1 hour ago, jsb235 said:

Some Eagles news.

They only have four TEs on the roster now, and Perkins and Ertz are more big receivers than TEs.

Noah Togiai is a guy who looks like he could easily make the roster, since he has a lot of athleticism and played in a two TE offense at Oregon State. He looks like a decent blocker, inasmuch as I didn't see anyone manhandle him or blow past him. He caught 70 percent of his targets, so decent hands as well. He had a draftable grade by some scouts, and I think if they had drafted him in the sixth or seventh round, no one would have been critical of it.    

Overall, we say we are primarily a two TE offense, but realistically Ertz is more of a big receiver/hback in our offense. So I see his backup being JJAW more than the third TE.

So the depth chart at TE right now would be Goedert and Togiai, and at the "big receiver spot" Ertz, JJAW and Perkins with Jeffery on PUP. 

Uh Ertz is the number 2/3 TE in the league,but he's not a TE? OK I give,how do you figure that?

I played TE,and trust me,he is a TE

8 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Uh Ertz is the number 2/3 TE in the league,but he's not a TE? OK I give,how do you figure that?

I played TE,and trust me,he is a TE

Hes comparing Ertz to Jimmy Graham which is not really uncalled for. Jimmy Graham himself called himself a big slot rec. I can see exactly what he means. Ertz is big and fits the TE role. He is not a good blocker which means hes out on patterns pretty much every play. Ertz is that type you can line him up anywhere. Slot, Hback, TE and creates mismatches in all those areas no matter who you put on him. To be honest, Goedert is the same but hes a better blocker. Are they called TEs? Yes But that is the direction TEs are going. I actually feel Goedert will be better then Ertz in the near future when given the starting nod. In the end, just like WR spots, people get too caught on on position titles. These guys now (TE, WR, RB) move all over the place. 

19 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

Hes comparing Ertz to Jimmy Graham which is not really uncalled for. Jimmy Graham himself called himself a big slot rec. I can see exactly what he means. Ertz is big and fits the TE role. He is not a good blocker which means hes out on patterns pretty much every play. Ertz is that type you can line him up anywhere. Slot, Hback, TE and creates mismatches in all those areas no matter who you put on him. To be honest, Goedert is the same but hes a better blocker. Are they called TEs? Yes But that is the direction TEs are going. I actually feel Goedert will be better then Ertz in the near future when given the starting nod. In the end, just like WR spots, people get too caught on on position titles. These guys now (TE, WR, RB) move all over the place. 

Funny that when the birds drafted Goedert all the "experts"  said the would have to be taught to block.

He's either a really fast learner or the "experts" were full of it as usual.

1 hour ago, DeathByEagle said:

Hes comparing Ertz to Jimmy Graham which is not really uncalled for. Jimmy Graham himself called himself a big slot rec. I can see exactly what he means. Ertz is big and fits the TE role. He is not a good blocker which means hes out on patterns pretty much every play. Ertz is that type you can line him up anywhere. Slot, Hback, TE and creates mismatches in all those areas no matter who you put on him. To be honest, Goedert is the same but hes a better blocker. Are they called TEs? Yes But that is the direction TEs are going. I actually feel Goedert will be better then Ertz in the near future when given the starting nod. In the end, just like WR spots, people get too caught on on position titles. These guys now (TE, WR, RB) move all over the place. 

Until they officially open up the "BIG WR" as a position on the roster he is a TIGHT END(blocking or not).Becoming more talented at a position does not change the position. SO was Sproles a "TINY WR" even though he started out of the backfield? I was a TE,suffice to say that this position has made the most major gains since I played.But calling Ertz a WR is not my definition. He is a receiving TE,other are blocking TE's They are both still TE's.JMO

1 hour ago, Asg 15 said:

Funny that when the birds drafted Goedert all the "experts"  said the would have to be taught to block.

He's either a really fast learner or the "experts" were full of it as usual.

