3 hours ago, ManuManu said:

So that one appears all but done too. 

Someone pissed in my Cheerios 😞

30 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

I would like to see Wentz "Voracek" McLane.

Will never happen.

1 hour ago, Ace Nova said:

More from the article:

 

Roseman, owner Jeffrey Lurie, and other Eagles leaders, however, treated Wentz as if he had won that championship. They allowed him too much say in the draft, free agency, and coaching decisions. And while he played a large role in getting to the title game, and to the postseason the next two years, he has only six playoff snaps in five years to his name.

Wentz’s Type-A personality could be credited just as much for his past success. Many top quarterbacks share the same trait. But the 28-year-old had increasingly rebuffed advice, defied criticism, and clashed with former coach Doug Pederson last season, Eagles sources said.

"Every great quarterback wants to be coached and they want to be coached hard and by the best, and it doesn’t seem like [Wentz] wants that,” one source said. "It’s kind of like whoever’s coaching him is working for him. But it can’t be that way.”

Wetz alone also factored into Pederson’s exit, despite Lurie’s claim otherwise. The Eagles essentially remained "married” to the quarterback, as Roseman had put it at the time of the

"Everyone believed Carson had no clue about when to get the ball out on time,” a source said, "and as a result made his [O-line] look terrible in times they were playing fine.”

"If you look at the film, anybody out there would be hard pressed to say, ‘OK, I’m going to bring him in as my starter,’” an NFL source who works with quarterbacks said.

Reich and the Colts could have interest with Philip Rivers a pending free agent and near 40. But it would take a leap of faith and significant cost.

"I’m not sure Frank would take him,” a source familiar with Reich’s thinking said.

https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/carson-wentz-eagles-regression-doug-pederson-press-taylor-howie-roseman-20210116.html

So, this doesn't read like a hatchet job by someone close to Pederson?

Every star QB gets input, that's a given, but none make those decisions.

As far as Wentz not trusting Pederson, gee, would I trust a HC who wants me to run an offense that obviously doesn't fit my skill set and sets me up for failure?

We all saw that the RPO doesn't work well with what Wentz does, nor did it make sense to have multiple deep routes by inexperienced WRs behind a makeshift OL.

And Pederson got totally away from the short passing game that worked at the end of last season with a bunch of PS WRs. And he quickly abandoned the running game despite two explosive RBs.

When the HC doesn't adjust to losing his TE and veteran WRs and leaves you out to dry, yeah, a QB can get gun shy.

Not saying Wentz doesn't need to work on his mechanics and decision making, and last season may be exactly what he needed - to be humbled and thus more receptive to coaching.

But Pederson was a problem and I'm glad he's gone.

1 hour ago, greendestiny27 said:

If it's Fing Kafka my passion for this team will drop to new lows. 

Or Duce or Mayo

11 hours ago, BigEFly said:

The consensus guy who defers to coaches on talent insists on a yes man?  Sorry but as much as I want Howie gone, I don’t see that. 

This is a nice way for him to always deflect blame for bad choices.  There's reports that he doesn't always follow the consensus, so then he just blames the coach... whom he hired... and at the end of the day, the GM isn't paid to build consensus, the GM is paid to take all the information in, filter it and then make a decision.  The GM is responsible for the decision - period.  Howie has never been held responsible for his decisions.

4 minutes ago, austinfan said:

So, this doesn't read like a hatchet job by someone close to Pederson?

Every star QB gets input, that's a given, but none make those decisions.

As far as Wentz not trusting Pederson, gee, would I trust a HC who wants me to run an offense that obviously doesn't fit my skill set and sets me up for failure?

We all saw that the RPO doesn't work well with what Wentz does, nor did it make sense to have multiple deep routes by inexperienced WRs behind a makeshift OL.

And Pederson got totally away from the short passing game that worked at the end of last season with a bunch of PS WRs. And he quickly abandoned the running game despite two explosive RBs.

When the HC doesn't adjust to losing his TE and veteran WRs and leaves you out to dry, yeah, a QB can get gun shy.

Not saying Wentz doesn't need to work on his mechanics and decision making, and last season may be exactly what he needed - to be humbled and thus more receptive to coaching.

But Pederson was a problem and I'm glad he's gone.

They were all problems, AF. And these aren’t really new complaints about Wentz. It’s been going back years now. 

3 hours ago, ManuManu said:

"There was a disconnect even before Wentz was benched, though. Pederson would call a play only for his quarterback to occasionally kill it for no other reason than his personal distaste, sources said. It became "a pissing match” between the two, another source said.”

And...

"He doesn’t understand that he lost games for us,” a veteran player said. "He will never admit that and that’s a problem because he can’t get it corrected.”

And...

In the quarterback room, when his errors were pointed out, Wentz would sometimes make irrelevant excuses and Taylor wouldn’t correct him. For instance, there would be a play when he didn’t throw to an open receiver. The read was drawn up as designed, the coverage played out as expected, and he would be asked why he didn’t pull the trigger.

And Wentz would say the look wasn’t there, or he would overemphasize the pass rush, and when it was suggested the play be run again in practice as to get it right, he would object.

