8 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

This is valid but I mean drafting a guy doesn’t mean he will be healthy.... get hit the wrong way and your out...

Though Hightower been healthy, and honestly feel like Watkins was more IR’d for roster space then a real bad injury.... Reagors have been fluky not naggy like soft tissue stuff so think he will be fine long term as well 

  OK, I'll buy that. IF they get back on the roster this season and perform, we can concentrate elsewhere. I do feel GBFL is not completely wrong either. It cannot hurt to add to our WR depth if the right player is there round 3, 5 or 6. Anyway, getting back to McNabb. I wonder what would have happened if we just forked out the dough for Owens... Just pull him in a room and tell him that you are gonna give him the cash and will give him another contract should he keep his mouth shut the following year. I feel Owens just felt betrayed when he worked his butt off to be able to play in the SB and we didn't even give him another dollar.

3 minutes ago, stine said:

OK, I'll buy that. IF they get back on the roster this season and perform, we can concentrate elsewhere. I do feel GBFL is not completely wrong either. It cannot hurt to add to our WR depth if the right player is there round 3, 5 or 6.

Don’t disagree either just rather wait before I make my claim on our WRs right now... Fact is this team is going to have a lot to address.

DL- we are old and might have to move guys to make cap space.

LB- we all see them 

CB- we have a 30 year old Slay... Mills is a FA(if we keep him at CB), Maddox has been bad, NRC not an answer in the slot maybe Leblanc is... No depth

OL- still a ??? Dillard unknown and Mailata has had one game

TE- Ertz still doesn’t seem like he is here for long.
RB- who we got to cover Sanders clearly Scott/Clement isn’t a great answer

11 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Don’t disagree either just rather wait before I make my claim on our WRs right now... Fact is this team is going to have a lot to address.

DL- we are old and might have to move guys to make cap space.

LB- we all see them 

CB- we have a 30 year old Slay... Mills is a FA(if we keep him at CB), Maddox has been bad, NRC not an answer in the slot maybe Leblanc is... No depth

OL- still a ??? Dillard unknown and Mailata has had one game

TE- Ertz still doesn’t seem like he is here for long.
RB- who we got to cover Sanders clearly Scott/Clement isn’t a great answer

  Yep. we need help at almost every position. I say build up the Oline and Dline along with one Stud LB. Then fill in where ever we can elsewhere but do so with good solid choices!  That is where we seem to have issues every draft.... Especially in the first couple rounds. Hurts was a wasted pick. plain and simple. There were so many players that would have helped our team right away and we use it for future QB? why? As insurance? Seriously?

7 minutes ago, stine said:

Hurts was a wasted pick. plain and simple. There were so many players that would have helped our team right away and we use it for future QB? why? As insurance? Seriously?

I was not happy with the Hurts pick either could have gotten another WR then double dipped in a deep class but oh well nothing we can do bout it now 

1 hour ago, stine said:

I think we will never get better unless we hit in the draft.

 

1 hour ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

The reality is if we can’t draft and bring guys along there is blame that needs to be thrown.... look at the list of casts you had most of them were drafted by those teams lot of them were 2nd and 3rd round guys 

YES... for me you always need to draft well ... nothing to do with salary cap or any of that ... Simply put... when you draft, you get 100% of the rights to that player.   When you look into free agency, it means some other team is releasing that player first.  The quality of player may not be as good.  There is only so much you can add via free agency, you need to build the core through the draft.  2017 was nice.. brining in both outside WRs... to go with drafted guys ... our 3 TEs and Agholor (who played well that year with that surrounding cast)   

I think if we look 2 years ahead... cap clears up, Wentz's $$$ is not as high in comparison ... so we will have cap room.  But, we still need one or multiple of these young WRs along with Goedert to be here and play well ... then we can add via a couple of more drafts or FA.    The weapons need upgrade for sure.   

Looking itno other areas, if these young OL can hold up, that would be great.   Still concern for me is our DL.  We need Sweat and Barnett to step up... even still, not much else there with these other guys getting older.   You always need to draft well.  So hopefully we can add... what I see here is our team is going to take a step back while our QB finishes his late 20s.  I hope we can get the team back up so he can make some runs while he is in his early 30s. 

