Goff is truly suffering in Detroit.

 

 

Hurts has 7 games this season with 25 or more passing attempts.

Atlanta - 35 attempts

Dallas- 39 attempts

KC- 48 attempts

Carolina- 37 attempts

Tampa- 26 attempts

Las Vegas- 34 attempts

Giants- 31 attempts

The Eagles are 2-5 in those games with wins against the Falcons and Panthers. Hurts is averaging a 78 QB rating and a 59% completion percentage for those games.

Minshew comes off the bench to start, without an offseason in this offense, and runs  the offense with greater success than Hurts has shown. Minshew with a 133 QB rating and 80% completion percentage yesterday.

Read this article by Reuben Frank.  Pretty bad IMO.  In trying to say Hurts hast to be the starter, he goes on and tells you exactly why Minshew is better...and also that the Eagles don't care how good he is/can be.

We have a pretty good idea what Minshew is. He’s a solid NFL quarterback who’s going to have a long career.

His numbers in his first 21 starts are really good – 64 percent, 5,172 yards, 35 TDs, 9 INTs, 94.4 passer rating. Only nine other QBs have ever completed 64 percent of their passes and thrown for 5,000 yards and 35 TDs in their first 21 starts. Minshew is the only one with fewer than 10 interceptions.

So the numbers are there. He can play. 

But this isn’t about Minshew. Nobody in the Eagles’ front office is incredibly curious what Gardner Minshew’s upside is or how much better he can get or how far he can take this football team.

https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/eagles/why-eagles-coach-nick-sirianni-has-stick-jalen-hurts?cid=sm_npd_rsn_phi_twt_mn

1 minute ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Goff is truly suffering in Detroit.

 

 

I'm sure he's really suffering with his millions of dollars and swimsuit model for a girlfriend. Poor guy.

20 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

For anybody that wants to see Hurts resume his starting role....why? Can you please explain your reasoning? 

I'll answer this

1) Still want to give Hurts a full year before making any decision on him. Minshew performance did nothing to change my mind on that. 

2) The Eagles paid a 6th rounder, but that becomes a 5th rounder if Minshew plays more then 50% in 3 games this season. I would rather keep that 5th rounder.

3) If Hurts plays great for the rest of the year, that is good for the Eagles. If he sucks and they lose these games, then at least the draft picks will be higher. Minshew does not help in that equation in the least bit.

4) I want to see how he responds after being on the sidelines and a bye week. Sometimes sitting and watching can help a QB out tremendously. That is what happened with McNabb when Reid benched him after a terrible performance and then he came back a better player.

Minshew brings very little to the table. What he did yesterday was classic Minshew. He plays great for the first few games as a starter, everyone starts to hang from his ball sack and then he starts to suck. That is why he was benched in Jacksonville. He is the type of QB to come in and pinch hit for a couple of games, but not the type of QB that can be the starter every game. He is not the future here, where Hurts still has time to prove whether he can be or not.

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Read this article by Reuben Frank.  Pretty bad IMO.  In trying to say Hurts hast to be the starter, he goes on and tells you exactly why Minshew is better...and also that the Eagles don't care how good he is/can be.

We have a pretty good idea what Minshew is. He’s a solid NFL quarterback who’s going to have a long career.

His numbers in his first 21 starts are really good – 64 percent, 5,172 yards, 35 TDs, 9 INTs, 94.4 passer rating. Only nine other QBs have ever completed 64 percent of their passes and thrown for 5,000 yards and 35 TDs in their first 21 starts. Minshew is the only one with fewer than 10 interceptions.

So the numbers are there. He can play. 

But this isn’t about Minshew. Nobody in the Eagles’ front office is incredibly curious what Gardner Minshew’s upside is or how much better he can get or how far he can take this football team.

https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/eagles/why-eagles-coach-nick-sirianni-has-stick-jalen-hurts?cid=sm_npd_rsn_phi_twt_mn

Nothing wrong with what Roob says here. In fact, he slips the dagger in quite smoothly.

1 hour ago, TorontoEagle said:

Oh I've long said Hurts should be converted to RB. I think he'd absolutely thrive as an RB. And I've definitely pounded the drum about him being too dumb football wise to handle being QB. His situational awareness is severely lacking, and he makes mistakes that kids in pop warner don't make. He's insanely dumb when it comes to football IQ. Has nothing to do with his race. 

I more refer to it as he simply lacks the natural instincts to play the QB position well enough at the NFL level.  Sure, in college at OU in that system and playing vs mostly Big 12 teams in a conference not known for having good D, he did well.  The NFL is an entirely different animal.  I feel like a broken record repeating this, as I'm sure other do as well, but these are my issues with Hurts:
1-Lacks the instincts to anticipate routes and receivers getting open, thus.....

