Doesn’t help me...I’m a stupid Eagles fan

Tired of fighting about things. I will just wait to see what we do

6 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

If we had a stacked team? Sure draft another QB early back to back. I just see a team in need of a youth infusion. We spent a second on a QB last draft. He looked pretty good. I’d explore that. Let him develop chemistry with his weapons. Get that understanding of what to expect. That right there makes any QB much better if you ask me. Concentrate on building the offense around Hurts to see what we really have. Give the guy every opportunity. 

You build a team AROUND a QB, not the other way around. First you say we need a "stacked team" then you say we need to build around a QB. It can't be both.QB has to be first and Howie will do whatever he needs to to replace Wentz. I just hope it's within reason and not a giveaway. We can't afford those right now

5 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

So you are all in on trading up and using all our draft ammo on Wilson?

Who says we have to trade up? What if the Jets gave us the 2 pick(flat out)? Pick 2 and 6 sounds pretty good to me

5 hours ago, joemas6 said:

But we aren't there yet.  I'm thinking down the road.  Listening to the radio now, Adam Shefter was on saying the trade was coming soon.  Seems like the Eagles are expecting a good return due to a few teams being interested.

The theme there, obviously their are people around the league who believe in Wentz. When he goes to a competent organization he should succeed.  Has nothing to do with who is to blame for 2020.  Which has been my point all along.  We are Eagled fans, our concern should be what the Eagles did wrong, not the player or coach... those guys come and go, but the organization doing things wrong is more of an issue. 

So down the road ... if Lurie is sitting watching playoff games with Reid and Wentz... does he think, we must be doing something wrong. We had both of those guys, why aren't I holding multiple trophies and having parades.

Throw in what if Doug takes another team to the playoffs?   At some point reality has to hit right? 

Terrific point!

4 hours ago, joemas6 said:

I had no issue with taking QB, my issue was why take one who works in a completely different style offense,

Because NO did it lol. We tried to copycat success??? IDK really

3 hours ago, jsb235 said:

If Howie trades Wentz for two number ones and Nick Foles, he should keep his job.

 

OH he should have a statue also lol

2 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Doesn’t help me...I’m a stupid Eagles fan

We all are that sadly

So Ham,forget the 2 #1 picks and whatever else the Rams gave up. Would you right NOW take the 2 pick for Wentz without giving up your 6?(like the 2 -1's you mentioned). If you WOULD, you'd best NAIL that pick. What would you give up for Lawrence? If we made the Jets trade(for their 2 outright) would you trade your 2 and 6 to Jax for Lawrence? It needs to be considered if we made the Jets deal a reality. Of course this would shatter all the mocks, but we'd have our new "franchise" QB and we can still make this team better in rounds 2 and 3(and maybe beyond)

 

 

 

Howard Eskin

 

@howardeskin

 

Rumors all over tonight on #Eagles trade of QB Carson Wentz. Here’s what I’m told. Wentz and a draft pick to #Bears for number 1 draft pick, QB Nick Foles, and RB Tarik Cohen who is coming off ACL injury but should be ready in September.

I’d this is true the Eagles just robbed the bears lol.... 1st, Foles and Cohen(stud) 

So,we trade Wentz to the Jets for their 2(nothing else just THAT pick). We now hold the 2 and 6 pick in round 1. Forget your graphs and charts and trade values, would you trade the 2 and 6 pick for the #1 pick? I'm sorry,but I have to consider that now

6 minutes ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

 

 

 

Howard Eskin

 

@howardeskin

 

Rumors all over tonight on #Eagles trade of QB Carson Wentz. Here’s what I’m told. Wentz and a draft pick to #Bears for number 1 draft pick, QB Nick Foles, and RB Tarik Cohen who is coming off ACL injury but should be ready in September.