This is why we are getting a Kafka Duce or Mayo, three people nobody else is interviewing. They are going to be told to keep Wentz and no top flight candidate wants to hear that.

11 hours ago, ManuManu said:

Lol

No, that's important, you want to do retrospective analyses of your drafting, both to judge your scouts (who is worth keeping) and why you made mistakes.

If they're identifying the right players, but can't make deals (it happens) or the coaches are overriding the scouts (every HC wants some control over personnel decisions and lobbies for players they want - a strong HC gets the final word) you want to know that. If the scouts are giving bad advice, you want to get new scouts.

5 minutes ago, austinfan said:

So, this doesn't read like a hatchet job by someone close to Pederson?

Every star QB gets input, that's a given, but none make those decisions.

As far as Wentz not trusting Pederson, gee, would I trust a HC who wants me to run an offense that obviously doesn't fit my skill set and sets me up for failure?

We all saw that the RPO doesn't work well with what Wentz does, nor did it make sense to have multiple deep routes by inexperienced WRs behind a makeshift OL.

And Pederson got totally away from the short passing game that worked at the end of last season with a bunch of PS WRs. And he quickly abandoned the running game despite two explosive RBs.

When the HC doesn't adjust to losing his TE and veteran WRs and leaves you out to dry, yeah, a QB can get gun shy.

Not saying Wentz doesn't need to work on his mechanics and decision making, and last season may be exactly what he needed - to be humbled and thus more receptive to coaching.

But Pederson was a problem and I'm glad he's gone.

have to see i agree 100%

17 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Still end up drawing interest as a HC? For what a HS team? His name has now only popped up once as a OC with a lot of teams needing HCs when he was let go.

The fact he was not even interviewed by anyone for a HC job speaks loudly. Funny that some said a few weeks ago if Doug was fired he would get a job the next week as a HC, lol. 

Maybe next year Doug

Well, he was fired a week later, and teams had already started interviews and moving forward with their plan.    I'm not saying that any of that matters, or that Doug might be very interested in just stepping back for a year.  He's getting paid either way, so he can step back, get paid and come out with a fresh perspective in a year's time.  

 

The Seattle connection is an interesting one, because he grew up in Washington, so that's 'going home', and coaching the offense for Seattle would basically give him autonomy for running the offense, without having to answer to the media all the time, while the GM who makes the decisions hides in a bunker.

26 minutes ago, myerstheman said:

Howie claims he defers to coaches when the picks don't work out.  When the picks are right, which they rarely are, he takes all the credit for those picks.  They are liars.  Doug wasn't picking any player he can't even pick his coaches.

Can you source this? 

1 minute ago, DawkinsOwnage03 said:

This is why we are getting a Kafka Duce or Mayo, three people nobody else is interviewing. They are going to be told to keep Wentz and no top flight candidate wants to hear that.

Not true, if you're a good QB coach you believe in yourself and your ability to work with a top talent. All QBs have egos, or they'd never succeed at that position.

And having Wentz and Hurts is a plus, take over a team with a young QB and no plan B then you live and die with that QB, with the Eagles, you can give Wentz your best shot but know you can groom Hurts as plan B a year or two down the road.

8 minutes ago, austinfan said:

So, this doesn't read like a hatchet job by someone close to Pederson?

Every star QB gets input, that's a given, but none make those decisions.

As far as Wentz not trusting Pederson, gee, would I trust a HC who wants me to run an offense that obviously doesn't fit my skill set and sets me up for failure?

We all saw that the RPO doesn't work well with what Wentz does, nor did it make sense to have multiple deep routes by inexperienced WRs behind a makeshift OL.

And Pederson got totally away from the short passing game that worked at the end of last season with a bunch of PS WRs. And he quickly abandoned the running game despite two explosive RBs.

When the HC doesn't adjust to losing his TE and veteran WRs and leaves you out to dry, yeah, a QB can get gun shy.

Not saying Wentz doesn't need to work on his mechanics and decision making, and last season may be exactly what he needed - to be humbled and thus more receptive to coaching.

But Pederson was a problem and I'm glad he's gone.

I agree with a lot of this, but who are the TWO explosive RBs?   There's Miles Sanders... and ???    I know you can't possibly referring to Boston Scott.

30 minutes ago, QBhunter58 said:

he knows what he is doing. stoking the fire and the rumor mill a bit. I think duce is the backup, backup plan

I think I’m at a point where there are a couple of guys that would have been first tier coaching options and then everyone else feels like a distant second tier. 
 

if we have to dip into that second tier, I’d actually prefer Duce over the other guys, just because I don’t expect any of them to be successful here. So might as well hire a guy the team would at least welcome rather than actively resent and fight. 

2 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Not true, if you're a good QB coach you believe in yourself and your ability to work with a top talent. All QBs have egos, or they'd never succeed at that position.

And having Wentz and Hurts is a plus, take over a team with a young QB and no plan B then you live and die with that QB, with the Eagles, you can give Wentz your best shot but know you can groom Hurts as plan B a year or two down the road.

Ignore him, hes a Wentz hater. 