Everyone is an expert,until they aren't(I suppose that includes me as well).Although Ertz gets the accolades(and the ball) in my view Goedert is the more complete TE as far as doing whatever is asked of him and I like that fact. Ertz can block,he is just much more effective when used as a pass catcher,so I am glad we turn him loose to do what he is best at

46 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Until they officially open up the "BIG WR" as a position on the roster he is a TIGHT END(blocking or not).Becoming more talented at a position does not change the position. SO was Sproles a "TINY WR" even though he started out of the backfield? I was a TE,suffice to say that this position has made the most major gains since I played.But calling Ertz a WR is not my definition. He is a receiving TE,other are blocking TE's They are both still TE's.JMO

 

You must have missed the entire last line which was the entire point, lol. BTW I was a safety in college but played  FS, SS, in the box, slot and even some outside corner. This was 20+ years ago. The the same principle has been around for a long time. There is no true position, you move around. A title is just a title, doesnt actually mean anything. People who get stuck on a title don't last much longer in the NFL. 

23 hours ago, DeathByEagle said:

We will agree to disagree then

I felt the 2018 roster had plenty of talent. WRs had Alshon, Nelson, Golden Tate, Jordan Matthews. 17 We had Smith instead of Golden Tate. Smith I felt was a below avg WR. He had speed, thats about it. So I felt our 2018 recs were better then 17. the fact "They couldnt figure out how to use a extremely good WR to get him ont he field" was telling. he was the most talented WR ont he team and they couldnt figure out how to get him in. I think we had better TEs in 18 with Etrz, Goedert. Yea 17 Burton was nice, Celek wasnt much anymore, but I would take Ertz and Goedert all day long. The one area Ill give 17 had was RBs. 18 We lost Sproles, Ajai, and Clements after week 2. So Ill give 17 the big edge there. QB, hey Foles was a drop from Wentz and I know Wentz came back way to early. But Foles was still a decent QB, better then some starters out there. But we also had Wentz in 19 and he played amazing with what he had in a scheme. To put up the numbers he did in a ding and dunk offense shows how good that kid is. 

As for Doug play calling. he gave away the scripting and game planning to Frank fully. He did it right after week 2 lost to Chiefs. He said it right on TV. So in turn that mean Doug did not call the first 15 plays of the game since they were scripted by Frank which is the key to the whole thing. When Doug game plans and scripts we have one of the worst teams in the lg in first half points. The rosters we went over above. I feel 18 was a pretty good roster other then RB. But look at RB in 19, was just as good as 17. WRs went down big. Key to me is Doug didnt know what he had in Frank till he gave him the nod. You are never going to know what you have in these coaches if he doesnt try. We know what we have in Doug when he calls plays, game plans and scripts. Mid level offense always having to come back in the 2nd half. Id personally rather give a shot to one of the other 20 offensive coaches in taking over that part of it. Could it be worse? yea. Could it be better like in 17? yea. Won't know till you try it. I have enough sample size from Doug to know im willing to make that change. 

This is awesome that we can go back and forth here.... so here you go.

2017 WRs.... Better fit, health and range of skills.   A top possession guy, a top speed guy and a top slot guy.    2018 your top possession guy was injured at the start, needed time to come back in.  No speed guy after Wallace got hurt.   This forced Agholor to move into a role he isn't good at, as he needs the guys on the outside taking attention away and giving him space.  Tate came later, and needed time to get into the system, and his skills overlapped what you got from Agholor. That WR didn't have the same fit not time to play together like the 2017 group did... from day 1 to the end, they were there healthy and gelling better each game.  

TEs.... I will take the 2017 group over 2018 simply because Goedert was a rookie.  He wasn't the same player he is now.  While you could say Celek wasn't much anymore, again I'm looking at the fit and how the unit functioned.  His blocking was superb.  Add in Burton as a move player/ hybrid FB in there, and the offense could do more.  

RB, as you said, not close.  But lets look at 2019.  Again, looking at the whole season, Sanders was not the player in the first half of the year as he was at the end.  This is a big factor you can't overlook, just like with Goedert.  Rookies take time to develop.  The Howard didn't finish.  As good as Sanders is, I'm taking Blount, Ajayi and Clement for the all around function of what they can bring.  Pass protection is a big edge to that 2017 group.  Not to mention the power running.  

