1 minute ago, cunninghamtheman said:

When did he coach him?

Your right my bad lol.... But huge difference between HC vs QB coach. 

1 hour ago, cunninghamtheman said:

I’m not real emotional about it at all. Not sure why you don’t see that Wentz was definitely a part of the problem. He just kept forcing the ball to Ertz regardless. Just wasn’t going to develop any of these receivers. Agholor wasn’t terrible. But he got in a Wentz dog house with drops ...so he wasn’t going back. Wentz was holding on to the ball while the film shows wide open guys. That’s not on coaching. That’s not on the FO. Him throwing inaccurate passes to open guys isn’t on coaching or the FO either. Who’s fault is it that Wentz has not been accepting coaching? Is it the coach because he can’t get Wentz to accept any blame or suggestions/instruction? Or is it the FO because they let Wentz go around the coach to ****? Or is there a point we actually point to the player at fault? Does the right character guy making franchise money need to be a leader? Should he lift others around him up? Or is it all just be talented and uncoachable? Only wearing the C so guys know not to mess with him. Why did his game pick up in 2019 once it became no name receivers? Is it because they hadn’t had a chance to get in his doghouse yet? That he didn’t hold the ball thinking about how he wouldn’t throw the ball towards two certain receivers regardless. He just went through his reads and slung it. What happened to him this season? Nicest version is he added weight and that threw off his touch....Oline fell apart from injury. But we saw a rookie come in and throw fit more yards than him in two games. Hard to blame lack of receiving talent when the rook comes in and throws for over 330 yards two out of three times.

 I can blame everybody for their roles. Wentz deserves his share.

Again... my point on the big picture.   " Andy needed to leave Philadelphia to succeed" is the article.    When the same article comes out on Wentz.  

Both guys Lurie brought into the league. He loves both guys.

Does he wake up at that point and ask himself " why couldn't these guys succeed here..  what are WE doing wrong"

Do you think that happens?

1 minute ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Your right my bad lol.... But huge difference between HC vs QB coach. 

When Hurts was already here and then you hire the coach with that relationship to Hurts. Not even just that but...the coach took the job to coach Hurts. I’m not sure Wentz wins that QB competition even to be honest. If that ever was a reality(which I don’t believe). 

1 minute ago, joemas6 said:

Again... my point on the big picture.   " Andy needed to leave Philadelphia to succeed" is the article.    When the same article comes out on Wentz.  

Both guys Lurie brought into the league. He loves both guys.

Does he wake up at that point and ask himself " why couldn't these guys succeed here..  what are WE doing wrong"

Do you think that happens?

AR did succeed here....very much. AR’s son killing himself at team facility did facilitate a change I think. He needed a refresh after so many years here also. 
    Not seeing much of a comparison between AR and Wentz. Other than Wentz needs out because he’s in the wrong spot to not have a very solid backbone.

7 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

Again... my point on the big picture.   " Andy needed to leave Philadelphia to succeed" is the article.    When the same article comes out on Wentz.  

Both guys Lurie brought into the league. He loves both guys.

Does he wake up at that point and ask himself " why couldn't these guys succeed here..  what are WE doing wrong"

Do you think that happens?

Evidently his answer for Wentz wasn’t that Rosie and himself were the problem so....

5 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

When Hurts was already here and then you hire the coach with that relationship to Hurts. Not even just that but...the coach took the job to coach Hurts. I’m not sure Wentz wins that QB competition even to be honest. If that ever was a reality(which I don’t believe). 

Lmao Wentz if he stayed won wasn’t even close... again still don’t believe we sit in the top 10 trade Wentz and do t take QB.. a QB coach hire from the coach doesn’t sell me that Lurie believes in him

He forced coaching hires and fires on his only SB winning coach....but then let the new young guy pick his own staff. That’s doesn’t seem right at all. Firing his SB winning coach after he went to the playoffs three straight seasons before. Fired him after the mist asterisk season possible of 2020 COVID. Pedey is a very good personal coach. No doubts that effected him. Big Giants game week the team wasn’t allowed to meet or huddle because of extreme COVID protocols. And we lost that game...shocker!

