are two players that I really like in this draft.

Tight end. Because at 32 you're getting the 3rd or 4th best TE in the draft class, and a position that has a high bust rate. Would be terrible roster building IMO.

10 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

"The Draft" is about much more than just the event that the NFL holds in April with 7 rounds of selections. For the diehard fans, "the Draft" is a year long process... it can start as early as the spring practices and reports from them about how the new incoming players look, how the senior class looks, etc. Then it goes into the season and watching games on Thursdays and Saturdays... all season long watching as players demonstrate learned skills and show their wares. Then we move in to the ramp up for the Draft itself and we have all-star games, the Combine and Pro Days. We get to hear about player visits and rumors of interest. And then finally, we get to Draft Weekend and the 7 rounds of selections and the post-draft scramble to sign UDFAs. But what you are referring to as "the Draft" is just a drop in the bucket of the entire process of what goes into it. Its not even the most visible part anymore. Senior Bowl practices are televised and watched with fine tooth combs by fans now. The Combine workouts are covered and people dig deep into those, and some Pro Days are even televised on NFL Network for the truly die-hard fan. So, yeah, all those things impact the enjoyment of 'the Draft'. And if you are someone who used to do all the things I've outlined, but now find the college game far less entertaining to watch so relentlessly, it will have a massive impact on someone's enjoyment of 'the Draft'.

If you approach it that way, and I don’t disagree with your description at all, then every Draft is different and unique in its details. So saying the draft is changed by NIL is just the current year broad brush stroke description of what happens every year.

I know most of you don’t venture out of this thread so I’ll ask here too

Is the board slow for anyone else?