3 hours ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

"The Eagles’ starting quarterback was really bad in this game. The framing that "he had them in a position to win” doesn’t really tell the whole story. He was incredibly fortunate that the Giants scored zero points (seems impossible) directly off of Philly’s four turnovers, three of which were Hurts interceptions. Not to mention Hurts had a pick dropped on the final drive.”

Thats a telling stat line Giants scored ZERO points off our turnovers 

In context .... one with zero time left at the half... he other was where they just tried to make the Eagles use all 3 timeouts, I mean Jones took a ten yard loss on purpose.   The 1st was deep in their end ... but the one that was key IMO, was after the pathetic "deep" ball to Reagor, that was good field position to where our defense got the ball right back.  Regardless of 1289 spin, the defense gave every opportunity for the offense to win

16 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Joe the read option isn’t some wild cat offense gimmick that had its two years is going to fade away… Elements of it will be used for years to come just like elements of the west coast is still used though almost no team runs a traditional west coast offense anymore 

BG... "elements" is fine.... when it's your entire offense... it is not NFL.    I personally find it boring.    you want to use it 3 times a game to throw the defense off, then great.  I like route trees and the chess match between the QBs and safeties.   Not, " how does the DE respond to the mesh point" for 50 plays.

19 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

If he can’t pass when healthy what makes me think he can pass when he isn’t??? Why would I pay a guy in 3 years if he doesn’t show he can pass when healthy??? 
 

To me there no reason to play him hurt…. We gain nothing from it 

I think someone is excited to have Mustache prove 1289 wrong.   It will come in time, we already know the answer to that, if anything having Hurts play without the running might wake up a few of those people.    My thing where we differ... I want to give Mustache a legit chance.  Maybe to be the long term answer?   I don't need a rush job.  The coach isn't going anywhere.  One rush job that might not work isn't going to tell us anything on him.   You have the rest of your life to laugh at 1289, no need to rush.   If we move on from Mustache after next year, let's do it after legit shot.  

3 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

BG... "elements" is fine.... when it's your entire offense... it is not NFL.    I personally find it boring.    you want to use it 3 times a game to throw the defense off, then great.  I like route trees and the chess match between the QBs and safeties.   Not, " how does the DE respond to the mesh point" for 50 plays.

Joe the nfl is turning more and more into the college game yearly…. Read option isn’t going anywhere lots of teams use it variations of it….Nah are teams the ravens no but just about every team has RPOs and use them throughout the game. Just reality of the game now 

14 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Hurts saying he will be ready to go so guess is all a moot point 

The intangibles here ... he can inspire his team with this stuff.   Let it happen...lol

Just now, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Joe the nfl is turning more and more into the college game yearly…. Read option isn’t going anywhere lots of teams use it variations of it….Nah are teams the ravens no but just about every team has RPOs and use them throughout the game. Just reality of the game now 

Again, i'm ok with that right... like I said in my post.   I don't want the Ravens or this offense is my point.  

5 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

The coach isn't going anywhere.  One rush job that might not work isn't going to tell us anything on him.   You have the rest of your life to laugh at 1289, no need to rush.   If we move on from Mustache after next year, let's do it after legit shot.  

Like Doug wasn’t going anywhere lmao come on we have no clue what happens at season end is it unlikely yea but we have no clue…. as for Minshew getting a legit shot so we going into next season saying Hurts isn’t the guy and building the entire offense around Minshew??? No Hurts will be the guy and the offense will be the same Minshew is still going to be running the same offense he would be running this Sunday. 

7 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

Again, i'm ok with that right... like I said in my post.   I don't want the Ravens or this offense is my point.  

How different is this offense if you have a different QB that’s a passer not a runner??? Because my guess is this offense looks like majority of nfl offenses with a more traditional passer… The RPOs will still be there just like so many other nfl teams though 

The Kansas City Chiefs led the NFL at 21.2% Last season in RPOs…. Chiefs offense looks drastically different then ours though or even the ravens 

39 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Like Doug wasn’t going anywhere lmao come on we have no clue what happens at season end is it unlikely yea but we have no clue…. as for Minshew getting a legit shot so we going into next season saying Hurts isn’t the guy and building the entire offense around Minshew??? No Hurts will be the guy and the offense will be the same Minshew is still going to be running the same offense he would be running this Sunday. 

