seengreen Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 The performance of the secondary is at times a cumulative effort based on the defensive scheme and players in the system. Teams with years long great defense know how to draft and whom to draft. They place emphasis on position and how that player fits in their defense. The Pittsburg's, the Seattle's, the Baltimore's always have hard hitting great Linebacking and great Dline play. Which really helps their secondary. They also give them the opportunity to make plays because of the pressure. They have been able to develop their lesser drafted players to become contributors. The Eagles used to be able to do this before with Andy. They have lost their way and it's going to have to hit bottom before it's blown up to start over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleVA Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 6 hours ago, Portyansky said: I disagree it was very difficult. He turned his head had plenty of time to track it, This is crazy talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK_EaglesFan89 Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 I do find it really hard to decide where I sit with the fire Schwartz situation. On the one hand all of the stats and rankings suggest he is doing a good job. The defense tends to be ranked fairly well in a number of categories. And that's all despite a defense that overall lacks elite talent. On the other hand there are absolutely issues with this defense and I think Schwartz has to take a lot of the blame for that. There are real issues with this scheme that lead to the same issues being exploited time and time again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManchesterEagle Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 On 10/19/2020 at 7:54 PM, seengreen said: The performance of the secondary is at times a cumulative effort based on the defensive scheme and players in the system. Teams with years long great defense know how to draft and whom to draft. They place emphasis on position and how that player fits in their defense. The Pittsburg's, the Seattle's, the Baltimore's always have hard hitting great Linebacking and great Dline play. Which really helps their secondary. They also give them the opportunity to make plays because of the pressure. They have been able to develop their lesser drafted players to become contributors. The Eagles used to be able to do this before with Andy. They have lost their way and it's going to have to hit bottom before it's blown up to start over. On 10/20/2020 at 10:14 AM, UK_EaglesFan89 said: I do find it really hard to decide where I sit with the fire Schwartz situation. On the one hand all of the stats and rankings suggest he is doing a good job. The defense tends to be ranked fairly well in a number of categories. And that's all despite a defense that overall lacks elite talent. On the other hand there are absolutely issues with this defense and I think Schwartz has to take a lot of the blame for that. There are real issues with this scheme that lead to the same issues being exploited time and time again. I've said before it might be time to move on from Schwartz, both parties may want to part ways. But the main issue on this D is not Schwartz, it's lack of talent. Over the past 5 years the Eagles have used 2 top 3 picks to draft defensive players (Douglas was a compensatory pick). 2 players out of a potential 15. That's not nearly enough. People were complaining quite rightly last year that Wentz had very little to work with at wide receiver. That was true, but he did have elite tight ends and a very good line and RBs. Schwartz has overachieved with the talent on this D for the past 4 years. This year it's not working so far. It may be time to move on and indeed Schwartz may not want to stay. But don't expect a fast improvement with a new DC without a serious influx of talent. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runtherock Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 I’d like to see what this guy could do with some real talent. It feels like he’s always having to strategize around what he doesn’t have. I don’t love him, hate the passive nature of his defenses, but that may be the result of having bad linebackers and an at best average secondary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad67 Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 3 hours ago, Runtherock said: I’d like to see what this guy could do with some real talent. It feels like he’s always having to strategize around what he doesn’t have. I don’t love him, hate the passive nature of his defenses, but that may be the result of having bad linebackers and an at best average secondary. But don't you think that having bad LBs is the result of that he as D coordinator doesn't value them? ...We had pretty good LBs just 2 years ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Philly Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 The problem I have with Schwartz is a lot of times I question his decisions. How many times do we have to watch the O struggle to take the lead in a hard fought game and the D just gives up points on the next opponent’s possession. I really hate when the D comes out after half time and you want them to set the tone for the second half but they immediately give up points. When you think they should blitz they lay back, when you think they should lay back and not attack he will