You both have valid points.My original arguement is,you don't stop the process of adding WR's when you can.Even teams WITH ELITE WR's continue to draft them and we are no close to resting on our WR laurels.Sean Peyton is a master at this./Their WR's are always top flight.You could argue GB's are as well.Noone hits 100% of their picks,but you keep at it.it's a fluid process and we have "weird" picks this next year 1,2,3,5,5,6,6,6,6,7. I'm sure that will change before draft day,but all I can go by it whats presented right NOW.I like Parsons and I am no D whiz,but he's a difference maker.Round 2 DL OR nice RB add(and there will be some there),round 3,as things stand I would opt for a WR.JMO and I know 93 has it different.But thats we we talk on this board.5,5,6,6,6,6,6,7 you are looking more at BU's(we need those too lol).Before anything else,I fire the entire S&C staff and start over.it's an annual disater that kills us every year

1 hour ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

I don’t dispute needing good players makers but come on you putting Eldeman remotely in the class of Julio Jones Michael Thomas, Randy Moss etc. 

Yes... just give me 2017 level.     None are elite to me in that group.   But all good and function well in different roles.    Alshon = you need to put your best CB on him, takes pressure off of everyone else.   Smith, can burn you deep, still need decent speed CB on him.   Agholor, functioned well with the ball in his hands and space to work with due to the outside guys needing attention.  Ertz, works great in 3 WRS sets, he gets the slowest cover guy.     Mix in a run game and it's nice.   Nothing elite about it except that the QB was elite when he had the slightly above average group that functioned well together.    To me that should be the goal.  doesn't need Michael Thomas or Julio ... Alshon level to start, then all players who are average at worst, but function well together.      Looking ahead, I like Goedert ... Reagor needs to be at least Torry Smith level.  Ward is ok.  Hopefully Hightower develops... but simialar to what we see with Buffalo this year just by adding Diggs.... we need that bottom level #1 type WR.   It's a game changer.  Look how good Josh Allen looks now.   None of those guys are really elite per se, but Diggs, Brown, Beasley ... with a couple nice TEs and RBs.... makes a big difference in how you need to defend as compared to taking Diggs away from that group.  Different world for the QB and different world for the defense trying to defend them.      WE have the QB IMO ... we have seen him perform at the elite level when he had above average teammates.  That should be the focus now.  

3 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

Yes... just give me 2017 level.     None are elite to me in that group.   But all good and function well in different roles.    Alshon = you need to put your best CB on him, takes pressure off of everyone else.   Smith, can burn you deep, still need decent speed CB on him.   Agholor, functioned well with the ball in his hands and space to work with due to the outside guys needing attention.  Ertz, works great in 3 WRS sets, he gets the slowest cover guy.     Mix in a run game and it's nice.   Nothing elite about it except that the QB was elite when he had the slightly above average group that functioned well together.    To me that should be the goal.  doesn't need Michael Thomas or Julio ... Alshon level to start, then all players who are average at worst, but function well together.      Looking ahead, I like Goedert ... Reagor needs to be at least Torry Smith level.  Ward is ok.  Hopefully Hightower develops... but simialar to what we see with Buffalo this year just by adding Diggs.... we need that bottom level #1 type WR.   It's a game changer.  Look how good Josh Allen looks now.   None of those guys are really elite per se, but Diggs, Brown, Beasley ... with a couple nice TEs and RBs.... makes a big difference in how you need to defend as compared to taking Diggs away from that group.  Different world for the QB and different world for the defense trying to defend them.      WE have the QB IMO ... we have seen him perform at the elite level when he had above average teammates.  That should be the focus now.  

Catch 22,we need an  O line.a CONSISTENT O line.This jostling of players has to have a negative impact on Wentz.It throws the timing off with let's say "less than stellar" WR's.My original thought was "we need to add another WR in the next draft".Thats when all the BS hit the fan lol.but I still feel we need to draft one in round 3.PS guys will only develop so far,we need to add one with a higher ceiling in MY view.if we can start developing our own,we can STOP hitting FA for other teams has beens

8 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

JMO and I know 93 has it different

I don’t disagree or agree yet just not ready to make a claim on WR it’s hard to see we have guys we have to see and right now we still have to finish the season.

