1 hour ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Because a conference is the reason a player is bad or is late to see the field wow.... Don’t mind the fact that USC is in the PAC-12 and produces numerous D players especially.... Or Stanford.... Oregon has had good players come out. 
 

Id rather just here Howie nuff said

There are always a few that'll be good but that conference has a history of producing a large number of soft players who struggle with the physicality at the pro level. That conference prioritizes finesse skills and ignores toughness. Why can't Ertz break tackles? Why can't DJAX play a whole season? Why is Dillard crying at practice and then melting down before a game? Why can't our 3rd round LB'er beat out a bunch of scrubs with street FA talent? JJAW??? They all have something in common...PAC-12-itis. Soft finesse players because that's how they were trained in college.

The saddest part is that Howie is all about their developmental formula and he just keeps going back to the softest conference in college football to find prospects. Oh, and when he doesn't go there, he goes to the 2nd softest, the Mountain West. If he's gonna still be the final word on draft day, I wish Lurie would drawn a line on a map along the east edge of the Rockies from Canada to Mexico and tell Howie everything left of the line is the NO DRAFT ZONE.

Would the Eagles miss out on a player or two? Maybe, but staying in the more dominant conferences gives you a better chance of finding dominant talent. JMO of course.

3 minutes ago, PoconoDon said:

There are always a few that'll be good but that conference has a history of producing a large number of soft players who struggle with the physicality at the pro level. That conference prioritizes finesse skills and ignores toughness. Why can't Ertz break tackles? Why can't DJAX play a whole season? Why is Dillard crying at practice and then melting down before a game? Why can't our 3rd round LB'er beat out a bunch of scrubs with street FA talent? They all have something in common...PAC-12 -itis. Soft finesse players because that's how they were trained in college.

The saddest part is that Howie is all about their developmental formula and he just keeps going back to the softest conference in college football to find prospects. Oh, and when he doesn't go there, he goes to the 2nd softest, the Mountain West. If he's gonna still be the final word on draft day, I wish Lurie would drawn a line on a map along the east edge of the Rockies from Canada to Mexico and tell Howie everything left of the line is the NO DRAFT ZONE.

Would the Eagles miss out on a player or two? Maybe, but staying in the more dominant conferences gives you a better chance of finding dominant talent. JMO of course.

And Ertz has played with broken ribs yup he is soft.... Blount one of the toughest hardest runners for awhile... Clay Matthews was a stud tough all around player....Troy P one of the greatest S ever.

This is like saying. Ohio State has a history of producing soft DEs because the Bosa have a history of getting hurt, JJ watt is falling apart from and Chase young already got hurt 

19 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

And Ertz has played with broken ribs yup he is soft.... Blount one of the toughest hardest runners for awhile... Clay Matthews was a stud tough all around player....Troy P one of the greatest S ever.

The bust rate is just higher for the PAC-12. That's just how it is. There are always a few exceptions. No conference produces zero good football players, but finding a few exceptions to the rule doesn't create a new rule, it just shows exceptions. The problem is how many don't stick from there and why they fail.

The oversimplified but correct answer, is that the brand of football on the left coast is finesse football. Almost every time they play an SEC (or other Eastern) powerhouse what happens? Embarrassing mismatch that often ends in a Blowout because the PAC-12 team can't hold up. Why? They get physically dominated time and again. Maybe it wasn't always that way, but it's that way now and has been for quite some time.

I'm just against going back to what looks like a poisoned well for a refill.

 

3 minutes ago, PoconoDon said:

The bust rate is just higher for the PAC-12. That's just how it is. There are always a few exceptions. No conference produces zero good football players, but finding a few exceptions to the rule doesn't create a new rule, it just shows exceptions. The problem is how many don't stick from there and why they fail

I feel like this is a false claim i want actual numbers backing this claim up vs every other conference. 

I can go for days listing players from the PAC-13 that were successful and are successful... It just lazy scouting to call a conference bad and don’t draft from them.... 

If we have that sorry of a scouting team that we feel like we could only draft from the SEC who produces tons of busts as well or Big 10 who produces plenty of busts there is an issue and we need a whole new scout team 

23 hours ago, stine said:

 Their D is playing better than ours. We beat a injured SF team tied a crappy Cincy team lost to a terrible Washington team and got Smacked by a good Rams team...