I’d this is true the Eagles just robbed the bears lol.... 1st, Foles and Cohen(stud) 

That;s a GO for me!!!(depends on the draft pick they want)

Chase Young from the no names-rookie of the year

6 hours ago, joemas6 said:

But we aren't there yet.  I'm thinking down the road.  Listening to the radio now, Adam Shefter was on saying the trade was coming soon.  Seems like the Eagles are expecting a good return due to a few teams being interested.

The theme there, obviously their are people around the league who believe in Wentz. When he goes to a competent organization he should succeed.  Has nothing to do with who is to blame for 2020.  Which has been my point all along.  We are Eagled fans, our concern should be what the Eagles did wrong, not the player or coach... those guys come and go, but the organization doing things wrong is more of an issue. 

So down the road ... if Lurie is sitting watching playoff games with Reid and Wentz... does he think, we must be doing something wrong. We had both of those guys, why aren't I holding multiple trophies and having parades.

Throw in what if Doug takes another team to the playoffs?   At some point reality has to hit right? 

Logical Captain, flawlessly logical. 

Wentz(whatever he gets in trade) and our six overall and next years first round pick for Lawrence I would do.

I’d also give that draft haul for Deshaun Watson

I don’t see a team trading Lawrence. That’s why the Jets really put Joe Douglas in a tough spot by winning. He was in the bag. At that position I agree with all out tanking. I’m still pissed we won the Saints game. Big difference. Tanking the No Name game I fully support. Huge difference. 9 to 3

10 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

AR did succeed here....very much. AR’s son killing himself at team facility did facilitate a change I think. He needed a refresh after so many years here also. 
    Not seeing much of a comparison between AR and Wentz. Other than Wentz needs out because he’s in the wrong spot to not have a very solid backbone.

OK... I will try the question one more time and maybe you can answer this time.... lets not rehash anything prior, or yours or my belief of what success is.  Again... there was an article I read (I didn't write it, so you can argue with the writer about what you think of Andy Reid's success here in Philly)  but it said ..." Andy Reid had to leave Philadelphia to be successful" or find success or whatever I wrote the first time ... anyway... if (I think when) ... lets say Lurie is sitting down watching playoff football, say conference title game ... and he sees AR and Wentz both out there and the narrative is that Wentz had to leave to find success.    Does Lurie ask himself, why aren't these guys doing it for me and my organization?  Does he finally see there could be a problem within the organization.  Like what do they do wrong?  ie Howie?  The guy who seems to butt heads with AR, Doug ... and a few players lately.  And more importantly the guy picking the players.   ie the supporting cast for the coaches and the QB... of which I believe, if the rosters were top notch nobody would be leaving.   

Like I feel bad for the Reid family about the loss of their son, if the Eagles had the current Chiefs roster, Andy doesn't leave back then... you follow.    I also believe if the 2017 roster was here last year, Wentz doesn't leave.   Nor does Doug.   Yet the common denominator, the only GM ever to oversee the firing and hiring of 3 different coaches... that guy is still here ... you know in Philadelphia, where other people have to leave?  

9 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

    So what is your point? Lurie will step down as CEO of the Eagles? Very unlikely. 
  I think it has plenty to do with 2020. ClusterF was going on before that. But it all hit a head in 2020....why? I’d say...because you made your football guy(Pederson) fire his coach. Forced coaches on him. Created a situation where the players went over the football guys head to the FO. Cut his balls off. Created a situation where Wentz didn’t think things should be done Pedersons way. Created a situation where Pederson had to play an old used up Peters. The drafts. The FA pickups. The BACKLOADING OF CONTRACTS! All of it came together into a sh17 storm of Rosie and Lurie’s flaws. So what was their answer to fix this? Not nearly the right ones.

Howie .. not Lurie.   But you are getting it now.   I would also add ... drafting only one pro bowl player since 2013.... then trading him after paying him $$$ but not giving him any help on the roster.... and you can say the same thing about not giving the only coach to win you a SB any help with players either.    I would add, doing something different in 2016 and 2017 by just going after each hole and filling it, the complete starting lineup, before investing picks and $$ into backups... then going back to the old way the last few years and watching it go back into the toilet. 