You talk GB and NO he’ll even Pittsburgh they don’t draft WRs every year and guys they take they develop and they find late gems.... So to me just drafting a position year in and year out doesn’t do anything if we can’t develop players 

 

2 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

O line.a CONSISTENT O line.

Our OL even with all the changing has been one of the better OLs PFF rates them as the 5th cleanest pocket for a QB.... I don’t put over value in PFF but think if they are seeing a fairly clean pocket for We to vs other QBs likely means the OL is doing fairly well 

2 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

I don’t disagree or agree yet just not ready to make a claim on WR it’s hard to see we have guys we have to see and right now we still have to finish the season.

You talk GB and NO he’ll even Pittsburgh they don’t draft WRs every year and guys they take they develop and they find late gems.... So to me just drafting a position year in and year out doesn’t do anything if we can’t develop players 

 

Then you make staff changes,you don't stop the process

1 minute ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Our OL even with all the changing has been one of the better OLs PFF rates them as the 5th cleanest pocket for a QB.... I don’t put over value in PFF but think if they are seeing a fairly clean pocket for We to vs other QBs likely means the OL is doing fairly well 

Maybe,we don't know.it's not like we played vs 4 powerhouse teams here lol

14 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

You both have valid points.My original arguement is,you don't stop the process of adding WR's when you can.Even teams WITH ELITE WR's continue to draft them and we are no close to resting on our WR laurels.Sean Peyton is a master at this./Their WR's are always top flight.You could argue GB's are as well.Noone hits 100% of their picks,but you keep at it.it's a fluid process and we have "weird" picks this next year 1,2,3,5,5,6,6,6,6,7. I'm sure that will change before draft day,but all I can go by it whats presented right NOW.I like Parsons and I am no D whiz,but he's a difference maker.Round 2 DL OR nice RB add(and there will be some there),round 3,as things stand I would opt for a WR.JMO and I know 93 has it different.But thats we we talk on this board.5,5,6,6,6,6,6,7 you are looking more at BU's(we need those too lol).Before anything else,I fire the entire S&C staff and start over.it's an annual disater that kills us every year

  Don't use GB as an example GBFL. They did not draft a WR last 2 years and actually let a couple go! My wife was hot about it too, lol. But yet you look at the group and they are playing well. Maybe their WR Coach knows what he is doing? in 2018 they drafted a WR on rounds 4,5 and 6. only one still here is 5th rounder Van Scantling...

2 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Then you make staff changes,you don't stop the process

Again your miss the point none of the teams you named draft the same position every year none of them.... DoNt think GB has drafted a WR since 18 maybe...

You know why we have good Ol depth because of we a good OL coach that develops guys... You know why we seem to find RB gems all the time we have a good RBs coach.

You know why GB and Pitt and NO have good WRs it seems like all the time because they develop them not because they are drafting them every year 

So yea don’t think the answer to our WR problem is to draft guys every year it’s to actually be able to develop and bring guys along 

3 minutes ago, stine said:

  Don't use GB as an example GBFL. They did not draft a WR last 2 years and actually let a couple go! My wife was hot about it too, lol. But yet you look at the group and they are playing well. Maybe their WR Coach knows what he is doing? in 2018 they drafted a WR on rounds 4,5 and 6. only one still here is 5th rounder Van Scantling...

Yeah,cap issues are always a problem.player are overpaid in my view,but they let that continue.The last 2 years for them were also "rebuild" years.They have a nice TE who is contributing for them now.@ years ago they were in a similar situation as we are now.They HAD to pay Aaron,their RB's were 2nd rate behind an "iffy" online and their mD was "average".So they had other problems.They put the onus all on Rodgers,like we are doing with Wentz.

9 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Maybe,we don't know.it's not like we played vs 4 powerhouse teams here lol

Washington has one of the best front 7 in football, Cincy not what they used to be on D but still solid team up front, SF just came off a dominating win be NY(yes bad team) and Rams have arguably the best pass rusher in football in Donald.... Not like we played slouches either in terms of pass rushing teams and the OL still graded favorably 

6 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Again your miss the point none of the teams you named draft the same position every year none of them.... DoNt think GB has drafted a WR since 18 maybe...

You know why we have good Ol depth because of we a good OL coach that develops guys... You know why we seem to find RB gems all the time we have a good RBs coach.