Now with the script and play calling. You are assuming a lot of things. We don't know how much responsibility Doug gave the guys the last 2 years.  Unless you are in Novacare and have inside info as to every specific?    Second, like I keep saying, just giving someone a job doesn't mean he will do it well.  The combo with Doug, Reich, DeFilippo... with Groh at WR coach ... and the players that they had worked great.   Take 2 coaches away, move another, take a few players away and and injury and inexperience to other positions and it's a different result.   All that said, we didn't even mention OL... lets be honest, that 2017 group was younger, healthier and more consistent.  Big V filling in and Seumalo playing as the extra lineman on short yardage was it... the last few years we have gotten deeper in the bench and starters are older, playing injured or just being recovered from injury.  Much different.  

QB play, Wentz great job last year, Foles had a great game vs Houston in 2018 ... but 2017 ... Wentz was MVP for 13 games, and Foles had another 3 excellent games vs NYG, Minn and NE.   Higher level and more consistency by far in 2017.   2 completely healthy QBs when they played in 2017 too.  

You can focus simply on the start of the game, that's great.  I'm looking at big picture.  The first element I needed address this year for the offense was a commitment to multiple speed WRs on the outside.  It's essential to this offense to have the space.  This particular offense with this particular QB ... MVP level in 2017 and one huge game with DeSean last year.  I think that is more important than any script.  

19 hours ago, Trini said:

JP greatest strength as an ALL World LT is his mentoring of our Young Guys. Nine Pro bowls .I wantPryor to get the start at RG.. Our youth need to get on the field ... JP can get practice reps and play RG if Pryor goes down. The Young can't Only get on the field due to injury. We need some of these young to Win the position.

1.  9 pro bowls was due to his play .. not his mentoring.

2.  How about since we just paid Peters in a season where there isn't much cap space to give away as it's needed to roll into next year.  How about we let him practice and just give the starting spots to the best 5 guys... the best unit.  If another guy earns it, then great.  I'm all for Pryor starting if he earns the spot as the best at that spot and the best combo of 5 has him in it.   

I'm not giving Pryor a spot because he is young or because I feel another guy.... who should be starting... would make a better back up.  That's not how sports works, not when their main job is protecting a $100 mil franchise QB. 

19 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

I say Pederson is a much better offensive mind than Reich. That’s my two cents. I believe Pedey is elite! But I think Reich brought a great synergy together with Pedey. After Reich gets fired in two more years I’d welcome him back as OC.

Absolutely would welcome him back!  As I would Groh as a WR coach and Foles as a backup QB (although I think drafting the kid in round 2 puts and end to that idea) 

4 hours ago, DeathByEagle said:

You must have missed the entire last line which was the entire point, lol. BTW I was a safety in college but played  FS, SS, in the box, slot and even some outside corner. This was 20+ years ago. The the same principle has been around for a long time. There is no true position, you move around. A title is just a title, doesnt actually mean anything. People who get stuck on a title don't last much longer in the NFL. 

I agree... that said... Fletcher Cox is one of the best LB in the game ... don;t just label him a DT...LOL.    I hear ya... Graham called himself a slot WR because he wanted to get the franchise tag of a WR, not a TE.  At the time it was a big $$$ difference.    But I will say this... if the first line of the post is that we are a 2 TE offense... and Ertz isn't really a TE.... we know Goedert only plays about half the snaps, so if Ertz isn't a TE, then we play half the snaps without a TE...and the other half with only one.    I call Ertz a TE, but I think TE is a position that moves around.  To me it doesn't matter what specific skill set the TE is good at .. he is still a TE.    Similar to other sports and other positions, you have multiple jobs, with a lot of those jobs overlapping with other positions... similar to how TE does with either a WR, OL or FB on any given play.  Ertz will block, run routes, catch ...etc just like all other TEs, ... now what he is good at, that's another conversation.      But if JJAW is considered to be playing the same position as Ertz... ie " Big WR"  I don't think Doug and co. look at it that way.  They won't have the same roles if say Ertz was to get injured.  