7 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Evidently his answer for Wentz wasn’t that Rosie and himself were the problem so....

But we aren't there yet.  I'm thinking down the road.  Listening to the radio now, Adam Shefter was on saying the trade was coming soon.  Seems like the Eagles are expecting a good return due to a few teams being interested.

The theme there, obviously their are people around the league who believe in Wentz. When he goes to a competent organization he should succeed.  Has nothing to do with who is to blame for 2020.  Which has been my point all along.  We are Eagled fans, our concern should be what the Eagles did wrong, not the player or coach... those guys come and go, but the organization doing things wrong is more of an issue. 

So down the road ... if Lurie is sitting watching playoff games with Reid and Wentz... does he think, we must be doing something wrong. We had both of those guys, why aren't I holding multiple trophies and having parades.

Throw in what if Doug takes another team to the playoffs?   At some point reality has to hit right? 

I haven't read the discussions yet since Friday...This might be OLD news reported on Bleeding Green Nation that Chicago is the front runner for Wentz...his first QB coach is the Chicago QB coach.  Eagles want two first round picks and a player probably ....Nick Foles coming back..the Bears pick 20th this year.... but the report says the deal is the best one on the table for Wentz.

Apologies if this has already been hashed.

1 hour ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Why stop at drafting three rookies. Let’s draft five. We’ll try and sort through the QBs and the losers can go block for the winner. We have endless draft ammo. Let’s trade up for Wilson. Trade Cox, Lane and Brooks to get another first round QB. Then we can have all three fight over one football. Stick a C on the water boy until we figure it out

Not a bad idea 😂😂

13 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

He forced coaching hires and fires on his only SB winning coach....but then let the new young guy pick his own staff. That’s doesn’t seem right at all. Firing his SB winning coach after he went to the playoffs three straight seasons before. Fired him after the mist asterisk season possible of 2020 COVID. Pedey is a very good personal coach. No doubts that effected him. Big Giants game week the team wasn’t allowed to meet or huddle because of extreme COVID protocols. And we lost that game...shocker!

I'm with you...

To me ... blame goes Howie, Doug and Wentz... 

The excuse Wentz and Doug have is the supporting cast.   Howie has only injury excuse... which also can be used by both Wentz and Doug.   Howie controlled what he gave Doug and Wentz... the other 2 really can't be blamed for making Howie look bad. 

And I'm consistent in talking about Hurts pick.  I had no issue with taking QB, my issue was why take one who works in a completely different style offense, made no sense.  Hard to compare IMO.  How do you have legit competition running a read option? No brainer Hurts can do that.  Then you see Hurts can't throw on the back foot, which will be needed at times.  The wishy washy going in between half commitment that we have talked about over the years.  Same crap.  Only time was different was 2016-17. They had a plan and committed to it, stuck by it and succeeded.  Forget the intangible BS.. not saying it doesn't matter.. but just look on paper. Was a better plan. 

Howie should be digging his grave... success for Wentz and or Doug ...and Hurts mediocrity should do the trick.  Even for Lurie, because I don't think he likes that style of play that Hurts will bring. 

17 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

But we aren't there yet.  I'm thinking down the road.  Listening to the radio now, Adam Shefter was on saying the trade was coming soon.  Seems like the Eagles are expecting a good return due to a few teams being interested.

The theme there, obviously their are people around the league who believe in Wentz. When he goes to a competent organization he should succeed.  Has nothing to do with who is to blame for 2020.  Which has been my point all along.  We are Eagled fans, our concern should be what the Eagles did wrong, not the player or coach... those guys come and go, but the organization doing things wrong is more of an issue. 

So down the road ... if Lurie is sitting watching playoff games with Reid and Wentz... does he think, we must be doing something wrong. We had both of those guys, why aren't I holding multiple trophies and having parades.

Throw in what if Doug takes another team to the playoffs?   At some point reality has to hit right? 

