The other thing about Cohen is what do you think his value is in terms of a draft pick?

It’s not like he’s replacing a fourth-round pick in the trade. He’s probably closer to a 6, and those are all but worthless. Cohen has shown that he can be an explosive weapon in the passing game. I’d trust guys like Sirianni and Steichen to get a lot out of Cohen considering their history with Ekeler and Hines.

8 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

He’s 5-9, 195. That’s some small thunder. 

A fart in the wind?

6 minutes ago, austinfan said:

They haven't traded Wentz yet, so let's see what happens.

Nor are they starting from ground zero in a rebuild, age in 2021:

QB:  Hurts (23)

RB:  Sanders (24), Scott (26)

WR:  Reagor (22), Fulgham (26), Ward (26), Watkins (23), Hightower (25)

TE:  Goedert (26), JJAW (25)

OL:  Dillard (26), Seumalo (28), Herbig (27), Mailata (24), Driscoll (24), Toth (25), Opeta (26)

DL:  Barnett (25), Hargrave (28), Williams (24), Sweat (24), Avery (26), Ostman (26)

LB:  Edwards (25), Singleton (28), Taylor (23), Bradley (24), Bachie (23), Smith (24)

CB:  Arnold (24), James (25), Jacquet (24), LeBlanc (27)

S:  Mills (27), Epps (25), Wallace (24)

A lot of these guys started multiple games last year.

This isn't nearly enough, but it's a solid start, and often one or two top players can make big difference, put a solid WLB with Edwards and Singleton, find a FS who can cover for limited CBs, etc.They should have two loaded drafts wtih high picks to find 4 or 5 starters to add to this group, and then in 2023 bring in 2-3 FAs. And develop a few UDFAs/Futures like that converted QB they brought in to try at H-back.

With the veterans phased out over two years, that buys time to replace guys like Graham, Cox, McLeod, Slay, Kelce, Brooks, Lane.

It’s not a solid start, AF. In fact, it’s a pretty crappy start. 

13 minutes ago, hputenis said:

Nope

2 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

It’s not a solid start, AF. In fact, it’s a pretty crappy start. 

It's a complete rebuild.

We're not competing until 2022 unless Hurts really is Russell Wilson (unlikely). 

13 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

He’s 5-9, 195. That’s some small thunder. 

True, but he has great contact balance and runs with a low center of gravity. His yards after contact average was outstanding. Think he's going to be a steal for whoever grabs him in the later rounds .

1 minute ago, RLC said:

It's a complete rebuild.

We're not competing until 2022 unless Hurts really is Russell Wilson (unlikely). 

If Goedert can ever stay healthy he’s an impact player. Sanders can be too, but he’s a running back so it barely matters to a team’s W-L record. Mailata looks really promising. 

Beyond that, I see some solid players and a lottery ticket in Hurts. 

That’s horrible. 

8 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

It’s not a solid start, AF. In fact, it’s a pretty crappy start. 

Not only that Mills is a FA and could be gone. There’s a chance they also trade barnett away rather than pay him what he’s owed for his 5th year and not get into a long term deal if they don’t believe he’s worth it. And Leblanc is a FA. 

19 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

In today's NFL, first round picks should be making impacts, not showing glimpses. 

They should also be put in a situation to succeed, which did not happen.  As was discussed earlier.

7 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Nope

He actually has a really good contract.  The problem is the Eagles eat way too much of that dead cap, so it sucks for them.  Despite your amnesia referring to years 2016-2019, it's a borderline steal for whoever retains his services.  Not to mention they won't have the bottle licking dunce calling the plays.  

2 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

If Goedert can ever stay healthy he’s an impact player. Sanders can be too, but he’s a running back so it barely matters to a team’s W-L record. Mailata looks really promising. 

Beyond that, I see some solid players and a lottery ticket in Hurts. 

That’s horrible. 

Yup. Just a lack of young talent. 

Tanking in 2021 and trading assets off the roster for anything is the best path-forward. Lurie was using rebuilding language in his press conferences.

I'm still wondering how the Ravens missed the playoffs 4 of 5 seasons after winning at SB, isn't that one of the best organizations in the NFL?

Or maybe everyone gambles, sometimes the dice roll your way, sometimes they don't, Malik and Wallace were highly durable until they come to the Eagles, then they get injured, Jerrigan was durable, gets injured, Brooks was a horse, Dillard had no injury issues, and so on. Sometimes you have a bad luck streak (or your HC is too soft in training camp? How come AR never had these injury issues?).

The proof is in the pudding, if by 2023 the Eagles aren't competitive (i.e. 8-8 or so with one of the youngest teams in the NFL) then both Howie and Sirianni are probably gone.

