51 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

So the next 2 seasons are all about young talent, cleaning out dead money, and we don’t need to be on the upswing until 2023, yet both qbs will somehow be much better next year.

Most of the change will be on the defensive side of the football.

Given what DeSean, Jeffrey and Ertz contributed last season, doubt they'd be missed. Kelce might retire, but truth is he's been on the downswing for two years, still a solid center, but not the elite player he was. Peters won't be missed. So the offense, if they draft a few players, is likely to be better next year. It's the defense that could struggle for a year or two, the DL is aging, while Malik won't be missed, losing him and Curry is basically their depth. And the secondary's best players are Slay and McLeod. So Gannon has his work cut out for him, but also the opportunity to plug in a lot of young athletes and let the cream rise.

3 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

He was better. The eye test shows he was better. He wasn't great, he was probably about average but he was better. It may not have been by a lot but he was better. 

He was better running the ball.  He did give the team a little spark but those sparks lasted usually 1 half.

If Jalen is our guy then I will support him 100% but I was never a fan of his as a QB going back to his Alabama days.  I just dont know how good he is or can be as a passer and you need to be in order to be a successful QB in the NFL.  College you can get away with being an OK passer.  Wentz was awful last year but he's proven he can be a good passer.

51 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

He isn't the better QB right now though.  Hurts was better than Wentz last season and I don't see why we are assuming Wentz will be better next year when he is in decline and Hurts should be taking a step forward in his second year. 

Just my opinion but I think Wentz will be better with a new coach and new system.  

Coaching and how you use players makes all the difference in the world.  I dont think Doug did a good job of that.  Whether Sirianni does or not, I dont know.  We will find out.

Hurts is a great dude, great attitude, all positive but I never liked him as a QB in college and hated using a 2nd on him.  It was a dumb pick.  

8 minutes ago, RLC said:

We saw Hurts and Wentz in the same offense with the same personnel and Hurts was demonstrably better.

 

13 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

Hurts:

Floor - Tebow 

Ceiling - Case Keenum with Taysom Hill running ability 

I thought the ceiling was Russell Wilson 😄

Just now, 315Eagles said:

I thought the ceiling was Russell Wilson 😄

His ceiling highly depends on how drunk the poster is at the time.  

1 hour ago, austinfan said:

Both Wentz and Hurts should be much better next year.

1) OL should be more stable, unlikely to have a similar spate of injuries, and depth is much better (young backups got NFL experience)

2) Eagles are almost certain to add at least one weapon in the draft, if not more, and the young WRs will have a chance to be coached up

3) Wentz will be motivated to fix his mechanical flaws, and Hurts will have a whole offseason to prepare for the NFL and some top QB coaching

It's amazing how people look at 4 games for a rookie who had almost no reps with the 1s and a limited offseason and declare him a finished product.

 

Get off of this nonsense.  Quit pretending as though nobody was familiar with Hurts all the way back to a freshman at Alabama.  We’re not talking about 4 games — it’s 4 years, plus 4 games.

His 4 games with the Eagles should have been used to evaluate his ceiling as an NFL QB.  What do you see his ceiling as?  It’s bottom-tier NFL starter.  Not top 5, not top 10.  Highly unlikely even mid range starter.  He’s a bottom-tier NFL starter.  Without a lot of talent on the roster to win games with him as a complementary piece, the Eagles are a 5-12 team with him as franchise QB — maybe 6-11.  Not in 2021 — that’s his ceiling as long as he’s here. 
 

It’s not even as though he showed he can manage the game and play mistake-free football; he throws INTs, and fumbles the ball all over the place.  That wasn’t because he had no reps and a limited offseason — he makes BAD decisions out there.  He can’t stand in and take a hit to make a play; he should have been pulled immediately against WFT  after skipping the ball 5 yards short of a sure TD to Watkins.  Any NFL QB has to make that throw — I’d bet money Nathan Peterman would have made that throw.  Numerous throws to the intermediate and deep middle of the field were far too late and far too off-target.

I could ramble on further.  Suffice to say he doesn’t have it, and he’s not magically going to get it.

It won’t happen but Jalen Hurts is most likely more valuable now than he’d ever be. 
 

If I was GM of the Bills or Ravens I’d give up a 3rd for Hurts. It’s two teams on the brink of making it to the big game who could use a backup QB that has a similar style of play to the starter. He has over a 90% chance to be more valuable than probably any round 3 pick over the next three years. 
 