The only mild disagreement ...I don't think the Rams are a good team...and yea they beat a bad Eagle team early in the season.

23 hours ago, joemas6 said:

I think we will look at the pay for Wentz differently real soon.  He won't be anywhere near top $$ for QBs.     The cap was tight for next year... we get past that... it won't be an issue.   The issue we are running into is the team got old and injured.  We invested in Agholor, Smith, Alshon, DeSean, JJAW and Reager ...  .. Agholor flopped .... Smith retired , Alshon and DeSean hurt, JJAW and Reagor not developed yet and both hurt ....   This isn't about placing blame or anything, just about the reality.     After next year they will be able to use FA if they like, but they will need to have one of these picks hit and or make another one that does.

In back to back season the first 5 games of the season Doug and his staff underperform. Last year Peedy sat most of his starters in the preseason. They looked putrid, the lack of preseason cost games just like they have this season . Is anyone surprised that JP, DJax , Vinny, are again on the sidelines. Peedy's loyalty to his older players is problematic... Weather JP is healthy or not...  Mailata needs to play and continue to grow and stay on the field.  I doubt they keep this huge young OL playing together. We refuse to put our young players on the  field citing they are not ready..  Why did it take four  years to see Mack Hollins was a bust. Arcega Whiteside is he a bust ? With the new liberal use of Practice Squard personnel, why are'nt we more aggressively trying to find out what we have.

20 hours ago, stine said:

True GB, but remember Maliata played better than Peters IMO. So maybe the line will be better once Johnson is healthy and we get solid play from our Guards...?

This new bunch did good work against a 49er Defense that were battling injuries, that 49er D is STILL formidable  and Carson was able to win with a Depleted WR Corp says a lot about this young group.

20 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Thats my hope as well.All the injuries and jostling take a toll.I'm surprised Sanders does as well as he does.Another shock to me is Ertz production falling away.Seems lately he needs Goeder to play or his efficiency tanks

Ertz issue is money he seems disgruntled to me, I don't see the effort. The Eagles need to reward Zach loyalty before he sours on Philly.

16 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

I feel like this is a false claim i want actual numbers backing this claim up vs every other conference. 

I can go for days listing players from the PAC-13 that were successful and are successful... It just lazy scouting to call a conference bad and don’t draft from them.... 

Call it whatever you want. I'm not doing your homework for you. Want to look into it to refute my claim, feel free. I know it's higher overall. 

Just now, PoconoDon said:

Call it whatever you want. I'm not doing your homework for you. Want to look into it to refute my claim, feel free. I know it's higher overall. 

Sounds like you have no actual proof lmao 😂 so it’s a baseless claim 

So about 11.7 percent of SEC players who move onto the NFL become Pro Bowlers.

Two other Big Five conferences — the Pac-12 (11.96 percent) and Big 12 (11.62 percent) — produce Pro Bowlers with about the same success rate
 

hmmmmm that was just a quick search 

Djax and Alshon no go's again.Tired of us manning the MASH tent ever year

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2018/success-players-college-conference-defense

More that shows PAC-12 right on par of the rest on the D side actually higher % then the SEC. 

17 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Sounds like you have no actual proof lmao 😂 so it’s a baseless claim 

Since we're discussing busts lets look at which conferences provide the most players that stick and don't bust out.

# of players by conference on active rosters as of Sept 8, 2020. 

SEC: 339

Big 10: 253

ACC: 215

PAC-12: 189

Almost double the # of players make their NFL team from the SEC than the PAC-12. Better to focus on scouting everything east of the Rockies IMO. Your chances of hitting are better.

 

34 minutes ago, Trini said:

The only mild disagreement ...I don't think the Rams are a good team...and yea they beat a bad Eagle team early in the season.

In back to back season the first 5 games of the season Doug and his staff underperform. Last year Peedy sat most of his starters in the preseason. They looked putrid, the lack of preseason cost games just like they have this season . Is anyone surprised that JP, DJax , Vinny, are again on the sidelines. Peedy's loyalty to his older players is problematic... Weather JP is healthy or not...  Mailata needs to play and continue to grow and stay on the field.  I doubt they keep this huge young OL playing together. We refuse to put our young players on the  field citing they are not ready..  Why did it take four  years to see Mack Hollins was a bust. Arcega Whiteside is he a bust ? With the new liberal use of Practice Squard personnel, why are'nt we more aggressively trying to find out what we have.