But the next two years are about rebuilding, and I trust Howie to do that as much as most "football guys," too many franchises never get out of the rebuilding phase (see nYG, 1 PO appearance last 9 seasons, TB missed the PO 12 straight years before this season, and so on).

TB was built through the draft but it took a long time with lot's of misses:

2012: David #58

2013: Gholston #126

2014:  Evans #7

2015:  Winston #1, Smith #34, Marpet #61, Alexander #124

2016:  whifff

2017:  Godwin #84

2018:  Vea #12, Jones #38, Davis #63, Cappa #94, Whitehead #117, Watson #144

2019:  White #5, Murphy-Bunting #39, Dean #94, Nelson #107, Miller #208

2020:  Wirf #12, Winfield #45, T Johnson #161

They drafted better the last three years, but it helps to have #5 and #12 twice as well as #38 and #39.

9 minutes ago, RLC said:

It's a complete rebuild.

We're not competing until 2022 unless Hurts really is Russell Wilson (unlikely). 

Yeah they might not be ready to compete by then either. Might realistically be 2023 and that’s if they actually draft well which hasn’t exactly been great since 2017. 

Just now, hputenis said:

He actually has a really good contract.  The problem is the Eagles eat way too much of that dead cap, so it sucks for them.  Despite your amnesia referring to years 2016-2019, it's a borderline steal for whoever retains his services.  Not to mention they won't have the bottle licking dunce calling the plays.  

I don't consider it a steal paying a dude who's somewhere between the 13th and 15th best QB in the NFL(as a most likely best case scenario) that much money. He's not gonna be good enough to win  you a Super Bowl, so it's just a waste of everyone's time.

1 minute ago, Wentz_Era said:

They should also be put in a situation to succeed, which did not happen.  As was discussed earlier.

Well I was very vocal before the draft that I would not touch Reagor in the 1st round. He was a reach. Poor route running skills and just avg hands at best. To me a first round WR should have those two traits. I don;t care about speed like everyone else. 

7 minutes ago, Iggles25 said:

True, but he has great contact balance and runs with a low center of gravity. His yards after contact average was outstanding. Think he's going to be a steal for whoever grabs him in the later rounds .

Buffalo plays who though?  How was his production against schools with actual talent across the line of scrimmage from him? 

7 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Yeah they might not be ready to compete by then either. Might realistically be 2023 and that’s if they actually draft well which hasn’t exactly been great since 2017. 

Yup.

For us to compete in 2022, we'd have to hit on 2021 in a major way. Yes we're picking at the top of each round, but I'm...skeptical. 

6 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Well I was very vocal before the draft that I would not touch Reagor in the 1st round. He was a reach. Poor route running skills and just avg hands at best. To me a first round WR should have those two traits. I don;t care about speed like everyone else. 

That's fair, many of us were on the other side of the fence.  Time will tell.

8 minutes ago, Wentz_Era said:

Buffalo plays who though?  How was his production against schools with actual talent across the line of scrimmage from him? 

Yeah that's a knock on him playing a MAC schedule. But he did have almost 100 total yards against Penn State and 130+ rushing yards versus Temple in 2019.

Just feel like his style of rushing translates well to the NFL, and that he'd be a nice complementary back to Sanders.

And will more than likely be available 5th round or later. Wouldn't have to waste a Top 100 pick on RB.

That Brandon Robinson Twitter should probably just be disregarded for the time being. All he’s said for the last few days was Bears have the best offer and the last two days he’s just begging for the Eagles to accept the mystery offer so he can come off as having some kind of clout. He’s a clown.  Basically anyone named Brandon is a clown. Sorry to anyone named Brandon in here. 

If Wentz reverted back to his 2019 play, these are the QBs I'd rank ahead of him, in no particular order:

Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, Watson, Mahomes, Carr, Herbert, Prescott, Rodgers, Ryan, Brady, Murray, Stafford, Wilson.

Close calls: Mayfield, Tannehill, Jimmy G.

Potential to be better, but no guarantee: Burrow, Lawrence.

I have him in that 13-16ish range. And that's if he plays like he did again in 2019, which is no guarantee. Maybe he's better than he was in 2020, but worse than he was in 2019.

I think for Lurie to truly regret trading Wentz, for what seems like it will be at least a 1st rounder, Wentz will need to go elsewhere and go back to his MVP form. Otherwise, you can find middle of the road NFL QBs again if that's where Wentz winds up. That isn't difficult. It's hard getting those top 5 guys.

 

2 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

If Wentz reverted back to his 2019 play, these are the QBs I'd rank ahead of him, in no particular order:

Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, Watson, Mahomes, Carr, Herbert, Prescott, Rodgers, Ryan, Brady, Murray, Stafford, Wilson.

Close calls: Mayfield, Tannehill, Jimmy G.

Potential to be better, but no guarantee: Burrow, Lawrence.