I don't think so ... I think this entire college RPO is built around Hurts.    If Mustache were to get a legit shot, we don't see 18 QB runs, we see more NFL passes.   I just want the team to actually practice that knowing he is going to be the guy, and put the RPO ONLY offense behind us, this way we see not only the QB, but the other guys.  

34 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

The Kansas City Chiefs led the NFL at 21.2% Last season in RPOs…. Chiefs offense looks drastically different then ours though or even the ravens 

I'm sorry.... My terminology is the issue... I get confused with these college terms.      I'm talking read option with the QB running as option #2 based on reading the DE at mesh point.    That is happening way more than 21% here and in Baltimore.    Probably the RPO is a different thing?????   Where it's run " pass"  option.    

That's different in what I'm trying to say or what i'm thinking...  1 out of 5 times placing the ball in the RB's stomach and pulling it back to pass is fine with me.  When the pass is the 2nd option.   QB isn't running 18 times with that.     

I apologize if my lingo is incorrect and for misunderstanding.... the issue to me is the QB running based off of one read.  It's snooze fest to me.

 

Am I incorrect in thinking the " read option"  is reading the DE and either handing off or QB keeper?    I thought "read option" was also a term ... which is different than RPO Run pass option????  

6 hours ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

If we are that worried about a QB controversy that’s a problem to begin with…. Also not banking on Dallas game for any information they are likely to have the division locked up by then playing backups 

week 17 is Washington. Dallas is week 18

 

52 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

How different is this offense if you have a different QB that’s a passer not a runner??? Because my guess is this offense looks like majority of nfl offenses with a more traditional passer… The RPOs will still be there just like so many other nfl teams though 

So correct me if I'm wrong.   The RPO... being the option to hand off, or pull back to pass it... (Hurts holding and running it, was causing penalties of linemen downfield because he ran for a second before passing it)    ... that is one element.    But I also assumed there were " read option" plays that did NOT involve the pass option???   like where we see him run 18 times, without a linemen downfield being called because he was never going to pass, it was run all the way???   

Where I think the offense would differ is that I think there would be less run plays involving the element of the QB keeper.  WE will see less where the play is shotgun and first move is the mesh point.  We will also see more pass plays. Basically, you can take the 18 plays where Hurts runs, and they become passes, while keeping everything else the same.    What the result would be, more targets for everyone.  Basically we get to see everyone else play football, not just the QB.  Which to me is the biggest draw back for this style offense, it relies too much on one guy and hurts the development of the others.   I go a step further and will say that if you use this style, you need to go with a similar running type backup QB.  Team needs to have all the same elements regardless of who is in there.  Baltimore has gone all in with this.  I would prefer not to do so.   I don't think ownership wants this, what I think is they wanted the gimmick like they had with Vick, Miami had with Ronnie Brown, the Saints had with Hill.   

While one might say the offense will remain the same... play calling and results of what actually happens during the play as far as who touches the ball and where... I think will be different.  Much different under Minshew.

4 minutes ago, stine said:

week 17 is Washington. Dallas is week 18

Thats why Dallas might not have to play legit in that game.  Because its the last game.  Flip it, and the chances are more likely they have to play in week 17.  Although, I think they will have the division wrapped up before then, at least as far as us... maybe not Washington.  

3 hours ago, joemas6 said:

I don't think it's that simple.   Stuff was built over time.   The easy narrative for the gossip type people is this.  For me ... Wentz, Schwartz, Doug and Duce... all wanted out, after seeing the direction this team is going.   That's not even just personnel moves with decisions that were brutal, but how some guys were treated ( Jenkins,  Ertz, etc)   it's easy to see if you look at the big picture and remove this idea that the Eagles are some sort of glamor franchise to play for.

We won SB why would they be planning to leave? It wasn't until Howie drafted Hurts that things started downhill and right after we lost Reich

6 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

Thats why Dallas might not have to play legit in that game.  Because its the last game.  Flip it, and the chances are more likely they have to play in week 17.  Although, I think they will have the division wrapped up before then, at least as far as us... maybe not Washington.  

