1 hour ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Big difference there,Joe, Balt already knows what they have in Jackson, we DONT know what we have in Hurts yet.We can evaluate it all after this season,but 4 games is too small of a sampling. I mean give him a solid consistent O line, maybe he shines? Add a RB to the backfield. Or maybe it proves he can't cut the mustard(why we brought Flacco in and pretty much got into position for a QB next year right?).Your right records don't matter,what matters is evaluating these young players and getting it right this time and not letting good guys go that we invested time in

Yes, we don't know for sure about Hurts... but I also think good possibility we don't find much out about our WRs with him as QB this year.   Like I said ...is the kid in Baltimore any good? Brown?   Idk... tough to see if your QB runs all the time?    Is it route running or is he good on the busted play when Jackson leaves the pocket?   It might take more than a year to get an idea about some of these young WRs

55 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

LOL yo 93. This would be interesting if Lance fell to 12. We could squeeze the Pats bigly and trade back to 15 😀 SO would you trade the 12 pick to the Pats for their 15, pick 96(late 3rd) and a late 2022 pick??? HMMMM

Yes, because we all know the player they take at 15 was going to be the same guy they would take at 12.  But if Washington could get involved it should raise the price.  

1 hour ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Add in the failed FA's we bring in(Tate,Alshon,Djax to mention a few) LOL

Nitpicky I know, but Tate was a trade (not a FA).  And I wouldn’t exactly call Jeffery a failed FA considering he was an integral part in securing our first ever Lombardi.  

11 hours ago, time2rock said:

But do we?  There was speculation that Seumalo was considered to be the heir apparent to Kelce ... by the previous coaching regime.  But they are all gone ... who knows what the new staff is thinking.  Some point to Juriga too.  We have no idea what we have in him.  He very well could be but I wouldn't say anything is set in stone yet.  Such an important position ... if we have an opportunity to add a blue chip piece there I'm definitely pulling the trigger on one.  Kelce is year to year now (TBH honest I'm surprised he didn't pack it in this offseason with all the changes), the need to identify his eventual replacement is critical.  

You don’t think with the team in ‘transition’....Kelce deciding to come back this season....kind of seems like he plans on playing two...maybe even three seasons?

10 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

I tend to agree that your #1 pick should start. SO the goal is to draft a #1 pick that will TAKE the job from the guy you have now.Talent, talent talent,develop,develop,develop,but first the right players need to be chosen(and that's where our past 4 years issues lie. There are some exceptions to the #1 start rule for me. That is you KNOW they will be starting the following year (such as a C or QB) otherwise I will find that position in later rounds. My round 1 needs to start or be the "heir apparent"

Different times....different teams....different situations dictate sine what. But when you are a rebuilding team....you gotta get some of these young guys on the field.

10 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

I was really upset with Ped changing O lines every game. There is no continuity to that, and you really can't know what you have shifting all those guys everywhere. Keep the guys where they will play.If one is weak,you can scheme to help some,but you also now KNOW where the ONE position problem is. After 14 O lines in 16 games,you don;t know diddly. I'm glad some stepped up,some not enough,maybe they are better this year? IDK the answer to that. I really hope we go CB first, because face it,we're going to have to cover some pretty nice WR's,the new kids coming in as well as the already established WR's on other teams. Loved the Harris pick-up,but him and Slay can't do this alone. IDK we need everything. I am thankful we have 11 picks and not the 5 we usually have, even if alot are day 3 BU,WIP p[icks

I don’t see him to blame at all. It was mostly injured related(not counting Tank Gane).

32 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

You don’t think with the team in ‘transition’....Kelce deciding to come back this season....kind of seems like he plans on playing two...maybe even three seasons?

I’d like to think so, but am only guessing at his age he is likely year to year now.  

2 hours ago, Bleedinggreen93 said:

Can you call Alshon a fail??? Huge part of the SB winning team Howie failure on the contract...Tate was just a dumb trade but not a bad player we just used wrong.... Djax made no sense from the get go that was a fail 

I meant last year was a fail as a whole. Stop  disecting every word lol

2 hours ago, joemas6 said:

Yes, we don't know for sure about Hurts... but I also think good possibility we don't find much out about our WRs with him as QB this year.   Like I said ...is the kid in Baltimore any good? Brown?   Idk... tough to see if your QB runs all the time?    Is it route running or is he good on the busted play when Jackson leaves the pocket?   It might take more than a year to get an idea about some of these young WRs

True,but other that Reagor those WR's we have are PS players and Fulgham was a reject from another team.Jjaw hasn't shown me a thing yet. Maybe they are better than we think. I will give them the op to do it. At least those guys stayed on the field,which is a big plus right there!!!!

2 hours ago, time2rock said:

Nitpicky I know, but Tate was a trade (not a FA).  And I wouldn’t exactly call Jeffery a failed FA considering he was an integral part in securing our first ever Lombardi.  

Yes, disect every word. it's getting to be I don't even want to comment anymore. Last years FA's were a fail, IDC what you did in previous years, you're only as good as your last game and frankly noone we got was on the field long enough to succeed. Injuries happen,I get that,but you still failed whether it was someones fault or not

2 hours ago, time2rock said:

Nitpicky I know, but Tate was a trade (not a FA).  And I wouldn’t exactly call Jeffery a failed FA considering he was an integral part in securing our first ever Lombardi.  

