3 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Pretty sure his extension actually opened up cap space in 2020 the way it was structured. 

It might have.   I can't recall now.

5 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

 

Listen sport.  You're out of your depth.  But I'll play along.  I was responding to AFan who said....Hurts was better than McNabb.  Your dumbarse comes along and suggest that I go look at their first full seasons and that I might be surprised.....I don't need to.  I saw all of McNabb's career.  I and countless other posters pointed out how dumb it was of you to compare the two.  Again, the rules were different back then.  You could mug the WR and get away with hitting the QB more than now.  Passing was a lot easier then.  And yes you were comparing the two.  Because you told me to look at McNabb's first full season......which is comparing the two.  Do you even think before you post? 

 

I'll share some numbers for you....so you can get an understanding as to how dumb it is to compare passing in 2021 to 2000...

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/NFL/passing.htm

 

NFL AVG Passing Yards/Game: 2000- 206.9       2021- 240.2.  34 yards per game difference.  Which equates to 544 yards for 16 games.

 

NFL AVG Passing TD/Game:  2000- 1.3      2021- 1.6   That's an additional 4.8 TD for 16 games

 

NFL AVG Interceptions/Game:  2000- 1.1     2021- .8.  That comes out to 4.8 less Interceptions for 16 games

 

NFL AVG Completion %:  2000- 58.2       2021- 65.4.   That's a huge difference.  

 

And the big one.....

 

NFL AVG QB Rating:     2000- 78.1    2021- 92.7.  That is an unbelievable difference.....

 

 

So when you tell someone to compare their first full seasons....then don't be butthurt when that person does.  As McNabb played more.....the coaches gave him more.  As Hurts plays more.......the give him less.  That is all you should need to know......unless you have a bias.  

McNabb....second in MVP voting in 2000.....Just so you know.  

 

 

15 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

 

Listen sport.  You're out of your depth.  But I'll play along.  I was responding to AFan who said....Hurts was better than McNabb.  Your dumbarse comes along and suggest that I go look at their first full seasons and that I might be surprised.....I don't need to.  I saw all of McNabb's career.  I and countless other posters pointed out how dumb it was of you to compare the two.  Again, the rules were different back then.  You could mug the WR and get away with hitting the QB more than now.  Passing was a lot easier then.  And yes you were comparing the two.  Because you told me to look at McNabb's first full season......which is comparing the two.  Do you even think before you post? 

 

I'll share some numbers for you....so you can get an understanding as to how dumb it is to compare passing in 2021 to 2000...

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/NFL/passing.htm

 

NFL AVG Passing Yards/Game: 2000- 206.9       2021- 240.2.  34 yards per game difference.  Which equates to 544 yards for 16 games.

 

NFL AVG Passing TD/Game:  2000- 1.3      2021- 1.6   That's an additional 4.8 TD for 16 games

 

NFL AVG Interceptions/Game:  2000- 1.1     2021- .8.  That comes out to 4.8 less Interceptions for 16 games

 

NFL AVG Completion %:  2000- 58.2       2021- 65.4.   That's a huge difference.  

 

And the big one.....

 

NFL AVG QB Rating:     2000- 78.1    2021- 92.7.  That is an unbelievable difference.....

 

 

So when you tell someone to compare their first full seasons....then don't be butthurt when that person does.  As McNabb played more.....the coaches gave him more.  As Hurts plays more.......the give him less.  That is all you should need to know......unless you have a bias.  

McNabb....second in MVP voting in 2000.....Just so you know.  

 

 

Sorry I got you so worked up.  You put in a lot of work to tell me that mcnabb was better than hurts his 1st season.  Even though I never said he wasn’t.  Hurts season isn’t even in the books yet.  
 

take a deep breath. 

41 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

RB factory?

Might as well. We have a RB at QB.

5 hours ago, TorontoEagle said:

Nah, he shouldn't and won't be fired. He's given up 6, 17, 18, 6, and 13 points to average or below average offenses. Against good offenses, he's given up 41,42,28, and 27. Considering the talent he's working with, that's pretty good. It frustrates us as fans to watch those good offenses have their way with us, but we aren't alone in that. I think Gannon is doing a fine job honestly. 

I think I've bolded the key point here. The secondary and linebacker units are almost devoid of quality talent. To be honest, Slay is the only legit quality player there. And he's in his thirties.

I'd be curious to see how effective Gannon can be with the (presumed) talented young players heading this way in the next couple of drafts. Because we all know that the draft resources are going to be sunk heavily into defense. As it should be.

It's painful this year watching good quarterbacks sling the ball around the field to wide open receivers all day long. But Dak is the only good quarterback still on the schedule at this point so I expect the defense to perform a lot better the rest of the year. Not good, mind you, but maybe average-ish. 

1 minute ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Might as well. We have a RB at QB.

Really don’t like that: "He’s just a RB”-bull.