blitz, it’s frustrating as hell to watch at times. And don’t even get me started on the stick D, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eglz1 Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 6 hours ago, Runtherock said: I’d like to see what this guy could do with some real talent. It feels like he’s always having to strategize around what he doesn’t have. I don’t love him, hate the passive nature of his defenses, but that may be the result of having bad linebackers and an at best average secondary. I suspect he needs talent that fits his scheme. L J Fort and Douglas have no talent? They seem to be doing okay with their new teams. Would a defense with 8 Pro Bowl level players on it be better? Most likely but that ain't realistic. Using the players he has to their best effect doesn't seem to be a strong suite. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runtherock Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 11 hours ago, Vlad67 said: But don't you think that having bad LBs is the result of that he as D coordinator doesn't value them? ...We had pretty good LBs just 2 years ago Probably so. I hold him responsible for many of the D personnel decisions as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runtherock Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 7 hours ago, eglz1 said: I suspect he needs talent that fits his scheme. L J Fort and Douglas have no talent? They seem to be doing okay with their new teams. Would a defense with 8 Pro Bowl level players on it be better? Most likely but that ain't realistic. Using the players he has to their best effect doesn't seem to be a strong suite. No its not, agreed, but there’s also a universe of talent between Pro Bowl players and the linebackers we have on this team, and many D backs as well.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 1 minute ago, Runtherock said: Probably so. I hold him responsible for many of the D personnel decisions as well. I don’t know if that’s the case really. Historically Schwartz has had decent enough linebackers. I don’t think he’s ever had a groups this young even in Philly. I think that Howie choose to invest more money in the line and sacrificed the linebackers to do so. Heck we had decent linebackers during the SB run. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtfcares Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 11 hours ago, Runtherock said: Probably so. I hold him responsible for many of the D personnel decisions as well. Do you hold Doug responsible for the O personnel decisions? Do you think Schwartz decided himself to leave a likely pro bowl player in Patrick Queen on the board, draft a WR instead and then be left with a bunch of undrafted players at LBs in his own defense? Do you think Schwartz decided to use all our 1st and 2nd round picks in the last 3 drafts on the offense? You can hate Schwartz’ play calls and style of play on the field all you want. But to say that HE CHOSE to have late round/undrafted players starting at half his Defense positions is comical. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManchesterEagle Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 12 hours ago, EazyEaglez said: I don’t know if that’s the case really. Historically Schwartz has had decent enough linebackers. I don’t think he’s ever had a groups this young even in Philly. I think that Howie choose to invest more money in the line and sacrificed the linebackers to do so. Heck we had decent linebackers during the SB run. 44 minutes ago, wtfcares said: Do you hold Doug responsible for the O personnel decisions? Do you think Schwartz decided himself to leave a likely pro bowl player in Patrick Queen on the board, draft a WR instead and then be left with a bunch of undrafted players at LBs in his own defense? Do you think Schwartz decided to use all our 1st and 2nd round picks in the last 3 drafts on the offense? You can hate Schwartz’ play calls and style of play on the field all you want. But to say that HE CHOSE to have late round/undrafted players starting at half his Defense positions is comical. Yeah this is BS from Schwartz haters. The D played really well tonight. Yes the rookie QB was shocking but the O put them in hole after hole and they gave up next to nothing. Schwartz has been overachieving with this D for years. They haven’t been good this year, up to this game and it may be time for both sides to move on at the end of the year, but those who have been calling for Schwartz’s head for years may get a shock when he moves on and the D sucks. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK_EaglesFan89 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, ManchesterEagle said: The D played really well tonight. Yes the rookie QB was shocking but the O put them in hole after hole and they gave up next to nothing. 3 FGs given up all night... When Wentz turns the ball over 4 times? And the offense turned it over on downs a couple of times too? Yeah that D balled out yesterday. Against an offense that sure their QB was bad but that offense has weapons and in the NFL you'll still get plays with those weapons. