3 hours ago, E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles said:

It goes so much further than that.  When a team gives up what it did to draft a franchise altering QB, and then fails, the issues last far longer than one year and digs deeper than finances.  Just remember all of those picks we gave up. I wouldn't expect you to understand the depth of large scale organizational investments and how they make or break the best teams.

It's far better for the Eagles to solve the Wentz riddle and commit to him.  BUT, you may be right, HE may be done with them.  At that point, he should do whatever it takes to get away from this awful organization and its silly fans. The Eagles will be the ones that regret that move.

They have up what? A first, a second and a fourth? They recouped the first and fourth by trading Bradford. They gained an extra second after winning the SB by trading back. So let's not pretend that it was this huge haul that they gave up and didn't have any picks.

And whether a team gives up a lot or not the wrong player is the wrong player. If Wentz isn't the guy then I agree it's a complete mess but guess what? It's a complete mess. 

5 hours ago, ShutDownDB said:

Yep Carson is so bad that's why Agholor is all-pro now, right? Oh wait nevermind dude is still average. For the record Pinkston and Thrash would be a massive upgrade over what they have now. But please keep reaching and moving goal posts cause that's all you have.

Still won with Torrance Small, Charles Johnson, Darnel Autry, and Dorsey Levens when he was cooked. Wentz has one double digit winning season and you boys are creaming yourselves. It’s a joke. For the record Nelson participated in and won a Super Bowl. Your Ginger Jesus watched the Super Bowl. 

11 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Still won with Torrance Small, Charles Johnson, Darnel Autry, and Dorsey Levens when he was cooked. Wentz has one double digit winning season and you boys are creaming yourselves. It’s a joke. For the record Nelson participated in and won a Super Bowl. Your Ginger Jesus watched the Super Bowl. 

And again attaching wins and losses to the QB, so weak. You'll get it one of these days, I have faith in you bud.

2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

They have up what? A first, a second and a fourth? They recouped the first and fourth by trading Bradford. They gained an extra second after winning the SB by trading back. So let's not pretend that it was this huge haul that they gave up and didn't have any picks.

And whether a team gives up a lot or not the wrong player is the wrong player. If Wentz isn't the guy then I agree it's a complete mess but guess what? It's a complete mess. 

The regression of Carson only adds to this mess right now. His fall has almost been as quick as his rise. The guy three years ago was considered a top three player in football, and now he’s one of the worse quarterbacks in football. There’s a lot of factors to his demise, but the fact the Eagles can’t count on Wentz after they have put so much into him has to be frustrating for the entire organization. 

1 minute ago, ShutDownDB said:

And again attaching wins and losses to the QB, so weak. You'll get it one of these days, I have faith in you bud.

Okay let’s look at his numbers. He’s one of the worst quarterbacks in football and a rookie who everyone (especially Wentz apologists) says is a running back throwing a football looked better than him with the same crap players you fantasy’s are whining about. Anyways it goes back to the original point. Carson NEEDS ELLITE TALENT AROUND HIM! 

3 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Okay let’s look at his numbers. He’s one of the worst quarterbacks in football and a rookie who everyone (especially Wentz apologists) says is a running back throwing a football looked better than him with the same crap players you fantasy’s are whining about. Anyways it goes back to the original point. Carson NEEDS ELLITE TALENT AROUND HIM! 

Yea we got derailed a bit and I agree that Carson was putrid this season. When they made the switch to Hurts I expected the offense to look better for the simple fact that that a QBs who can move around like him put extra stress on a defense. 

We can go round and round posting about WRs this or Carson that, and I don't wanna do it anymore and frankly I don't come here to argue with you guys. My bottom line has been and will continue to be that yes Carson was bad bad this year but all this talk of trading him after 1 bad year is a bit early. If he stinks it up again next year, absolutely ship him out. Hel I'll pack all his ish for him.

11 minutes ago, ShutDownDB said:

Yea we got derailed a bit and I agree that Carson was putrid this season. When they made the switch to Hurts I expected the offense to look better for the simple fact that that a QBs who can move around like him put extra stress on a defense. 

We can go round and round posting about WRs this or Carson that, and I don't wanna do it anymore and frankly I don't come here to argue with you guys. My bottom line has been and will continue to be that yes Carson was bad bad this year but all this talk of trading him after 1 bad year is a bit early. If he stinks it up again next year, absolutely ship him out. Hel I'll pack all his ish for him.