The Eagles used to line Wilbert Montgomery out wide sometimes on pass plays, he was still a RB though.  

5 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

But if JJAW is considered to be playing the same position as Ertz... ie " Big WR"  I don't think Doug and co. look at it that way.  They won't have the same roles if say Ertz was to get injured.

When Ertz was injured at the end of the year, he was replaced by Perkins, who is the same size as JJAW. So if Perkins can play that position, I think JJAW should be able to handle it, and in theory should be a lot better at it.

 

Eagles will play with no fans(aka pointless BS)

8 hours ago, DeathByEagle said:

You must have missed the entire last line which was the entire point, lol. BTW I was a safety in college but played  FS, SS, in the box, slot and even some outside corner. This was 20+ years ago. The the same principle has been around for a long time. There is no true position, you move around. A title is just a title, doesnt actually mean anything. People who get stuck on a title don't last much longer in the NFL. 

Yeah different schemes sometimes to mess with defenses.How common are those???.Sorry,you can't do stats without a title/classification. SO if there are no true positions what do you write down on your resume? I was a TE,caught some balls which made me a RECEIVER,but I was still a TE lol.Every position has gotten stronger,faster,with more longevity,but that doesn't change the positions

Welp,with covid BS,there is no home field advantage lol(cause there are no fans)

4 hours ago, jsb235 said:

When Ertz was injured at the end of the year, he was replaced by Perkins, who is the same size as JJAW. So if Perkins can play that position, I think JJAW should be able to handle it, and in theory should be a lot better at it.

 

Not really, Goedert replaced Ertz.   Perkins played a little as your # 2 TE.   JJAW won;t be lining up on the line as a #2 TE.  Which some formations call for.   The playcalling will be different with JJAW vs Ertz. 

2 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Welp,with covid BS,there is no home field advantage lol(cause there are no fans)

Different cities and states have different rules. So this actually could turn out to be the largest gap in home field advantage we’ve ever seen.

11 hours ago, joemas6 said:

Not really, Goedert replaced Ertz.   Perkins played a little as your # 2 TE.   JJAW won;t be lining up on the line as a #2 TE.  Which some formations call for.   The playcalling will be different with JJAW vs Ertz. 

This isn't true. When Goedert and Ertz are on the field together, Goedert is almost exclusively lined up as a traditional TE. Ertz then either lines up as a TE on the other side (which is rare) or as an Hback, X or Y. I can't recall seeing any plays where Ertz was lined up as the traditional TE and Goedert was outside of him. This doesn't mean it didn't happen, but if it did, it was outside of the norm. 

In the game that Ertz missed, Perkins was his replacement. It is pretty clear if you watch the film of the game and compare it to games where Ertz and Goedert played together. Also, when both Ertz and Goedert were healthy, Perkins began seeing an increase in playing time as a replacement for Jeffery.

As far as your suggesting that JJAW won't be lining up in the Ertz role, that may be true. But that would be a decision of the coaches, and not because he lacks the physical attributes. Again, he is the same size as Perkins. And they used Perkins in the big WR role when Jeffery went on IR. So the question becomes, if Perkins can do what JJAW does, why can't JJAW do what Perkins does?

2 hours ago, jsb235 said:

This isn't true. When Goedert and Ertz are on the field together, Goedert is almost exclusively lined up as a traditional TE. Ertz then either lines up as a TE on the other side (which is rare) or as an Hback, X or Y. I can't recall seeing any plays where Ertz was lined up as the traditional TE and Goedert was outside of him. This doesn't mean it didn't happen, but if it did, it was outside of the norm. 

In the game that Ertz missed, Perkins was his replacement. It is pretty clear if you watch the film of the game and compare it to games where Ertz and Goedert played together. Also, when both Ertz and Goedert were healthy, Perkins began seeing an increase in playing time as a replacement for Jeffery.

As far as your suggesting that JJAW won't be lining up in the Ertz role, that may be true. But that would be a decision of the coaches, and not because he lacks the physical attributes. Again, he is the same size as Perkins. And they used Perkins in the big WR role when Jeffery went on IR. So the question becomes, if Perkins can do what JJAW does, why can't JJAW do what Perkins does?

