2 hours ago, jsb235 said:

We all saw Wentz play at a very high level. If Hurts plays at a very high level, then I think you have to place the blame for Wentz's regression on the coaching staff, rather than the guy selecting the players.

We have all seen how Slay has struggled the last two weeks. We have seen players who couldn't get on the field here (Fort, Douglas, Jones, Darby) go on to have success elsewhere. So at some point, you have to realize that the problem isn't the talent, it's what being done with it.

The bottom line is this. Howie drafted Hurts because he felt he was a unicorn, namely a qb capable of being a top 10 guy in the league. If he was right, you don't lose your job for finding a unicorn just because you missed on a third round linebacker.

And, what if we see guys like JJAW and Hightower start to play better with Hurts on the field? I think that substantially changes the equation in terms of how we drafted. Wentz's poor play hasn't just impacted his value, but that of our oline and wrs as well. If Hurts is who Howie thought he was, we should see all of those elements get better.

One caveat. I didn't think Hurts was that good. So I didn't see what Howie saw in him, nor do I expect him to do well the rest of the season. So Howie should absolutely lose his job if that's the case. But if he got this right, you can't fire him.

Perhaps if Hurts gets a full week of practice with the first team... And does not get dumped in a game against an 8 game winning playoff bound Packer team, with the game bordering on getting out of hand....hmmmmmm perhaps Hurts would have performed better. We keep being told Hurts isn't ready...he is our #2 ? after Wentz right ... if Wentz gets hurt ?Hurts who is not ready becomes the guy that played yesterday with no reps with the starters. This whole QB situation is foul.

3 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I mean you'd have to hope that one of those rooks is going to work out? I can't imagine how far it would set this franchise back if neither were. I agree though it is by very sad to be talking like this. 

Well we still have Suds. IDK I never see him play, but he should have some kind of knowledge after what 4 years now? I would be fine with Fields. With Hurts, maybe we could move them in/out every game so both can play(like what they did in New Orleans,when Brees went down Hill stepped right in and they are still winning) 

1 minute ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Well we still have Suds. IDK I never see him play, but he should have some kind of knowledge after what 4 years now? I would be fine with Fields. With Hurts, maybe we could move them in/out every game so both can play(like what they did in New Orleans,when Brees went down Hill stepped right in and they are still winning) 

Suds will likely be gone after this year bud. I mean he's seen Wentz play like ish all year but didn't get a chance. Now he's seen Hurts come in when Wentz has been benched. Suds has no future here, or at least i don't think he does. And if they draft a QB high this year then he definitely doesn't. 

11 minutes ago, Trini said:

Perhaps if Hurts gets a full week of practice with the first team... And does not get dumped in a game against an 8 game winning playoff bound Packer team, with the game bordering on getting out of hand....hmmmmmm perhaps Hurts would have performed better. We keep being told Hurts isn't ready...he is our #2 ? after Wentz right ... if Wentz gets hurt ?Hurts who is not ready becomes the guy that played yesterday with no reps with the starters. This whole QB situation is foul.

After 5 years, Wentz is not ready yet lol 🙄

5 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Suds will likely be gone after this year bud. I mean he's seen Wentz play like ish all year but didn't get a chance. Now he's seen Hurts come in when Wentz has been benched. Suds has no future here, or at least i don't think he does. And if they draft a QB high this year then he definitely doesn't. 

He;s not real expensive lol,sign him another year until you find your QB. You may never need him if we had Hurts and  Lawrence/Fields. Sadly though every ONE of those guys should be starting somewhere next year,so it would be tough to relegate one as the #2, but like I said,you'd probably figure that out in camp and trade the other, plus you can spread out that huge dead hit over 5 years if you took Lawrence or Fields. I am not recoing this, but right now all options should be on the table

2 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

He;s not real expensive lol,sign him another year until you find your QB. You may never need him if we had Hurts and  Lawrence/Fields. Sadly though every ONE of those guys should be starting somewhere next year,so it would be tough to relegate one as the #2, but like I said,you'd probably figure that out in camp and trade the other, plus you can spread out that huge dead hit over 5 years if you took Lawrence or Fields. I am not recoing this, but right now all options should be on the table

I can see what you're saying i just don't see it. I mean the team may decide to keep Wentz and draft a QB in the first round. That's not out of the question with this team is it? Use another valuable pick on another QB.

IDK peeps, Wentz is reminding me more and more of Bradford the statue. Most sacks,worst QB in the league, but apparently the stats aren't bad enough for Ped. Maybe the benching will wake Wentz up(which I suggested be done weeks ago). So it's "crunch time for Carson"

2 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I can see what you're saying i just don't see it. I mean the team may decide to keep Wentz and draft a QB in the first round. That's not out of the question with this team is it? Use another valuable pick on another QB.