  My point was I said to play Minshew in week 17, which was Washington, not Dallas. So he gets two weeks at the end of the year when we probably already know about Hurts and can learn a bit more about Siri and Minshew with this offense...

47 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

I'm sorry.... My terminology is the issue... I get confused with these college terms.      I'm talking read option with the QB running as option #2 based on reading the DE at mesh point.    That is happening way more than 21% here and in Baltimore.    Probably the RPO is a different thing?????   Where it's run " pass"  option.    

That's different in what I'm trying to say or what i'm thinking...  1 out of 5 times placing the ball in the RB's stomach and pulling it back to pass is fine with me.  When the pass is the 2nd option.   QB isn't running 18 times with that.     

I apologize if my lingo is incorrect and for misunderstanding.... the issue to me is the QB running based off of one read.  It's snooze fest to me.

 

I think people are replacing RPO when it should say "PLAY ACTION" which is what I feel KC does. Mahomes seems to be a pass first QB which would fit the RPO phrase,but I think last year he ran alot more  play action so I think KC mixes them up

https://www.viqtorysports.com/understanding-rpo/   The passage right before conclusion is what I have been trying to explain

https://www.viqtorysports.com/understanding-rpo/  For anyone who wants to know things,this is a great site to learn from at your leisure

Installing the RPO into your playbook will require confidence in your Quarterback as he will have to make a split-second decision to either hand the ball off to his running back or pull the ball back to fire a quick pass.            Here's where the failure lies IMO

24 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

We won SB why would they be planning to leave? It wasn't until Howie drafted Hurts that things started downhill and right after we lost Reich

Dude,  2019 was a sh#tshow.  Got worse in 2020. What were the signs you see that anything was going to get better.   Plus you can't discount how they dealt with Jenkins / Hurts.   You as a WR guy should see it.  Kupp.. passed....Metcalf...passed... Jefferson or trade for Diggs.. passed.  Fulgham who is reported that both Doug and Wentz wanted him on the roster at the start of the season,  was put on PS.   They replaced Reich with the first ever... OC by committee.  Oh yeah... it was just Hurts....lol

Just now, joemas6 said:

Dude,  2019 was a sh#tshow.  Got worse in 2020. What were the signs you see that anything was going to get better.   Plus you can't discount how they dealt with Jenkins / Hurts.   You as a WR guy should see it.  Kupp.. passed....Metcalf...passed... Jefferson or trade for Diggs.. passed.  Fulgham who is reported that both Doug and Wentz wanted him on the roster at the start of the season,  was put on PS.   They replaced Reich with the first ever... OC by committee.  Oh yeah... it was just Hurts....lol

I meant Jenkins/ Ertz... how the front office treated them on the way out

SO as you can see,the RPO limits most deeps balls because there simply isn't time,so it's a dunk and dunk offense which defeats the purpose of having speedsters unless you have a QB with cannon arm who can launch 60 yards in 2 seconds with accuracy basically sight unseen. Guys like Arod can do it, Stafford etc. So we have pro style WR's stuck in an RPO offense and its not working

6 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

Dude,  2019 was a sh#tshow.  Got worse in 2020. What were the signs you see that anything was going to get better.   Plus you can't discount how they dealt with Jenkins / Hurts.   You as a WR guy should see it.  Kupp.. passed....Metcalf...passed... Jefferson or trade for Diggs.. passed.  Fulgham who is reported that both Doug and Wentz wanted him on the roster at the start of the season,  was put on PS.   They replaced Reich with the first ever... OC by committee.  Oh yeah... it was just Hurts....lol

I meant Jenkins/ Ertz... how the front office treated them on the way out

Yeah,then treated Foles alot better lol.I still don't know why. because of the fan backlash for denegrating your "SB' QB I would guess lol

23 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

I think people are replacing RPO when it should say "PLAY ACTION" which is what I feel KC does. Mahomes seems to be a pass first QB which would fit the RPO phrase,but I think last year he ran alot more  play action so I think KC mixes them up

I mean....Mahomes is a pass first QB.   Pretty much all QBs are except for Jsckson and Hurts.   Murray was going there, but both he and his team seemed to change that for the good of the team.