Goedert took over for Ertz... he played the snaps that would normally go to Ertz.  However you want to look at who lines up where.  When we use 1 TE it is Ertz. When he got hurt Goedert took over the bulk of those snaps.    Replacing the snaps is what counts more than who lines up where right?   If one guy normally plays,  and another guy replaces him in the lineup you would consider that to be his replacement? 

4 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

Goedert took over for Ertz... he played the snaps that would normally go to Ertz.

You are aware that we normally play Ertz and Goedert together 70 percent of the time, right? You seem to be unable to process the fact that when Ertz and Goedert are on the field together, they don't play the same position. Goedert plays TE. Ertz almost never plays TE. He almost always plays an Hback or X receiver position. The only time Ertz plays tight end is when Goedert is out of the game, so about 30 percent of the time.

16 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Different cities and states have different rules. So this actually could turn out to be the largest gap in home field advantage we’ve ever seen.

Quite possible,but if thats the case,Goodell failed again(no surprise-worst commish ever) as it should be the same rules for every team

OK so why aren't our draft picks signed(Reagor,hightower,etc)? Or are they just behind? Goodwin could be used out until we see if Reagor can handle the job.If he can,then Goodwin can do returns and rotate in /out? We have plenty of speed now we lacked before,so I hope we use it.Goodwin ran a 4.27 40 at his combine. Jjaw needs to show us his talents as a possession WR and he better do it right away.No more word on what was an apparent Alshon dust up.I hope that is gone for good.DJax laying low(as well he should).Anxious to see if the staff change makes a marked difference.Loved the Slay acquisition.Playmakers on both sides of the ball if we can make it work

18 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Quite possible,but if thats the case,Goodell failed again(no surprise-worst commish ever) as it should be the same rules for every team

Tough situation. But you know making money will rule the day. 

NC, I have little doubt about Moorehead being an obvious upgrade. Only so much you can accomplish virtually though. 

NC, everybody has been in lockdown. Rookies report Tuesday I believe. So that gives a chance for them to pass physicals...and physically sign on the dotted line. I think that’s the main holdup with more than half of the rookies across the league.

On 7/14/2020 at 11:30 AM, Trini said:

U talked to TD123 lately hope he is ok  he a warrior haven't seen him on here.

I'm ok brother. Doing great. Staying super busy. Very hard to find time in 2 days off trying to keep up with everything for 2 houses. Kinda like shoveling sh!t against the tide lol. When I do get some free time it's spent keeping Mr. Shiny happy lmao. Thanks for thinkin' of me!

On 7/14/2020 at 12:57 PM, GreenbleedinNC said:

TD123 is now PW'd lol. Apparently they dont have internet yet.I'm happy for him finding someone.Too late for me 😞

Still no i-net. Slow here at smoke shop today so I get more than a minute here - minute there to TRY and keep up. Think I'll change my screen name to EaglesPW'd123. Always gotta be hammering me don't you? lol

10 hours ago, cunninghamtheman said:

NC, I have little doubt about Moorehead being an obvious upgrade. Only so much you can accomplish virtually though. 

Gonna be a tough season especially for rooks.Pretty sure thats why we picked a few vet-semi vets.if Reagor has any issues with this virtual learning,Goodwin can step right in,so I think we covered that.If Reagor is ready to roll,Goodwin can be used as a returner and in a rotation.Those 2 and Djax all have speed.We know what we have in Alshon,I suspect we got Jjaw as his replacement and why he needs to show us something.he needs to take a big step THIS year.If he can't,depending what we do with Alshon,we could be needing a possession WR,although Ward may be able to handle that .That kid Hightower would be that type also.It's tough to transition to the NFL anyway,and this virtual BS makes it much harder.All teams will have these same issues,so who knows how it all works out.Gotta be weird for players to play in empty stadiums with no fans cheering on the homers.I know they are pros,still that lack of emotion could be a bigger detriment that we think