Keeping him another year WOULD save on the dead money hit(53 mil to 24 I think I read), then again what would you get for a #2 QB with no upside a year from now? it's like trading Suds lol. May as well find a chump right now

2 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Keeping him another year WOULD save on the dead money hit(53 mil to 24 I think I read), then again what would you get for a #2 QB with no upside a year from now? it's like trading Suds lol. May as well find a chump right now

Trading him this year would mean we take the cap hit of like $30M but that's all. I mean I say that's all, of course that's a huge number but I think you get what I'm saying. 

7 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I can see what you're saying i just don't see it. I mean the team may decide to keep Wentz and draft a QB in the first round. That's not out of the question with this team is it? Use another valuable pick on another QB.

Yeah,but I'm not paying Wentz that HUGE amount be to a 2, so for me, I cut bait. I'm sure everyone has different opinions. And keeping him does nothing to lower the cap for the next draft/off season. At least not enough

3 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Trading him this year would mean we take the cap hit of like $30M but that's all. I mean I say that's all, of course that's a huge number but I think you get what I'm saying. 

I thought  it was 53 this year and 24 next. Could be wrong

Just now, GreenbleedinNC said:

Yeah,but I'm not paying Wentz that HUGE amount be to a 2, so for me, I cut bait. I'm sure everyone has different opinions.

To me you either trade him or you have him here next year. He can start out the year if you have drafted a young QB and then that guy takes over or he can be a very expensive back up. You absolutely don't cut him because then it is a huge cap hit that I'm not sure this team can even afford?

4 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

To me you either trade him or you have him here next year. He can start out the year if you have drafted a young QB and then that guy takes over or he can be a very expensive back up. You absolutely don't cut him because then it is a huge cap hit that I'm not sure this team can even afford?

Well we have that right now with Hurts, so if I Take a QB in 1,that's my QB. No sense repeating what we did with Hurts IMO. Maybe Hurts IS good enough, we don;t know that yet. let the year go and see that we think at the end of it. IDK we get one mess and keep adding to it,it's insane.Nothing ever gets fixed

My round 1 pick needs to start at ANY position. If they can't that is a draft fail in my view. Round 2 should be a contributor with starting potential the following year(Hurts), but Wentz is so bad we have to force the issue now

9 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

To me you either trade him or you have him here next year. He can start out the year if you have drafted a young QB and then that guy takes over or he can be a very expensive back up. You absolutely don't cut him because then it is a huge cap hit that I'm not sure this team can even afford?

No,I never meant CUT him. I figured you assumed it was a Wentz trade

So basically, if we drafted like 4-5, you'd basically be looking at the Jets and Jags as trade partners for Wentz and our 4/5 for their 1 plus maybe a 4th also. A bit of a hard sell for them since they could just say no and draft the 2 QB's,so it's rather slim. I was just tossing out the possibility. Maybe the Jets like Darnold,IDK. I think the Jags need a new QB. Wentz is experienced,or they could opt for a rook. I have no clue where this all ends up

In any case,my thoughts are we will go with Hurts, try to trade Wentz for ???????, keep Suds and pick up another QB later in the draft. I like Zac Thomas as a DITR (Appalachian state) Could be had in round 6 I suppose

Another trade partner  IMO could be TB. Brady is getting up there now. Wentz could be a nice 2 who could take over for them,same with Rivers in Indy

1 hour ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

IDk that either could be any worse right now,but with 2 rooks,we'd have 3 years to find our QB and maybe trade the other lol. I really HATE to be talking like this!!! very sad

Don't see them taking that Wentz Cap hit or Trade without trying to salvage Wentz first... regardless ....of how well Hurts plays or performs they will bring someone in to fix Wentz  before Laurie blows it up. Maybe a team like Indy with Reich might take on a Wentz contract, with a coach that knows him. I don't think Wentz has #1 value after how he has played this year even if we find someone that is willing. We cannot just give him away.after all the resources we gave up for Wentz.

1 hour ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I mean you'd have to hope that one of those rooks is going to work out? I can't imagine how far it would set this franchise back if neither were. I agree though it is by very sad to be talking like this. 

There are so many other problems on this team beside Wentz. Edwards has had some good moments but is still getting lost in coverage. Has Slay lost a step, is this another High priced aging vet wasted money. Or is it scheme and Coaching. Not in a rush to Dump Wentz as disappointing and frustrating as this season has been, can he be fixed. I still need to know what we have in Hurts?

The one really attractive thing about Wentz to another team is that his salary would be reasonable for four years, with cap hits of $25 million, $22 million, $25 million and $26 million, with only the first year being guaranteed. So if you do turn him around, you get a cheap qb for four years, and if you don't, you just cut him with no real damage done.