2-Doesn't get the ball out on time for the most part.

3-Can only see 1/3 of the field.

4-Lacks pocket awareness, which leads to.....

5-Panics unnecessarily and dances in the pocket creating pressure since his OL now don't know how to block defenders away from him because he's all over the place.

5b-Doesn't simply slide a step forward/left/right to avoid pressure while keeping his eyes downfield then reset his feet to make a throw.

6-Doesn't have good mechanics which leads to poorly thrown passes.

That's the meat of it.  And I opine that most of this is more instinct than something that can be coached up.  Can he work hard and improve on these issues?  Sure.  However, he'll only improve so much and not enough to ever be a reliable quality starting QB you can make a playoff run with in the NFL.  You can't teach/coach instincts.  You either have them or you don't.  His ceiling isn't much higher than what we're seeing now.  He needs his running ability to make him a better QB.  Take that away from him or limit that running ability and we see the result we got in the Giants game last week.  Good teams in the playoffs will suffocate him and turn him into Tebow.

Now Minshew also is not a QB to hang your future on, but he is a better QB than Hurts.  At least with Minshew under center Sirianni can run more of the O he wants and that helps our young skill players develop.  With Hurts as QB they'll have to go from an Army/Navy O to an NFL O at the flick of a switch and that's not a good way to go about it.  I honestly don't think Hurts will ever match Minshew's level of play as a passing QB.  As stated above, these fundamentals and natural instincts of playing the QB position properly in today's NFL that he is just lacking in them and won't be that much better than he is now.  We're still looking for our next future long term QB.

 

I am not convinced the Eagles do better than split with the WTF.  Yesterday they beat the worse team in the NFL.  Instead of looking at the W/L (although still not to .500), we need to acknowledge what teams they beat.  Some very bad ones because they were the 4th place team last year  we all joked about Judge’s meltdown about the Eagles tanking last year.  Well 2021 Eagles playoff dreams are as delusional as 2020 giants playoff dreams  

On that second TD to Goedert, I think any QB could have hit that throw. Minshew was entertaining and had a good game.  I liked the trade and liked him in the draft, as a late round quality back up QB.  Glad to see that most are avoiding the unicorns and rainbows vision of the back up QB following a beating on a Little Sisters of the Mercy quality football team.

I wasn’t just laughing at Saleh yesterday, I was rolling.   Brady got fired as an OC.  From the look of things, Sirianni as a "consolation” pick at HC was a serious miss by a few posters in here. He and his coordinators are growing well into their roles. 

15 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Not sure why this matters, as against similarly horrible teams like the Lions, Giants, Hurts was not good. 

Minshew is probably one of the best back up QBs in the league honestly. I wouldn't want him either as the full time guy. But he gives our offense a much better shot than Hurts. 

He's a back-up. I'm sure they want to give Hurts every opportunity as a starter

36 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

If you look at Giroux for what he is, he's just fine.  He's a 2nd liner, sometimes 3rd liner who can still produce. 

These coaches are some of the worst, we have zero powerplay game plan, the GM didnt get us a true scorer which we needed, and Again, Carter Hart is just fine. 

I don't agree. The coaches have almost nothing to work with. AV used a hyperaggressive system because without it we would get steamrollered every game, which, come to think of it, is what's happening now. Every team we meet has three or four players much better than our best player, whoever he might be.

6 minutes ago, justrelax said:

Nothing wrong with what Roob says here. In fact, he slips the dagger in quite smoothly.

The issue is, if the Eagles front office is "still Curious" about what upside Hurts has.

Thats very telling about their ability.  I will go out on a very secure limb here and say Hurts never improves his passing to the point of being as good as Minshew at passing. And that bar is set low. 

3 minutes ago, greend said:

He's a back-up. I'm sure they want to give Hurts every opportunity as a starter

I have seen enough,  it is very telling that they THINK they have not seen enough yet. 

4 minutes ago, greend said:

He's a back-up. I'm sure they want to give Hurts every opportunity as a starter

Hurts is also at best a back up QB

34 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Imagine being an Eagle fan and thinking that a large portion of the fan base is resistant to a QB because he is black.  Our most important and high profile QB's in the last 30 years have been black.  JFC....talk about dumb.  

The reality is that if Hurts had a decent game against the Giants and the team had won, this wouldn't be a real issue.  Minshew made high percentage throws at a high percentage.  He had 2 passing TD's that were not great passes but good decisions and good enough throws.  He looked like a decent back up QB.  But to be honest, the question with Hurts would remain even if Minshew didn't look efficient.  Hurts should be the starting QB the next game. He's the more physically talented player.  Minshew playing efficiently will impact the leash on Hurts I think both from Sirianni's perspective but also how the locker room thinks about what gives them the best chance.  If he looks bad against WFT, then Minshew could very well start the next game. 