You know why GB and Pitt and NO have good WRs it seems like all the time because they develop them not because they are drafting them every year 

The we need a staff change,that's still no excuse for avoiding a WR in ANY draft.last year I SAID we needed a WR in ROUND ONE(did I not? This next time we need ANOTHER WR in round 3.All I will ask of him is to be a solid CONTRIBUTOR that is BETTER than what we have now.I am NOT stopping the process and I really could care less about GB or anyone else.The fact remains you draft to make positions better no matter where that is.So what this boils down to is I feel a need at WR  and you do not

3 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Yeah,cap issues are always a problem.player are overpaid in my view,but they let that continue.The last 2 years for them were also "rebuild" years.They have a nice TE who is contributing for them now.@ years ago they were in a similar situation as we are now.They HAD to pay Aaron,their RB's were 2nd rate behind an "iffy" online and their mD was "average".So they had other problems.They put the onus all on Rodgers,like we are doing with Wentz.

GB hardly ever signed free agents until they got their new GM a couple years back. Then he signs some nice players, drafts some nice players and they are back to being a legit contender. All in 3 years..... Hmmm..... Wonder why we can't do that?

3 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Washington has one of the best front 7 in football, Cincy not what they used to be on D but still solid team up front, SF just came off a dominating win be NY(yes bad team) and Rams have arguably the best pass rusher in football in Donald.... Not like we played slouches either in terms of pass rushing teams and the OL still graded favorably 

It's going to get tougher than that.if our O line is so potent why is Wentz tossing picks? why does he feel rushed and rolls out? I bet some of that was pressure,so you can site PFF all day.Our O line is "average" at best against some fairly lackluster teams.We lost because of the OFFENSE and that includes the Oline

1 minute ago, stine said:

GB hardly ever signed free agents until they got their new GM a couple years back. Then he signs some nice players, drafts some nice players and they are back to being a legit contender. All in 3 years..... Hmmm..... Wonder why we can't do that?

Their new TE is making HUGE waves(Tonyan).I suspect that frees up their WR's more.Rodgers makes average WR's look good.Brady did the same.Wentz has not done that to my satisfaction.Players change teams and many fail.GB only let's their go when they need to

True GB, but remember Maliata played better than Peters IMO. So maybe the line will be better once Johnson is healthy and we get solid play from our Guards...?

2 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

It's going to get tougher than that.if our O line is so potent why is Wentz tossing picks? why does he feel rushed and rolls out? I bet some of that was pressure,so you can site PFF all day.Our O line is "average" at best against some fairly lackluster teams.We lost because of the OFFENSE and that includes the Oline

Some of the Picks were his terrible decisions throwing to a double covered JJaw in the EZ.... We also designing a ton of rollouts for Wentz to get him on the move which he likes 

6 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

The we need a staff change,that's still no excuse for avoiding a WR in ANY draft.last year I SAID we needed a WR in ROUND ONE(did I not? This next time we need ANOTHER WR in round 3.All I will ask of him is to be a solid CONTRIBUTOR that is BETTER than what we have now.I am NOT stopping the process and I really could care less about GB or anyone else.The fact remains you draft to make positions better no matter where that is.So what this boils down to is I feel a need at WR  and you do not

Lmao wow you use them as an example know you don’t care about them.... And you keep acting like I’m saying no to a WR when I’m saying I just ant to wait for the end of this season to see what we have....

I mean I forgot WR is the only position we need no need to worry about the rest of the team lol 

5 minutes ago, stine said:

GB hardly ever signed free agents until they got their new GM a couple years back. Then he signs some nice players, drafts some nice players and they are back to being a legit contender. All in 3 years..... Hmmm..... Wonder why we can't do that?

So the point for me in GB is,the last 2 years they didn;t have hose elite WR's that Aaron loves and they did not contend like they usually do.Now IDK what the reason was they let WR go,thats not my biz,but they were awful in alot of areas both years.So they sacrificed that position like we do at LB

Well, we are talking like the Eagles are a very solid team. Fact is they are not that good. Some here are positive and I like it, but do not fool yourselves into thinking we can compete this year. We have way too many holes. Wentz is trying too hard to make up for all of our problems...