50 minutes ago, mattwill said:

All true, and I agree good conversation. Gunslinging for me doesn’t have to be game long. Gary Cooper in High Noon is definitely a gunslinger but until the showdown actually happens and he slings his guns you would never know he was a gunslinger, and almost immediately after the showdown happens he reverts back to his non gunslinger persona, but there is no question that he was a gunslinger throughout the movie

JMO

Wouldn’t be surprised if the majority of posters haven’t seen High Noon. Westerns were pretty much dead by the 1970s.

This throw is still unreal to me. Dropping it when it hit your facemask is insulting

20 minutes ago, Diehardfan said:

Because it is. That's not even close to the same thing, but if you want to use that then the actor who won only won because the others Anything other than the Eagles defense dominated is disrespectful. Saying he crapped the bed takes away from the Eagles.

As you said, we will have to agree to disagree. I suspect Fangio has a robust enough ego to be totally oblivious to any possible inadvertent disrespect that might be floating around.

28 minutes ago, just relax said:

Jerry Wolman deserves consideration.

Good point.

7 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

Interceptions being all against the QB is a bad measure.

In small sample sizes like a single game or two? Sure. But over the course of someone's entire career? I'd love to hear you make the case that Favre's receivers were more at fault for the 300+ interceptions than Mahomes or other comparable QBs.

Seems like you wanted to disparage Mahomes' decision making and immediately reached for a comparison with the all-time leader in interceptions, and now you're gonna try to say it was more of the receiver's fault than Favre whereas Mahomes' weren't?

51 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Honestly, even if they wanted Grant, I'm glad it turned out the way it did. They obviously need a Lane heir apparent at some point, but I want to repeat, and if taking Grant caused them to miss out on Robinson(or another DT closely ranked) then I'll pass. DT is pretty thin. It was a bigger need. Grant wouldn't have played in 2025 barring disaster.

Also notable is while everyone focused on Cameron Williams, Hinton seems to be the OL that hyped Stout up the most.

DT was thin? Carter, Davis, Ojomo, Booker and added Robinson. Byron Young and Gabe Hall on the outside looking in. Both Ojomo and Booker looked good in their roles last year.

38 minutes ago, just relax said:

Jerry Wolman deserves consideration.

You might be right. Way before my time.

12 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

Wouldn’t be surprised if the majority of posters haven’t seen High Noon. Westerns were pretty much dead by the 1970s.

He was conversing with me, and I have... along with many many other Westerns.

7 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

DT was thin? Carter, Davis, Ojomo, Booker and added Robinson. Byron Young and Gabe Hall on the outside looking in. Both Ojomo and Booker looked good in their roles last year.

Only two of those I feel good about are Carter and Ojomo, and Ojomo is a projection that still has not proven he can be the man.

30 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Everything about that play was perfect.

The ball was slightly underthrown - allowing the defender to get his arm into the catch point. Smith was ahead of Watson by two yards when the ball was thrown.

Watson puts his hand a little more to the right, he breaks up the pass.

That Hurts' throw was 50+ air yards. I don't really see how you can call that underthrown.

15 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

The ball was slightly underthrown - allowing the defender to get his arm into the catch point. Smith was ahead of Watson by two yards when the ball was thrown.

Watson puts his hand a little more to the right, he breaks up the pass.

18 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

The ball was slightly underthrown - allowing the defender to get his arm into the catch point. Smith was ahead of Watson by two yards when the ball was thrown.

Watson puts his hand a little more to the right, he breaks up the pass.

I don't think it was underthrown. He was running full speed when he caught it. It hit him in the hands. Also, Watson did not have the angle to have his hand a little more to the right.

2 minutes ago, RLC said:

That Hurts' throw was 50+ air yards. I don't really see how you can call that underthrown.

Easy...

It was underthrown. So were the passes to Dotson and Barkley. If the receiver needs to slow down, allowing the defender to catch up, then the ball is underthrown.

To be clear, I was merely responding to ManuManu's assertion that it was a perfect play. The arrogance to make the call was memorable. Smith did everything right. But the pass wasn't "perfect".

4 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

In small sample sizes like a single game or two? Sure. But over the course of someone's entire career? I'd love to hear you make the case that Favre's receivers were more at fault for the 300+ interceptions than Mahomes or other comparable QBs.