Annoying as f.

1 minute ago, Infam said:

Really don’t like that: "He’s just a RB”-bull.

Annoying as f.

I'm jesting.

1 hour ago, Infam said:

So no matter how many yards he gets, he will be worse no matter what?

Why? Because you were young and everything was golden back then?

They have basically identical stats through their first 14 starts, chief. Hurts averaging 50 more yards per game can be in correlation to the rule changes that have happened throughout the 20 years since McNabb's first 14 starts. I don't have an issue with Hurts. I think he can be a good quarterback and has been improving, but just because you were in diapers 20 years ago doesn't change the fact that it's easier to play the position now than it was then. 

 

5 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I'm jesting.

Should have been more truthful and said "he's basically just a rookie RB at QB"

1 minute ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

They have basically identical stats through their first 14 starts, chief. Hurts averaging 50 more yards per game can be in correlation to the rule changes that have happened throughout the 20 years since McNabb's 14 starts. I don't have an issue with Hurts. I think he can be a good quarterback and has been improving, but just because you were in diapers 20 years ago doesn't change the fact that it's easier to play the position now than it was then. 

First of all: I wanted to say there has to be a point where stats are so much better that even though it got easier he still is better. Otherwise it’s not a comparison. It’s just hero worship.

And I was thinking stats prolly were similar. Now with what you posted, Hurts stats are way better. Less int, more yards as a passer and a whole different world running it. And then there is that Hurts is loved by the team and a hard worker..

Now I think up to this point Hurts did a better job even factoring in that the league made it easier to throw the ball.

32 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

 

Listen sport.  You're out of your depth.  But I'll play along.  I was responding to AFan who said....Hurts was better than McNabb.  Your dumbarse comes along and suggest that I go look at their first full seasons and that I might be surprised.....I don't need to.  I saw all of McNabb's career.  I and countless other posters pointed out how dumb it was of you to compare the two.  Again, the rules were different back then.  You could mug the WR and get away with hitting the QB more than now.  Passing was a lot easier then.  And yes you were comparing the two.  Because you told me to look at McNabb's first full season......which is comparing the two.  Do you even think before you post? 

 

I'll share some numbers for you....so you can get an understanding as to how dumb it is to compare passing in 2021 to 2000...

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/NFL/passing.htm

 

NFL AVG Passing Yards/Game: 2000- 206.9       2021- 240.2.  34 yards per game difference.  Which equates to 544 yards for 16 games.

 

NFL AVG Passing TD/Game:  2000- 1.3      2021- 1.6   That's an additional 4.8 TD for 16 games

 

NFL AVG Interceptions/Game:  2000- 1.1     2021- .8.  That comes out to 4.8 less Interceptions for 16 games

 

NFL AVG Completion %:  2000- 58.2       2021- 65.4.   That's a huge difference.  

 

And the big one.....

 

NFL AVG QB Rating:     2000- 78.1    2021- 92.7.  That is an unbelievable difference.....

 

 

So when you tell someone to compare their first full seasons....then don't be butthurt when that person does.  As McNabb played more.....the coaches gave him more.  As Hurts plays more.......the give him less.  That is all you should need to know......unless you have a bias.  

McNabb....second in MVP voting in 2000.....Just so you know.  

 

 

hey lardo, eat some salad once in awhile

11 minutes ago, Infam said:

First of all: I wanted to say there has to be a point where stats are so much better that even though it got easier he still is better. Otherwise it’s not a comparison. It’s just hero worship.

And I was thinking stats prolly were similar. Now with what you posted, Hurts stats are way better. Less int, more yards as a passer and a whole different world running it. And then there is that Hurts is loved by the team and a hard worker..

Now I think up to this point Hurts did a better job even factoring in that the league made it easier to throw the ball.

That's where we disagree. As McNabb's second season progressed, they put the game into his hands more. As Hurts' second season is progressing, they're taking the game out of his hands and protecting him from his flaws. He's been efficient the past few games with that style, but it's not a long-term plan to success given how QB-driven the league is. 

Didn’t they sign him like a day ago?

8 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Didn’t they sign him like a day ago?

35 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

They have basically identical stats through their first 14 starts, chief. Hurts averaging 50 more yards per game can be in correlation to the rule changes that have happened throughout the 20 years since McNabb's first 14 starts. I don't have an issue with Hurts. I think he can be a good quarterback and has been improving, but just because you were in diapers 20 years ago doesn't change the fact that it's easier to play the position now than it was then. 

 

The NFL permitted defense to be played during McNabb's era.

 

3 hours ago, TorontoEagle said:

 

Next up, QB's who need a good run game:

Elite either means "the best of the best" or it's meaningless - the top 10% or so which is the top 3-4 QBs over an extended period (like a decade).

Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Brees. That's it.

