6 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

I suggested he be cut week 2 or week 3 and it was called a hot take and I was a troll. This dude blows and shouldnt be in the NFL

Cutting a first round pick in the 2nd week of his 2nd year is a troll take....you had to at least let him show if he could improve or not. 

32 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

and with the right coaches this year he didnt look that bad. Pre ACL I would have  defiantly took a solid look at him here next year. 

Again people are shocked when guys like Doug Marrone, Vic Fangio, Jeff Fisher cant develop quarterbacks. 

Winston as a place holder would be OK by me.  Don't love nor hate him.  

9 hours ago, austinfan said:

People talk as if you just draft a QB and you're guaranteed a winner as long as he has a strong arm.

Meanwhile, something like 2/3 of the QBs taken in the top 15 the last five years or so aren't even top 20 guys.

It is really hard to draft a franchise QB, it is easy to ruin a potential franchise QB by drafting him onto a team that can't provide adequate support.

Hurts can win 10 games with a good defense, a strong running game and a good defense can carry you through the regular season.

First build that solid team, then worry about a QB that can take you to the SB.

12 QBs threw for 4000 yards in 2020, Watson, Ryan, Carr, Cousins and Stafford missed the playoffs. Guess a passing QB is no guarantee of winning 10 games.

1 bolded): Virtually no one has said that.

2 bolded): A good QB can win a SB with that support.

3 bolded): Irrelevant to the argument.

8 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

he probably has the strongest arm in general in the draft and probably the most accurate too(top 3 for sure). 

And his knee lol. He hurt it his Junior year of high school, which is... 4 or 5 years ago now and I dont think hes missed a game since. 

And by the way, Bledsoe had a really good career on some really bad teams with some bad talent at times

 

Actually it was his senior year in HS, and the surgery was getting several dissolvable nails put in his knee. (He was thought to be a recruited basketball player avg 18-12 as a Jr) Strong has had at least 2 arthroscopic surgeries since to clean the knee out and just this past August, it had to be drained and he missed some preseason practice.  
 It’s the biggest question on Strong going into the draft. 

7 minutes ago, Desertbirds said:

1 bolded): Virtually no one has said that.

2 bolded): A good QB can win a SB with that support.

3 bolded): Irrelevant to the argument.

It's very relevant, just getting a pssing QB guarantees nothing.

As far as drafting a QB, what's between the ears is more important than arm strength, Drew Brees did not have a great arm.

Give me a smart QB with an average arm, quick release, accuracy and the ability to anticipate the open receiver. And a feel for the pass rush in the pocket.

I think most QBs get overdrafted based on arm strength and athleticism, b/c it's hard to scout football IQ.

9 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

The point is you adore and absolutely love a quarterback then draft him regardless of how your team looks currently or if a quarterback becomes available on the trade market that you absolutely  love and is a franchise changer then you go and make it happen. cause you don’t know when one of those quarterbacks is going to come back around again. 

That holds for any player at any position, if you think he's the slam dunk best value you jump on him or even trade up for him.

The problem is with QBs, teams get so desperate that they talk themselves in love with mediocre prospects (we can teach him how to read defenses) and make bad mistakes.

If you're not certain he's going to be a franchise QB, then you can get mediocre prospects in the 2nd and 3rd rd, would you rather start Minshew or Darnold?

37 minutes ago, Ipiggles said:

oooofff

 

 

How is that yards per route run stat even possible? Gross 

21 hours ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Warner (HOF. Franchise) Marc Bulger

Delhomme (non elite)

McNabb (franchise QB)

Wilson (Franchise, elite)

Ryan (Franchise)

Goff (non elite)

Mahomes (Franchise, elite)

oops...nevermind. I don't know why I remember Bulger being the QB in that superbowl...

37 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

What about Denver with Manning? 

They burned a first round pick two years before signing him on Tebow 

4 minutes ago, Westbrook#36 said:

 

Warner played in that SB. Bulger didn’t play at all until the season after. 

Defenses can still win championships with mediocre QB play. Build up the defense if there isn't a QB you love

31 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Cutting a first round pick in the 2nd week of his 2nd year is a troll take....you had to at least let him show if he could improve or not. 