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, ManchesterEagle said: Yeah this is BS from Schwartz haters. The D played really well tonight. Yes the rookie QB was shocking but the O put them in hole after hole and they gave up next to nothing. Schwartz has been overachieving with this D for years. They haven’t been good this year, up to this game and it may be time for both sides to move on at the end of the year, but those who have been calling for Schwartz’s head for years may get a shock when he moves on and the D sucks. I do think he may have outstayed his welcome in Philadelphia, but Howie has more to do with the way this roster has been built than anyone else. I don’t know why people are working so hard to ignore this though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said: 3 FGs given up all night... When Wentz turns the ball over 4 times? And the offense turned it over on downs a couple of times too? Yeah that D balled out yesterday. Against an offense that sure their QB was bad but that offense has weapons and in the NFL you'll still get plays with those weapons. I do have to take some of the defenses "balling out” with some caution. Let’s be honest here they weren’t playing an NFL quarterback and that guy was missing easy throws. That’s what is most humbling about this game considering his numbers weren’t as bad as Carson’s were despite he was going up against A BETTER DEFENSE THAN THE ONE CARSON WAS AGAINST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK_EaglesFan89 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: I do have to take some of the defenses "balling out” with some caution. Let’s be honest here they weren’t playing an NFL quarterback and that guy was missing easy throws I don't dispute that. I'm not going to laud this defense as some great defense. But it did its job. It held an offense with weapons to 9 points and it did what it had to do. They deserve credit for that even if that's what we'd expect. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said: I don't dispute that. I'm not going to laud this defense as some great defense. But it did its job. It held an offense with weapons to 9 points and it did what it had to do. They deserve credit for that even if that's what we'd expect. They made the plays when they needed to. The end score is very misleading from this game though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK_EaglesFan89 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 33 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: They made the plays when they needed to. The end score is very misleading from this game though. In terms of how many points we scored it is yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cochis_Calhoun Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 hour ago, EazyEaglez said: I do have to take some of the defenses "balling out” with some caution. Let’s be honest here they weren’t playing an NFL quarterback and that guy was missing easy throws. That’s what is most humbling about this game considering his numbers weren’t as bad as Carson’s were despite he was going up against A BETTER DEFENSE THAN THE ONE CARSON WAS AGAINST. This pretty much sums it up, our offense should've run wild against what is a historically bad Cowgirls defense, instead we turned it over 4 times and could only manage 2 offensive scores, conversely if Dalton had been in there, Dallas might have pulled that game out, instead our secondary was given the night off by Dallas Luke Falk. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK_EaglesFan89 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Just now, Cochis_Calhoun said: This pretty much sums it up, our offense should've run wild against what is a historically bad Cowgirls defense, instead we turned it over 4 times and could only manage 2 offensive scores, conversely if Dalton had been in there, Dallas might have pulled that game out, instead our secondary was given the night off by Dallas Luke Falk. Don't forget the 4th down turnovers too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said: Don't forget the 4th down turnovers too. Just incredibly inept offense against a historically bad defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK_EaglesFan89 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 18 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: Just incredibly inept offense against a historically bad defense. I feel like it's almost beyond inept. And I'm sorry but there's no real excuse for this one. Reagor and Goedert were back. Fulgham is a legit WR. Ward we know is solid. Rodgers is an OK TE. I mean these aren't the scrub receivers that some fans want to make out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoconoDon Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Schwartz doesn't have a ton to work with, but that's no excuse for what he asks them to do, which is play to their weaknesses and allow the opposing Offense to dictate the terms while our defense merely reacts. Too passive by his very nature, and for that, he must go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 33 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said: I feel like it's almost beyond inept. And I'm sorry but there's no real excuse for this one. Reagor and Goedert were back. Fulgham is a legit WR. Ward we know is solid. Rodgers is an OK TE. I mean these aren't the scrub receivers that some fans want to make out. There was the pass to Ward he threw before the attempted touchdown to Reagor at the end of the game and he threw it to him and got him lit up. Two guys were baring down on Ward and as soon as he caught it they blasted him. Way to protect your guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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