JH is a guy you want on your team if you need a QB to come in, play 3 games because the starter gets hurt(no pun intended), and go 2-1. 

39 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Doug and his coaching staff was fired. 

 

 

I guess you are going to memory hole just how god awful Wentz played last year?  It wasn't Doug's shining moment as he had more than his fair share of questionable decisions and he certainly shares a level of the blame for all of this.  Wentz has always been a player who will miss easy throws from time to time but I never hold that against him because if people are being honest then they would realize that all QBs are players who will miss easy throws from time to time.  But that is all Wentz did in 2020.  The play calling wasn't at this dreadful that there just wasn't anything there for Wentz to do it was just that he wasn't capable of making the correct right decision on plays and even when he was his throws were often horribly off target.  

 

I remember a key 3rd down at a key point of a game but I can't remember the game because all of completely dreadful experience of watching Wentz play QB last season it is all starting to merge together.  But anyway, on this 3rd down the play call is there.  It was a quick inside slant to I believe Reagor with another WR pulling a pick play.  Almost similiar to the play at the end of the Seahawks-Patriots Super Bowl where Butler picked off Wilson.  Anyway it was there, the play call was good, the route was good, the pick was good, Reagor was open for the one second window that he needed to be open.  And in the replays you saw Wentz pull back and clutch it before then throwing it when it was already too late.  Another shining example of just how awful Wentz was last year was that play early against the Cowboys I think it was in Philly when he bootlegged out of the pocket to his left and there isn't anyone open and Wentz sees a defender break free with a straight charge at him but Wentz for some reason doesn't throw it a way and keeps looking down the field and takes a huge loss and god knows how he didn't fumble it on that play, or maybe he did and I don't remember.  

 

Wentz was Fing terrible last because Wentz himself was terrible.  Now there are contributing factors from the GM to the coach and while I think the GM played a far larger part in contributing to Wentz's downfall (roster decisions and the unnecessary mental pressure of Hurts taken in the 2nd that Wentz wasn't able to handle) than the HC, Wentz still deserves the largest part of the blame for his bad play.  The HC is gone but the two biggest factors of our team being bad last year (GM & QB) remain and the QB hates the GM.  There is no reason to believe that Wentz is going to turn it around next season.  The WRs are off training with Hurts.  You think Wentz has shown anything over the last 3 years that make you think he can mentally handle the young backup QB in the 2nd round now openly going for the job instead of the situation of that 2nd round and Nick Foles just playing the backup role and saying they just want to play their part to help the team win ect?

 

Then you are also hoping that Howie Roseman with the cuts he is going to have to make across the board and a likely Kelce retirement is actually going to make the offensive surrounding cast for Wentz better?  And then is our new HC who while I hope he is successful, his bumbling overly nervous introductory press conference did little to inspire me that he is going to have it in him to actually hold this $33M disgruntled former franchise QB accountable while also trying to keep him happy to manage an ugly situation especially when that disgruntled highly paid QB has a history of being very resistant to taking to coaching and was able to over time turn coaches into being passive towards him instead of fighting with him to coach him.  Maybe Sirianni can do it but it seems like those that were able to (Reich and DeFlippo) were older more sure of themselves experienced confident personalities and Sirianni struck me as the more younger inexperienced trying to make an impression using their words instead of actually having made an impression through their experience young type of coach like a Press Taylor or Mike Groh that just couldn't hang with keeping Wentz accountable and coaching him.  

49 minutes ago, RLC said:

We saw Hurts and Wentz in the same offense with the same personnel and Hurts was demonstrably better.

False

27 minutes ago, 315Eagles said:

Just my opinion but I think Wentz will be better with a new coach and new system.  

Coaching and how you use players makes all the difference in the world.  I dont think Doug did a good job of that.  Whether Sirianni does or not, I dont know.  We will find out.

Hurts is a great dude, great attitude, all positive but I never liked him as a QB in college and hated using a 2nd on him.  It was a dumb pick.  

 

Wentz's issues last season went so far beyond coaching.  Even if the coaching is improved, Wentz has still become a really bad QB.  How good will any team or offense be if you have one of the worst QBs in the NFL playing the position?  We didn't have a good team last season but Wentz unquestionably held this team back.  The team was much more watchable with Hurts last season and the offense overall looked better.  He was a rookie so of course there were predictable times of struggle to go along with the flashes.  I have no doubt that if Hurts started most of that season that we would have finished with a better record than we would have with Wentz.  Regardless of last season though it is highly reasonable to expect Jalen Hurts to take a step forward in his second year.  We don't know just how much of a step forward he will take but it is completely reasonable to expect him to take a step forward.  Wentz on the other hand though, he didn't give us any reason to be optimistic about him going forward.  There were brief glimpses of hope during the Fulghum run but still his fair share of awful play in those games.  And then those games passed and he was back to being just awful.  Coming out of the bye week he became even worse and was now playing his worst football of the season until he was finally benched.

