21 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

I'm talking about the people who are saying the article is BS and everyone is claiming anonymous sources so they can push an agenda. The people who are saying that would've eaten up the article if it was a Hurts puff piece. They're just butt hurt it has criticism in it.

Well as I said, in your scenario with sources praising Hurts, the opposite side of things would happen. Hurts haters would call the piece BS with an agenda. Of course, we don't have to wonder about a hypothetical. For one, why would anyone need to go anonymous to say something positive? But we do in fact have articles, quotes, videos from many people praising Hurts. And that gets ignored by the critics.

The sources in the recent article are obviously coming from disgruntled people, definitely Patullo for starters. Shortly after he was demoted/fired like a day or two after there was an "anonymous source" that was painting Patullo in a good light and saying it wasn't his fault. When Patullo was promoted and they asked Hurts about it, he was very unenthusiastic and took a wait and see kind of response, vs Hurts being excited about Mannion. (So the idea is to bring more motion, under center and other things Hurts supposedly doesn't like to do, but Hurts knows this and said with a big smile he's really excited about Mannion, interesting).

We have players, coaches, Howie, Lurie, former teammates and coaches from college, a lot of people on record praising Hurts over the years. But people will gobble up anonymous sources from disgruntled people. There's usually truth in between the narratives. I can see some players not liking if Hurts is stoic and keeps to himself in the locker room. Although, last season there were on record reports from players saying Hurts was spending more time with them. There are videos of Hurts spending more time with teammates on the sidelines, looking at the tablet more, celebrating with teammates in the locker room. But those on record quotes and videos don't get considered, yet people will believe anonymous sources who won't go on record but just want to bash him.

53 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Brandon Grahams big announcement is he's launching his own sheety hard seltzer

34 minutes ago, hputenis said:

I think the way these QBs are being groomed also has a huge part in this. While still receiving mega-contracts, none of these QBs are pro-ready. There aren't any current QBs that seem to scan the field and shred defenses apart from Mahomes (who I'd even question after his last few years). College coaches go after and teach their QBs to be athletes to help them win now, but these guys are not NFL QBs. They are typically 1-read and take-off QBs.

2nd part to this - NFL franchises no longer have patience to groom a QB. Peyton Manning was thrown to the wolves his rookie year with all the security in the world. "Get all the bugs out of your system" was the longest leash ever. There is no patience for that type of a season anymore. If you're not producing at a high/serviceable level in your rookie year, teams are already looking for replacement possibilities.

So this is an interesting post, and in line with what a lot of people have said about the more recent progression of college QBs to the NFL. It's been a conversation for a long time. Tom Brady has said this for a few years now as well.

So you're saying there aren't any other QBs besides Mahomes (perhaps we can include a couple others?) who scan the field and shred defenses apart. Yet, we criticize Hurts for being a 1-2 read QB who can't read defenses. But if we're also saying that there aren't any other QBs out there who do that, and college QBs aren't being trained that way...it begs the question, why are we so harsh on Hurts? If he's like the other QBs and the ones who scan the defense are more rare, and there aren't options in college coming out who do that because it's kind of an obsolete thing...then it doesn't make sense to be so critical of Hurts for not doing it when you look at the landscape of NFL QBs. Hurts at least has a winning record, would have been the MVP of his first SB had they won, was an MVP runner up in 2022, and won the SB MVP the year they won (which I recognize we won because of defense and they gave it to the QB).

It seems then, given these circumstances, for a team to have good coaching and a system that can plug and play a QB to execute it. Which sounds like going to what college used to be instead of having more traditional NFL QBs who were the most important player on the team and carried their franchises. That's one reason (plus financial reason) why I think there could be more of a trend to not overpay QBs the same high contracts. If you can win with a cheaper option or a QB on a rookie deal plugging into a solid roster with good coaching that may be a new model.

But again, if no other QB in the NFL besides Mahomes can scan and shred a defense, why then so critical of Hurts compared to other QBs around the league who haven't won ish?

41 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

So, trying to digest all these competing story lines, here's my best guess on things.

1. Looking back, it seemed like things were doomed to fail on offense from the jump due to (i) coaching and (ii) injuries on the line. But what is very clear is Jalen was never really a fan of KP, and that was evident in how he reacted to the news he was promoted (as compared to his reaction this year to Mannion). For better or worse, it seems Jalen tunes out coaches he doesn't respect/like, and I think that was the case with KP from the start. Jalen got along well with Saban and didn't really take offense to the benching - Saban is known for coaching guys hard. Steichen seemingly coached him hard and got his best play. Moore, according to reports, also pushed back on him. I think the simple answer is Jalen needs coaches that will push him out of his comfort zone, and he has to respect that those coaches have answers. He never had that respect for KP, and it showed. Should he have had more respect for KP - yeah, ideally he would. But it's not like KP showed a ton of competence.

2. We basically tried to change the offense on the fly last year - more under center, more play action, etc. Jalen hasn't had a ton of experience with those concepts, and I don't think he's comfortable doing things that he hasn't repped or practiced a ton. He's just not a guy you can add new concepts with quickly - if you're negative, you'd say he learns slowly, if you're a fan, it's that he wants to perfect things. Either way, this isn't a QB where you can make massive in season changes on the fly, IMO.