Comparing Hurts and McNabb was in the context of a decent but not great QB who won on a regular basis with the right team. It's too early to know what Hurts is or will be.

McNabb's decade, he was consistently around #10-15 among starting QBs, a couple years in the top ten, a couple toward #20. He came out of the option in Syracuse and it took 4 years for Reid to help him master the WCO - but he used his legs to compensate his first few seasons.

3 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Elite either means "the best of the best" or it's meaningless - the top 10% or so which is the top 3-4 QBs over an extended period (like a decade).

Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Brees. That's it.

Comparing Hurts and McNabb was in the context of a decent but not great QB who won on a regular basis with the right team. It's too early to know what Hurts is or will be.

McNabb's decade, he was consistently around #10-15 among starting QBs, a couple years in the top ten, a couple toward #20. He came out of the option in Syracuse and it took 4 years for Reid to help him master the WCO - but he used his legs to compensate his first few seasons.

Are you replying to the right person? I was never involved in the hurts/mcnabb debate?

54 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I'm jesting.

Man, that was a fast retreat.

2 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Are you replying to the right person? I was never involved in the hurts/mcnabb debate?

Probably going after you cause you considered Wilson elite. Meanwhile he doesn’t mention mahomes who’s been elite for 3 consecutive seasons. And this year in a bad year for him is 2nd in passing yards, 2nd in passing td and completing 66% of his passes. 

50 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

They have basically identical stats through their first 14 starts, chief. Hurts averaging 50 more yards per game can be in correlation to the rule changes that have happened throughout the 20 years since McNabb's first 14 starts. I don't have an issue with Hurts. I think he can be a good quarterback and has been improving, but just because you were in diapers 20 years ago doesn't change the fact that it's easier to play the position now than it was then. 

 

Where do they grade on the NFL scale, though?  Looks to me like McNabb was quite a ways ahead in a few categories:

McNabb 2000 -- 21st in comp. %, tied for 7th in TD passes, 12th in yardage

Hurts 2021 -- 29th in comp. %, tied for 17th in TD passes, 19th in yardage

 

Trying to compare raw numbers from separate eras isn't going to tell a whole lot.  Grading on the curve against the rest of the league is more relevant.

25 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Probably going after you cause you considered Wilson elite. Meanwhile he doesn’t mention mahomes who’s been elite for 3 consecutive seasons. And this year in a bad year for him is 2nd in passing yards, 2nd in passing td and completing 66% of his passes. 

I'm not sold on Wilson, like Murray, I think he may be the product of a scheme built to disguise his limits as a pocket QB, and of course, had a defense that made life easier.

Mahomes, check back in five years, elite is not just a couple good years but a decade of performance. Which is why Kurt Warner is tough to place, when healthy he was definitely elite, but just didn't stay healthy, had 3 elite seasons, then a checkered career until he finished with three very good seasons in Arizona.

Elite either is a limited group, or it loses meaning. Like brilliant, I hate when people use it in the context of bright, competent, etc. - either brilliant is exceptional or it has no meaning. Most QBs are not elite, and most people at the top of their profession are not brilliant.

9 minutes ago, austinfan said:

I'm not sold on Wilson, like Murray, I think he may be the product of a scheme built to disguise his limits as a pocket QB, and of course, had a defense that made life easier.

Mahomes, check back in five years, elite is not just a couple good years but a decade of performance. Which is why Kurt Warner is tough to place, when healthy he was definitely elite, but just didn't stay healthy, had 3 elite seasons, then a checkered career until he finished with three very good seasons in Arizona.

Elite either is a limited group, or it loses meaning. Like brilliant, I hate when people use it in the context of bright, competent, etc. - either brilliant is exceptional or it has no meaning. Most QBs are not elite, and most people at the top of their profession are not brilliant.

Russell Wilson has the 4th best passer rating of all-time........

You can't possibly believe that Russell Wilson is a product of scheme built to benefit his "limitations." You have to be completely clueless to really think that way.

2 hours ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Zimas.....ha.  Whatever happened to those things.  I was drinking MGD and Icehouse  back then and packing on the lbs.  

Good ol Icehouse!  When I was stationed in Georgia there was this line by where I lived.  One side was the hood and the other side was amazing.  Right inside the hood line was a beer store that sold tall boy slabs of Icehouse for dirt cheap.  My roommate and I would be in there daily!  Lol

18 minutes ago, austinfan said:

I'm not sold on Wilson, like Murray, I think he may be the product of a scheme built to disguise his limits as a pocket QB, and of course, had a defense that made life easier.

 

You don't actually believe that do you? I mean, no one's that stupid right? 

All time, Wilson is: 

4th in QB rating 

12th in completion percentage 

29th in passing yards (will likely be top 15 by time he retires). 

6th all time in INT % 

17th in passing TDs 

By the time he retires, he will undoubtedly be a top 10-15 QB  in NFL history

You continually make garbage ass takes.