February 3, 20214 yr 1 minute ago, DrPhilly said: You're turning into a partisan hack mate. Did Moss hijack your account? Um...there are 211 GOP House members. 139 voted against PA certification. 139 is more than half of 211.
February 3, 20214 yr 1 minute ago, DrPhilly said: I'd love to see the traditional group walk away and join the new "Lincoln Party" as a founding member. You absolutely hated that idea a few weeks back and you crucified me for even uttering the thought. Because it's a terrible idea. I didn't say start a new party, I said run primary challengers to take back the existing party with all its infrastructure, ballot access, etc. Starting a new party is political suicide. Reading...it's fundamental.
February 3, 20214 yr 4 minutes ago, NOTW said: I don't know what you're trying to say here. Trying to prove...what? I called the storming of the Capitol domestic terrorism and was horrified by it. I condemned Qanon. I've criticized the Republican party for being lost, giving in to the cult of Trump, losing their identify and no longer being about the classical conservative principles. I've called them hypocrites. I haven't defended a single GOP politician. I've said Trump should be thrown in jail. What I've argued against is your exaggeration that MAINSTREAM Republican views are MURDERING Democrats, removing term limits for life, and other such nonsense. You're so emotional and over the top - sometimes you back away and say you're just trolling and you really don't believe it. Then you call everyone else triggered while you makes these crazy claims. Vikas was right: let's focus on how they deal with Greene and Cheney. How they vote on Impeachment. Watch how many more Republicans leave the party, and what happens to them going forward. Is there a split? Does the crazy take over and a new party forms? Lots more to come. For some reason he's not approachable on the subject. Surprising really. It seems so obvious. This might be the next CVON inspired moment of truth for me. The last one was seeing Zuker go off the rails with Trump. That's where "lock&load" came from as I knew there was big trouble ahead.
February 3, 20214 yr Just now, vikas83 said: Because it's a terrible idea. I didn't say start a new party, I said run primary challengers to take back the existing party with all its infrastructure, ballot access, etc. Starting a new party is political suicide. Reading...it's fundamental. Oh I saw what you wrote. That's exactly why I brought up the subject again. I'm suggesting a tactic. It can be temporary in nature.
February 3, 20214 yr 2 minutes ago, NOTW said: Answers of "I've never heard of QAnon: 14% total 9% Democrat 19% Republican Yeah, even if you're being generous by saying those who have heard of Qanon may not necessarily know enough about it to say whether it's true or not, you'd still be nowhere near 70%.
February 3, 20214 yr 14 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: Yes. So where are the smilies and memes making fun of Democrats who think QAnon is true? Or panic about the rise of QAnon conspiracy believers in the Democratic party?
February 3, 20214 yr 3 minutes ago, vikas83 said: Um...there are 211 GOP House members. 139 voted against PA certification. 139 is more than half of 211. We were using the number of 120 and looking at all the votes back when we had that discussion. Add in the 44 Senators. Voila.
February 3, 20214 yr 3 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: Yeah, even if you're being generous by saying those who have heard of Qanon may not necessarily know enough about it to say whether it's true or not, you'd still be nowhere near 70%. Not a very good question there, you can dislike Qanon but believe in deep state elites, sort of like asking do you agree with hitler that ketchup sucks, answering yes does not mean you like hitler
February 3, 20214 yr 1 minute ago, DrPhilly said: Oh I saw what you wrote. That's exactly why I brought up the subject again. I'm suggesting a tactic. It can be temporary in nature. Starting a new party is an awful idea. Utterly terrible. Just getting ballot access would be a debacle. You'd be better off just giving up. The point is -- many of these House members fall inline because they are afraid of a Trump inspired primary challenger in their safe district. So, let's give them something else to fear -- a primary challenge from a traditional Republican. Unlike Trump the Koch's are actually multi-billionaires, intelligent and politically connected. If these guys only react to fear of losing their seat, then put the fear of God into them. Running as a 3rd party doesn't do that, because they will still win the general election. Well funded primary challengers are what they fear most.