3. I don't for a single second believe Jalen called 4 verts. And if he did, then it's a bigger indictment of the coaching that they went along with it.

4. This is 100% a put up or shut up year for Hurts. They've brought in a new offense, and he'll have all offseason to learn it. Mannion, Grizzard and Johnson - that's a ton of help to try and teach him the new system. If the offense flounders again this year, the Eagles will not extend him and likely look to move him next offseason (via trade, if he waives the NTC). If he excels, then he's getting a large extension and is the QB of the future.

After this year, AJ is basically out of gteed money (if he isn't traded before then), Barkley is basically out of gteed money and Jalen only has a partial guarantee for 2027. The upcoming offseason was always going to be a potential reset on offense.

Agree with all this.

24 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Seems bizarre given they guaranteed Elliott's money this offseason.

From what I recall, it was just a move to take guaranteed money they would have to pay in future years, reduce it down to a lower amount and pay it all this year. I think that actually makes it easier to move on from him if I'm not mistaken. But @LeanMeanGM explained it and can clarify.

46 minutes ago, RLC said:

100% this. Clearly a Patullo article.

Moreover, the "4 Verts" comments both doesn't pass the smell test as we watched the video AND it's not like we can't find tons of examples of Jalen audibling into the right plays.

As one team source recalled, Hurts was the one who recommended four verts. A separate source with knowledge of the situation says that though the Eagles' quarterback did suggest it, he was simply responding to a question about his preferences.

2 separate sources

31 minutes ago, NOTW said:

From what I recall, it was just a move to take guaranteed money they would have to pay in future years, reduce it down to a lower amount and pay it all this year. I think that actually makes it easier to move on from him if I'm not mistaken. But @LeanMeanGM explained it and can clarify.

Do you mean this year or next? Next year, sure. But it makes it more costly to move on from him this year.

1 hour ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Brandon Grahams big announcement is he's launching his own sheety hard seltzer

7 minutes ago, paco said:

Do you mean this year or next? Next year, sure. But it makes it more costly to move on from him this year.

IIRC, all that happened was Jake took $1mm less this year to get it fully guaranteed. Reduces the dead money to move on after this year by ~$800k.

Just now, vikas83 said:

IIRC, all that happened was Jake took $1mm less this year to get it fully guaranteed. Reduces the dead money to move on after this year by ~$800k.

That's what I remember. He took a small pay cut but they guaranteed everything for 2026 so they are basically locked into him for this year. So it is a bit weird they are spending so much time on a guy who won't be here. They would have to trade Elliott to move on.

2 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

That's what I remember. He took a small pay cut but they guaranteed everything for 2026 so they are basically locked into him for this year. So it is a bit weird they are spending so much time on a guy who won't be here. They would have to trade Elliott to move on.

Or carry 2 kickers on the 53, which would be...interesting.

10 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

IIRC, all that happened was Jake took $1mm less this year to get it fully guaranteed. Reduces the dead money to move on after this year by ~$800k.

Yup. So hurts more to move on from him this year vs if they didn't touch his contract.

Lurie tells Howie that they can't get rid of Jake because of the guaranteed money.

Howie whistles for Big Dom to come into the room

"What if there should be an unfortunate accident?"

1 hour ago, NOTW said:

So this is an interesting post, and in line with what a lot of people have said about the more recent progression of college QBs to the NFL. It's been a conversation for a long time. Tom Brady has said this for a few years now as well.

So you're saying there aren't any other QBs besides Mahomes (perhaps we can include a couple others?) who scan the field and shred defenses apart. Yet, we criticize Hurts for being a 1-2 read QB who can't read defenses. But if we're also saying that there aren't any other QBs out there who do that, and college QBs aren't being trained that way...it begs the question, why are we so harsh on Hurts? If he's like the other QBs and the ones who scan the defense are more rare, and there aren't options in college coming out who do that because it's kind of an obsolete thing...then it doesn't make sense to be so critical of Hurts for not doing it when you look at the landscape of NFL QBs. Hurts at least has a winning record, would have been the MVP of his first SB had they won, was an MVP runner up in 2022, and won the SB MVP the year they won (which I recognize we won because of defense and they gave it to the QB).

It seems then, given these circumstances, for a team to have good coaching and a system that can plug and play a QB to execute it. Which sounds like going to what college used to be instead of having more traditional NFL QBs who were the most important player on the team and carried their franchises. That's one reason (plus financial reason) why I think there could be more of a trend to not overpay QBs the same high contracts. If you can win with a cheaper option or a QB on a rookie deal plugging into a solid roster with good coaching that may be a new model.

But again, if no other QB in the NFL besides Mahomes can scan and shred a defense, why then so critical of Hurts compared to other QBs around the league who haven't won ish?

Good counterpoint and question. Maybe I throw Burrow into that category as well. And while the majority of them can’t do it like the franchise QBs used to, I think they do it a lot better than Hurts over the span of a season. My stance has always been that Hurts is an anomaly on the big stage. His 2 SB’s and NFCC game are the 3 best games of his career, and I’ll treasure him for that for the rest of my life. Other than his "MVP” season, he has regressed. His SB win was a season of the run and the best OL play I’ve ever seen. They literally took the ball out of his hands to start winning. All he had to do was not F up. Then he took his game to another level those last 2 games.

