August 26, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Mike31mt said: Yes that massive 44% approval rating. Those are ratings you just cant buy! It’ll be good enough to beat the clown.
August 26, 20223 yr Author PPP was the right thing to do, but the way the money was disbursed was just unconscionably irresponsible...kinda like student loans!
August 26, 20223 yr Just now, EaglesRocker97 said: PPP was the right thing to do, but the way the money was disbursed was just unconscionably irresponsible...kinda like student loans! It was totally bananas. Basically, any company could get a loan and get it forgiven. But that's how it was designed. A few of our portfolio companies used it and it was a real lifeline to keep people employed. But basically every HF took money too because...well, they qualified. And HF managers aren't stupid -- they'll take free money if it is offered. The simpler solution would have been to give money to the payroll processors to keep checks going out for employees, but exempt certain businesses or employees. But...that would have required thought. Government doesn't do that.
August 26, 20223 yr 24 minutes ago, EaglesRocker97 said: PPP was the right thing to do, but the way the money was disbursed was just unconscionably irresponsible...kinda like student loans! 20 minutes ago, vikas83 said: It was totally bananas. Basically, any company could get a loan and get it forgiven. But that's how it was designed. A few of our portfolio companies used it and it was a real lifeline to keep people employed. But basically every HF took money too because...well, they qualified. And HF managers aren't stupid -- they'll take free money if it is offered. The simpler solution would have been to give money to the payroll processors to keep checks going out for employees, but exempt certain businesses or employees. But...that would have required thought. Government doesn't do that. I don't feel like doing any research, but was there not a controversy when some wanted more oversight into how the PPP money was being used, and the administration at the time fought back on that oversight?
August 26, 20223 yr 2 hours ago, vikas83 said: You can call them whatever you like - that's not the point. The point is that when someone took a PPP loan, it was designed to be forgiven. That was how the program was created, and people took the loans/entitlements knowing the rules of the game. Student loans were not set up to be forgiven. If it would make you feel better to state the criticism more clearly -- the government shouldn't change the rules AFTER the loan has been initiated. And certainly not simply through executive action. The loans were made by the taxpayers, and approved by Congress, with no mechanism for forgiveness. Now we just forgive them based on the decision of one person. That's bananas. Our entire system is based on the sanctity of contracts, and government keeps trying to mess that up (see GM bankruptcy). Right, but again, they're criticizing MTG because she said, in black and white, that the government shouldn't forgive a loan, when she had a loan forgiven by the government. No matter how it was structured, she still had a government loan forgiven and so did a whole lot of other Republican Congressman. She didn't lay it out with the nuance of the program and what was pre-agreed upon, she went straight to basics, because that's how the GOP communicates. And it's a very smart counter for the White House to go after the Republicans for their blatant hypocrisy here. If the right wants to make your point, then they're free to do it and it's valid (although if they're going to do that, they should also dig into how much grift there was in PPP and how much taxpayer money was wasted), but if they want to make MTG and the rest of the morons in the GOP's point, then they should be blasted for it.
August 26, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, Dave Moss said: I thought Krugman made a good point. Yep. It's essentially a repeat of the GOP's position on everything and the real problem for them is when they're suddenly confronted with actually having to do something about a problem, instead of just screeching about it. They screamed to the rafters about Obamacare and every single one of them, to a man, ran on getting rid of it for years and then they finally had a chance to repeal it and replace it with something else and not only could they not repeal it, they couldn't even write down a replacement plan. They really can't even do the bare minimum anymore and they've gamed out that it's never in their best interest to try. Better to be the party of screaming at clouds. Plays better to the base.
August 26, 20223 yr 16 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: Right, but again, they're criticizing MTG because she said, in black and white, that the government shouldn't forgive a loan, when she had a loan forgiven by the government. No matter how it was structured, she still had a government loan forgiven and so did a whole lot of other Republican Congressman. She didn't lay it out with the nuance of the program and what was pre-agreed upon, she went straight to basics, because that's how the GOP communicates. And it's a very smart counter for the White House to go after the Republicans for their blatant hypocrisy here. If the right wants to make your point, then they're free to do it and it's valid (although if they're going to do that, they should also dig into how much grift there was in PPP and how much taxpayer money was wasted), but if they want to make MTG and the rest of the morons in the GOP's point, then they should be blasted for it. Just because one side if comprised of imbeciles, that doesn't mean the other side has to lower itself to the same level. You can't claim to be the party of smart people and then act like this.
