5 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

Serious question: are asylum seekers, regardless of the abuse of the asylum system, considered "illegal immigrants" in this poll?

They should be

19 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

Serious question: are asylum seekers, regardless of the abuse of the asylum system, considered "illegal immigrants" in this poll?

Probably, and most of them should be. Legally they need to stop in the first country they arrive in; they can’t legally choose to skip all of Central America, pass through Mexico, and go to the US because that’s where they prefer to be.

1 hour ago, TEW said:

I’m all in favor of that, but that’s not the problem. The problem is that the left wants, encourages, and incentivizes them coming here.

We could end it tomorrow if we wanted — immediate deportation if you’re here illegally, with swift enforcement, and it would stop. But they don’t want it to stop. In fact, they want more of it.

So illegal immigrants come here solely because Joe Biden and the democrats want them to? Not because they can find employment for cash money in the land of opportunity?

You don’t seriously believe that do you?

Just now, MidMoFo said:

So illegal immigrants come here solely because Joe Biden and the democrats want them to? Not because they can find employment for cash money in the land of opportunity?

You don’t seriously believe that do you?

Hello, welcome to CVON, are you new here? 

26 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

So illegal immigrants come here solely because Joe Biden and the democrats want them to? Not because they can find employment for cash money in the land of opportunity?

You don’t seriously believe that do you?

Employment?

More likely the free benefits 

9 hours ago, lynched1 said:

Employment?

More likely the free benefits 

Please name them and loop hole that allows an ILLEGAL immigrant to receive them.

10 hours ago, TEW said:

Probably, and most of them should be. Legally they need to stop in the first country they arrive in; they can’t legally choose to skip all of Central America, pass through Mexico, and go to the US because that’s where they prefer to be.

Link?

44 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Link?

It’s complicated.  Here’s a paper on the subject. It a hard read.  You may want to jump to the US example.

https://www.unhcr.org/59c4be077.pdf

22 minutes ago, Talkingbirds said:

It’s complicated.  Here’s a paper on the subject. It a hard read.  You may want to jump to the US example.

https://www.unhcr.org/59c4be077.pdf

That's pre-Trump era though. I assume he's referring to, or confusing his statements with, the Remain in Mexico policy that Trump put into place, but that's the one that was challenged and went to the SCOTUS only for them to rule against it and side with the Biden admin. 

https://www.npr.org/2022/06/30/1104015677/supreme-court-remain-in-mexico-rmm

As I understand it the rules are part of international agreements about how to handle refugees claiming political asylum. 

Those international agreements stipulate that asylum seekers need to petition the first government they flee to. 

It doesn't necessarily mean that we as a nation can't also consider asylum claims from seekers outside the border nations, but it does mean that we're not obligated to.

12 hours ago, TEW said:

I’m all in favor of that, but that’s not the problem. The problem is that the left wants, encourages, and incentivizes them coming here.

We could end it tomorrow if we wanted — immediate deportation if you’re here illegally, with swift enforcement, and it would stop. But they don’t want it to stop. In fact, they want more of it.

Funny how you never blame the employers of these illegals. The ones causing the problem.

10 minutes ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

As I understand it the rules are part of international agreements about how to handle refugees claiming political asylum. 

Those international agreements stipulate that asylum seekers need to petition the first government they flee to. 

It doesn't necessarily mean that we as a nation can't also consider asylum claims from seekers outside the border nations, but it does mean that we're not obligated to.

As far as I know, we don't have a "Third Country" agreement with Mexico, so the only applicable "law" was Trump's Remain in Mexico policy which required migrants to stay in Mexico while their asylum claims were being heard/processed. 

Isn't there some stipulation that in order to deport back to the original country they entered the US have to have some kind of written agreement between those countries to recognize them as a safe alternative?  Did that change?

Edit: @we_gotta_believe clarified. "third country agreement.  Seems like that's where the legality gets tricky. 

I could have sworn Trump fixed the border.

13 hours ago, JohnSnowsHair said:

Serious question: are asylum seekers, regardless of the abuse of the asylum system, considered "illegal immigrants" in this poll?

They need to change the law. It’s being exploited. The spirit of the law was for refugees escaping the carnage of war, now it’s used by anyone and everyone who simply doesn’t think the country they live in is all that great. 

13 hours ago, TEW said:

Probably, and most of them should be. Legally they need to stop in the first country they arrive in; they can’t legally choose to skip all of Central America, pass through Mexico, and go to the US because that’s where they prefer to be.

I actually agree with you. Mexico for its part seems to be encouraging them to go straight through their country to our border 

1 hour ago, Toastrel said:

I could have sworn Trump fixed the border.