 

Maybe if it seemed like Wentz was excited about this new coach and the opportunity to get back out there and compete to win his job back but every indication we have is it is the completely opposite reaction.  He wants out and is just waiting right now for over a week as the Eagles are openly trying to trade him.   There is nothing about what is going on right now that should give anyone optimism that Wentz is going to turn it around from last year if he remains on this team with Howie and Hurts around.

 

Hurts was an awful pick in the 2nd round.  It was beyond iodic by Howie and not only wasted the chance to get a player that could possibly develop into a long term good starter at one of the many holes on the roster but it also served to put more unnecessary pressure on a QB that has shown that he struggles with that.  But what is done is done and what occurred can't be put back in the box.  Wentz has become a completely broken bad QB.  However low you might think Hurts' ceiling is, he still provides us a better path forward than Wentz this season.  Whether Hurts is the long term answer or not.  

58 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

Hurts:

Floor - Tebow 

Ceiling - Case Keenum with Taysom Hill running ability 

Love how all the football geniuses and psychics on here know how good Hurts will be after playing 1/4 of his rookie season.

Not saying he showed greatness but give the kid a chance. 

3 hours ago, greend said:

Pretty simple. Somebody makes trouble in the lockeroom bench or cut them. As far as the fans who cares? Nothing ever pleases them. Even after winning the super bowl fans ****ed about stuff.

I think it’s easy to just say you cut or bench guys when it could wind up being half the team or a quarter or ten guys and you’re not gonna cut or bench half the team. It’s easy if it’s one or two guys however it could wind up being More players than you think.  Add on you have a rookie head coach. I do not think that’s something you want your rookie head coach to deal with on top of everything else he’s experiencing for the first time. 

the fan part is true. However you already seen now before all this trade stuff the whirlwind of why doesn’t he talk and then the massive amount of speculation. That takes a toll on a team and player over time when they are asked about routinely 

1 hour ago, austinfan said:

Most of the change will be on the defensive side of the football.

Given what DeSean, Jeffrey and Ertz contributed last season, doubt they'd be missed. Kelce might retire, but truth is he's been on the downswing for two years, still a solid center, but not the elite player he was. Peters won't be missed. So the offense, if they draft a few players, is likely to be better next year. It's the defense that could struggle for a year or two, the DL is aging, while Malik won't be missed, losing him and Curry is basically their depth. And the secondary's best players are Slay and McLeod. So Gannon has his work cut out for him, but also the opportunity to plug in a lot of young athletes and let the cream rise.

Got it.  So the worst offense in the nfl won’t have any personnel change.  And that’s cause for optimism apparently.  Nowhere to go but up I guess.

8 minutes ago, eaglesflyers#1 said:

Love how all the football geniuses and psychics on here know how good Hurts will be after playing 1/4 of his rookie season.

Not saying he showed greatness but give the kid a chance. 

Bitter hatred is all, their boy can’t even pull in a first so they have to vent.

10 minutes ago, eaglesflyers#1 said:

Love how all the football geniuses and psychics on here know how good Hurts will be after playing 1/4 of his rookie season.

Not saying he showed greatness but give the kid a chance. 

That is the big difference between Wentz haters and Wentz supporters.

Haters just say Wentz blows after one bad season when the entire team sucked, including Hurts in his 4 games. Wentz supporters feel Wentz under a new coach, better game planning etc can be successful. However those same supporters feel Hurts can be better as well. maybe not the ceiling of Wentz but better.

If it comes down to Wentz getting traded, they will give Hurts the chance and support him. Wentz haters wont do the same if Wentz stays, even if he plays well. Well or they will say they were supporters all along. Just like all the morons who said they had Reagor as their top choice WR in the draft. Yes there was those people, but they suddenly all disappeared and won't admit it. 

5 minutes ago, eaglesflyers#1 said:

Love how all the football geniuses and psychics on here know how good Hurts will be after playing 1/4 of his rookie season.

Not saying he showed greatness but give the kid a chance. 