August 26, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, vikas83 said: Just because one side if comprised of imbeciles, that doesn't mean the other side has to lower itself to the same level. You can't claim to be the party of smart people and then act like this. Fyi Munson is sad he can’t be here to argue with you about student loans
August 26, 20223 yr Just now, Dave Moss said: Fyi Munson is sad he can’t be here to argue with you about student loans Tell him I said hello and he is still wrong
August 26, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, vikas83 said: Tell him I said hello and he is still wrong I would post what he wrote but I don’t 100% understand his argument so I don’t want to get stuck trying to defend it.
August 26, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, Dave Moss said: I would post what he wrote but I don’t 100% understand his argument so I don’t want to get stuck trying to defend it. SPOILER ALERT: nobody can follow a Munson argument Really good dude, just wrong about almost everything
August 26, 20223 yr Here’s my brief take on loans though 1). Predatory lending is a problem. 18 year olds don’t know what they’re doing when they take out these loans from for-profit enterprises 2). College costs are ridiculous and middle class folks think they can only attend if they get loans 3) i have no idea what the solution is
August 26, 20223 yr Just now, Dave Moss said: Here’s my brief take on loans though 1). Predatory lending is a problem. 18 year olds don’t know what they’re doing when they take out these loans from for-profit enterprises 2). College costs are ridiculous and middle class folks think they can only attend if they get loans 3) i have no idea what the solution is 1) The loans aren't from for-profit enterprises. They are from the federal government. ~93% of existing student loan debt is owed to the federal government, and basically all new loan originations since 2010 are from the Feds. Stop with the predatory lender boogyman -- the guy screwing people is the federal government that morons think will save them 2) Stop having the federal government gives loans to anyone to study anything at any school, with no regard for the ability to repay the loan. 3) Make the universities themselves lend the money and watch them get VERY selective. In order to get the volume they need, prices will come down to levels where the debt can be serviced and repaid based on the value of the degree. Right now, Villanova and Harvard basically are the same price, which makes no sense as a degree from Harvard is much more valuable. This is because no one looks at value when making the loans. You need that rationality back.
August 26, 20223 yr 13 minutes ago, vikas83 said: Just because one side if comprised of imbeciles, that doesn't mean the other side has to lower itself to the same level. You can't claim to be the party of smart people and then act like this. I disagree. It's absolutely imperative the Democrats act like this, if by 'this', you mean playing the same gotcha game without concerning yourselves with nuance that Republicans do. It's unfortunately where we are as a society and the right has understood that for a long time, and have built the entire backbone of their party on it. The Dems either play that game and play it well or watch themselves fade into obscurity.
August 26, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: I disagree. It's absolutely imperative the Democrats act like this, if by 'this', you mean playing the same gotcha game without concerning yourselves with nuance that Republicans do. It's unfortunately where we are as a society and the right has understood that for a long time, and have built the entire backbone of their party on it. The Dems either play that game and play it well or watch themselves fade into obscurity. OK, but then you don't get to claim being the smarter party. Just like you can't be the pro-democracy party and then support election deniers in the primary. You can't have moral indignation when playing the same game. And I still get to call what they are doing pathetic and disingenuous, because it is. Just like most of what the GOP does.
August 26, 20223 yr 7 minutes ago, vikas83 said: OK, but then you don't get to claim being the smarter party. Just like you can't be the pro-democracy party and then support election deniers in the primary. You can't have moral indignation when playing the same game. And I still get to call what they are doing pathetic and disingenuous, because it is. Just like most of what the GOP does. Exactly. 101 both sider logic.
August 26, 20223 yr 8 minutes ago, DrPhilly said: Exactly. 101 both sider logic. Damn, what an insult
August 26, 20223 yr Which of you highly educated Biden voters is this? Coming through the great state of WV, PA tags, "College of L" No wonder youre all highly educated
August 26, 20223 yr 8 minutes ago, Dave Moss said: Damn, what an insult In the end it will be a great compliment. I highly doubt you’ll ever receive one on the topic.
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