While Biden isn’t doing much about this and I think he’s culpable, you’re right to point this out. It was quite literally Trumps entire platform (if you can call it that). He had 2 years where his minions in congress literally voted for anything he told them to. They could have fixed this and they didn’t. It’s almost like they don’t want to solve the problem because then they don’t have a convenient boogie man to rile up their base. 

12 hours ago, MidMoFo said:

So illegal immigrants come here solely because Joe Biden and the democrats want them to? Not because they can find employment for cash money in the land of opportunity?

You don’t seriously believe that do you?

Incentives matter. Would they come here if they were immediately deported when found instead of finding home in "sanctuary cities?” If they would be homeless because sheltering them would be illegal instead of a tax funded affair?

How about if they had to do hard labor for a few years before deportation? If they were forbidden from getting drivers licenses? Or using banks? Or getting medical treatment?

We all know the left wants them to come here and stay here.

Why even pretend otherwise. You know it, I know it, we all know it. Stop with the stupid games.

If there was a bill that would throw every business owner in jail who hired illegals, but would also deport every illegal in the country, the democrats would vote unanimously against it.

1 hour ago, Toastrel said:

Funny how you never blame the employers of these illegals. The ones causing the problem.

No, it’s not causing the problem.

The problem is that one party, the Democratic Party, encourages them to come here.

We have Fing NGO’s that literally supply them and give them directions on how to cross the border, legal assistance, etc etc.

And we all know where the funding is coming from.

This idea that it’s caused by business owners is laughable and demonstrably false. This problem didn’t exist up until the second half of the 20th century even though we had less border security and no laws on who you could hire, let alone enforcement.

10 minutes ago, Gannan said:

I actually agree with you. Mexico for its part seems to be encouraging them to go straight through their country to our border 

Of course they are, because they are a gigantic public burden. Only a moron would want them to come to their country.

13 minutes ago, TEW said:

No, it’s not causing the problem.

The problem is that one party, the Democratic Party, encourages them to come here.

We have Fing NGO’s that literally supply them and give them directions on how to cross the border, legal assistance, etc etc.

And we all know where the funding is coming from.

This idea that it’s caused by business owners is laughable and demonstrably false. This problem didn’t exist up until the second half of the 20th century even though we had less border security and no laws on who you could hire, let alone enforcement.

Of course they are, because they are a gigantic public burden. Only a moron would want them to come to their country.

Yes, it has NOTHING to do with companies willing to illegally hire cheap labor because they can get away with it.

You are just SO clever.

18 minutes ago, TEW said:

No, it’s not causing the problem.

The problem is that one party, the Democratic Party, encourages them to come here.

We have Fing NGO’s that literally supply them and give them directions on how to cross the border, legal assistance, etc etc.

And we all know where the funding is coming from.

This idea that it’s caused by business owners is laughable and demonstrably false. This problem didn’t exist up until the second half of the 20th century even though we had less border security and no laws on who you could hire, let alone enforcement.

Of course they are, because they are a gigantic public burden. Only a moron would want them to come to their country.

I wonder if there was a certain US-based policy that was a catalyst for the crime and lawlessness in these countries forcing so many families to be displaced around that same period of time. Like some sort of drug enforcement initiative that gave rise to cartels eager to capitalize on a massively burgeoning black market of illegal drugs. Can't quite put my finger on when that all went down though. Ah well, even if it was during that same period of time, I'm sure it was all just a coincidence!

Illegals come for jobs, but the problem is certainly not the fact that companies get away with hiring them illegally.

The issue is liberals.

 

PS - most illegals enter the US legally, then don't leave.

4 minutes ago, Toastrel said:

Illegals come for jobs, but the problem is certainly not the fact that companies get away with hiring them illegally.

The issue is liberals.

How many lib "sanctuary" cities and laws making it legal for illegal immigrants to get driver's licenses do you need to see before we stop pretending retarded liberals are encouraging people to come here lmao?

"Herr durr, it jest greedy corporations that to blame hurrr"

 

20 minutes ago, Kz! said:

How many lib "sanctuary" cities and laws making it legal for illegal immigrants to get driver's licenses do you need to see before we stop pretending retarded liberals are encouraging people to come here lmao?

"Herr durr, it jest greedy corporations that to blame hurrr"

 

No one is blaming the immigration problem on one thing except you and your ilk. 

50 minutes ago, Toastrel said:

This idea that it’s caused by business owners is laughable and demonstrably false. This problem didn’t exist up until the second half of the 20th century even though we had less border security and no laws on who you could hire, let alone enforcement.

It’s almost like too restrictive guest worker/immigration polices, and locking down the border is part of the problem. 
 

General Chapman’s Last Stand