1 hour ago, bpac55 said:

So the snap counts are out.

Quez Watkins- 55 snaps

Jalen Reagor- 48 snaps

DeVonta Smith- 44 snaps

I just gave Sirianni an attaboy but what the hell is that all about?  Smith should have the most snaps of any of the WR but how he has the least out of the top 3 and why Reagor continues to have that many is beyond me.

One small defense for Reagor though.  They continue to not give him good opportunities with throws behind the LOS.  Can they please stop calling that play.

I'd be curious to see the snaps broken down by qtr.  Smith looked like he got banged up in the 2nd half.  Saw him holding and shaking out his elbow after one play.  Didn't notice him or it again after.

4 minutes ago, Ipiggles said:

The issue is, if the Eagles front office is "still Curious" about what upsaide Hurts has.

Thats very telling about their ability.  I will go out on a very secure limb here and say Hurts never improves his passing to the point of being as good as Minshew at passing. And that bar is set low. 

I have seen enough,  it is very telling that they THINK they have not seen enough yet. 

Nah, we've seen enough, but we are fans

1 minute ago, Ipiggles said:

Hurts is also at best a back up QB

Agree but he will finish the season unless Hurts stays hurt

 

8 minutes ago, pallidrone said:

I'll answer this

1) Still want to give Hurts a full year before making any decision on him. Minshew performance did nothing to change my mind on that. 

2) The Eagles paid a 6th rounder, but that becomes a 5th rounder if Minshew plays more then 50% in 3 games this season. I would rather keep that 5th rounder.

3) If Hurts plays great for the rest of the year, that is good for the Eagles. If he sucks and they lose these games, then at least the draft picks will be higher. Minshew does not help in that equation in the least bit.

4) I want to see how he responds after being on the sidelines and a bye week. Sometimes sitting and watching can help a QB out tremendously. That is what happened with McNabb when Reid benched him after a terrible performance and then he came back a better player.

Minshew brings very little to the table. What he did yesterday was classic Minshew. He plays great for the first few games as a starter, everyone starts to hang from his ball sack and then he starts to suck. That is why he was benched in Jacksonville. He is the type of QB to come in and pinch hit for a couple of games, but not the type of QB that can be the starter every game. He is not the future here, where Hurts still has time to prove whether he can be or not.

 

5 minutes ago, greend said:

He's a back-up. I'm sure they want to give Hurts every opportunity as a starter

Haven't we seen enough of Hurts? We know exactly what he is, his weaknesses from college haven't improved a lick over the course of his games. He's a great runner, and boosts an already strong running game that we have.

He's a god awful thrower. Maybe worst in the league as far as "starting" QBs go. He has basically no football IQ. Makes insanely dumb mistakes. Has no pocket presence, as we've seen him spin around like a top in a completely clean pocket. Seems unable to even step up in a clean pocket to deliver a ball. Any throw downfield requires him to sort of, hop-step before he throws. None of these things are likely to improve over the last 4 games. We've seen enough. I understand the FO will insist he start, because they have to. 

But there is no future as a starting QB for Hurts. How he can be defended is beyond me. Even a marginal upgrade to a passing QB yesterday showed how much better this offense can be. I was on the fence for trading for a QB....but after yesterday, I'm fine if we trade future picks for Russ Wilson. I'd like to hold onto at least 2 first rounders this year, but a first this and our first next year for Wilson? Sure, get it done. It would put us into the playoff picture immediately, and with some upgrades to defense, we could even be a legit playoff threat. 

3 minutes ago, greend said:

Nah, we've seen enough, but we are fans

Agree but he will finish the season unless Hurts stays hurt

Agreed, and it might actually be best for us. Minshew is just good enough to possibly make the playoffs with our easy schedule. 

What would Hurts need to do to prove to the FO that he belongs?

9 minutes ago, Bacarty2 said:

Wont get an argument from me. I dont like AV style, it doesn't work and neither does someone like Torts which is why both get rolled out relatively quickly because their scheme and style is tiresome. 

The Fact that Chuck Fletcher didnt go with him is beyond me. 

Chuck is awful- must go.  But the Comcast idiots will let him ruin the team for another season or two

1 hour ago, bpac55 said:

So the snap counts are out.

Quez Watkins- 55 snaps

Jalen Reagor- 48 snaps

DeVonta Smith- 44 snaps

I just gave Sirianni an attaboy but what the hell is that all about?  Smith should have the most snaps of any of the WR but how he has the least out of the top 3 and why Reagor continues to have that many is beyond me.

One small defense for Reagor though.  They continue to not give him good opportunities with throws behind the LOS.  Can they please stop calling that play.