This new bunch did good work against a 49er Defense that were battling injuries, that 49er D is STILL formidable  and Carson was able to win with a Depleted WR Corp says a lot about this young group.

Ertz issue is money he seems disgruntled to me, I don't see the effort. The Eagles need to reward Zach loyalty before he sours on Philly.

Yeah IDK here.We have JP,(who we ended up paying),Dillard and Mailata.Now we know JP is gone after this year(I think????) And Dillard hasn't played enough and strikes me(without facts) as a guy who would sit out for stubbed toe.If Mailata has another 2-3 decent enough games(I'm not expecting pro bowler here yet lol) would you trade Dillard for another position of need? Or keep him as a BU?.or do you play Dillard and put Mailata at BU? This should be an interesting battle going foward

1 minute ago, PoconoDon said:

Since we're discussing busts lets look at which conferences provide the most players that stick and don't bust out.

# of players by conference on active rosters as of Sept 8, 2020. 

SEC: 339

Big 10: 253

ACC: 215

PAC-12: 189

Almost double the # of players make their NFL team from the SEC than the PAC-12. Better to focus on scouting everything east of the Rockies IMO. Your chances of hitting are better.

 

SEC cranks out some excellent players(I had JJ in the last draft).Most of those are "NFL ready" or at least it seems they are easier to transition.Being from Ohio of course I am an OSU fan.The ACC is a growing league and they are starting to produce more keepers

Some things to watch for tomorrow.

Mailata versus Bud Dupree. Dupree is a legit pass rusher. He had somewhat of a breakout season last year with 11.5 sacks, 17 qb hits and 16 TFLs. He has a nasty spin move, which is Mailata's biggest weakness. One good thing is that he wins a lot with pure speed, which Mailata should be able to handle. This is a great test for Mailata to see if he is the real deal. Expect to see a lot of Dupree using a speed rush initially, and then ducking to the inside. Dupree also makes a lot of tackles in the run game, so if the Eagles want to run the ball, Mailata has to neutralize him.

Carson versus the secondary. The Steelers play a lot of off coverage, so guys will be open early. Can he make quick accurate throws? Can the receivers generate YAC against a tough D?

Our DEs against the Pittsburgh tackles. I would say the tackles have been a weakness for the Steelers. Can our guys generate pressure and keep Ben from getting to his second and third read?

Alex Singleton versus James Connor. The Steelers run the ball well, and Singleton has a chance to earn a starting job this week.

 

 

2 minutes ago, jsb235 said:

Some things to watch for tomorrow.

Mailata versus Bud Dupree. Dupree is a legit pass rusher. He had somewhat of a breakout season last year with 11.5 sacks, 17 qb hits and 16 TFLs. He has a nasty spin move, which is Mailata's biggest weakness. One good thing is that he wins a lot with pure speed, which Mailata should be able to handle. This is a great test for Mailata to see if he is the real deal. Expect to see a lot of Dupree using a speed rush initially, and then ducking to the inside. Dupree also makes a lot of tackles in the run game, so if the Eagles want to run the ball, Mailata has to neutralize him.

Carson versus the secondary. The Steelers play a lot of off coverage, so guys will be open early. Can he make quick accurate throws? Can the receivers generate YAC against a tough D?

Our DEs against the Pittsburgh tackles. I would say the tackles have been a weakness for the Steelers. Can our guys generate pressure and keep Ben from getting to his second and third read?

Alex Singleton versus James Connor. The Steelers run the ball well, and Singleton has a chance to earn a starting job this week.

 

 

They have some nice WR's. Getting to Ben isn't so easy and he's hard to bring down.I hope our secondary can cope

7 minutes ago, PoconoDon said:

Since we're discussing busts lets look at which conferences provide the most players that stick and don't bust out.

# of players by conference on active rosters as of Sept 8, 2020. 

SEC: 339

Big 10: 253

ACC: 215

PAC-12: 189

Almost double the # of players make their NFL team from the SEC than the PAC-12. Better to focus on scouting everything east of the Rockies IMO. Your chances of hitting are better.