People have really short memories.  Agholor was drafted in almost the exact same slot as Reagor (#20 overall), and was objectively worse than Reagor has been:

Agholor 2015 and 2016 -- 648 total receiving yards in 28 games, 52.2% catch, 3 total TDs

Reagor 2020 and 2021 -- 597 total receiving yards in 23 games, 56.6% catch, 3 total TDs + 1 PR TD.  At least Reagor can return punts, Agholor was scared of it.

 

There were lots of people in here who wanted to cut Agholor in his 2nd year -- me among them -- but I knew there was zero chance the organization cuts a first round pick in the first two years.  Agholor was adequate when moved to the slot; nothing better.  He was severely overrated when he emerged from his tomb of horrid play.

The Eagles might use the Agholor experience to cut ties with Reagor faster; I could see him getting moved after the season if any team wishes to give a 4th round pick for him.  Otherwise he'll be competing in training camp next season for a job.  He would be a possible cut next season in camp, not before.  

21 minutes ago, austinfan said:

It's very relevant, just getting a pssing QB guarantees nothing.

As far as drafting a QB, what's between the ears is more important than arm strength, Drew Brees did not have a great arm.

Give me a smart QB with an average arm, quick release, accuracy and the ability to anticipate the open receiver. And a feel for the pass rush in the pocket.

I think most QBs get overdrafted based on arm strength and athleticism, b/c it's hard to scout football IQ.

Not having a passing qb does though.

2 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

People have really short memories.  Agholor was drafted in almost the exact same slot as Reagor (#20 overall), and was objectively worse than Reagor has been:

Agholor 2015 and 2016 -- 648 total receiving yards in 28 games, 52.2% catch, 3 total TDs

Reagor 2020 and 2021 -- 597 total receiving yards in 23 games, 56.6% catch, 3 total TDs + 1 PR TD.  At least Reagor can return punts, Agholor was scared of it.

 

There were lots of people in here who wanted to cut Agholor in his 2nd year -- me among them -- but I knew there was zero chance the organization cuts a first round pick in the first two years.  Agholor was adequate when moved to the slot; nothing better.  He was severely overrated when he emerged from his tomb of horrid play.

The Eagles might use the Agholor experience to cut ties with Reagor faster; I could see him getting moved after the season if any team wishes to give a 4th round pick for him.  Otherwise he'll be competing in training camp next season for a job.  He would be a possible cut next season in camp, not before.  

Yes, I could see him being cut/traded after this year. But considering last year was a complete cluster F all the way around, it would be insane to have cut him week 2 this year. 

14 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Warner played in that SB. Bulger didn’t play at all until the season after. 

You are correct. For some reason I had it in my head that Bulger started that game.

2 hours ago, Alphagrand said:

Every situation is unique and I think too many people are viewing the Eagles QB situation from either extreme — it’s either find an elite QB prospect/elite veteran QB, or stay with Hurts.  Nobody wants to consider a middle ground, but there is a vast middle ground.

 

Middle ground to me is a waste of time. It's years and years worth of 9-8, 8-9, 7-10 or 10-7 and if you are lucky, being one and done in the playoffs, being stuck in the mid rounds of the draft and likely unable to be in position to draft a Blue Chip QB prospect without mortgaging you future with draft picks. 

 

1 hour ago, Mike030270 said:

Defenses can still win championships with mediocre QB play. Build up the defense if there isn't a QB you love

I am ok with this,:

I would love to have Rodgers or Wilson. So I throw the kitchen sink at trying to land one.  if we cant get either  and we dont like any in the draft, I would trade back with one of the 1sts for a 1st next year. The issue with that is , there are still no promises there will be a good QB in next years draft you like and can get either. 

55 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Yes, I could see him being cut/traded after this year. But considering last year was a complete cluster F all the way around, it would be insane to have cut him week 2 this year. 

Honestly it really is hard to evaluate these wr's properly when you have Hurts as the QB. Please let me see him stink up the joint with 5 games of Minshew or better at QB before we make that determination. SOmething I would like to have happen THIS YEAR before the offseason. 

17 minutes ago, Ipiggles said:

Middle ground to me is a waste of time. It's years and years worth of 9-8, 8-9, 7-10 or 10-7 and if you are lucky, being one and done in the playoffs, being stuck in the mid rounds of the draft and likely unable to be in position to draft a Blue Chip QB prospect without mortgaging you future with draft picks. 

 

No it isn't.  Who are the best QBs in the NFL, and where were they drafted?