Or maybe it is Lurie and Howie is just doing what he says... but I don't think so, not all that stuff.    That's Howie.  With the exception that I do think it is Lurie who doesn't fully trust Doug.  

As they were talking on the radio.... it's amazing after the crap of a roster both coach and QB had to deal with this year... that both will be gone and the GM remains.   I will say, I don't think Doug minds that he isn't here anymore, same as the QB.   Which is a bigger problem.  And BTW, you can keep building up Hurts all you want, I still think Howie and the lack of faith in him and the way he handled other situations is why #11 doesn''t want to be here, not some " fear of competition"   Or perhaps just doesn't want to be a part of a rebuild.  Player tastes success at the highest level both individually and as a team, the idea of a rebuild doesn't seem to exciting, especially for a guy who has been used to winning.   Hurts is ideal for this rebuild, there is no expectation for anything, nobody will care if he ultimately fails and the team moves on to another QB in a year or two.     

10 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

How does blame go to Pedey? Because he wanted certain coaches. Forced to fire them. Not only that...but had coaches forced on him. He just wanted to be in charge and in control. Stated he just thought his voice should be the only one in the QB room. Not Mornigweg. Not having his QB think he can just kill any play before they even break the huddle. Consequences. If you do it Pedey’s  way and it doesn’t work....fire him. But you have a QB coming over his head complaining to Lurie and Rosie. The guy at QB isn’t even playing well. Needed to listen to some coaching. But he won’t because the non football guys know everything. Who to hire and fire coaching wise. How to undercut their actual football guy so their franchise QB won’t listen. Results are the results. Aren’t Pedey’s results though. Heard too much about the disfunction in the FO and QB. 
   Short version: Pedey wasn’t allowed to hire his coaches. Wasn’t allowed to be in charge. QB wasn’t running his playcalls. Wasn’t given quality personnel. How much of 4-11-1 you want to put on that guy that’s proven he can win?

See this is where you lose me... you go 50%, I go all in.   I say BOTH guys had issues with Howie and the way things were run.  You keep harping on a Wentz vs Doug situation... but if that was the case, why would both be gone?     You can defend Doug all you want, that's ok with me.  You can believe all the other soap opera stuff too.   To me it doesn't need to go any further for the coach, that the GM didn't give him a good roster.   That's it for me.  To me it's the genesis of everything.   If Doug called a play for Diggs, does the QB think he needs to change it?  You see where  I'm going... why was there no issues in 2017?  Because the GM gave the coach and the QB the tools to have success.     The only excuse the GM has, and I'm sure he has played it for a few years now... is the injury situation, but like I said, that same excuse could then be used for the coach and the QB, so it doesn't work in the big picture.   

Like I said, after seeing the article about Reid needing to leave to find success... will be interesting if and when Wentz and or Doug do the same elsewhere... Lurie is left with Howie figuring out how they can give a backup DT $10 mil per year while they still need a WR.  Does he finally say WTF are we doing?  

As far as the Wentz trade, I am seeing a lot of pretty bad offers floated out there, and at this point if they don't get a decent package, they should just keep him. He isn't going to be a distraction, and if he has a great preseason, we could pull a Bradford and trade him right before the season.

If Wentz really wanted to be traded, he could rework his deal. Until he is willing to do that, I would keep him.

 

1 minute ago, jsb235 said:

As far as the Wentz trade, I am seeing a lot of pretty bad offers floated out there, and at this point if they don't get a decent package, they should just keep him. He isn't going to be a distraction, and if he has a great preseason, we could pull a Bradford and trade him right before the season.

I'm just not sure about that to be honest. I'm not sure at this point the Eagles have any choice but to move him on. I'm not sure it's really feasible to bring him back now. 

18 minutes ago, jsb235 said:

I am seeing a lot of pretty bad offers floated out there,

Most the reports I seen were at least a 1st for Wentz plus some 

24 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I'm just not sure about that to be honest. I'm not sure at this point the Eagles have any choice but to move him on. I'm not sure it's really feasible to bring him back now. 