It is bigger than this season and the Eagles know it. Statistically in 2018 Carson was better than 2017, but there was a lack in the big plays that made 2017 in particular with his running. In 2019 there was a lot of up and down play until he finally kind of got better near the end of the season against three teams that quit on their coaches. This year there was a host of problems, but I will say that the Eagles don’t draft Hurts in the second round if they’re 100% all in on Wentz. The Eagles are the ones who created the doubt in Wentz by their own actions. They drafted Hurts before Wentz had this season so clearly in their minds they had doubts before Carson had a 2020 stink bomb. 

13 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

It is bigger than this season and the Eagles know it. Statistically in 2018 Carson was better than 2017, but there was a lack in the big plays that made 2017 in particular with his running. In 2019 there was a lot of up and down play until he finally kind of got better near the end of the season against three teams that quit on their coaches. This year there was a host of problems, but I will say that the Eagles don’t draft Hurts in the second round if they’re 100% all in on Wentz. The Eagles are the ones who created the doubt in Wentz by their own actions. They drafted Hurts before Wentz had this season so clearly in their minds they had doubts before Carson had a 2020 stink bomb. 

Not sure I buy that to be honest. Going by stats alone Carson had his 2nd highest completion %, most yards and 2nd highest TDs. You say there was some up and down play I won't argue that, but there is no way Howie could see him becoming the worst QB in the NFL.

To this day the Hurts pick is still baffling, especially with all the holes on the roster. 

1 hour ago, ShutDownDB said:

Not sure I buy that to be honest. Going by stats alone Carson had his 2nd highest completion %, most yards and 2nd highest TDs. You say there was some up and down play I won't argue that, but there is no way Howie could see him becoming the worst QB in the NFL.

To this day the Hurts pick is still baffling, especially with all the holes on the roster. 

In the beginning of 2018, Carson was considered a top five player. He was in the top 5 voted by other players in the league. By  the start of the 2020 season he wasn’t even on that list according to his peers. I remember in 2019 his back to back stink bombs against the Seahawks and Patriots. The year before he got destroyed by the Saints. His numbers were awful in that game. The truth is as his contract escalates the less likely the Eagles can afford to have talent around him. Carson’s best game to me over the past three seasons was the Green Bay game and most of that was due to the fact he didn’t try to force things, and play hero ball. He managed the game. The reason Carson got hurt against the Seahawks was because he was trying to be a hero and make something out of nothing. Carson hasn’t been 2017 Carson for a long time now. 
 

On a side note a lot of people like to minimize the impact of the quarterback to the win/loss record especially when their favorite guy is losing. I find that interesting considering many people hold Carson most responsible for the 2017 season. He gets the praise for the wins and excuses for the losses. Look other than the center the quarterback touches the ball the most of any player on the team. On average a quarterback throws the football between 30-50 times a game. To act like the play of a quarterback has no bearing on wins and losses is a joke. There’s a reason why quarterbacks get paid the most. It’s not cause they are irrelevant. 

10 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Sounds like Wentz... Difference being Hurts is a whole lot cheaper. 

Yup. I remember wentz being a whole lot more effective when he used his legs. Now that it seems like his scrambling is gone, so is half the talent.

Just now, EagleMatt said:

Yup. I remember wentz being a whole lot more effective when he used his legs. Now that it seems like his scrambling is gone, so is half the talent.

But I think some knew this? They knew that Carson is not a pure pocket passer but due to those injuries they want to keep him in the pocket. And he's not the same in terms of agility etc so to have a longer career he needs to be someone he's not. 

7 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

But I think some knew this? They knew that Carson is not a pure pocket passer but due to those injuries they want to keep him in the pocket. And he's not the same in terms of agility etc so to have a longer career he needs to be someone he's not. 

I still go back to what we know. We know Doug has asked both Foles and Hurts what plays they liked to run so how in the world can we think he didn’t do that for Wentz especially during a time he was struggling? We also know Carson’s Buddy installs the gameplan so are we really going to believe he’s setting Carson up for failure too knowing it could cost him his job? No here’s the truth. Carson is running the plays he wants to run. I don’t think there’s been a quarterback in Eagles history whose made more audibles and line checks than Carson too. 

2 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

I still go back to what we know. We know Doug has asked both Foles and Hurts what plays they liked to run so how in the world can we think he didn’t do that for Wentz especially during a time he was struggling? We also know Carson’s Buddy installs the gameplan so are we really going to believe he’s setting Carson up for failure too knowing it could cost him his job? No here’s the truth. Carson is running the plays he wants to run. I don’t think there’s been a quarterback in Eagles history whose made more audibles and line checks than Carson too. 