That was 4 years ago,we've had major success at WR since then????

1 hour ago, cunninghamtheman said:

I don’t see him to blame at all. It was mostly injured related(not counting Tank Gane).

Plenty of blame to go around. Ped was not blameless. yeah lets go for it on 4th and 2 with a bum O line and a struggling QB. Is that intelligent???(and it happened more than once). Also giving up the running game early and often is who's fault??

25 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Yes, disect every word. it's getting to be I don't even want to comment anymore. Last years FA's were a fail, IDC what you did in previous years, you're only as good as your last game and frankly noone we got was on the field long enough to succeed. Injuries happen,I get that,but you still failed whether it was someones fault or not

Hey I did start my response with "nitpicky”.  haha

25 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

That was 4 years ago,we've had major success at WR since then????

Well you are the one who brought up Jeffery, so ... 😉

3 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

You don’t think with the team in ‘transition’....Kelce deciding to come back this season....kind of seems like he plans on playing two...maybe even three seasons?

Nah, he was given a nice bump in pay to play this year.  But in a way to save cap.  Was like a bribe.   

2 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Plenty of blame to go around. Ped was not blameless. yeah lets go for it on 4th and 2 with a bum O line and a struggling QB. Is that intelligent???(and it happened more than once). Also giving up the running game early and often is who's fault??

I gotta be honest... I thought last year that one could argue Pederson actually was too conservative in regards to 4th down.   Game situations really dictate that,  and for sure a bunch of times you could say " why not go for it there"

As for WR, bringing up that Tate was actually a trade actually makes your point stronger... means more was invested than just money, it's another pick involved as well. 

 A lot of picks and cap space used for WR and in 2021, not much to show for it.  Pretty bad.  

5 hours ago, joemas6 said:

Yes, we don't know for sure about Hurts... but I also think good possibility we don't find much out about our WRs with him as QB this year.   Like I said ...is the kid in Baltimore any good? Brown?   Idk... tough to see if your QB runs all the time?    Is it route running or is he good on the busted play when Jackson leaves the pocket?   It might take more than a year to get an idea about some of these young WRs

Seems like that was the big issue withWentz. He really played favorites. 

1 hour ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Seems like that was the big issue withWentz. He really played favorites. 

If that's the case then maybe the FO was playing that card when they drafted Hurts. (???)

15 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

How did Mac move to QB 3? If Lance falls to 8,Carolina will have to think about it

Mac is more NFL ready

13 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Add in the failed FA's we bring in(Tate,Alshon,Djax to mention a few) LOL

  Probably a good reason they should have stayed at 6 and drafted Chase...?

20 minutes ago, stine said:

  Probably a good reason they should have stayed at 6 and drafted Chase...?

It sure seemed like a no brainer.  Have to wonder if they heard whispers of another team picking ahead of us taking him or was Howie once again overthinking the situation looking at the history of top 10 WRs (is it really true the failure rate is no different than WRs taken later?) so he channeled his inner fantasy football nerd as he has done so many times in the past.  He is one of those guys that relies on analytics entirely too much ... sometimes you just gotta go with the gut.  

10 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

I meant last year was a fail as a whole. Stop  disecting every word lol

That has nothing to do with WRs though did we even sign any FA WRs last year???? Fulgham and I only brought up the 3 guys you mentioned in post lol .. Everyone knows last year was a fail has nothing to do with your original post or mine about WRs

6 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Seems like that was the big issue withWentz. He really played favorites. 

?   Nothing to do with favorites.  But for example,  we saw Fulgham run routes and make catches for a few weeks with Wentz..  Hurts goes in and his targets disappear.   Similar to all the others as they had limited targets with Hurts running a lot.   If the QB takes off all the time, doesn't really do much for WR evaluation and development.    It may end up being we move on from Hurts and still need to really evaluate the WRs with the next guy.  Idk,  we shall see.

50 minutes ago, stine said:

  Probably a good reason they should have stayed at 6 and drafted Chase...?

What happens if Pitts and Chase are gone and Miami doesn't offer the same trade?    I still think they don't want to invest that high of a pick for a skill position guy.  

I saw something showing the recent WRs drafted top ten and how the success has been very minimal for the team... other than Julio Jones they all seemed to be taken way too early. 

41 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

What happens if Pitts and Chase are gone and Miami doesn't offer the same trade?    I still think they don't want to invest that high of a pick for a skill position guy.  

I saw something showing the recent WRs drafted top ten and how the success has been very minimal for the team... other than Julio Jones they all seemed to be taken way too early. 

With a minimum of 3 QBs going ahead of the 6th pick, I have a hard time thinking the other 2 picks are going to be Pitts and Chase ... it could very well end up that way but I think it is much more likely at least one would have been there.  Another QB, Sewell and/or Slater, Parsons ... to me it seems likely at least one of those would have gone ahead of 6.  

Those could'ves, would'ves and should'ves will kill ya! Lamenting the trade back is a waste of time. Sure, it seems like a 6 pick is better than a 12 pick, but is the difference that great when we add in what we got in the trade when in a rebuild? Would be a lot different if we just needed a few players to contend for a SB. Get the picks, build a team, decide on QB next yr.

OT - Got our 2nd shots so will be in PA for the draft - Deb's Mom's been in the hospital and finally able to visit, had to get special permission from Masonic VIllage.