I think the media perception of what is happening is far different than the actual situation. As far as the Eagles, what would happen if they don't trade him? It's not like he is going to refuse to play.

Plus, he shouldn't want to get traded right now. Media in other cities are going nuts about the prospect of giving up anything for him. any situation he walks into is going to be way worse than what is happening here.

The only way that a Wentz trade makes sense is if he makes massive changes to his contract reducing our commitment to him and his new team's commitment to him. That means we can lower our asking price, and the new team won't be handed an albatross if he continues to be terrible.

Short of that, we should just keep him. The one credible offer I saw was to swap the Colts first with our second, plus a bunch of backups and a possible mid round pick in two years. That's just not very good. and i doubt anyone is doing a lot better than that.   

 

5 hours ago, joemas6 said:

OK... I will try the question one more time and maybe you can answer this time.... lets not rehash anything prior, or yours or my belief of what success is.  Again... there was an article I read (I didn't write it, so you can argue with the writer about what you think of Andy Reid's success here in Philly)  but it said ..." Andy Reid had to leave Philadelphia to be successful" or find success or whatever I wrote the first time ... anyway... if (I think when) ... lets say Lurie is sitting down watching playoff football, say conference title game ... and he sees AR and Wentz both out there and the narrative is that Wentz had to leave to find success.    Does Lurie ask himself, why aren't these guys doing it for me and my organization?  Does he finally see there could be a problem within the organization.  Like what do they do wrong?  ie Howie?  The guy who seems to butt heads with AR, Doug ... and a few players lately.  And more importantly the guy picking the players.   ie the supporting cast for the coaches and the QB... of which I believe, if the rosters were top notch nobody would be leaving.   

Like I feel bad for the Reid family about the loss of their son, if the Eagles had the current Chiefs roster, Andy doesn't leave back then... you follow.    I also believe if the 2017 roster was here last year, Wentz doesn't leave.   Nor does Doug.   Yet the common denominator, the only GM ever to oversee the firing and hiring of 3 different coaches... that guy is still here ... you know in Philadelphia, where other people have to leave?  

Wentz got hurt three of five seasons he’s been in the NFL. The two seasons he didn’t get injured he wasn’t very good. 2016 he was a rook ,....but wasn’t great. 2017 he was great but hit injured. 2018 he wasn’t very good....Foles came in and saved the season. 2019 he was pretty good ...got injured in the playoff game. 2020 he was terrible.

5 hours ago, joemas6 said:

Howie .. not Lurie.   But you are getting it now.   I would also add ... drafting only one pro bowl player since 2013.... then trading him after paying him $$$ but not giving him any help on the roster.... and you can say the same thing about not giving the only coach to win you a SB any help with players either.    I would add, doing something different in 2016 and 2017 by just going after each hole and filling it, the complete starting lineup, before investing picks and $$ into backups... then going back to the old way the last few years and watching it go back into the toilet. 

Or maybe it is Lurie and Howie is just doing what he says... but I don't think so, not all that stuff.    That's Howie.  With the exception that I do think it is Lurie who doesn't fully trust Doug.  

As they were talking on the radio.... it's amazing after the crap of a roster both coach and QB had to deal with this year... that both will be gone and the GM remains.   I will say, I don't think Doug minds that he isn't here anymore, same as the QB.   Which is a bigger problem.  And BTW, you can keep building up Hurts all you want, I still think Howie and the lack of faith in him and the way he handled other situations is why #11 doesn''t want to be here, not some " fear of competition"   Or perhaps just doesn't want to be a part of a rebuild.  Player tastes success at the highest level both individually and as a team, the idea of a rebuild doesn't seem to exciting, especially for a guy who has been used to winning.   Hurts is ideal for this rebuild, there is no expectation for anything, nobody will care if he ultimately fails and the team moves on to another QB in a year or two.     

So you think Wentz is welcoming of competing for the starting job...,anywhere?