It’s a discussion board dude... the point is to give your opinion. You can agree or disagree. Sure, I could be wrong but I’d be very shocked if Hurts is anything more than a high end backup/ low end starter. 
 

Also there’s tons of film on him at Alabama and Oklahoma. It’s not like he’s Allen coming out of Wyoming. 

2 hours ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Usually... almost all the time... executives lose their jobs for their mistakes.

Current cap situation for the eagles in 2022. They are under it but barely. Even if they make some moves that they can they are at the moment roughly 30 million behind the 31st team on the league in Minnesota. So this blip howie and Lurie keep selling is not a one year blip. 

 

2 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

It’s a discussion board dude... the point is to give your opinion. You can agree or disagree. Sure, I could be wrong but I’d be very shocked if Hurts is anything more than a high end backup/ low end starter. 
 

Also there’s tons of film on him at Alabama and Oklahoma. It’s not like he’s Allen coming out of Wyoming. 

No, we have to treat him like a swaddled baby. Make sure you support the neck! He’s only 4 games old. 

1 minute ago, LeanMeanGM said:

No, we have to treat him like a swaddled baby. Make sure you support the neck! He’s only 4 games old. 

Rookie Lives Matter. 

2 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Rookie Lives Matter. 

All players lives matter.... that’s how it goes right?

2 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Rookie Lives Matter. 

🤨

3 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Current cap situation for the eagles in 2022. They are under it but barely. Even if they make some moves that they can they are at the moment roughly 30 million behind the 31st team on the league in Minnesota. So this blip howie and Lurie keep selling is not a one year blip. 

 

To be fair that’s, that’s going to drastically change. That’s with Malik having a $23M cap charge and Alshon at $14M. There’s others like Goodwin being $7M and of course Wentz being the big one. 

17 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

Wentz's issues last season went so far beyond coaching.  Even if the coaching is improved, Wentz has still become a really bad QB.  How good will any team or offense be if you have one of the worst QBs in the NFL playing the position?  We didn't have a good team last season but Wentz unquestionably held this team back.  The team was much more watchable with Hurts last season and the offense overall looked better.  He was a rookie so of course there were predictable times of struggle to go along with the flashes.  I have no doubt that if Hurts started most of that season that we would have finished with a better record than we would have with Wentz.  Regardless of last season though it is highly reasonable to expect Jalen Hurts to take a step forward in his second year.  We don't know just how much of a step forward he will take but it is completely reasonable to expect him to take a step forward.  Wentz on the other hand though, he didn't give us any reason to be optimistic about him going forward.  There were brief glimpses of hope during the Fulghum run but still his fair share of awful play in those games.  And then those games passed and he was back to being just awful.  Coming out of the bye week he became even worse and was now playing his worst football of the season until he was finally benched.

 

Maybe if it seemed like Wentz was excited about this new coach and the opportunity to get back out there and compete to win his job back but every indication we have is it is the completely opposite reaction.  He wants out and is just waiting right now for over a week as the Eagles are openly trying to trade him.   There is nothing about what is going on right now that should give anyone optimism that Wentz is going to turn it around from last year if he remains on this team with Howie and Hurts around.

 

Hurts was an awful pick in the 2nd round.  It was beyond iodic by Howie and not only wasted the chance to get a player that could possibly develop into a long term good starter at one of the many holes on the roster but it also served to put more unnecessary pressure on a QB that has shown that he struggles with that.  But what is done is done and what occurred can't be put back in the box.  Wentz has become a completely broken bad QB.  However low you might think Hurts' ceiling is, he still provides us a better path forward than Wentz this season.  Whether Hurts is the long term answer or not.  

Just me, I'd rather see Wentz play under a new coach and system than see Hurts play.  There's been "reports" that Sirianni prefers Wentz and wants to keep him.  It's because he's the better QB.  He just needs some fixing.  I'm not saying he's going to be 2017 Wentz again but he can be a good QB.  I don't expect him to play anywhere as bad as he did in 2020.

11 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

It’s a discussion board dude... the point is to give your opinion. You can agree or disagree. Sure, I could be wrong but I’d be very shocked if Hurts is anything more than a high end backup/ low end starter. 
 

Also there’s tons of film on him at Alabama and Oklahoma. It’s not like he’s Allen coming out of Wyoming. 

100%.  There is tons of film on his at premier destinations surrounded by the best coaching staffs at that level and the best talent at that level.   Those things may have created a mirage for some, but his short stint with mediocre talent and coaching was not good.