I’m guessing some of it has to do with they were just gonna run ball more in 2nd half. 

48 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

For anybody that wants to see Hurts resume his starting role....why? Can you please explain your reasoning? 

There are legitimate reasons

- He makes the run game better, which is sustainable year to year for QBs who run the ball
- His teammates love him, so there's no issue bringing him back
- He makes 1.5M / Year the next 2 years, so if he's the 2022 starter, our cap problems are solved and we'll be back to even with the league by 2023/2024
- He's improved as a passer every year since college. That could reasonably continue
- Keeping Hurts > drafting a QB in this draft class or trading multiple picks for an expensive QB. Even if Hurts isn't great, Hurts + picks > available QBs

Just now, TorontoEagle said:

 

Haven't we seen enough of Hurts? We know exactly what he is, his weaknesses from college haven't improved a lick over the course of his games. He's a great runner, and boosts an already strong running game that we have.

He's a god awful thrower. Maybe worst in the league as far as "starting" QBs go. He has basically no football IQ. Makes insanely dumb mistakes. Has no pocket presence, as we've seen him spin around like a top in a completely clean pocket. Seems unable to even step up in a clean pocket to deliver a ball. Any throw downfield requires him to sort of, hop-step before he throws. None of these things are likely to improve over the last 4 games. We've seen enough. I understand the FO will insist he start, because they have to. 

But there is no future as a starting QB for Hurts. How he can be defended is beyond me. Even a marginal upgrade to a passing QB yesterday showed how much better this offense can be. I was on the fence for trading for a QB....but after yesterday, I'm fine if we trade future picks for Russ Wilson. I'd like to hold onto at least 2 first rounders this year, but a first this and our first next year for Wilson? Sure, get it done. It would put us into the playoff picture immediately, and with some upgrades to defense, we could even be a legit playoff threat. 

Thankfully you are not in the front office then.

A football player is not grown over few games, especially one that was a known project coming out of college. I have no idea if Hurts can be the man or not and 12 games into 2021 does not answer anything.

The issue here is that nobody has patience. Everyone KNEW that this was going to be a tough year. Everyone KNEW that there was going to be growing pains. Everyone KNEW that this was going to be a retooling year filled with a lot of ups and downs. Nobody seems to willing to acknowledge that now and thinks they know exactly how these players are going to be and what their ceiling is.

5 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

 

Haven't we seen enough of Hurts? We know exactly what he is, his weaknesses from college haven't improved a lick over the course of his games. He's a great runner, and boosts an already strong running game that we have.

He's a god awful thrower. Maybe worst in the league as far as "starting" QBs go. He has basically no football IQ. Makes insanely dumb mistakes. Has no pocket presence, as we've seen him spin around like a top in a completely clean pocket. Seems unable to even step up in a clean pocket to deliver a ball. Any throw downfield requires him to sort of, hop-step before he throws. None of these things are likely to improve over the last 4 games. We've seen enough. I understand the FO will insist he start, because they have to. 

But there is no future as a starting QB for Hurts. How he can be defended is beyond me. Even a marginal upgrade to a passing QB yesterday showed how much better this offense can be. I was on the fence for trading for a QB....but after yesterday, I'm fine if we trade future picks for Russ Wilson. I'd like to hold onto at least 2 first rounders this year, but a first this and our first next year for Wilson? Sure, get it done. It would put us into the playoff picture immediately, and with some upgrades to defense, we could even be a legit playoff threat. 

Bro, I'm not defending him. I'm telling you he will be the starter. Winning the Jets games was never going to get Minshew to be the starter. 

9 minutes ago, downundermike said:

 

I didn't know Westbrook was a racist

1 minute ago, pallidrone said:

Thankfully you are not in the front office then.

A football player is not grown over few games, especially one that was a known project coming out of college. I have no idea if Hurts can be the man or not and 12 games into 2021 does not answer anything.

The issue here is that nobody has patience. Everyone KNEW that this was going to be a tough year. Everyone KNEW that there was going to be growing pains. Everyone KNEW that this was going to be a retooling year filled with a lot of ups and downs. Nobody seems to willing to acknowledge that now and thinks they know exactly how these players are going to be and what their ceiling is.

I have patience for those who deserve it. Hurts burned through his. How many more times do you want to see him throw a ball away on a 4th down play? Or at the end of a half, throwing not only short of the endzone, but throwing an INT when a simple throw away would give us a FG shot? How many more plays do you need to see a wide open WR who Hurts doesn't see because it's not the first read? How many more basic, simple mistakes do you need to see him make to realize he just doesn't have it? 

Yes, he'll get the rest of the year as the starter, and fine. But he's terrible and if he comes back next year as the starter, our season is already toast.