    So what is your point? Lurie will step down as CEO of the Eagles? Very unlikely. 
  I think it has plenty to do with 2020. ClusterF was going on before that. But it all hit a head in 2020....why? I’d say...because you made your football guy(Pederson) fire his coach. Forced coaches on him. Created a situation where the players went over the football guys head to the FO. Cut his balls off. Created a situation where Wentz didn’t think things should be done Pedersons way. Created a situation where Pederson had to play an old used up Peters. The drafts. The FA pickups. The BACKLOADING OF CONTRACTS! All of it came together into a sh17 storm of Rosie and Lurie’s flaws. So what was their answer to fix this? Not nearly the right ones.

No Mas, Rosie is the voice of Lurie. I’m not sure Rosie isn’t but a fall guy somewhat here as well.

How does blame go to Pedey? Because he wanted certain coaches. Forced to fire them. Not only that...but had coaches forced on him. He just wanted to be in charge and in control. Stated he just thought his voice should be the only one in the QB room. Not Mornigweg. Not having his QB think he can just kill any play before they even break the huddle. Consequences. If you do it Pedey’s  way and it doesn’t work....fire him. But you have a QB coming over his head complaining to Lurie and Rosie. The guy at QB isn’t even playing well. Needed to listen to some coaching. But he won’t because the non football guys know everything. Who to hire and fire coaching wise. How to undercut their actual football guy so their franchise QB won’t listen. Results are the results. Aren’t Pedey’s results though. Heard too much about the disfunction in the FO and QB. 
   Short version: Pedey wasn’t allowed to hire his coaches. Wasn’t allowed to be in charge. QB wasn’t running his playcalls. Wasn’t given quality personnel. How much of 4-11-1 you want to put on that guy that’s proven he can win?

But I have full confidence in the path forward of repeat and rinse

52 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

He forced coaching hires and fires on his only SB winning coach....but then let the new young guy pick his own staff. That’s doesn’t seem right at all. Firing his SB winning coach after he went to the playoffs three straight seasons before. Fired him after the mist asterisk season possible of 2020 COVID. Pedey is a very good personal coach. No doubts that effected him. Big Giants game week the team wasn’t allowed to meet or huddle because of extreme COVID protocols. And we lost that game...shocker!

There were reports confirming Lurie forcing coaching hires on Doug staff... for my billion dollars. SB winning owner....I reserve the right to do Whatever the Fu::  I see fit. To do 🤓..That the reality, not just in the Not For Long league...In America money talks lol🤑..  Pederson wanted to promote Press Taylor to OC...😱after the year Wentz had.  Really.  I wouldn't let that happen either. This wasn't the only time that Peedys choices were questionable.

I love my first SB winning HC. Forever. He was a very questionable hire before winning the SB.

I get we got to the playoffs all these yrs. After our Championship year can you say. the way we got in to the playoffs made you feel those teams could go to the Championship rounds. To me those Playoff teams after our Championship yr  felt like we overachieved.

Everybody had to deal with COVID. Lot of NEW first time coaches....That Cancer fighting coach in  Washington for example. I have said here repeatedly I felt we started TANKING the Dallas game.

If Howie trades Wentz for two number ones and Nick Foles, he should keep his job.

 

Can you blame Pederson for wanting to promote a guy he had trust in? He just wanted his voice to be the only voice. He hired Groh. Groh became Rosie’s fall guy. Rosie forced MM on Pedey instead. Pederson just wanted Wentz to know who was in charge. You gotta listen to coach. Seems so simple and basic to me.

2 minutes ago, jsb235 said:

If Howie trades Wentz for two number ones and Nick Foles, he should keep his job.

 

Redemption could be at hand. Even a first rounder period would be huge.

1 minute ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Can you blame Pederson for wanting to promote a guy he had trust in? He just wanted his voice to be the only voice. He hired Groh. Groh became Rosie’s fall guy. Rosie forced MM on Pedey instead. Pederson just wanted Wentz to know who was in charge. You gotta listen to coach. Seems so simple and basic to me.

When we went Rosie’s route of firing Groh and bringing in Scarangello and MM....did everything massively improve? Or go straight to the sh177er? Who was right?