This is where I’m at a crossroads because I think half the QBs in the league would take this offense to another level with the weapons and OL we’ve had. But would they choke when it matters? No idea. Oh…and

27 minutes ago, vikas83 said:

IIRC, all that happened was Jake took $1mm less this year to get it fully guaranteed. Reduces the dead money to move on after this year by ~$800k.

Reading into all of this too much and over-analyzing, but that's the point of the blog. With that disclaimer said, it doesn't speak highly to his confidence or self-expected trajectory that he'd take a $1mm haircut get get his money guaranteed.

I don't get it with Jake Elliott. He is, IMO, the best kicker in franchise history. In the past, he's had ice in his veins for the biggest, longest kicks. All of the biggest kicks in franchise history are his, not Akers. With the way he's performed in multiple SB's, I really can't question anything between the ears on him...yet how has he fallen off a cliff at a very young age for kickers?

5 minutes ago, hputenis said:

Good counterpoint and question. Maybe I throw Burrow into that category as well. And while the majority of them can’t do it like the franchise QBs used to, I think they do it a lot better than Hurts over the span of a season. My stance has always been that Hurts is an anomaly on the big stage. His 2 SB’s and NFCC game are the 3 best games of his career, and I’ll treasure him for that for the rest of my life. Other than his "MVP” season, he has regressed. His SB win was a season of the run and the best OL play I’ve ever seen. They literally took the ball out of his hands to start winning. All he had to do was not F up. Then he took his game to another level those last 2 games.

This is where I’m at a crossroads because I think half the QBs in the league would take this offense to another level with the weapons and OL we’ve had. But would they choke when it matters? No idea. Oh…and

Your last point is what makes this all so fascinating. Let's run through the top QBs:

Allen - never could conquer the Chiefs in the playoffs, and then this year lost to Bo freaking Nix. Physically, he might be the most talented QB in the game, but his inability to get it done this year, without Mahomes in his way, is really telling.

Lamar - ESPN ranked the Ravens' roster as better than the Eagles going into 2025, and he still managed to miss the playoffs.

Burrow - basically lives off beating Mahomes in the 2021 AFCCG. Top flight wideouts and can't make the playoffs. Meanwhile Hurts made it with our train wreck of a defense in 2023.

Herbert - don't make me laugh

All of those guys are more talented than Hurts, will put up better stats, etc. But none of them delivered in big moments. It's why in my mind, the QB hierarchy is basically Mahomes by himself, and then let arguments ensue.

3 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

I don't get it with Jake Elliott. He is, IMO, the best kicker in franchise history. In the past, he's had ice in his veins for the biggest, longest kicks. All of the biggest kicks in franchise history are his, not Akers. With the way he's performed in multiple SB's, I really can't question anything between the ears on him...yet how has he fallen off a cliff at a very young age for kickers?

He's not that young. Out of guys under contract, there are only 8 older than him. And of those 8 only 1 has been with his original team his whole career.

36 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

That's what I remember. He took a small pay cut but they guaranteed everything for 2026 so they are basically locked into him for this year. So it is a bit weird they are spending so much time on a guy who won't be here. They would have to trade Elliott to move on.

Package him with picks for Myles Garrett!

Thanks for SB LII, Stephon

18 minutes ago, hputenis said:

Good counterpoint and question. Maybe I throw Burrow into that category as well. And while the majority of them can’t do it like the franchise QBs used to, I think they do it a lot better than Hurts over the span of a season. My stance has always been that Hurts is an anomaly on the big stage. His 2 SB’s and NFCC game are the 3 best games of his career, and I’ll treasure him for that for the rest of my life. Other than his "MVP” season, he has regressed. His SB win was a season of the run and the best OL play I’ve ever seen. They literally took the ball out of his hands to start winning. All he had to do was not F up. Then he took his game to another level those last 2 games.

This is where I’m at a crossroads because I think half the QBs in the league would take this offense to another level with the weapons and OL we’ve had. But would they choke when it matters? No idea. Oh…and

I get that, and I've been critical of Hurts as well. He does miss open receivers, he sometimes fixates on a receiving option, he's made some boneheaded throws & turnovers. But he's also made great plays, has gone through reads, has thrown to the middle, has done well on plays under center, has called audibles that led to great plays and is clutch in big games.

Because he's not a top passer, it's not so clear cut. So he needs an OC to scheme to his strengths. Given the contract, everyone recognizes this is the last year for excuses. They're ready to move to McVay/Shanahan scheme, new coaches, new blocking schemes. Be on board or be gone.

Oh and...when you're nasty to me it only turns me on more.

5 hours ago, pallidrone said:

So he is both alive and dead?

Yup. Or, in this scenario... he's either the answer to the RT conundrum, or he's not.

2 hours ago, Sack that QB said:

Seems bizarre given they guaranteed Elliott's money this offseason.

I was told they cannot bring in competition against Elliott.