I have him in that 13-16ish range. And that's if he plays like he did again in 2019, which is no guarantee. Maybe he's better than he was in 2020, but worse than he was in 2019.

I think for Lurie to truly regret trading Wentz, for what seems like it will be at least a 1st rounder, Wentz will need to go elsewhere and go back to his MVP form. Otherwise, you can find middle of the road NFL QBs again if that's where Wentz winds up. That isn't difficult. It's hard getting those top 5 guys.

 

Agree with all this

4 minutes ago, RLC said:

Yup.

For us to compete in 2022, we'd have to hit on 2021 in a major way. Yes we're picking at the top of each round, but I'm...skeptical. 

Howie makes the final call... I won't hold my breath.

5 minutes ago, Wentz_Era said:

That's fair, many of us were on the other side of the fence.  Time will tell.

Well... I think everyone knows that Jefferson was my guy.   So... yeah...  🤦‍♂️

1 hour ago, austinfan said:

Howie gambled on keeping the window open. He lost. But it's very hard after winning a SB to say, "hey we got lucky, now we're gonna blow it up." And it's not just football, how many businessmen have Buffett's humility to admit that luck played a big part in their success. As the financial literature has shown, luck is more common than skill.

After 2017 Doug and Schwartz had maximum "pull" when it came to FAs and the draft, they had delivered the Holy Grail. 2018, they win 5 of their last 6 and Foles almost gets them past NO, defense was 12th in points allowed, offense was 18th but a lot of injuries. 2019 the offense rebounds to 12th in points, defense remains in the middle of the pack. The cracks are starting to show, and Howie admits it was time to rebuild. Then COVID comes along, and he makes a fatal miscalculation, driven probably by both the hope they can take advantage of the situation, but also the limited options to dump veterans in a year when there are fewer buyers than normal.

Notice they didn't bring in many new players in 2019, basically Malik b/c Jerrigan was damaged goods. Avery in mid-season. The Jeffrey restructure.

Most of the moves were made in 2018, coming off the SB, when they thought they were still a 10-12 win team.

Nor were the drafts terrible, mediocre yes, but not awful. Jones in 2017 at #43, JJAW at #57 in 2018, are the only two "bad" picks. All teams miss on some first and second day picks.

2017 was meh, Barnett is a solid starter at RDE, but below what you'd want at #14, 2018, Goedert was a good pick at #49, Sweat and Mailata were third day hits, 2019 Dillard is just bad luck, would have been the LT this past season, Sanders is a hit, 2020 added a lot of depth, forget Reagor  v Jefferson, and compare Reagor to most WRs taken at #21 (and 20 other teams passed on Jefferson), Hurts may end up starting, Driscoll is a good bet to be a starting OG, we'll see about the rest in a year or two.

So in the last four years they may end up with starters in Barnett, Goedert, Sweat, Mailata, Dillard, Sanders, Reagor, Driscoll, Hurts and maybe a couple others. Given they only had 3 1st rd picks, that's not a bad haul for four seasons - the average draft only produces 2 starters and a top backup unless you're picking in the top 10.

Last 8 years, best drafts were 2012, 2013, 2016,  worst, 2014, 2017.

I agree mostly with the first paragraph but Warren is voracious in researching his financial decisions.   He has made some real interesting moves.  Taking on latent injury and environmental liabilities from major insurers on the bet that he will profit from the float more quickly that what he pays out the money they paid.  Layering his insurers, the major source of his capital, across personal lines, middle and large commercial insurance and reinsurance.  He keeps his companies autonomous because that allows him to make gambles. He can always let one fail.  They know that so they are shrewd negotiators.  He also studies the market.  He invests in what people are buying.   Even his noninsurer purchases are what people are buying.  Furniture, building materials, a railroad, etc.  There is some luck but a heck of a lot of planning.  he will never make an AIG mistake because he insists on underwriting discipline.  There use to be a show around of Gates and Buffett talking with grad business school students about their philosophies.  It is real telling when they speak about their identification of people talent.  Yet you are defending Howie who seems to miss more than he hits in that arena.  Warren also knows when to fold.

You are excusing bad decision making.  Howie has a pattern of this.  Dream team, OR player draft for Chip, bad extensions.  If this is consensus with the coaches, then he is a bad manager.  If this is trying to extend the Super Bowl team too long, then he is doing a lousy job of informing Lurie of what is likely to go wrong with an aging roster.  Their most successful draft choice this year was a fourth round G playing RT out of necessity and then getting hurt.  Look, I know you look to see the bright side of your team.  I have a bit of a tendency to do that too.  But I struggle to see Howie’s success.  I do think he does have a strong scouting staff, although how he manages the information from them is spotty at best.  As the consensus builder, he sucks by leaning the wrong way.