49 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

I'm with you...

To me ... blame goes Howie, Doug and Wentz... 

The excuse Wentz and Doug have is the supporting cast.   Howie has only injury excuse... which also can be used by both Wentz and Doug.   Howie controlled what he gave Doug and Wentz... the other 2 really can't be blamed for making Howie look bad. 

And I'm consistent in talking about Hurts pick.  I had no issue with taking QB, my issue was why take one who works in a completely different style offense, made no sense.  Hard to compare IMO.  How do you have legit competition running a read option? No brainer Hurts can do that.  Then you see Hurts can't throw on the back foot, which will be needed at times.  The wishy washy going in between half commitment that we have talked about over the years.  Same crap.  Only time was different was 2016-17. They had a plan and committed to it, stuck by it and succeeded.  Forget the intangible BS.. not saying it doesn't matter.. but just look on paper. Was a better plan. 

Howie should be digging his grave... success for Wentz and or Doug ...and Hurts mediocrity should do the trick.  Even for Lurie, because I don't think he likes that style of play that Hurts will bring. 

I am with you Howie,Doug, Wentz, share in the blame.

Whats wrong with taking a QB with multi-dimensional skills...  " Hurts can't throw on the back foot." ... So what! The old Stereotypes of the QB that disected teams from the pocket... Is almost at an end... I dislike Tom Brady and what he did as a Patriot. I will be rooting for Big Red tomorrow. Look around the league...the future ... Josh Allen... Mahomes...LaMarr... Herbert...Burrow...RPO...those OLD stand tall in the pocket stereotypes you're pining over better move or get killed . These kids are bringing a much more prolific and exciting game of football. Than your complaints about Hurts.

  Hurts proved ge has Enough arm talent. And proved that Defenses that was eating Wentz for lunch all season...barely got close to impacting Hurts game. Wentz was plain bad  last season. We know his top receiver Ertz was pissed with the Eagles because they were NOT gonna pay him. Ertz was invisible for the Eagles last year.Did his best friends issues  impact Wentz play.? Was he Sooo offended by Howie selecting a " Running QB 😂 " Offend Wentz to the point he refused to compete for his 150 million dollar contract lol. Common Joe you don't even sound like the Joe mas 11 l've listened to all these years. I get it though...I had high hopes for Carson.

 

 

17 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Can you blame Pederson for wanting to promote a guy he had trust in? He just wanted his voice to be the only voice. He hired Groh. Groh became Rosie’s fall guy. Rosie forced MM on Pedey instead. Pederson just wanted Wentz to know who was in charge. You gotta listen to coach. Seems so simple and basic to me.

I can't blame Doug...but Come Oonnn after his Offense and 150 million dollar QB performed the way they did....COME oooonnnn. Lol Lurie get blamed for keeping his trusted Howie around.Lol.

5 minutes ago, Trini said:

I can't blame Doug...but Come Oonnn after his Offense and 150 million dollar QB performed the way they did....COME oooonnnn. Lol Lurie get blamed for keeping his trusted Howie around.Lol.

They fired his coach and stuck him with guys subverting his command. Seems like the point was proven. I was with Pedey. Let him hire his guys. If they fail...then ax him. Lurie did it his way...that was 2020. Epic failure. There are excuses...but still. The FO ideas were terrible. Not a way you could come out of what we saw and think the non football guys were right. They drove it straight into the ground. They’re the guys still here though.

22 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

They fired his coach and stuck him with guys subverting his command. Seems like the point was proven. I was with Pedey. Let him hire his guys. If they fail...then ax him. Lurie did it his way...that was 2020. Epic failure. There are excuses...but still. The FO ideas were terrible. Not a way you could come out of what we saw and think the non football guys were right. They drove it straight into the ground. They’re the guys still here though.

Agreed on all points. Bottom Line somebody had to pay...Doug will get another chance . Somewhere else.

10 minutes ago, Trini said:

Agreed on all points. Bottom Line somebody had to pay...Doug will get another chance . Somewhere else.

Us