Seems like you wanted to disparage Mahomes' decision making and immediately reached for a comparison with the all-time leader in interceptions, and now you're gonna try to say it was more of the receiver's fault than Favre whereas Mahomes' weren't?

Where did I say that Favre’s receivers were "more at fault” for his interceptions? Favre was. I just pointed out that interceptions all going to the QB is a bad measure. Receivers running the route poorly, having the ball bounce off them and even some plays where the DB takes the ball away from the receiver probably shouldn’t go against the QB. Then there is the fact that all QBs benefit from the fact that DBs are frequently DBs because of their hands.

You seem to take gunslinger as an insult. You want the QB to be fearless. I think Mahomes makes some really good decisions. Very quick read, Peyton fast. And the bit of a Run ‘n Shoot understanding that he and Kelce have had is a thing of beauty. (Run ‘n Shoot calls for the receiver and the QB to read the D and run the route the D is showing. Kelce knows where to go when the D is disrupting the play and Mahomes knows where he is going. That’s reading through the play. They are very good at that.) But Mahomes can get careless at times, which was my premise. Sometimes Texas Tech Patrick shows up.

Note that Mahomes grew up in the Leach route concept. Leach arranged his routes so the QB could see multiple routes from a single look. AR uses some of that. I like that Moore was bringing that to the Eagles and hopefully it wore off on Patullo. Because Lincoln Riley incorporated some of that at Oklahoma and Hurts did well with it. I like the Loeffler hire as he has been exposed to lots of different concepts. Curious to see what Frasier learned from McDaniels.

1 minute ago, BigEFly said:

But Mahomes can get careless at times, which was my premise.

It's a faulty premise that's not borne out by reality, especially when you chose to draw comparisons to the record holder of most interceptions in NFL history.

3 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

I don't think it was underthrown. He was running full speed when he caught it. It hit him in the hands. Also, Watson did not have the angle to have his hand a little more to the right.

I disagree on both points.

So how does Watson close the distance from when the ball was thrown? Did he run faster or did Smith run slower?

Watson had plenty of angle to move his arm to the right and deflect the ball.

7 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

If the receiver needs to slow down

I'm not really seeing him slow down there, he's just turning back to track the ball, but his foot speed seems to remain fairly consistent to me.

2 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

It's a faulty premise that's not borne out by reality, especially when you chose to draw comparisons to the record holder of most interceptions in NFL history.

So you don’t think some of the no look passes, the weird passes don’t have a bit of risk to them just like some of Favre’s throws. Gotcha. We disagree. That’s fine.

3 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

I'm not really seeing him slow down there, he's just turning back to track the ball, but his foot speed seems to remain fairly consistent to me.

Seems.

If two moving objects are two yards apart. Then after a few seconds they are one yard apart, one of them must have changed speeds. Did Watson run faster?

3 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

I disagree on both points.

So how the Watson close the distance from when the ball was thrown? Did he run faster or did Smith run slower?

Watson had plenty of angle to move his arm to the right and deflect the ball.

The DB is always going to be able to run faster if he's solely locked onto the receiver's eyes in catch-up mode and never gets his head around. It's somewhat similar with soccer or basketball, a ball carrier is always going to have his speed limited by the act of dribbling while the trailing defender can focus solely on running as fast as possible to gain ground.

14 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Easy...

It was underthrown. So were the passes to Dotson and Barkley. If the receiver needs to slow down, allowing the defender to catch up, then the ball is underthrown.

To be clear, I was merely responding to ManuManu's assertion that it was a perfect play. The arrogance to make the call was memorable. Smith did everything right. But the pass wasn't "perfect".

The INT was clearly short as well, but that's an obvious one

1 minute ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Seems.

If two moving objects are two yards apart. Then after a few seconds they are one yard apart, one of them must have changed speeds. Did Watson run faster?

Yes, because he's not tracking the ball. Go outside and run a timed 40 yd dash while looking straight ahead and then do it again with your head turned back trying to track a ball while it's in flight.

Slow time of the year, eh? Debating about how perfect that pass was or not was certainly not on my bingo card.

6 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

So you don’t think some of the no look passes, the weird passes don’t have a bit of risk to them just like some of Favre’s throws. Gotcha. We disagree. That’s fine.

They have risk, but in aggregate, they are not nearly as risky as how often Favre would make similar risky throws, especially down field. Mahomes is very good at protecting the ball and has one of the best TD:INT ratios for a reason.