Brady -- 6th round

Dak -- 4th round

Wilson -- 3rd round

Rodgers -- 24th overall

Mahomes -- 10th overall and was predicted to go late 1st round

 

It's about identifying the QB talent that fits the system you want to run, and developing that QB.  Draft and develop your own franchise QB, because just selling the farm for one guy like Watson without any resources to do anything else with the roster gets you a 4-12 Texans team with Watson freelancing and dancing around putting up numbers, but no wins to show for it.  You need a strong, deep 53-man roster 

 

2 minutes ago, Ipiggles said:

Honestly it really is hard to evaluate these wr's properly when you have Hurts as the QB. Please let me see him stink up the joint with 5 games of Minshew or better at QB before we make that determination. SOmething I would like to have happen THIS YEAR before the offseason. 

Eh I think Reagor is done here, this last game is probably the end. Even as bad as Hurts is throwing, you can see Smith is gonna be good. He's constantly open, has good hands, just....don't make him run any routes to the left with Hurts under centre, cause he'll never get the ball. 

Same with Goedert, you can see his talent and ability, though he's a bit inconsistent with his hands. 

Even Quez, you've seen him flash an ability to be a #2/#3 WR. 

What have we seen from Reagor? Sloppy routes since day 1, refuses to fight for balls on comebacks/digs, if the play isn't designed for him, he seems not to care, which are all the same knocks on him coming out of college. His supposed speed hasn't really flashed, and he's terrible on punt returns. There's not one single positive thing I can say he has going for him so far, whereas the other skill players, there's at least something you can point to.

Of course he'll finish out the year here, but barring some kind of miracle turnaround this month, I'm fine with moving on from him. 

2 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Eh I think Reagor is done here, this last game is probably the end. Even as bad as Hurts is throwing, you can see Smith is gonna be good. He's constantly open, has good hands, just....don't make him run any routes to the left with Hurts under centre, cause he'll never get the ball. 

Same with Goedert, you can see his talent and ability, though he's a bit inconsistent with his hands. 

Even Quez, you've seen him flash an ability to be a #2/#3 WR. 

What have we seen from Reagor? Sloppy routes since day 1, refuses to fight for balls on comebacks/digs, if the play isn't designed for him, he seems not to care, which are all the same knocks on him coming out of college. His supposed speed hasn't really flashed, and he's terrible on punt returns. There's not one single positive thing I can say he has going for him so far, whereas the other skill players, there's at least something you can point to.

Of course he'll finish out the year here, but barring some kind of miracle turnaround this month, I'm fine with moving on from him. 

Cant disagree, I just like to give everyone a fighting chance. I am not sure Hurts allows that.  Reagor does get open and Hurts is late to deliver the ball. How much more productive would he be if the ball is actually out in front of him when he has his man beat? 

3 hours ago, Nivraga said:

What makes you think Howie doesn't trust his scouts?

Ignoring the higher rated player to select the ones that we ended up with.  

Veto scouts... select JJAW, at behest of Lurie. 

Veto scouts... select Hurts over Chinn. 

Veto scouts... select Reagor over Jefferson.

 

3 hours ago, Penn7980 said:

True.  Brady joined a team already had good players at many key positions.  What Bucs lacked was a good QB.  Once Brady arrived, they won the SB!  That is a strong case supporting the approach of building the team first and getting your QB later.

It is an outlier as well.  Very few times does a QB of Brady's stature ever hit the free agency market, in fact... I'm pretty sure it's the only time.  

Odds are long of getting that... and trading for one increases the cost exponentially.

4 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

No it isn't.  Who are the best QBs in the NFL, and where were they drafted?

Brady -- 6th round

Dak -- 4th round

Wilson -- 3rd round

Rodgers -- 24th overall

Mahomes -- 10th overall and was predicted to go late 1st round

 

It's about identifying the QB talent that fits the system you want to run, and developing that QB.  Draft and develop your own franchise QB, because just selling the farm for one guy like Watson without any resources to do anything else with the roster gets you a 4-12 Texans team with Watson freelancing and dancing around putting up numbers, but no wins to show for it.  You need a strong, deep 53-man roster 

 

You are talking about getting lucky, drafting a QB later in the rds, and that only has happened, what 4 times in past 20 years...

and you expect Howie can get lucky drafting one? 

 

You have way more faith than I do. 

1 hour ago, NCiggles said:

What about Denver with Manning? 

Manning was a shell in Denver.