Yep completely agree. I don't know why we think that Doug works his offense for Foles and Hurts but not for Carson. It's complete nonsense let's be honest. The truth is, Carson is what he is. He's capable of the sublime but equally he's just as likely to produce the ridiculous. He's an up and down QB and to be honest bar 2017 has been throughout his NFL career to this point. 

5 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Yep completely agree. I don't know why we think that Doug works his offense for Foles and Hurts but not for Carson. It's complete nonsense let's be honest. The truth is, Carson is what he is. He's capable of the sublime but equally he's just as likely to produce the ridiculous. He's an up and down QB and to be honest bar 2017 has been throughout his NFL career to this point. 

When you have a quarterback with shaky mechanics who mostly relied on his athleticism to make plays, but now that player loses the athleticism, all you have left is shaky mechanics. There should be no surprise to anyone that Carson is an up and down quarterback. 

49 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

When you have a quarterback with shaky mechanics who mostly relied on his athleticism to make plays, but now that player loses the athleticism, all you have left is shaky mechanics. There should be no surprise to anyone that Carson is an up and down quarterback. 

Yep. And he's not going to be fixed, not properly anyway. He may bounce back, he may have a few good games but those will be followed by more bad games and so on. 

6 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Yep. And he's not going to be fixed, not properly anyway. He may bounce back, he may have a few good games but those will be followed by more bad games and so on. 

Carson needs to change his game like Big Ben did. Trying really hard the wrong way will not fix his problems. 

17 hours ago, Portyansky said:

 

I guess we'll see in the next couple days. Bc if his time is truly up in Philly, this should be handled immediately. Not holding my breath...

I am going to agree with this right here. I see NO reason they should drag this out.....it should be handled immediately

I guess its Backup QB Syndrome (or just Negadelphia), but I continue to be shocked at how many people want to roll with a QB widely projected to be a 5th round project.  All of the sudden, we are supposed to believe that Howie got this one right.  Wrong!

1 hour ago, E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles said:

I guess its Backup QB Syndrome (or just Negadelphia), but I continue to be shocked at how many people want to roll with a QB widely projected to be a 5th round project.  All of the sudden, we are supposed to believe that Howie got this one right.  Wrong!

I know you say Hurts is not the franchise and have watched him but I want to see more of him before I say he is not the one. I didn't really know anything about him until recently and I can't say anything for sure after just three games so I am going to hold off on passing judgement just yet.....

2 hours ago, E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles said:

I guess its Backup QB Syndrome (or just Negadelphia), but I continue to be shocked at how many people want to roll with a QB widely projected to be a 5th round project.  All of the sudden, we are supposed to believe that Howie got this one right.  Wrong!

I don’t know why you’re going to base your opinion on draft media guys projection, but if we’re playing that game Daniel Jeremiah had him ranked #50. 

What are the other options right now? Wentz’s issues/projection has been beaten to death. Zero cap room to sign any other guys in FA, and I don’t see any NFL QB that’ll be potentially available via trade that’d be worth it. And we don’t know where Eagles will fall in the draft order, or who will be available & if they’re worth taking.

Hurts has played in 3 games now. looked decent against one of the best defenses, played sharp against Arizona & was one Goedert dive away from getting a win, then had highs and lows against Dallas. We’ll see about tomorrow. You invested a 2nd round pick in the guy, it’s not unreasonable to see if he has what it takes to be the guy. Howie may have many misses, but he occasionally does hit. This could be one of them but we won’t know unless they give him a shot. 

Next season we will have fans, he will be boo’d by week 3 right out the stadium if he plays anywhere near how he did this year.

4 hours ago, E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles said:

I guess its Backup QB Syndrome (or just Negadelphia), but I continue to be shocked at how many people want to roll with a QB widely projected to be a 5th round project.  All of the sudden, we are supposed to believe that Howie got this one right.  Wrong!

Has nothing to do with Hurts.  We don’t know what he is yet.

We do know that Wentz is a proven failure so no matter what Hurts ends up doing, Carson needs to go.

 

8 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

Carson needs to change his game like Big Ben did. Trying really hard the wrong way will not fix his problems. 

Maybe he does but that takes away from the player he was. Can he play from the pocket? I think he can but at an elite level? Absolutely not. 

https://nfltraderumors.co/carson-wentz-expected-to-request-trade-this-offseason/

If true, buh bye. I don't want guys on the team that don't want to be here