23 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Someone pissed in my Cheerios 😞

Would you rather go to LA with Herbert or come to Philly and have to put up with Howie and our crap QB situation? 

AF, I have to push back on another comment you made. You said Doug went away from what worked down the stretch last year. Why the hell would anyone want that to be the offense moving forward? It was painful, slow, station to station football that required 10-14 play scoring drives. That is not a sustainable formula.  

Just now, Solomon said:

Would you rather go to LA with Herbert or come to Philly and have to put up with Howie and our crap QB situation? 

I'd actually rather go to San Diego.      But, there's no team there now.

5 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I agree with a lot of this, but who are the TWO explosive RBs?   There's Miles Sanders... and ???    I know you can't possibly referring to Boston Scott.

Scott average 4.7 ypc with a long run of 56 yards. He's a tinker toy, but a good one.

Eagles did need a power back for short yardage, that was on Howie.

29 minutes ago, myerstheman said:

Howie claims he defers to coaches when the picks don't work out.  When the picks are right, which they rarely are, he takes all the credit for those picks.  They are liars.  Doug wasn't picking any player he can't even pick his coaches.

Its so simple, we learn from a very young age to shift blame when things go poorly. Entitlement and inflated egos have become an epidemic in this country. The thing that baffles me is that Jeff is blind to Howie's ineptitude. Hopefully we hire some no nonsense coaches who wont be pushed around... it doesn't always pay to be the nice guy. 

Just now, Solomon said:

Would you rather go to LA with Herbert or come to Philly and have to put up with Howie and our crap QB situation? 

Oh I get it if he does go there. I see the positives. However we do have positives as well. I think Doug was hired as a yes man. I think if the Eagles landed a top guy they would treat him different. The Chargers are a cheap team. they just dont spend the money the Eagles will. Now I get it right now we are cap screwed and Howie has not done a great job spending that money. But with the right plan in 2022 we could be in good shape with money again and not afraid to spend it. Lets not forget the fact the Chargers fan base just blows. That does play a role for me if I had a choice in two teams. 

Daboll was my guy from day 1, I am just not thrilled about any of the other candidates. Now dont get me wrong, Doug had to go this year. I guess Id roll the dice with Brady or Eric and hope for the best.

However speaks loudly that Eric was passed up last year and not a single mention this year by any team after everyone in the NFL said he would be the "hot" name this off season. So thats very concerning to me.

If Kafka is the man, Id be more disappointed then any other hire. Hes no different from Doug. So Id be unhappy for the next few years till they fire him seeing it was a poor choice. 

30 minutes ago, austinfan said:

So, this doesn't read like a hatchet job by someone close to Pederson?

Every star QB gets input, that's a given, but none make those decisions.

As far as Wentz not trusting Pederson, gee, would I trust a HC who wants me to run an offense that obviously doesn't fit my skill set and sets me up for failure?

We all saw that the RPO doesn't work well with what Wentz does, nor did it make sense to have multiple deep routes by inexperienced WRs behind a makeshift OL.

And Pederson got totally away from the short passing game that worked at the end of last season with a bunch of PS WRs. And he quickly abandoned the running game despite two explosive RBs.

When the HC doesn't adjust to losing his TE and veteran WRs and leaves you out to dry, yeah, a QB can get gun shy.

Not saying Wentz doesn't need to work on his mechanics and decision making, and last season may be exactly what he needed - to be humbled and thus more receptive to coaching.

But Pederson was a problem and I'm glad he's gone.

One thing with the NFL is that debates like this usually work themselves out.   We'll (likely) end up seeing who has better future success. (Wentz vs Pederson).  

Just now, austinfan said:

Scott average 4.7 ypc with a long run of 56 yards. He's a tinker toy, but a good one.

Eagles did need a power back for short yardage, that was on Howie.

Gonna have to disagree with you on that.   He's primarily a JAG who can make plays against the Giants, for whatever reason.   If the Eagles could schedule the Giants 12 times a year, then sure.. he's a good, explosive player.  Against the rest of the NFL, he's a JAG.

1 minute ago, ManuManu said:

AF, I have to push back on another comment you made. You said Doug went away from what worked down the stretch last year. Why the hell would anyone want that to be the offense moving forward? It was painful, slow, station to station football that required 10-14 play scoring drives. That is not a sustainable formula.  

Because good HCs adjust to circumstances. Pederson wanted an explosive offense, but when you lose your LT and your top OL in Brooks, as well as Seumalo, and Lane is playing on one leg, and DeSean goes down, a smart HC moves away from slow developing routes and focuses on plays that take less than 3 seconds.

And when you have a big QB with a strong arm but who lacks burst, you don't call RPOs that actually require the QB present a threat to run. You know what Wentz can do well, you don't ask him to become Foles (RPO passer) or Hurts.

A smart HC would have pulled back the reins, gone to the conservative short passing game with more emphasis on the run, and used play action and Hightower/Reagor/Watkins to go deep at times to keep safeties honest. It wouldn't be exciting, but as 2019 showed, it could work.

Sometimes you have to accept "you can't always get what you want . . . "

If Duce is retained, is it more likely or less likely that we retain Wentz?