February 3, 20214 yr Just now, NOTW said: So where are the smilies and memes making fun of Democrats who think QAnon is true? Or panic about the rise of QAnon conspiracy believers in the Democratic party?
February 3, 20214 yr 10 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said: Of course. But not nearly as concerning as the 68% of republicans that did the same. Or 9% vs 56% that believe it's partly or mostly true. Or 5% vs 33% that believe it's mostly true. However you want to slice it, it's awful. The end result is the representatives of one party has free reign to disavow this nonsense publicly, while the other basically has its hands tied and needs to walk on eggshells when addressing this sort of insanity. BOTH SIDES!
February 3, 20214 yr 2 minutes ago, Joe Shades 73 said: Not a very good question there, you can dislike Qanon but believe in deep state elites That's one of the questions I asked. I'd rather see a poll asking about specifics like believing they are Satan worshippers who sacrifice children, or believe that Jewish space lasers caused the wildfires. Plus, not a single response was "all true." The choices were mostly, some or not at all. This was also in August. People learned more about QAnon since then, and a more recent poll in January shows that belief in QAnon has lowered.
February 3, 20214 yr 2 minutes ago, NOTW said: That's one of the questions I asked. I'd rather see a poll asking about specifics like believing they are Satan worshippers who sacrifice children, or believe that Jewish space lasers caused the wildfires. Plus, not a single response was "all true." The choices were mostly, some or not at all. This was also in August. People learned more about QAnon since then, and a more recent poll in January shows that belief in QAnon has lowered. I would be concerned about the people that said no to that question, of course there are deep state elites and there are some conspiracies...like the Jews killed Kennnedy
February 3, 20214 yr 7 minutes ago, NOTW said: So where are the smilies and memes making fun of Democrats who think QAnon is true? Or panic about the rise of QAnon conspiracy believers in the Democratic party? The same place as the elected Democrats in the Federal Government who believe in QAnon. Neither exists.
February 3, 20214 yr 1 minute ago, we_gotta_believe said: Obviously, it's worse on the right and QAnon is a problem in the Republican party. I wouldn't even suggest it was an issue at all on the left, I would assume everyone on the left would not believe it. Just poking fun at the fact that the same poll used to show that "majority" of Republicans think QAnon is true, shows that there are Democrats who think it's true as well. Democrats better get control of the wacky QAnon conspiracy theorists in their party before they become like the Republicans!
February 3, 20214 yr Just now, vikas83 said: The same place as the elected Democrats in the Federal Government who believe in QAnon. Neither exists. That's how it starts. Soon, these Democrats who believe QAnon will find one to get elected in the House. It's a slippery slope (for the record, this is a joke. Repeat, this is a joke) Just now, NOTW said: Obviously, it's worse on the right and QAnon is a problem in the Republican party. I wouldn't even suggest it was an issue at all on the left, I would assume everyone on the left would not believe it. Just poking fun at the fact that the same poll used to show that "majority" of Republicans think QAnon is true, shows that there are Democrats who think it's true as well. Democrats better get control of the wacky QAnon conspiracy theorists in their party before they become like the Republicans!
February 3, 20214 yr 6 minutes ago, Joe Shades 73 said: Not a very good question there, you can dislike Qanon but believe in deep state elites, sort of like asking do you agree with hitler that ketchup sucks, answering yes does not mean you like hitler I don't even understand what a "deep state elite" is. Seems like kind of an oxymoron. As I understand it, the deep state is supposed to be lifers in the bureaucracy, meaning they're just people with long tenured, lower level government jobs. I wouldn't exactly consider them elite. Now the guy that was supposed to destroy the deep state, who sheet on a golden toilet, on the other hand...