If a team offered a first for him, or even a package of picks with that value, and if Hurts plays well, you do that deal all day long. Sure, the dead cap money is pretty rough in 2021. But you would be looking at having upwards of $100 million in cap space in 2022, so you could push a lot of money into that year. 

The really important thing is determining whether or not Hurts is any good. We will hopefully see Sunday.

 

  

1 hour ago, Trini said:

Don't see them taking that Wentz Cap hit or Trade without trying to salvage Wentz first... regardless ....of how well Hurts plays or performs they will bring someone in to fix Wentz  before Laurie blows it up. Maybe a team like Indy with Reich might take on a Wentz contract, with a coach that knows him. I don't think Wentz has #1 value after how he has played this year even if we find someone that is willing. We cannot just give him away.after all the resources we gave up for Wentz.

There are so many other problems on this team beside Wentz. Edwards has had some good moments but is still getting lost in coverage. Has Slay lost a step, is this another High priced aging vet wasted money. Or is it scheme and Coaching. Not in a rush to Dump Wentz as disappointing and frustrating as this season has been, can he be fixed. I still need to know what we have in Hurts?

IDK bud,those resources we gave up are like buying an old POS car. You can pour money into it for years, and after 4 years you decide to drive it on vacation. Then it quits on you in the middle of nowhere. Do you keep pouring money into it, or do you sell it on the spot and learn a lesson? I will agree though, that Lurie will just wait and let the fans suffer more humiliation before acting. If I was him, I would sell the team and buy 2 beach houses in Hawaii and say F it. When your team's gear on Fanatic goes on sale for 70% off, you can figure your team and investment are in trouble

1 hour ago, jsb235 said:

The really important thing is determining whether or not Hurts is any good. We will hopefully see Sunday.

Absolutely the key. Not expecting world class performance after 1/2 game. Just show me signs of life and the ability to make the throws and decisions. Recall if you will this team played better AS A TEAM, AFTER Wentz went down and we put Foles in. It wasn't that Foles was better,' it's everyone around him pulled together, which at this point, in this lame season doesn't matter

2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I can see what you're saying i just don't see it. I mean the team may decide to keep Wentz and draft a QB in the first round. That's not out of the question with this team is it? Use another valuable pick on another QB.

This is the least expected discussion I NEVER imagined we would be having.  I love that kid Wentz , but he is just NOT the version I was expecting after 5 yrs. I say Howie has to be declawed and a Football GM be brought in. I always saw Howie as one of the best in the game. Glad for the Championship, the lack of Elite Talent is clear,  Age of players we depend on has reared it ugly head with the lack of production on the field, and one injury after another. How many players on this team can we say are capable of making Dynamic plays. Less tha4? Less than 3.? I Really think Peedy has checked out he comes across disinterested. Hey UK EF89 did you mean Waste another valuable pick on a QB...lol.😅

1 hour ago, jsb235 said:

The one really attractive thing about Wentz to another team is that his salary would be reasonable for four years, with cap hits of $25 million, $22 million, $25 million and $26 million, with only the first year being guaranteed. So if you do turn him around, you get a cheap qb for four years, and if you don't, you just cut him with no real damage done.

If a team offered a first for him, or even a package of picks with that value, and if Hurts plays well, you do that deal all day long. Sure, the dead cap money is pretty rough in 2021. But you would be looking at having upwards of $100 million in cap space in 2022, so you could push a lot of money into that year. 

The really important thing is determining whether or not Hurts is any good. We will hopefully see Sunday.

 

  

I really think even if Hurts play well...good for Hurts, it enhances his value  Wentz gets a new voice and a chance to get his mojo back they bet the farm on Wentz. I just don't see it.

12 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

IDK bud,those resources we gave up are like buying an old POS car. You can pour money into it for years, and after 4 years you decide to drive it on vacation. Then it quits on you in the middle of nowhere. Do you keep pouring money into it, or do you sell it on the spot and learn a lesson? I will agree though, that Lurie will just wait and let the fans suffer more humiliation before acting. If I was him, I would sell the team and buy 2 beach houses in Hawaii and say F it. When your team's gear on Fanatic goes on sale for 70% off, you can figure your team and investment are in trouble

I like your analogy.😂 We already dealing with a lot of dead money .... add Covid loses, that would really compound things.

3 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Well we have that right now with Hurts, so if I Take a QB in 1,that's my QB. No sense repeating what we did with Hurts IMO. Maybe Hurts IS good enough, we don;t know that yet. let the year go and see that we think at the end of it. IDK we get one mess and keep adding to it,it's insane.Nothing ever gets fixed

Very good and fair point. Build an offense and a team that can support its QB. Whether that is Hurts or another young QB.

3 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

No,I never meant CUT him. I figured you assumed it was a Wentz trade

A Wentz trade doesn't come with a $55-60M hit though.