And how many SEC players were drafted in that span???? Lmao I like percents that a real indicator 

If there is 339 SEC and 1200 were drafted in that span that’s a 28% success rate for them sticking on roster 

if Pac12 had 600 draft in that span that a 31.5% success rate there players stick on rosters 

2 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

And how many SEC players were drafted in that span???? Lmao I like percents that a real indicator 

The math isn't hard.

The SEC had 339 active NFL players as of sept 8, 2020 and the PAC-12 had 189. If there are more drafted from the SEC, it might mean that's where more NFL level talent is located.

We can go round and round all day but in the end, I am of the opinion that there's a problem with the PAC-12 football programs and the Eagles players from that conference (sans Ertz and Blount) have been remarkably unreliable and mostly uninspiring. It's fine if you disagree.

2 minutes ago, PoconoDon said:

The math isn't hard.

The SEC had 339 active NFL players as of sept 8, 2020 and the PAC-12 had 189. If there are more drafted from the SEC, it might mean that's where more NFL level talent is located.

We can go round and round all day but in the end, I am of the opinion that there's a problem with the PAC-12 football programs and the Eagles players from that conference (sans Ertz and Blount) have been remarkably unreliable and mostly uninspiring. It's fine if you disagree.

Your right the math isn’t hard just because more players come out of a conference doesn’t make you more likely to hit on a player lmao....

if you have a 20% chance to hit on a SEC and a 30% chance to hit on a Pac12 player PAC12 is better 

Again if you have 1200 SEC players and only 339 are success rates and you are randomly picking hmmmm that’s a 28.2% success rate 

600 PAC12 players and you have a 189 that’s a 31.5% success rate of finding a player 

Last I checked 31.5> 28.2% 

15 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Your right the math isn’t hard just because more players come out of a conference doesn’t make you more likely to hit on a player lmao....

if you have a 20% chance to hit on a SEC and a 30% chance to hit on a Pac12 player PAC12 is better 

Your % seem a little off.

from 2010 through 2019 drafts the # of drafted prospects by conference was:

SEC: 516 taken, so 65% made it.

PAC-12: 319 taken, so 59% made it.

More from the SEC and at a higher %.

Take your Howie loving philosophy out to the left coast and enjoy your finesse football.

At the end of the day, I just want the Eagles to find great talent wherever they look. Of late, Howie has been dipping into the PAC-12 well and coming up with nothing.

I would expect these three spots to be filled today. The most obvious choices are Curry, Watkins and Craig James, if they are able to play. It makes sense to activate Watkins and James, as we are light at WR and CB. If the team doesn't feel Watkins is ready, it makes sense to leave him on IR and promote Burnett. If James isn't ready I would think Arnold gets the nod from the PS. Curry seems like a luxury right now, but it would be good to get him back because he is good against the run. But I also want to see more snaps from Avery.

My guess for the inactives will be Maddox, Jeffery, DJax (all hurt), Sudfeld and Toohill. I think all the olinemen will be active due to injury concerns. They are light at DB, so I could also see a RB inactive and Arnold or Riley called up from the PS, depending on James' status. Huntley hasn't done much so far to justify being active.  

 

11 minutes ago, PoconoDon said:

Your % seem a little off.

from 2010 through 2019 drafts the # of drafted prospects by conference was:

SEC: 516 taken, so 65% made it.

PAC-12: 319 taken, so 59% made it.

More from the SEC and at a higher %.

Take your Howie loving philosophy out to the left coast and enjoy your finesse football.

Lmao except SEC had 516 players drafted pretty sure not every 339 player still on roster was drafted out of the SEC likely ton of UDFA in there.

PAC 12 has that same problem but the numbers are damn near the same.

Point is your laziness to just call out a conference is bogus as numerous numbers suggested. 

Everything you spout as been complete nonsense that isn’t backed up by anything 

54 minutes ago, PoconoDon said:

At the end of the day, I just want the Eagles to find great talent wherever they look. Of late, Howie has been dipping into the PAC-12 well and coming up with nothing.

Lmao and again this is on Howie and poor scouting not a conference....