February 3, 20214 yr 2 minutes ago, vikas83 said: Starting a new party is an awful idea. Utterly terrible. Just getting ballot access would be a debacle. You'd be better off just giving up. The point is -- many of these House members fall inline because they are afraid of a Trump inspired primary challenger in their safe district. So, let's give them something else to fear -- a primary challenge from a traditional Republican. Unlike Trump the Koch's are actually multi-billionaires, intelligent and politically connected. If these guys only react to fear of losing their seat, then put the fear of God into them. Running as a 3rd party doesn't do that, because they will still win the general election. Well funded primary challengers are what they fear most. There needs to be something real and tangible done. Something dramatic. If that's Mitch and a set of others setting up a list of candidates to fight anyone that Trump aligns with then make that a bold, vocal, and swift action. Come out swinging. Fight fire with fire. Get on Twitter and FB, etc. and go to battle. A real civil war inside the party. I honestly see no other option other than the long game thru a new party (which by the way would effectively control the Senate at least for 2 years, no doubt Manchin would join and maybe a couple others so the Dems would only have max 49).
February 3, 20214 yr 2 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: I don't even understand what a "deep state elite" is. Seems like kind of an oxymoron. As I understand it, the deep state is supposed to be lifers in the bureaucracy, meaning they're just people with long tenured, lower level government jobs. I wouldn't exactly consider them elite. Now the guy that was supposed to destroy the deep state, who sheet on a golden toilet, on the other hand... https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Deep_state_in_the_United_States
February 3, 20214 yr 2 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: I don't even understand what a "deep state elite" is. Seems like kind of an oxymoron. As I understand it, the deep state is supposed to be lifers in the bureaucracy, meaning they're just people with long tenured, lower level government jobs. I wouldn't exactly consider them elite. Now the guy that was supposed to destroy the deep state, who sheet on a golden toilet, on the other hand... Educated people. They mean educated people.
February 3, 20214 yr Just now, Joe Shades 73 said: https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Deep_state_in_the_United_States So just special interest and lobbyists? Well, yeah, they exist. Wouldn't consider them the Deep State though. There's nothing secretive about the fact that they have power in Washington.
February 3, 20214 yr Just now, VanHammersly said: So just special interest and lobbyists? Well, yeah, they exist. Wouldn't consider them the Deep State though. There's nothing secretive about the fact that they have power in Washington. Remember the fundamental unifying principle of Trump cultists -- they are morons who hate the educated folks who talk down to them. They think people who went to Ivy League schools are all part of some secret cabal to steal their freedom and money while making them all get gender reassignment surgery. So of course, they worship someone who...checks notes...went to an Ivy League school. Morons. They are morons.
February 3, 20214 yr 4 minutes ago, VanHammersly said: I don't even understand what a "deep state elite" is. Seems like kind of an oxymoron. As I understand it, the deep state is supposed to be lifers in the bureaucracy, meaning they're just people with long tenured, lower level government jobs. I wouldn't exactly consider them elite. Now the guy that was supposed to destroy the deep state, who sheet on a golden toilet, on the other hand... So sounds like you agree that the poll question may not be saying what Gannan and Forbes want it to say? That maybe - just maybe? - when people said that the idea of "deep state elites" is "mostly true" or "partly true" that it doesn't mean that they think Jewish space lasers caused wildfires, that they think Democrats are Satan worshippers who sacrifice children?
February 3, 20214 yr Just now, NOTW said: So sounds like you agree that the poll question may not be saying what Gannan and Forbes want it to say? That maybe - just maybe? - when people said that the idea of "deep state elites" is "mostly true" or "partly true" that it doesn't mean that they think Jewish space lasers caused wildfires, that they think Democrats are Satan worshippers who sacrifice children? I don't know, but I've been kind of having a different conversation than you guys. I'd vote unequivocally no on whether there are "deep state elite" because from the sound of it, it's just right wing scare mongering gibberish.
February 3, 20214 yr 2 minutes ago, vikas83 said: Remember the fundamental unifying principle of Trump cultists -- they are morons who hate the educated folks who talk down to them. They think people who went to Ivy League schools are all part of some secret cabal to steal their freedom and money while making them all get gender reassignment surgery. So of course, they worship someone who...checks notes...went to an Ivy League school. Morons. They are morons. Three are plenty of educated Trump supporters....... you can still get a degree from Liberty university
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